UK forum members, BREXIT?

[vodka]

Even if there were such a thing as independent organisation, that still would have been money flushed down the drain IMO, because the truth simply is, nobody knows what is going to happen now.
But thanks to the UK voters we are going to find out what happens next.

I agree that no one really knows the answers. But we could have at least been presented with reliable/accurate facts and figures about the existing EU situation. I now know (AFTER the referendum has finished), far more about the EU, than I did before.

I'm also disappointed that the EU and the member countries seem to be blaming the UK, for Brexit. I.e. We may just be the first of a few, or even more countries that decide to leave.


It may well end up being the case, that in the upcoming future years, other (current) EU member countries also have referendums, and may also decide to leave. Potentially either ending the EU and/or dramatically changing how the EU works and its responsibilities.
I.e. No EU and/or a drastically restructured scope/functionality EU and/or an EU with many of the existing EU member countries outside of it.

I'm interested in what is going to happen in the next few years, as regards the EU. If any other significant player EU member countries also end up leaving. I think things will be far more likely to change, as regards the EU.

I am seeing as the Spider Captains dissapeared, i arrived the conclusion that the British Politics didn't want the Brexit ,and they have mounted all that spiel as the classic kid  with a huff, kicking and screaming.

Only there are two solutions , you give to kid all he wants, and you will avoid the huff or you leave the hand to walk and the kid will think it two time for throwing to floor

And the EU will choose leaving the hand to walk

[nctnico]

It would be comparable to the UK people of today still holding a grudge against the romans or the Norse Vikings. Only conflict in the middle east even predates those expansionist wars. They are still fighting in the middle east over stuff that happened over a thousand years ago. All other civilisation moved forward they still live a thousand years in the past.

I think the more interesting question is why they fight. I think the biggest problem is that most people are poor and if you tell poor people to cut their neighbour's head of because he has a funny beard, a long nose or whatever then poor people will do that. I have no clear answer to stop the violence but it will take getting rid of the people turning people against eachother for their own gain (power trip), educating the general public and get the region the prospher somehow. But maybe we just have to let Darwin sort it out. At some point the people who want to fight have killed eachother so the genetically less inclined to fight will be the (more) peacefull leftovers.

[MK14]

I am seeing as the Spider Captains dissapeared, i arrived the conclusion that the British Politics didn't want the Brexit ,and they have mounted all that spiel as the classic kid  with a huff, kicking and screaming.

Only there are two solutions , you give to kid all he wants, and you will avoid the huff or you leave the hand to walk and the kid will think it two time for throwing to floor

And the EU will choose leaving the hand to walk

I agree the British political establishment seem to have been taken, completely by surprise. Which in itself is a bad thing, since they should have known it was a significant possibility and/or been prepared for that option anyway.
As it is, they are looking like a right shambles (probably just about ALL parties).

I also agree that (currently) the EU, is saying "Bye, close the door on the way out".

But if other countries also leave, I think the EU will either be more likely to compromise and/or it will be the end of the EU (or it will painfully struggle on, with a different set of counties within it).

[tggzzz]

But if other countries also leave, I think the EU will either be more likely to compromise and/or it will be the end of the EU (or it will painfully struggle on, with a different set of counties within it).

The 27 will have to crucify the UK, so as to make it clear to their population that leaving is the worse option.

[tggzzz]

I'm interested in what is going to happen in the next few years, as regards the EU. If any other significant player EU member countries also end up leaving. I think things will be far more likely to change, as regards the EU.

The 27 are motivated to crucify the UK, "pour encourager les autres" - i.e. let their population see that leaving is worse than staying.

[vodka]

It would be comparable to the UK people of today still holding a grudge against the romans or the Norse Vikings. Only conflict in the middle east even predates those expansionist wars. They are still fighting in the middle east over stuff that happened over a thousand years ago. All other civilisation moved forward they still live a thousand years in the past.

I think the more interesting question is why they fight. I think the biggest problem is that most people are poor and if you tell poor people to cut their neighbour's head of because he has a funny beard, a long nose or whatever then poor people will do that. I have no clear answer to stop the violence but it will take getting rid of the people turning people against eachother for their own gain (power trip), educating the general public and get the region the prospher somehow. But maybe we just have to let Darwin sort it out. At some point the people who want to fight have killed eachother so the genetically less inclined to fight will be the (more) peacefull leftovers.

