General > General Technical Chat

What if someone is WRONG on this forum?

<< < (14/27) > >>

tggzzz:

--- Quote from: wilfred on December 27, 2023, 11:19:42 am ---And trolling in my view is NOT the same as repeatedly being wrong. Trolling is different in that the troll seeks to advance both sides of an argument simply to provoke angry responses. They can be completely indifferent to right or wrong. If you're aggressively wrong you might be a dickhead but not a troll.

--- End quote ---

Precisely.

Awkward question: should someone be allowed to continue beligerantly encouraging other people (especially beginners) to do things that are generally acknowledged to be dangerous?

watchmaker:
The mistake you made was saying "one doesn't reply to rhetoric".

[/quote]

Dave,

I may be a newbie, but I am old enough to know the power of bullshit. To be clear, I grew up when Republicans and Democrats went to the same worship centers.

In the old days, you could ignore nonsense because it had no place to propagate short of the KKK or John Birch.  But if it is publicly unchallenged, you wind up with post WWI Italy. 

Rhetoric MUST be refuted.  Will the refutation do any good today? Likely not.  In the 1980s, I had to build a conceptual model of persuasion.  Sensory stuff at birth, basic learning theory, beliefs, values, attitudes and SOURCE.  In those days source meant a trusted community member.  Which meant someone you touch and feel and who had to face the community every day.

Today, that source is an internet influencer with high likes.  Further, the social media bubbles mean "the community" shares and ENFORCES a common set of values and attitudes.  It is important to note I do not mention facts.  Cognitive acquisition is filtered by all the above prior to acceptance.  Parents especially are no longer trusted sources compared to "influencers".

I think you are asking the right questions.  The question is to how to be effective.

EEVBLOG is a community.  It shares a set of beliefs, values, attitudes and even facts.  You and several others are trusted sources.  The extent to which the community enforces it's shared culture is beyond my pay grade.  I will say that rigid forum policies have resulted in power things that led to collapse.  The policy here is seems to have worked.

I propose two strategies.  First, it is possible to provide "known trusted source" tags next to a poster's ID.  There are social psyc reasons I do not suggest going negative.  It can turn into a nightmare.

Secondly, as a newbie, it may well be useful to provide a sticky on the Beginners page (Repair as well?) that first off explains safety for beginners; and secondly how to read posts and interpret the "trusted source" tag.  I already do this via the "SuperContributor/Administrator" tags.

An analogy of safety for beginners.  I have been trained to OSHA standards in chainsaw (including falling).  The certification course are not intended to make you perfect. They are intended to increase your chance of survival when you make a mistake (after which you do a post mortem and LEARN).

It took me three days to sort thru basic grounding and ESD mitigation.  ESD was after my time in class, and grounding I wanted to refresh.  Basic safety would include these as well as define earthing vs circuit ground.  It could also hit how international and historical variations of power distribution can impact this.

Perhaps as simple as link to a EEVBLOG video?

After that, I think your ethical/moral concerns are addressed.  You are keeping the forum public, directing newbies to vetted information about how to minimize injury as we learn, and how to interpret the community's acceptance of individual posts via the trusted source marker.

This took some time to write and I know it is taking time to read. But this has been one of the only two useful and enjoyable forums of which I was a member.  And I first used listservs in 1995!

THANKS to all who make this forum work.

Dewey




watchmaker:

--- Quote from: spork on December 27, 2023, 01:20:22 pm ---
--- Quote from: watchmaker on December 27, 2023, 01:16:46 pm ---I may be a newbie, but I am old enough to know the power of bullshit. To be clear, I grew up in the US long before Gore invented the Internet.

--- End quote ---

Yeah - Gore never made any such claim.

--- End quote ---

I removed the irony for clarity.  Thanks!

And for the helluvit,  I was using DARPAnet at UVA in 1982.

watchmaker:
I used to have this on the cabinet next to my computer but lost it in the move.  I used it to explain to my kid.  Published in the New Yorker in 1993 by Peter Steiner, 1993.

I THINK this is permitted by use but if not let me know.

tggzzz:

--- Quote from: spork on December 27, 2023, 01:18:43 pm ---
--- Quote from: hans on December 27, 2023, 07:46:55 am ---To be honest this forum does feel unmoderated at times, where some infamous "nutcases" will be ridiculed and bashed to virtual death.

--- End quote ---

It's the only way to go in my opinion.  The only thing I'd change is to get rid of the scare-quotes on "nutcases".

--- End quote ---

Indeed.

Some views need to be vigorously and unambiguously "challenged". People that repeatedly propose such views should be forcibly challenged.

Example, in the form of an analogy that appears to have some validity since it is becoming repeated more frequently by more posters on this forum. Anybody that advocates - especially to inexperienced beginners - the equivalent of "I have run into the road many times without looking and not come to any harm. Therefore it isn't dangerous and you can do it too". Yes, there are such posts, and the proponents typically refuse to understand[1] the points made in multiple authoratative publications.

Should such perps be banned? Probably not. But it is essential that they are challenged and their ignorance is ridiculed before people/property are harmed.

[1] or even read, or are incapable of understanding, or are simply trolls.

Navigation

[0] Message Index

[#] Next page

[*] Previous page

There was an error while thanking
Thanking...
Go to full version
Powered by SMFPacks Advanced Attachments Uploader Mod