General > General Technical Chat
UPDATED: Well... looks like I've l̶o̶s̶t̶ won the battle against scam callers
Halcyon:
I don't know the technical details of how number spoofing works/is prevented, but I've never seen a spoofed number appear on my carriers network (Telstra). Whatever controls they have in-place seem to be working. I can't speak of the other carriers though, as I've never used them.
All of the spam/scam calls I receive are usually from the same block of numbers, which are obviously VoIP services connected to the normal telco network, so the numbers are real, they just have incoming call restrictions enabled so you can't call them back.
Some legitimate companies route all their outbound calls so they appear to come from their main number, which is fine. The way the trunk is set up means they can only "spoof" that number that belongs to them and no one else as it's done at the network level.
SMS spoofing is entirely different but it's something the carriers are working on. Like CID spoofing, I've never seen a spoofed SMS on Telstra's network. Maybe it's something that plagues the cheaper MVNOs? I don't know for certain. There seems to be new rules surrounding this for anyone who wants a read: https://www.commsalliance.com.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0015/72150/C661_2022.pdf
gnuarm:
--- Quote from: Halcyon on August 04, 2023, 12:45:17 am ---I don't know the technical details of how number spoofing works/is prevented, but I've never seen a spoofed number appear on my carriers network (Telstra). Whatever controls they have in-place seem to be working. I can't speak of the other carriers though, as I've never used them.
--- End quote ---
How do you know the number is spoofed or not? Do you ever get calls from someone with a thick Indian accent, offering you insurance for "final expenses"? Actually, that's likely only for people of certain ages, so maybe not. If you do, and it's not an overseas call, you've been spoofed.
--- Quote ---All of the spam/scam calls I receive are usually from the same block of numbers, which are obviously VoIP services connected to the normal telco network, so the numbers are real, they just have incoming call restrictions enabled so you can't call them back.
--- End quote ---
How do you know any of this? I think you are kidding yourself.
Halcyon:
--- Quote from: gnuarm on August 04, 2023, 12:52:05 am ---
--- Quote from: Halcyon on August 04, 2023, 12:45:17 am ---I don't know the technical details of how number spoofing works/is prevented, but I've never seen a spoofed number appear on my carriers network (Telstra). Whatever controls they have in-place seem to be working. I can't speak of the other carriers though, as I've never used them.
--- End quote ---
How do you know the number is spoofed or not? Do you ever get calls from someone with a thick Indian accent, offering you insurance for "final expenses"? Actually, that's likely only for people of certain ages, so maybe not. If you do, and it's not an overseas call, you've been spoofed.
--- Quote ---All of the spam/scam calls I receive are usually from the same block of numbers, which are obviously VoIP services connected to the normal telco network, so the numbers are real, they just have incoming call restrictions enabled so you can't call them back.
--- End quote ---
How do you know any of this? I think you are kidding yourself.
--- End quote ---
It's easy to see whether a number is a VoIP service or not. There are plenty of lookup tools that give you information about a number, it's rough geographical location, etc...
Also, how do I know this? Simple, look at the number. 99% of the scam calls I've received originate from numbers in the +61 2 5119 2xxx, +61 2 725x xxxx and +61 2 9564 7xxx blocks of numbers. They aren't random nor are they spoofed numbers belonging to someone else, if they were, they'd be pretty bloody obvious.
Whether they have an Indian accent or not is irrelevant. You don't need to be in Australia to use an Australian VoIP service/number. There's this thing called the internet which allows you to use those services from anywhere in the world. For example, you yourself can jump on Skype right now and register your own telephone number in just about any country in the world.
https://support.skype.com/en/faq/FA269/in-which-countries-are-skype-numbers-available
So it's a little rude to suggest that I'm "kidding myself" with no basis.
gnuarm:
--- Quote from: Halcyon on August 04, 2023, 01:09:12 am ---
--- Quote from: gnuarm on August 04, 2023, 12:52:05 am ---
--- Quote from: Halcyon on August 04, 2023, 12:45:17 am ---I don't know the technical details of how number spoofing works/is prevented, but I've never seen a spoofed number appear on my carriers network (Telstra). Whatever controls they have in-place seem to be working. I can't speak of the other carriers though, as I've never used them.
