General > General Technical Chat
we need traffic lights for satellites
<< < (4/17) > >>
SparkyFX:

--- Quote from: Psi on September 04, 2019, 09:04:59 am ---But maybe a TCAS system like planes use could work.
Where the satellites can take their own action to move out of the way in opposite directions if they sense a proximity issue.
--- End quote ---
The orbital mechanics require satellites to take action while on the other side of the orbit the potential collision would occur, at least that is the location where you get the biggest change of height in the shortest time with the lowest amount of fuel.
You could move a satellite sideways (change its inclination), but it would cost lots of fuel for very little change.

So there is no direct line of sight/communication and for proximity based systems this would be too late, as most satellite thrusters do not have a lot of thrust (provide only a small fraction of the weight of the satellite, making this a very slow process). They are built for small corrections that need to take place at the right time.

As far as i understood it, TCAS in planes more or less assumes all others stay on their course on their altitude (as in a circular orbit), satellites do not necessarily have to have a circular orbit, making the calculations and detection way more complex.

Video about collisions in space and collision avoidance:
nuclearcat:

--- Quote from: SparkyFX on September 04, 2019, 04:01:47 pm ---
--- Quote from: Psi on September 04, 2019, 09:04:59 am ---But maybe a TCAS system like planes use could work.
Where the satellites can take their own action to move out of the way in opposite directions if they sense a proximity issue.
--- End quote ---
The orbital mechanics require satellites to take action while on the other side of the orbit the potential collision would occur, at least that is the location where you get the biggest change of height in the shortest time with the lowest amount of fuel.
You could move a satellite sideways (change its inclination), but it would cost lots of fuel for very little change.

So there is no direct line of sight/communication and for proximity based systems this would be too late, as most satellite thrusters do not have a lot of thrust (provide only a small fraction of the weight of the satellite, making this a very slow process). They are built for small corrections that need to take place at the right time.

As far as i understood it, TCAS in planes more or less assumes all others stay on their course on their altitude (as in a circular orbit), satellites do not necessarily have to have a circular orbit, making the calculations and detection way more complex.

Video about collisions in space and collision avoidance:


--- End quote ---
I think it is quite simple, if satellites able to get their position anyhow (GPS on orbit?). They need few points and its enough to build TLE. Send it to ground stations across the globe, and they will assist this "satellite-TCAS", same as flight dispatchers.
The only difference is that the satellite is better to start the maneuver in advance. For example, Starlink is very slow to move.
Dispatchers can also help to plan orbit movements.
klunkerbus:
I seem to recall that the Kessler Syndrome from the 70's suggested it was just a matter of time before LEO became a disaster zone.
Mr. Scram:

--- Quote from: timgiles on September 04, 2019, 09:53:08 am ---I still find it hard to believe in a three dimensional space (spherical skin with depth of x meters or kms) the size of the earths diameter plus a tiny bit - that satellites really get that close to each other - ever! Unless they are programmed to do so (conspiracy theory time!).

Am I wrong? Please help my old grey matter understand if so. I just dont see it happening. Sure, space debris, but that is many many magnitudes higher density.

--- End quote ---
Aviation safety used to depend on exactly that reasoning. Then flying became more popular and people started dying.
m98:
There really should be some kind of space traffic control a commercial satellite operator should have to stay in touch with to coordinate maneuvering.
Navigation
Message Index
Next page
Previous page
There was an error while thanking
Thanking...

Go to full version
Powered by SMFPacks Advanced Attachments Uploader Mod