1. Give up the poor and analphabet people excuse becuase there are too rich people that they recieved good education as the Bangladesh terrorist.

2. The wars on middle-east are fought about all clans wars between the same group religious and rarely against other differents religious group(Sunni vs chris, Kurdish VS chilis).
    and the concept family clan are differents to european familiar(9-20 members), they can have until 300 members or more and maybe they have never seen,but they are considered family.

3. The peace on middle-east almost always have imposed with a tyran or a dictator

[MK14]

But if other countries also leave, I think the EU will either be more likely to compromise and/or it will be the end of the EU (or it will painfully struggle on, with a different set of counties within it).

The 27 will have to crucify the UK, so as to make it clear to their population that leaving is the worse option.

I agree. They are treating us like the bad "boy" of the EU.

But I think that policy will back-fire, big time on the EU. The wrong thing to do at the wrong time.

Germany is getting especially worried, as they may have to fork out huge amount of money, to keep the EU afloat. (That is my interpretation, anyway).

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/683224/END-OF-THE-EU-Germany-France-Austria-Hungary-Finland-Netherlands-Europe-Brexit

END OF THE EU? Germany warns FIVE more countries could leave Europe after Brexit

FIVE European countries may seek to follow Britain’s lead in leaving the EU in a Brexit domino effect, Germany has warned.

By JONATHAN OWEN

France, the Netherlands, Austria, Finland and Hungary could leave.

[vodka]

I'm interested in what is going to happen in the next few years, as regards the EU. If any other significant player EU member countries also end up leaving. I think things will be far more likely to change, as regards the EU.

The 27 are motivated to crucify the UK, "pour encourager les autres" - i.e. let their population see that leaving is worse than staying.

https://youtu.be/P-7moc6I9Jg

[Alex Nikitin]

I'm interested in what is going to happen in the next few years, as regards the EU. If any other significant player EU member countries also end up leaving. I think things will be far more likely to change, as regards the EU.

The 27 are motivated to crucify the UK, "pour encourager les autres" - i.e. let their population see that leaving is worse than staying.

Oh, that will be the perfect  illustration why the UK is much better out of this camp .

Cheers

Alex

[tggzzz]

I'm interested in what is going to happen in the next few years, as regards the EU. If any other significant player EU member countries also end up leaving. I think things will be far more likely to change, as regards the EU.

The 27 are motivated to crucify the UK, "pour encourager les autres" - i.e. let their population see that leaving is worse than staying.

Oh, that will be the perfect  illustration why the UK is much better out of this camp .

Prove that assertion.

This isn't a game, despite what some politicians evidently believe.

[tggzzz]

But if other countries also leave, I think the EU will either be more likely to compromise and/or it will be the end of the EU (or it will painfully struggle on, with a different set of counties within it).

The 27 will have to crucify the UK, so as to make it clear to their population that leaving is the worse option.

I agree. They are treating us like the bad "boy" of the EU.

But I think that policy will back-fire, big time on the EU. The wrong thing to do at the wrong time.

Germany is getting especially worried, as they may have to fork out huge amount of money, to keep the EU afloat. (That is my interpretation, anyway).

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/683224/END-OF-THE-EU-Germany-France-Austria-Hungary-Finland-Netherlands-Europe-Brexit

END OF THE EU? Germany warns FIVE more countries could leave Europe after Brexit

FIVE European countries may seek to follow Britain’s lead in leaving the EU in a Brexit domino effect, Germany has warned.

By JONATHAN OWEN

France, the Netherlands, Austria, Finland and Hungary could leave.

Who knows Either way it is a hell of a gamble.

We deserve better than our fate being determined by a couple of old Etonian Bully(ngdon) Boys playing dominance games.

[Alex Nikitin]

I'm interested in what is going to happen in the next few years, as regards the EU. If any other significant player EU member countries also end up leaving. I think things will be far more likely to change, as regards the EU.

The 27 are motivated to crucify the UK, "pour encourager les autres" - i.e. let their population see that leaving is worse than staying.

Oh, that will be the perfect  illustration why the UK is much better out of this camp .

Prove that assertion.

This isn't a game, despite what some politicians evidently believe.

I've lived in the USSR half of my life, there people trying to leave the country were shot at or sent to labour camps - all for the common good. Now EU starts to smell that way  .

Cheers

Alex

[MK14]

Who knows Either way it is a hell of a gamble.

