Author Topic: When Your Phone Turns on You  (Read 904 times)

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Online Homer J Simpson

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When Your Phone Turns on You
« on: March 08, 2020, 10:54:53 pm »

"Your phone might be turned against you - when the police search a geofenced area looking for suspects."


 

Offline I wanted a rude username

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Re: When Your Phone Turns on You
« Reply #1 on: March 09, 2020, 12:36:18 am »
The only surprise is that police have just now started using such warrants widely. I remember discussions about this in 1999/2000 when E-911 was introduced ... people on the mailing list were well aware the technology would enable such correlation analysis.
 

Offline SilverSolder

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Re: When Your Phone Turns on You
« Reply #2 on: March 09, 2020, 03:20:39 am »

This whole thing is kind of dumb - if you have the GPS trail, you can see they just passed by (as opposed to stopped to do something).
 

Offline GlennSprigg

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Re: When Your Phone Turns on You
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2020, 01:30:44 pm »
I know some people hate it, when people like me say... "Well I've got nothing to hide!".
Seriously though, I don't!!  I understand how to disable most/all tracking data etc, but I don't bother.
I'm in Perth Australia, and recently we went to Adelaide for 4 days, for private reasons. After looking at available flights, Google messaged me saying something to the likes of... "You were last in Adelaide 4 years ago, from 23rd Oct to the 27th Oct 2016. You had accommodation at Mick O'Sheas Irish Pub just South of Adelaide, and had a rental car from xxxxxx. Your Google Map searches/routes today, indicate you may be going to the same place. We can place you in contact with all concerned, to finalize all your bookings!  And the company that you stored your vehicle at in Perth, has moved, and their new location is xxxxxxx"...  8)   HA!!!  I actually thought it was funny!!!   :-DD
« Last Edit: March 10, 2020, 01:32:16 pm by GlennSprigg »
 

Offline SilverSolder

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Re: When Your Phone Turns on You
« Reply #4 on: March 10, 2020, 02:55:19 pm »
I know some people hate it, when people like me say... "Well I've got nothing to hide!".
Seriously though, I don't!!  I understand how to disable most/all tracking data etc, but I don't bother.
I'm in Perth Australia, and recently we went to Adelaide for 4 days, for private reasons. After looking at available flights, Google messaged me saying something to the likes of... "You were last in Adelaide 4 years ago, from 23rd Oct to the 27th Oct 2016. You had accommodation at Mick O'Sheas Irish Pub just South of Adelaide, and had a rental car from xxxxxx. Your Google Map searches/routes today, indicate you may be going to the same place. We can place you in contact with all concerned, to finalize all your bookings!  And the company that you stored your vehicle at in Perth, has moved, and their new location is xxxxxxx"...  8)   HA!!!  I actually thought it was funny!!!   :-DD

"You went to the restroom at the pub, at 17:55hours.  As you were there for 7 minutes, we conclude that it was a "big" rather than a "small" visit.  Based on the accelerometer readings of your steps before and after the visit, we estimate your stools weighed 243 grams. 

Later that evening, you went to the address of a young lady, half your age, that our records show you have no business seeing.  Based on your pulse and breathing patterns, we conclude that your neurotransmitters including dopamine and oxytocin were at elevated levels for several hours.  Based on the spring in your steps after the visit, we conclude you had a pleasant love hangover.  Would you like us to automatically arrange for a meeting with her in advance of your next trip?  Don't forget to upgrade to Google DoublePlusGood membership to keep your wife from finding out."
« Last Edit: March 10, 2020, 02:56:50 pm by SilverSolder »
 
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Offline RoGeorge

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Re: When Your Phone Turns on You
« Reply #5 on: March 10, 2020, 02:57:38 pm »
...
 people like me say... "Well I've got nothing to hide!".
Seriously though, I don't!!

Then why don't you publish all your passwords, your credit cards details, phone PIN, and so on.

Everybody has something to hide, you just don't realize you have.  Rookie mistake.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2020, 02:59:15 pm by RoGeorge »
 
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Offline SiliconWizard

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Re: When Your Phone Turns on You
« Reply #6 on: March 10, 2020, 03:22:38 pm »
...
 people like me say... "Well I've got nothing to hide!".
Seriously though, I don't!!

Then why don't you publish all your passwords, your credit cards details, phone PIN, and so on.

Everybody has something to hide, you just don't realize you have.  Rookie mistake.

Yeah.

But this "I've got nothing to hide!" statement is just bullshit for anyone concerned with freedom. I thought people were actually fighting for freedom at some point - I think it's even the basis of the US constitution (and that of many other countries these days)? Now it seems that not only are they not fighting anymore, but they just don't care and actually need to be lectured about freedom. Sad days huh?

It's the exact argument all totalitarian regimes have used to promote complete "transparency". It's just a pile of shit. Whether you have anything to "hide" is not the point whatsoever. You may have nothing to hide (whatever that means, basically: nothing when you think about it for more than 2 seconds), but you probably wouldn't want to live in a completely transparent house with everyone able to see your every move when you're inside. You may not want people seeing you shit or fuck, even though there's probably nothing to hide here either - everybody does it right? - and so on.

Privacy (and freedom in general) is not about hiding stuff. Once you introduce the "hide" term, you're already submitting to something or someone else. End of the freedom story.

