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What's the real reason that laptop batteries are made not-accessible?

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SilverSolder:

--- Quote from: james_s on December 04, 2021, 07:46:36 pm ---[...]
Planned obsolescence is "Let's try to ensure the product stops working by this point in time", normal engineering is "Let's make sure the product lasts at least this long." The difference may seem subtle but there is definitely a difference. Most engineers are not going to go out of their way to make sure something fails.
[...]

--- End quote ---

Agreed, and in the case of sealed-in batteries, they aren't actually going out of their way to make sure the device fails...   they are, however, creating a barrier to replacing the battery that is sufficient to make it uneconomical to do so in many/most cases.

Maybe we should think in terms of different flavors of planned obsolescence...

PO Type 1:  Device is coded / designed to become totally useless on a certain date or other terminating condition not controlled by the user/"owner", the only remedy is to purchase a new device when that condition is triggered.

PO Type 2:  Device is designed to be difficult/impossible to repair by anyone other than the manufacturer,  the only remedy is to purchase a new device once out of warranty.

PO Type 3: Device is designed to be difficult/impossible to repair by anyone other than the manufacturer, but the manufacturer does have reasonably priced remediation options (repair and/or replacement)

SilverSolder:

--- Quote from: IanB on December 04, 2021, 08:01:12 pm ---

It's not always the vendor to blame.

[...] but then app vendors started refusing to install their apps on older versions of the OS. [...]


--- End quote ---

Sadly, it is still the vendors to blame...  I had an email exchange with an app author when the latest version of his app refused to install on the older (but perfectly usable) Android tablet I had laying about in the car.

He explained that he would love to be able to support older versions of the OS, but that unfortunately developers like him have to agree to Google terms and conditions which includes NOT supporting OS versions over a certain age...    he is outright prohibited from supporting older OS versions.

Another issue with Android apps is that they stop working if the tablet is not connected to the Internet for a while.  You get an error message, "App not owned" when you try to start it.  Basically, it seems all the apps you buy on Android need to check in with the mother ship every so often, even after they have been installed!  So I had to drag the tablet into the house and let it nuzzle up to Mother every so often, to keep the purchased apps working.

This kind of stuff all makes me want to puke...  -   Basically, I have gone back to using a Windows tablet in my car, since - much as people hate on MS - they are nowhere near as bad as Google (just yet, at least).

tooki:

--- Quote from: cortex_m0 on December 03, 2021, 04:37:19 am ---
--- Quote from: james_s on December 03, 2021, 04:20:08 am ---That is not planned obsolescence, that is cost engineering.
--- End quote ---
Planned obsolescence is a special case of cost engineering.


--- Quote from: james_s on December 03, 2021, 04:20:08 am ---Planned obsolescence is engineering that has no other function than to deliberately limit lifespan, for example a timer that bricks something after a specified number of uses,

--- End quote ---
No, that is fraud (unless it is advertised as being time limited).


--- Quote ---or a system that is tied to a remote server for no reason than to be able to disable it.
--- End quote ---
No, that's a time-limited license. So long as I can continue paying the subscription fee to keep using my gizmo, nothing is being made obsolete.


--- Quote from: james_s on December 03, 2021, 04:20:08 am ---They're making them as cheap as they can while still lasting long enough.

--- End quote ---

I'd consider this a concise definition of planned obsolescence.  :clap:

--- End quote ---
And you’d be wrong. james_s is exactly right about what planned obsolescence is and is not. His last sentence above is cost engineering.

What you’re calling “fraud” is literally what planned obsolescence actually means. Probably 99% of the times people cry “planned obsolescence!” do not actually meet the actual meaning, because true planned obsolescence is astoundingly rare. Cost engineering is NOT planned obsolescence!!

tooki:
One issue, specific to smartphones and some accessories, is waterproofing. I think it’s a great thing that so many phones now are seriously IP rated, since the number of phones that succumbed to water ingress in the past was huge, generating tons of e-waste. But it’s exceedingly difficult, to the extent of being practically impossible, to make a user-replaceable battery compartment that maintains waterproofing properly. (Look at the maintenance instructions for underwater camera housings and you'll see what I mean.)
And it’s categorically impossible to do that while maintaining the sleekness expected today. Even non-waterproof battery compartments are hard to do with such space constraints, but waterproof ones? Forget it, no way. :(

So we are left with adhesive seals. But at least on iPhones, they’re fairly easy to replace. Apple stores, and authorized and unauthorized repair shops alike can perform an iPhone battery swap in 10 minutes, including replacing the sealing adhesive, so I don’t think it’s in any way reasonable to claim adhesive as justification for accusations of planned obsolescence.

tooki:

--- Quote from: SilverSolder on December 04, 2021, 03:32:00 pm ---
--- Quote from: james_s on December 03, 2021, 04:20:08 am ---[...] Planned obsolescence is engineering that has no other function than to deliberately limit lifespan [...]

--- End quote ---

Doing planned obsolescence by making the battery uneconomical to replace has an element of 'plausible deniability' about it...  the consumer cannot easily identify who is to blame for his/her predicament, and will generally just pony up for a new device.

--- End quote ---
But the company most commonly cited in such situations, Apple, actually offers perfectly economical battery replacements. Go online, schedule a service appointment, bring in the phone or computer, and 15 minutes later you walk out with your device with a fresh battery installed (and a cleaning inside and out), for the same price of a battery for the models years ago whose batteries were user replaceable. (So considering inflation, the laptop batteries are actually cheaper now than years ago.)

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