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Veritasium -- How Special Relativity Makes Magnets Work.

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aetherist:

--- Quote from: TimFox on April 03, 2022, 09:16:52 pm ---Drifting electrons and holes make transistors work.
Flying electrons make vacuum tubes work.
--- End quote ---
Yes, i am ok with drifting electrons making transistors work. And flying electrons too.
But how do drifting electrons in a wire know that the wire is or isnt insulated?

aetherist:

--- Quote from: dunkemhigh on April 03, 2022, 09:21:36 pm ---
--- Quote from: aetherist on April 03, 2022, 08:56:01 pm ---
--- Quote from: dunkemhigh on April 03, 2022, 10:52:33 am ---
--- Quote ---Old (electron) electricity can't explain how insulation lowers the speed of electricity on a wire
--- End quote ---
How do you know?
--- End quote ---
I know throo my own searches over a few months that there has not been any satisfactory or reasonable explanation.
I know throo my own reasoning that there can be no satisfactory or reasonable explanation.

--- End quote ---
That's strange because through my own searches over a few years and with my own reasoning I came to the opposite conclusion to you. But I can spell properly, so clearly my opinion is the more thoughtful and, hence, correct one.
--- End quote ---
A wonderful achievement. Congratulations. Have u told anyone of your explanation of how drifting electrons in a wire know whether the wire is insulated? And how exactly they adjust their speed or something?

TimFox:

--- Quote from: aetherist on April 03, 2022, 09:26:35 pm ---
--- Quote from: TimFox on April 03, 2022, 09:16:52 pm ---Drifting electrons and holes make transistors work.
Flying electrons make vacuum tubes work.
--- End quote ---
Yes, i am ok with drifting electrons making transistors work. And flying electrons too.
But how do drifting electrons in a wire know that the wire is or isnt insulated?

--- End quote ---
In a coaxial cable, see how the dielectric effects the speed of propagation of the voltage from center conductor to coaxial shield in any normal textbook.
In such a cable, the relevant variables as a function of time at a given plane cutting the cable are the voltage from center to outer conductors, and the net current in the center conductor.
Note that the coaxial transmission line is a generalization of Heaviside's triumphant demonstration of adding inductive loading with lumped-constant inductors to telegraph lines.
A commercial cable (e.g., RG-58/U) is an example of a good transmission line.  An insulated wire in an undefined environment (like from the bench to the floor) is a crummy ill-defined transmission line.

aetherist:

--- Quote from: TimFox on April 03, 2022, 09:37:24 pm ---
--- Quote from: aetherist on April 03, 2022, 09:26:35 pm ---
--- Quote from: TimFox on April 03, 2022, 09:16:52 pm ---Drifting electrons and holes make transistors work.
Flying electrons make vacuum tubes work.
--- End quote ---
Yes, i am ok with drifting electrons making transistors work. And flying electrons too.
But how do drifting electrons in a wire know that the wire is or isnt insulated?
--- End quote ---
In a coaxial cable, see how the dielectric effects the speed of propagation of the voltage from center conductor to coaxial shield in any normal textbook.
In such a cable, the relevant variables as a function of time at a given plane cutting the cable are the voltage from center to outer conductors, and the net current in the center conductor.
Note that the coaxial transmission line is a generalization of Heaviside's triumphant demonstration of adding inductive loading with lumped-constant inductors to telegraph lines.
A commercial cable (e.g., RG-58/U) is an example of a good transmission line.  An insulated wire in an undefined environment (like from the bench to the floor) is a crummy ill-defined transmission line.
--- End quote ---

There is still no explanation of how internal drifting electrons (in the central wire in the coax)(& in the ordinary wire that is not a coax) change their speed, or the speed of the wavefront, based on
(1) whether there is internal dielectric (in the coax), or
(2) whether there is external insulation on the outside of the shield of the coax, or
(3) whether there is insulation on the outside of an ordinary wire.

Which raises an interesting question. What is the speed of electricity along a coax if the outer shield duznt have insulation on the outside?
I think that the speed of electricity along the central wire would depend on the speed of electricity in the dielectric (usually 2c/3).
And the speed along the outer shield would be the speed of electricity in air (ie c/1).
Two different speeds. Fast going out, slow coming back.

TimFox:

--- Quote from: aetherist on April 03, 2022, 10:36:38 pm ---
--- Quote from: TimFox on April 03, 2022, 09:37:24 pm ---
--- Quote from: aetherist on April 03, 2022, 09:26:35 pm ---
--- Quote from: TimFox on April 03, 2022, 09:16:52 pm ---Drifting electrons and holes make transistors work.
Flying electrons make vacuum tubes work.
--- End quote ---
Yes, i am ok with drifting electrons making transistors work. And flying electrons too.
But how do drifting electrons in a wire know that the wire is or isnt insulated?
--- End quote ---
In a coaxial cable, see how the dielectric effects the speed of propagation of the voltage from center conductor to coaxial shield in any normal textbook.
In such a cable, the relevant variables as a function of time at a given plane cutting the cable are the voltage from center to outer conductors, and the net current in the center conductor.
Note that the coaxial transmission line is a generalization of Heaviside's triumphant demonstration of adding inductive loading with lumped-constant inductors to telegraph lines.
A commercial cable (e.g., RG-58/U) is an example of a good transmission line.  An insulated wire in an undefined environment (like from the bench to the floor) is a crummy ill-defined transmission line.
--- End quote ---

There is still no explanation of how internal drifting electrons (in the central wire in the coax)(& in the ordinary wire that is not a coax) change their speed, or the speed of the wavefront, based on
(1) whether there is internal dielectric (in the coax), or
(2) whether there is external insulation on the outside of the shield of the coax, or
(3) whether there is insulation on the outside of an ordinary wire.

Which raises an interesting question. What is the speed of electricity along a coax if the outer shield duznt have insulation on the outside?
I think that the speed of electricity along the central wire would depend on the speed of electricity in the dielectric (usually 2c/3).
And the speed along the outer shield would be the speed of electricity in air (ie c/1).
Two different speeds. Fast going out, slow coming back.

--- End quote ---

In a transmission line, the observable variables are the voltage across and the current down the cable, that I discussed in my reply.
That is "electricity" moving through the cable.  The electrons respond in their own manner.

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