General > General Technical Chat
US Ceiling Fan Efficiency Rule Proposal
RJSV:
Thanks PwrElectronics:
First of all, nothing personal, I'm a very criticism filled EE.
(We gonna learn and hear about a myriad of Engineering issues, from the mouths of the barely educated. Now, if you think I'm out of line, bringing in the racial diversity dynamics, try figuring out who (may) be pushing for a DC fan style, (ignorant of engineering issues brought up here). Odds are, that person came out of school with a degree in 'Multi-ethnic Studies', and would reply with:
"AC, DC, smeecy"....you WILL comply.
Were you surprised, when that 'Gas Oven ban' wasn't a one-off thing? A glitch, never to happen again ?
In a real situation, (climate change disasters) we are going to need ENGINEERS doing the science. The whole 'diversity thing likely will get plugged in, with any large technology change (shoved down our throats).
thanks, there.
- - Rick
RJSV:
Yes, A DISMISSAL, quite a tired taktic being used these days, to avoid any substantive debate.
It's, 'too ridiculous' to even touch....next you should maybe say: (and again, a tired, dismissive phrase), SAY:
"You people seem to see a conspiracy behind every tree..."
But that would be baiting, after you stepped in the poo.
Sometimes you've got to wait, for the consequences to manifest.
What other 'delusion' accusing talking points do you have, because (we) can't just sit here calling each other a 'Ninny',
No, you're a ninny...back and forth. Why don't you, uh, hit us critical thinkers with some good attacks, rather than repeating same old dismissals.
Do you have a gas stove ? Try some effective 'gas lighting' so we can respect your dismissals as being valid.
Rejected yours.
gnuarm:
--- Quote from: bdunham7 on September 08, 2023, 08:14:51 pm ---
--- Quote from: RJSV on September 08, 2023, 08:06:23 pm ---Now, if you think I'm out of line, bringing in the racial diversity dynamics, try figuring out who (may) be pushing for a DC fan style, (ignorant of engineering issues brought up here).
--- End quote ---
Yes, I think that is way out of line and quite ridiculous.
--- End quote ---
I was going to say there's no way to show you don't consider a post appropriate to the forum... but there is a link to report the post to the moderator, which I have done. I hope others do as well.
Siwastaja:
--- Quote from: wraper on September 08, 2023, 02:26:39 pm ---BLDC is more reliable in general because there is no run capacitor that degrades and they do not heat nearly as much due to high efficiency. Shaded pole motor that is most common in AC fans on other hand is cheap but super inefficient, heats like hell and that heat kills bearings. Not surprising due to ~25% efficiency.
--- End quote ---
This matches with my experience. "Good old" cheap inefficient AC motors have failure modes such as destruction of run capacitor or destruction of bearings (oil) due to too high operating temperature. BLDC fan has all the chances to be much more reliable. Those that fail fast are outliers; I also strongly agree with bdunham7 that if and when governments apply laws mandating better efficiency, they should be coupled with better lifetime requirements, too.
Nominal Animal:
--- Quote from: Siwastaja on September 09, 2023, 05:56:15 am ---if and when governments apply laws mandating better efficiency, they should be coupled with better lifetime requirements, too.
--- End quote ---
True; that should ensure the quality.
Yet... When was the last time you remember lifetime requirements being extended?
Here in Finland, the climate is quite challenging for house builders, swinging from an occasional -40°C in coldest winters to +30°C during hottest summers.
Yet, the typical warranty period is only 5 years, and most houses are designed for only a 30 - 50 year lifetime.
Now that EU will require much, much higher energy efficiency for houses, they have not and will not address the warranty period or manufacturer/builder responsibility at all. Funny thing is, you could achieve the energy efficiencies easily, simply by making thicker walls. Apartment buildings built 100-150 years ago in Helsinki still fulfill even the strictest energy efficiency requirements, simply because they have walls half a meter thick of stone and concrete. That will not happen, because new is always better and "we can achieve the same energy efficiency with these layered plastic and insulator structures" (which will be first-rate grow zones for mold as the sharp temperature differences will cause water to condensate there, and there is no mechanism to dry it out). The apartment I'm renting right now, for example, has such an outer wall structure that if you were to screw anything into the outer wall, you'd compromise the vapourtight barriers and the outer wall, and possibly compromise the long-term stability of that outer wall altogether. This is relatively common in new buildings, too.
Thus, while longer lifetime requirement would obviously make the primary worries go away, I do not see such requirements happening at all.
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