### Author Topic: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"  (Read 1809 times)

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#### imo

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##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"
« Reply #50 on: October 21, 2019, 09:37:28 pm »
..Unfortunately for that position, many restaurants now have menus containing prices like £4.5 instead of £4.50.
I don't like it, but it isn't wrong.
Soon it will be £5

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#### Zero999

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##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"
« Reply #51 on: October 21, 2019, 09:45:33 pm »
The Verizon Math thing I linked above exemplifies precisely the confusion that dumb people get into with decimals in currency. That’s why we exactly should not be teaching that the decimal point denotes a change in denomination.
That's how I always thought of it and never had any problems. A hundred pennies in a pound, so £1.50 means one pound and fifty pence. No one would say "one point five pounds", even though it would still be right.

Unfortunately for that position, many restaurants now have menus containing prices like £4.5 instead of £4.50.

I don't like it, but it isn't wrong.
Where? I eat out regularly and have never seen that before.

#### rsjsouza

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##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"
« Reply #52 on: October 21, 2019, 10:07:37 pm »
Unfortunately for that position, many restaurants now have menus containing prices like £4.5 instead of £4.50.

I don't like it, but it isn't wrong.
Where? I eat out regularly and have never seen that before.
Upscale or "in" places... I surely don't see these in mom and pop's restaurants.

To the main question... I say "point fifteen", just like I would in my mother language.
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Oh, the "whys" of the datasheets... The information is there not to be an axiomatic truth, but instead each speck of data must be slowly inhaled while carefully performing a deep search inside oneself to find the true metaphysical sense...

#### tggzzz

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##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"
« Reply #53 on: October 21, 2019, 11:02:34 pm »
Unfortunately for that position, many restaurants now have menus containing prices like £4.5 instead of £4.50.

I don't like it, but it isn't wrong.
Where? I eat out regularly and have never seen that before.
Upscale or "in" places... I surely don't see these in mom and pop's restaurants.

Precisely. A few examples, not mom 'n' pop, but not high end. Hipster maybe...
https://www.theathenian.co.uk/price-list

Quote
To the main question... I say "point fifteen", just like I would in my mother language.

And for x.015%?
There are lies, damned lies, statistics - and ADC/DAC specs.
Glider pilot's aphorism: "there is no substitute for span". Retort: "There is a substitute: skill+imagination. But you can buy span".
Having fun doing more, with less

#### Tomorokoshi

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##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"
« Reply #54 on: October 21, 2019, 11:27:32 pm »
...
And for x.015%?

"X point fifteen per mill."

#### Brumby

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##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"
« Reply #55 on: October 21, 2019, 11:33:43 pm »
..Unfortunately for that position, many restaurants now have menus containing prices like £4.5 instead of £4.50.
I don't like it, but it isn't wrong.

I'd call it "wrong".

No matter how mathematically correct not doing so may be, I would like to think providing two decimal digits is simply the civilised way to express currency amounts.  Leaving it without the trailing zero is, IMHO, a simple result of lazy spreadsheet habits.

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#### Brumby

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##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"
« Reply #56 on: October 21, 2019, 11:35:31 pm »
On a tangent, does anyone have a problem if you see a price of something sold at, for example, a rate of $1.2475 per kg? #### rs20 • Super Contributor • Posts: 2163 • Country: ##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent" « Reply #57 on: October 21, 2019, 11:46:57 pm » On a tangent, does anyone have a problem if you see a price of something sold at, for example, a rate of$1.2475 per kg?

That sort of thing is an absolute necessity, especially when dealing with SMD resistors and other things that can cost less than a cent each.

#### rsjsouza

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##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"
« Reply #58 on: October 22, 2019, 02:33:44 am »
Unfortunately for that position, many restaurants now have menus containing prices like £4.5 instead of £4.50.

I don't like it, but it isn't wrong.
Where? I eat out regularly and have never seen that before.
Upscale or "in" places... I surely don't see these in mom and pop's restaurants.