We deserve better than our fate being determined by a couple of old Etonian Bully(ngdon) Boys playing dominance games.

Basically, we have been caught up in the EU headlights, heading towards us at high speed, and had to decide to Fight or flight ?

Where Fight (The EU) = Leave/Brexit and flight = Remain/Accept the way things are.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fight-or-flight_response



Rightly or wrongly, we are fighting it out (or NOT depending on which rumors you believe).
EDIT: Corrected mistake

[Alex Nikitin]

Who knows Either way it is a hell of a gamble.

We deserve better than our fate being determined by a couple of old Etonian Bully(ngdon) Boys playing dominance games.

Our fate was decided by the majority of voters, thankfully.

Cheers

Alex

[vodka]

Who knows Either way it is a hell of a gamble.

We deserve better than our fate being determined by a couple of old Etonian Bully(ngdon) Boys playing dominance games.

Basically, we have been caught up in the EU headlights, heading towards us at high speed, and had to decide to Fight or flight ?

Where Fight (The EU) = Leave/Brexit and flight = Remain/Accept the way things are.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fight-or-flight_response



Rightly or wrongly, we are fighting it out (or NOT depending on which rumors you believe).
EDIT: Corrected mistake

Rather fight , you have flown 3 leaders, please don't fight that  give me others cringe.

[tggzzz]

I'm interested in what is going to happen in the next few years, as regards the EU. If any other significant player EU member countries also end up leaving. I think things will be far more likely to change, as regards the EU.

The 27 are motivated to crucify the UK, "pour encourager les autres" - i.e. let their population see that leaving is worse than staying.

Oh, that will be the perfect  illustration why the UK is much better out of this camp .

Prove that assertion.

This isn't a game, despite what some politicians evidently believe.

I've lived in the USSR half of my life, there people trying to leave the country were shot at or sent to labour camps - all for the common good. Now EU starts to smell that way  .

Having been through the Berlin Wall several times, and having had family friends that crawled under the Iron Curtain to escape, your statement is completely unbelievable.

[Tepe]

When I voted to join what was then the EEC I never voted for Political union.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Feature_creep

Of course he did:
http://www.hri.org/docs/Rome57/Preamble.html
"Determined to lay the foundations of an ever closer union among the peoples of Europe"

[Zero999]

The only proper way to handle elections is to REQUIRE people to vote.  Singapore does that and I think it is because, on average, people want to maintain the status quo.  Nobody likes change.  Which, of course, supports your position.

Singapore is hardly an example of a functioning democracy. It's much closer to a dictatorship than any EU country.

Precisely. The debate was a national disgrace and made me ashamed to be British.

I agree.

[Galenbo]

I'm interested in what is going to happen in the next few years, as regards the EU. If any other significant player EU member countries also end up leaving. I think things will be far more likely to change, as regards the EU.

The 27 are motivated to crucify the UK, "pour encourager les autres" - i.e. let their population see that leaving is worse than staying.

Oh, that will be the perfect  illustration why the UK is much better out of this camp .

Nobody wants leaders that behave repressionist like that. If there's any pro-EU feeling left in me, it's because they create(d) a moderate basis for voluntary partnerships.
I wouldn't wonder if that kind of behavour puts undecided people in the "Leave" camp for the upcoming referenda (if not banned by then)

[apis]

I hope this can be contained as merely a political bloodbath. My fear is what happens when the disenfranchised brexiters realise that either (a) brexit will hit them harder than the establishment, or (b) that establishment politicians don't deliver what they promised. Neither is good for the democratic process.

That is what is worrying me as well, Cameron has created a lose-lose situation for everyone.

Welcome to the 1930s, in the Weimar Republic.

Why? Did you loose a long war and were blead dry by the winning countries?
Don't think so. Business will get back as usual but a bit less probably.

Yeah, there are similarities but not as bad as that. The UK will be OK, just a lot less so than if they had stayed in the union. For EU things will continue mostly as usual, the power balance within the EU will shift a little bit to the east, EU-oriented businesses will move from the UK to other EU-countries, creating jobs here, etc.

[apis]

It would be comparable to the UK people of today still holding a grudge against the romans or the Norse Vikings. Only conflict in the middle east even predates those expansionist wars. They are still fighting in the middle east over stuff that happened over a thousand years ago. All other civilisation moved forward they still live a thousand years in the past.

