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What is a good about Covid 19 related?
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bd139:
It’s amazing how much damage you can do to society via WhatsApp.
SiliconWizard:

--- Quote from: petert on March 31, 2020, 06:38:26 am ---It is not as clear cut anymore, as when people were farmers and grew food. In other words, just because you are forced to work, does not necessarily mean you really contribute to society, even if you pay taxes. The net result for society may be negative, depending on your employer and motivations.

--- End quote ---

That's quite right, and I don't think it just depends on the employer. It depends on the kind of job it is, the activity of the company, the field itself, and many complex factors.

I do agree these days that more activities than we think have a net negative result. Many jobs are actually useless or even damaging in the big picture, whereas almost everyone is convinced that by merely having a job, we contribute positively.

Kasper:

--- Quote from: SerieZ on March 31, 2020, 08:33:24 am ---:-DD [...] brain melted yet by the sharlatans who promise magic handouts and infinite wealth [...] :blah: [...]  :palm:

--- End quote ---

Cool story bro. Useful contribution to this thread.  When you rely on exaggerations, you prove that even you don't believe you have a good argument.

If you had even a decent argument, you would have at least mentioned the current welfare system instead of some obscure island since UBI is meant as a repair to the current welfare system.  You are clearly stuck on stage 1 of the debate: free money = bad.  Pretty sure everyone agrees that free money is bad.  If your brain weren't so melted, you'd see that and move on to stage 2.

Stage 2 of this debate discusses the current free money system, welfare.  UBI creates a gap between entry level workers and non-workers and it should be fairly ineffectual to everyone else. That gap doesn't exist with current welfare system so people currently on welfare have no incentive to get off welfare.  With UBI they do have incentive, they get more money if they work.  In stage 2, we debate whether welfare or UBI causes more people to refuse to work.

Stage 3 of the debate looks at the cost savings in other areas but you can't even comprehend stage 2 so I won't risk melting your brain with something as complex as healthcare and crime.

I look forward to continuing this conversation.  Always wanted to learn more about emojis.  Is there an emoji for sarcasm?
SparkyFX:

--- Quote from: Zero999 on March 30, 2020, 07:22:06 pm ---As far as UBI devaluing the currency is concerned. People said a similar thing about he minimum wage, which was supposed to push up prices, negating any pay rises, yet that doesn't seem to have been the case.
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Minimum wage affects people that do work, that add value to some product or process, their wage is just higher and can not be circumvented by subcontracting. (Operations that lead to a net negative effect of the economy sooner or later crash, depending on lobby and public image).


--- Quote from: petert on March 31, 2020, 05:58:22 am ---Automation will keep increasing the efficiency of production, and will result in few people accumulating more wealth with increasingly less need to distribute it again, by having employees. The goal of any company (in our current economy) is to reduce costs, including labor cost as much as possible. That in itself is a major problem, that the UBI tries to address.
--- End quote ---
Another way of looking at this is that products that are produced automatically are valued lower, and even a fully automatic plant needs customers to sell their stuff to. And this is how these questions are handled already, e.g. injection molded parts are usually not valued much higher than the material is worth (unless a company has an exceptional image... or does things no one else can), so basically the commodity prices are what drives this. I don't see why this would not transfer to other automated branches of any economy - there is competition after all.

daqq:

--- Quote ---What is a good about Covid 19 related?
--- End quote ---
The antivaxers are keeping awfully quiet.
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