Precisely. A few examples, not mom 'n' pop, but not high end. Hipster maybe...
That's the word I was looking for! I also have seen places without decimal places altogether. I think it gives the impression that one is too cool to care for small change...

To the main question... I say "point fifteen", just like I would in my mother language.

And for x.015%?
Point zero fifteen. It is all a colloquialism, really. Besides, in portuguese it would be the correct decimal separator comma. <duck and run>
Vbe - vídeo blog eletrônico http://videos.vbeletronico.com

Oh, the "whys" of the datasheets... The information is there not to be an axiomatic truth, but instead each speck of data must be slowly inhaled while carefully performing a deep search inside oneself to find the true metaphysical sense...

#### KL27x

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##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"
« Reply #59 on: October 22, 2019, 04:40:24 am »
Quote
Quote from: tggzzz on Yesterday at 09:29:48 pm
..Unfortunately for that position, many restaurants now have menus containing prices like £4.5 instead of £4.50.
I don't like it, but it isn't wrong.

I'd call it "wrong".
We'll never get rid of the penny, even after physical cash is gone and a loaf of bread costs 40 dollars.

#### tggzzz

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##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"
« Reply #60 on: October 22, 2019, 08:27:42 am »
...
And for x.015%?

"X point fifteen per mill."

If someone said that to me I would have to ask them what they meant, because I wouldn't have a clue. Or simply ignore the number as being to boring to think about
There are lies, damned lies, statistics - and ADC/DAC specs.
Glider pilot's aphorism: "there is no substitute for span". Retort: "There is a substitute: skill+imagination. But you can buy span".
Having fun doing more, with less

#### tggzzz

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##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"
« Reply #61 on: October 22, 2019, 08:31:16 am »
..Unfortunately for that position, many restaurants now have menus containing prices like £4.5 instead of £4.50.
I don't like it, but it isn't wrong.

I'd call it "wrong".

No matter how mathematically correct not doing so may be, I would like to think providing two decimal digits is simply the civilised way to express currency amounts.  Leaving it without the trailing zero is, IMHO, a simple result of lazy spreadsheet habits.

In restaurants it is more likely a hipster fashion statement. I very much doubt that any spreadsheet would come up with a number that precise, nor that any number would simply be copied to a menu.
There are lies, damned lies, statistics - and ADC/DAC specs.
Glider pilot's aphorism: "there is no substitute for span". Retort: "There is a substitute: skill+imagination. But you can buy span".
Having fun doing more, with less

#### GeorgeOfTheJungle

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##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"
« Reply #62 on: October 22, 2019, 08:47:35 am »
When you are dealing with the decimal point you have entered the realm of scientific notation

Not really, that would be 1.5e-1 or 15e-2 !
#include <unistd.h>
int main (void) { while (1) fork(); }

#### Zero999

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##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"
« Reply #63 on: October 22, 2019, 09:31:08 am »
Unfortunately for that position, many restaurants now have menus containing prices like £4.5 instead of £4.50.

I don't like it, but it isn't wrong.
Where? I eat out regularly and have never seen that before.
Upscale or "in" places... I surely don't see these in mom and pop's restaurants.

Precisely. A few examples, not mom 'n' pop, but not high end. Hipster maybe...
https://www.theathenian.co.uk/price-list
That's terrible, apart from the one which is just in pounds, which is definitely acceptable. There's no mention of the currency. I'd love to troll them by paying in Euros and give them €4.05, where it says 4.5.

#### Fraser

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##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"
« Reply #64 on: October 22, 2019, 09:59:35 am »
Do not forget the following ways of saying, for example 0.015....