 
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Offline blueskull

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Re: When Your Phone Turns on You
« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2020, 03:43:42 pm »
It's all about who to trust more, and what is statistically safer.

For instance, my phone has a TrustZone feature, which allows certain sensitive app's files to be stored in Huawei cloud instead of locally (essentially VFS).

Due to the nature of rooted Android, a file stored on a device can be read by other apps, so all security you get is the app's own encryption capability.

While I trust my bank to develop reliable apps, I am also aware that with enough reward hackers are working hard against it.

So it's a matter of choice. Do I trust a company that fears allegation of data leakage the most, or trust all my apps from random developers.

Similarly, I trust OneDrive more than a local drive as my daily storage, and Gmail more than a disc for backups of small but very important files (passwords, keys, legal documents, tax sheets).

Technology has already evolved to a point that it can fuck us all, very hard. Sarcasm as it sounds, sometimes privacy has to be given up to the right person in order to protect it.
 

Online David Hess

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Re: When Your Phone Turns on You
« Reply #8 on: March 11, 2020, 01:24:27 am »
What could possibly go wrong?

Police had arrested the wrong man based on location data obtained from Google and the fact that a white Honda was spotted at the crime scene. The case against Molina quickly fell apart, and he was released from jail six days later. Prosecutors never pursued charges against Molina, yet the highly publicized arrest cost him his job, his car, and his reputation.

https://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/news/google-geofence-location-data-avondale-wrongful-arrest-molina-gaeta-11426374
 

Offline Ranayna

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Re: When Your Phone Turns on You
« Reply #9 on: March 11, 2020, 09:16:18 pm »
And that is only one of the issues with all that relentless data gathering.
Even completely senseless accusations tend to stick. God beware if you are a male and even mentioned in relation to a sex crime for example.
 

Online Cerebus

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Re: When Your Phone Turns on You
« Reply #10 on: March 12, 2020, 12:52:25 am »
What could possibly go wrong?

Police had arrested the wrong man based on location data obtained from Google and the fact that a white Honda was spotted at the crime scene. The case against Molina quickly fell apart, and he was released from jail six days later. Prosecutors never pursued charges against Molina, yet the highly publicized arrest cost him his job, his car, and his reputation.

https://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/news/google-geofence-location-data-avondale-wrongful-arrest-molina-gaeta-11426374

Naīve people believe that the police have some interest in establishing the truth. Most times they do not, they just want to "get a result". People also foolishly believe "It could never happen to me, just to criminal types". Consider where you are located at this moment; if a serious crime occurred within 100 meters of where you are now, could you prove you had nothing to do with it? (Note, you don't have an alibi [lit. elsewhere], your phone has placed you at the crime scene.)

Last year a murder happened 40-50 metres from where I am sitting at around this time of day. The police had no reason to suspect me, I just happen to live nearby, and they never talked to me about it because the suspects were obvious and it happened where there was CCTV coverage. Had that not been the case and they'd used a geo-fenced warrant (or, this being the UK, probably obtained phone company records with no court involvement at all)  how safe would I have been from coming under unwelcome and unjustified scrutiny, possibly at the extreme a wrongful conviction? I suspect less safe than many people would think - I've worked with the police, been in major incident rooms and heard the chatter, it's not encouraging. In the mind of PC Plod there's a world of difference between "he has an address nearby" and "digital forensics can place him in the vicinity of the crime". Under those circumstances it doesn't matter to PC Plod that in theory it's his job to prove your involvement, he''ll treat you as a "person of interest" until you can prove that you had nothing to do with it.

Anybody got a syringe I can use to squeeze the magic smoke back into this?
 

Online vk6zgo

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Re: When Your Phone Turns on You
« Reply #11 on: March 12, 2020, 01:20:58 am »
You would think that anyone planning a crime would make sure his phone, & any other digital crap was left at home, use an old car without any IOT stuff, or walk.

But then again, Criminals generally have faeces for brains!
Who with anything approaching a mind would think that pumping 9 bullets into someone would, in some magic way, solve a problem?
 

Online David Hess

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Re: When Your Phone Turns on You
« Reply #12 on: March 12, 2020, 03:23:35 am »
You would think that anyone planning a crime would make sure his phone, & any other digital crap was left at home, use an old car without any IOT stuff, or walk.

The ones who did that, had no conspirators, never bragged, and exercised their 4th (consent), 5th (silence), and 6th (lawyer) amendment rights, did not get caught.
« Last Edit: March 12, 2020, 03:26:15 am by David Hess »
 

Offline GlennSprigg

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Re: When Your Phone Turns on You
« Reply #13 on: March 12, 2020, 01:29:33 pm »
...
 people like me say... "Well I've got nothing to hide!".
Seriously though, I don't!!

Then why don't you publish all your passwords, your credit cards details, phone PIN, and so on.

Everybody has something to hide, you just don't realize you have.  Rookie mistake.

I couldn't help but reply, mate.  As stated, I am perfectly able to 'block' all tracking on any device,
but generally choose not to, for fun! (It's interesting to 'Look Yourself Up' later for a laugh)...
However, that being said, my Credit Card numbers/pins/csv's etc are beyond Fort Knox !!!
What they know about me, is what I LET them know... & I'm not talking about simple VPN shit.
 


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