--- End quote ---
How do you know the number is spoofed or not? Do you ever get calls from someone with a thick Indian accent, offering you insurance for "final expenses"? Actually, that's likely only for people of certain ages, so maybe not. If you do, and it's not an overseas call, you've been spoofed.
--- Quote ---All of the spam/scam calls I receive are usually from the same block of numbers, which are obviously VoIP services connected to the normal telco network, so the numbers are real, they just have incoming call restrictions enabled so you can't call them back.
--- End quote ---
How do you know any of this? I think you are kidding yourself.
--- End quote ---
It's easy to see whether a number is a VoIP service or not. There are plenty of lookup tools that give you information about a number, it's rough geographical location, etc...
Also, how do I know this? Simple, look at the number. 99% of the scam calls I've received originate from numbers in the +61 2 5119 2xxx, +61 2 725x xxxx and +61 2 9564 7xxx blocks of numbers. They aren't random nor are they spoofed numbers belonging to someone else, if they were, they'd be pretty bloody obvious.
Whether they have an Indian accent or not is irrelevant. You don't need to be in Australia to use an Australian VoIP service/number. There's this thing called the internet which allows you to use those services from anywhere in the world. For example, you yourself can jump on Skype right now and register your own telephone number in just about any country in the world.
https://support.skype.com/en/faq/FA269/in-which-countries-are-skype-numbers-available
So it's a little rude to suggest that I'm "kidding myself" with no basis.
--- End quote ---
So you don't get spam calls from your own area code? You are one in a thousand.
But, I'm sorry that you understand so little of what I've said. The phone number reported on your caller ID has nothing to do with where the call originates.
Halcyon:
--- Quote from: gnuarm on August 04, 2023, 02:34:59 am ---So you don't get spam calls from your own area code? You are one in a thousand.
But, I'm sorry that you understand so little of what I've said. The phone number reported on your caller ID has nothing to do with where the call originates.
--- End quote ---
This is exactly what I said (read my last post).
It seems that you're the one who has little understanding. Let me enlighten you. Australia doesn't use "area codes" in the traditional sense. Those were largely abolished a long time ago when we went to 8-digit telephone numbers (10 if you include the state (or STD) code). The first two digits in a fixed line phone number designates the state (02 is New South Wales and ACT for example). This "area code" (if you like) is optional when you're dialling within your own state. Whether it's a VoIP service or a landline phone, the equipment is present in that state and connects to an exchange there (with some exceptions for border towns). To give you some understanding of how big an area we're talking about, the state of New South Wales (where I live) covers an area of over 800,000 square kilometers. Travelling from the east-most point to the west-most point is over 1000 kilometers.
In some cases, the first (and sometimes the second) digit of the phone number itself might loosely define a more narrower geographic area (like a council area or a county) but that's more of a throw-back from the old days. It's not a reliable method of determining where a call is coming from anymore.
Mobile numbers always start with 04; Landlines never do.
If you take the numbers I gave in my example, they loosely align to numbers based in Sydney but they could be anywhere else in the state. "Sydney" could be a few kilometers down the road, or 100 kilometers away.
So no, I don't get spam calls from my own area code since they don't really exist anymore. In fact, some scam calls I've received in the past are from another block of VoIP numbers based in entirely different states.
The only reason scammers use VoIP services based in Australia (and other countries) is so they appear "more legitimate" compared to say, an international number originating from India, or a blocked number with no caller ID. Most people would simply not answer those calls are they are out of the ordinary (and expensive for the scammers to place the call). Scammers are actually buying/leasing these services as they are relatively cheap, they don't spoof them (not here anyway). Some scammers will even go as far as operating "pop up" call centres physically in the country, I have seen this myself.
As I mentioned before, telcos are taking action against caller-ID spoofing and whilst I don't know the in-depth technical details about the mechanisms, I would say it's largely impossible to do on today's infrastructure (at least, without the telco's cooperation). How telephone networks operate outside of Australia, I don't know.
SMS spoofing is an entirely different topic. That does happen, at least on some networks.
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