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| "Veritasium" (YT) - "The Big Misconception About Electricity" ? |
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| penfold:
--- Quote from: aetherist on March 22, 2022, 06:59:21 pm --- --- Quote from: HuronKing on March 22, 2022, 06:02:00 pm ---And if you still don't believe me, I'll just refer you to C. Proteus Steinmetz who introduced complex numbers to electrical engineering in 1893 and, in doing so, massively revolutionized and simplified the solutions to engineering problems: https://kupdf.net/download/complex-quantities-and-their-use-in-electrical-engineering_5900f124dc0d60ae1f959ea1_pdf https://web.archive.org/web/20140105044817/http://zrno.fsb.hr/katedra/download/materijali/966.pdf --- End quote --- Interesting. Can anyone show me where Steinmetz believed that electricity is due to drifting electrons? Can anyone show me where Steinmetz believed that the transient impedance was the same animal as resistance? Steinmetz (stone mason) would have loved my new (electon) electricity, photons hugging a wire. Both of us were born in Germany. And our names end in z. But my back aint bent. --- End quote --- No, no, no... I thought we got to the "electricity" isn't due only to electrons, whether they drift, glide or skate point, yeah, it's also not only fields and there's a bit in the middle that we've not provided an answer to yet... doesn't mean an answer doesn't exist, just nobody has given it to you. Talking of Steinmetz... reminds me of magnetic losses... that's worth a look at with regard to electons, especially in soft-ferrite and iron powder type cores, EM properties of the bulk material, their heating under AC magnetic fields and temperature variations thereof do provide some results that fit very nicely within Drude type electron drift models... worth a look perhaps. It's not necesarily a fully closed proof of drift, but it narrows down the number of apparently free variables. |
| aetherist:
--- Quote from: penfold on March 22, 2022, 09:07:26 pm --- --- Quote from: aetherist on March 22, 2022, 06:59:21 pm --- --- Quote from: HuronKing on March 22, 2022, 06:02:00 pm ---And if you still don't believe me, I'll just refer you to C. Proteus Steinmetz who introduced complex numbers to electrical engineering in 1893 and, in doing so, massively revolutionized and simplified the solutions to engineering problems: https://kupdf.net/download/complex-quantities-and-their-use-in-electrical-engineering_5900f124dc0d60ae1f959ea1_pdf https://web.archive.org/web/20140105044817/http://zrno.fsb.hr/katedra/download/materijali/966.pdf --- End quote --- Interesting. Can anyone show me where Steinmetz believed that electricity is due to drifting electrons? Can anyone show me where Steinmetz believed that the transient impedance was the same animal as resistance? Steinmetz (stone mason) would have loved my new (electon) electricity, photons hugging a wire. Both of us were born in Germany. And our names end in z. But my back aint bent. --- End quote --- No, no, no... I thought we got to the "electricity" isn't due only to electrons, whether they drift, glide or skate point, yeah, it's also not only fields and there's a bit in the middle that we've not provided an answer to yet... doesn't mean an answer doesn't exist, just nobody has given it to you. Talking of Steinmetz... reminds me of magnetic losses... that's worth a look at with regard to electons, especially in soft-ferrite and iron powder type cores, EM properties of the bulk material, their heating under AC magnetic fields and temperature variations thereof do provide some results that fit very nicely within Drude type electron drift models... worth a look perhaps. It's not necesarily a fully closed proof of drift, but it narrows down the number of apparently free variables. --- End quote --- I am ok with drifting electrons inside a wire, & i am ok with drifting electrons causing heating & resistance & energy loss. But i aint ok with drifting electrons causing electricity. There is some talk of drifting electrons feeding a magnetic field back into the circuit or something – i will have to have a think about that. What did Steinmetz think of the electric energy being in the Poynting Field? I think Steinmetz agreed. |
| TimFox:
--- Quote from: aetherist on March 22, 2022, 09:24:11 pm ---What did Steinmetz think of the electric energy being in the Poynting Field? I think Steinmetz agreed. --- End quote --- That's a fair question to ask, but perhaps you can find something in Steinmetz' writings to back up your guess that "Steinmetz agreed", since you are treating him as an heroic source. |
| aetherist:
--- Quote from: TimFox on March 22, 2022, 09:37:14 pm --- --- Quote from: aetherist on March 22, 2022, 09:24:11 pm ---What did Steinmetz think of the electric energy being in the Poynting Field? I think Steinmetz agreed. --- End quote --- That's a fair question to ask, but perhaps you can find something in Steinmetz' writings to back up your guess that "Steinmetz agreed", since you are treating him as an heroic source. --- End quote --- I have some of his writings. And i have his 4 lectures. I will have to have a read. https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=mdp.39015078008185&view=page&seq=61&skin=2021 |
| HuronKing:
--- Quote from: aetherist on March 22, 2022, 08:37:43 pm ---Did Steinmetz believe in electrons? --- End quote --- Who cares? He died before he knew about the Pauli Exclusion Principle, the Dirac Equation, Wave-Particle Duality etc etc etc... Which means he did not know about electrons and photons to the extent we do now. If he believed in electrons, great! But he didn't know what we know now. If he didn't believe in electrons, that's okay too. It's not his fault he died before so much more was discovered about them. Whatever he believed about electrons is incomplete and irrelevant to our current understanding. Although, from a historical point of view, if you read his lectures on relativity you'll see he was very close to describing a proto-idea of quantum field theory. This is like asking if Newton believed in galaxies... --- Quote ---Did Steinmetz believe that electricity was due to drifting electrons inside a wire? --- End quote --- Who cares? --- Quote ---It appears that Steinmetz was an Einsteinist in that Steinmetz believed that the speed of light was a constant. --- End quote --- LOL are you choosing to ignore the evidence of your own eyes? Steinmetz delivered 4 scathing lectures in which he went through all of special relativity and general relativity. He was into the whole thing, hardcore. I'm surprised you weren't aware of how thoroughly he shreds ether to pieces. --- Quote ---What would Steinmetz have thort about DeWitte finding that the speed of electricity is not a constant (coax cables)? --- End quote --- Steinmetz knew that dielectrics affect the speed of light - it's not light in a vacuum anymore... --- Quote ---What would Steinmetz have thort about new (electon) electricity? --- End quote --- Krapp. Next? :scared: |
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