I think the more interesting question is why they fight. I think the biggest problem is that most people are poor and if you tell poor people to cut their neighbour's head of because he has a funny beard, a long nose or whatever then poor people will do that. I have no clear answer to stop the violence but it will take getting rid of the people turning people against eachother for their own gain (power trip), educating the general public and get the region the prospher somehow. But maybe we just have to let Darwin sort it out. At some point the people who want to fight have killed eachother so the genetically less inclined to fight will be the (more) peacefull leftovers.

If evolution is making us more peaceful we would be peace-loving care-bears already. If one looks at the history of the world objectively it will be very obvious that people can be genocidal, warmongering zealots whether they are from the Middle East, Americas, Africa, Asia, or Europe. In certain situations it's in our DNA apparently, so we need to set up the political systems to prevent situations that cause people to go bonkers.

[nctnico]

Germany is getting especially worried, as they may have to fork out huge amount of money, to keep the EU afloat. (That is my interpretation, anyway).

END OF THE EU? Germany warns FIVE more countries could leave Europe after Brexit

FIVE European countries may seek to follow Britain’s lead in leaving the EU in a Brexit domino effect, Germany has warned.

France, the Netherlands, Austria, Finland and Hungary could leave.

Since the Netherlands is one of the founders of the EU it is highly unlikely the NL will leave (as in never ever). The claim in the article that the referendum about the treaty with Ukraine was rejected overwhelmingly is simply not true. The referendum in the Netherlands barely met it's turn up threshold (2% over 30%) and the outcome was 61/38. But it also says 68% of the voters didn't care at all. Or -like me- didn't vote because they found the referendum a waste of time. The whole referendum was a big hoax staged by an alternative news website with videos of the neighbour's cats doing funny jumps which was about to be closed down by the owners due to lack of revenue. All in all I'd take the article with a large grain of salt.

[apis]

I'm interested in what is going to happen in the next few years, as regards the EU. If any other significant player EU member countries also end up leaving. I think things will be far more likely to change, as regards the EU.

The 27 are motivated to crucify the UK, "pour encourager les autres" - i.e. let their population see that leaving is worse than staying.

Oh, that will be the perfect  illustration why the UK is much better out of this camp .

If you stay, all your problems are because of the EU.
If you leave, all your problems are because of the EU.
How convenient.

[Alex Nikitin]

I'm interested in what is going to happen in the next few years, as regards the EU. If any other significant player EU member countries also end up leaving. I think things will be far more likely to change, as regards the EU.

The 27 are motivated to crucify the UK, "pour encourager les autres" - i.e. let their population see that leaving is worse than staying.

Oh, that will be the perfect  illustration why the UK is much better out of this camp .

Prove that assertion.

This isn't a game, despite what some politicians evidently believe.

I've lived in the USSR half of my life, there people trying to leave the country were shot at or sent to labour camps - all for the common good. Now EU starts to smell that way  .

Having been through the Berlin Wall several times, and having had family friends that crawled under the Iron Curtain to escape, your statement is completely unbelievable.

Out of curiosity - what exactly about my statement you find "completely unbelievable"? Or just all of it? It is accurate to the best of my (first-hand) knowledge. 

Cheers

Alex

[MK14]

Germany is getting especially worried, as they may have to fork out huge amount of money, to keep the EU afloat. (That is my interpretation, anyway).

END OF THE EU? Germany warns FIVE more countries could leave Europe after Brexit

FIVE European countries may seek to follow Britain’s lead in leaving the EU in a Brexit domino effect, Germany has warned.

France, the Netherlands, Austria, Finland and Hungary could leave.

Since the Netherlands is one of the founders of the EU it is highly unlikely the NL will leave (as in never ever). The claim in the article that the referendum about the treaty with Ukraine was rejected overwhelmingly is simply not true. The referendum in the Netherlands barely met it's turn up threshold (2% over 30%) and the outcome was 61/38. But it also says 68% of the voters didn't care at all. Or -like me- didn't vote because they found the referendum a waste of time. The whole referendum was a big hoax staged by an alternative news website with videos of the neighbour's cats doing funny jumps which was about to be closed down by the owners due to lack of revenue. All in all I'd take the article with a large grain of salt.

If you are not happy with my original source. This one is even harder hitting . . .

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/25/european-leaders-fear-brexit-vote-could-herald-eu-collapse-unles/