“Zero point Zero One Five”

“Naught point Zero One Five”

“Naught point Oh One Five”

“Zero Decimal Zero One Five”

There are many ways to say the same thing. The rule is to ensure the audience understands the terms used

Fraser

« Last Edit: October 22, 2019, 10:01:39 am by Fraser »

#### tooki

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##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"
« Reply #65 on: October 22, 2019, 02:36:54 pm »
The Verizon Math thing I linked above exemplifies precisely the confusion that dumb people get into with decimals in currency. That’s why we exactly should not be teaching that the decimal point denotes a change in denomination.
That's how I always thought of it and never had any problems. A hundred pennies in a pound, so £1.50 means one pound and fifty pence. No one would say "one point five pounds", even though it would still be right. In the olden days there used to be 240 pennies in a pound, but only really old people remember that.
The problem is when the need arises to discuss fractional amounts of the smaller unit. Many people don’t truly understand the broader concept of the decimal, so when you talk about a fractional penny, their brain short circuits and you get Verizon Math, where 5 customer “service” reps in a row could not understand the difference between “\$0.002” and “0.002¢”. To them, the decimal place itself cemented the units as dollars to the left and cents to the right of the decimal, regardless of which unit they actually uttered. That’s why I think we should not be expressly teaching that the decimal point is a unit delimiter, because a decimal can be used to subdivide any unit, even one without named subunits.

I know, we shouldn’t have to think about such absurd misinterpretations of basic math concepts, but in practice, we do.

#### tooki

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##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"
« Reply #66 on: October 22, 2019, 02:47:18 pm »
The Verizon Math thing I linked above exemplifies precisely the confusion that dumb people get into with decimals in currency. That’s why we exactly should not be teaching that the decimal point denotes a change in denomination.
That's how I always thought of it and never had any problems. A hundred pennies in a pound, so £1.50 means one pound and fifty pence. No one would say "one point five pounds", even though it would still be right.

Unfortunately for that position, many restaurants now have menus containing prices like £4.5 instead of £4.50.

I don't like it, but it isn't wrong.
Where? I eat out regularly and have never seen that before.
It’s very common in posh venues, or places that wishfully pretend they are. So far, I’ve encountered it in 4 countries that I can remember (USA, UK, CH, and F), so I’m thinking it’s here to stay.

While I appreciate the mathematical correctness of it, I just find it so silly and pretentious that to me, it slightly downgrades the place.

(Note that I don’t mind omitted cents if all the prices are integers. Here in CH, on menus and signs with items that have cents, you often see the integer prices written as “4.–”, which I find rather elegant, as it’s much easier to skim than “.00”)

..Unfortunately for that position, many restaurants now have menus containing prices like £4.5 instead of £4.50.
I don't like it, but it isn't wrong.

I'd call it "wrong".

No matter how mathematically correct not doing so may be, I would like to think providing two decimal digits is simply the civilised way to express currency amounts.  Leaving it without the trailing zero is, IMHO, a simple result of lazy spreadsheet habits.
Oh, believe me, it’s highly deliberate.

As tggzzz said, it’s definitely a hipster statement: “We’re too cool for zeros.”

#### rs20

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##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"
« Reply #67 on: October 22, 2019, 10:23:14 pm »
There are many ways to say the same thing. The rule is to ensure the audience understands the terms used

A nice rule but i hold myself. to a higher standad than that its not enuf for the audience to eventually piece together what you mean it should; also be as effortless and smooth to understand as wel

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#### Brumby

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##### Re: Pronouncing 0.15% as "Point fifteen percent" instead of "Point one five percent"
« Reply #68 on: Yesterday at 02:11:06 am »
..Unfortunately for that position, many restaurants now have menus containing prices like £4.5 instead of £4.50.
I don't like it, but it isn't wrong.

I'd call it "wrong".

No matter how mathematically correct not doing so may be, I would like to think providing two decimal digits is simply the civilised way to express currency amounts.  Leaving it without the trailing zero is, IMHO, a simple result of lazy spreadsheet habits.
Oh, believe me, it’s highly deliberate.

As tggzzz said, it’s definitely a hipster statement: “We’re too cool for zeros.”

I could ask: "What is the world coming to?"....

.... but I don't think I want to know.

Smf