Author Topic: Why, Australia, WHY?  (Read 6155 times)

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Offline cdev

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #25 on: November 23, 2017, 01:31:39 am »
Carnivorous plants?

This is making me see my European roots entirely in a different light!

« Last Edit: November 23, 2017, 01:37:32 am by cdev »
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Offline cdev

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #26 on: November 23, 2017, 01:38:29 am »
Oh...

Thats very disappointing of us.
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Offline David Hess

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #27 on: November 23, 2017, 03:48:42 am »
 

Offline Someone

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #28 on: November 23, 2017, 04:03:34 am »
What kinds of animals still kill people in Europe?
Some areas have pretty bad Lyme disease, I hear. Malaria is said to be making a come back in Greece.

Thank God for good old safe Europe with no dangerous wild creatures
The data is not perfect (reporting inconsistencies) and the vertical scale is logarithmic to fit the labels but Australia is far from the worst place to risk your life from animals, below is reliable data plotted across Europe and adding Australia for comparison.
Not from hard statistics but based on news stories I've seen, the deadliest animal in Europe happens to be homo sapiens.  Their target often are other homo sapiens.

In Australia, humans don't have to worry much about being rape by a spider or mugged by a croc.  In Europe, homo sapiens being mugged or rape by another homo sapiens is a daily thing.
We have the statistics freely available, you can check that all you like. From the European Detailed Mortality Database we can see how countries compare for their rates of assaults causing death (attached below) and Australia is quite a bit higher than the average european nation, so with that and the relative rates of deaths from animals (venomous or otherwise) the data shows the exact opposite of your suggestion.

After a slight error I've reuploaded the animal threat comparing europe to Australia:

Seems like europeans are bad at treating venomous animal bites or are they actually more common?
« Last Edit: November 23, 2017, 06:17:07 am by Someone »
 

Offline Neganur

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #29 on: November 23, 2017, 06:23:03 am »
Drowning after touching jelly fish, death by inflammation from tick bites, don’t think snakes are sufficiently venomous in the northern countries. Can’t think of much else.

Edit: oh my, allergies! Bee sting.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2017, 06:24:54 am by Neganur »
 

Offline IanB

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #30 on: November 23, 2017, 06:48:30 am »
What kinds of animals still kill people in Europe?

Domestic animals, sometimes. Being trampled to death by cows is a thing.
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Offline Bashstreet

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #31 on: November 23, 2017, 07:03:13 am »
Finland seems like pretty dangerous place must be all those venomous snakes bears wolfs bulls and polar bears... :wtf:
 

Offline Someone

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #32 on: November 23, 2017, 07:03:44 am »
Edit: oh my, allergies! Bee sting.
X23 Contact with hornets, wasps and bees
this dominates deaths from poisonous/venomous animals in the above plot. Similarly W55 Bitten or struck by other mammals includes boring things like cows on farms.
 

Offline Bashstreet

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #33 on: November 23, 2017, 07:08:11 am »
Edit: oh my, allergies! Bee sting.
X23 Contact with hornets, wasps and bees
this dominates deaths from poisonous/venomous animals in the above plot. Similarly W55 Bitten or struck by other mammals includes boring things like cows on farms.

Well in Finland (what is very dangerous place) in average one person yearly dies from hornet/bee/wasp stings like i said must be the polar bears...
 

Offline Someone

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #34 on: November 23, 2017, 07:15:14 am »
Edit: oh my, allergies! Bee sting.
X23 Contact with hornets, wasps and bees
this dominates deaths from poisonous/venomous animals in the above plot. Similarly W55 Bitten or struck by other mammals includes boring things like cows on farms.
Well in Finland (what is very dangerous place) in average one person yearly dies from hornet/bee/wasp stings like i said must be the polar bears...
Thats not the figures they're reporting:
http://data.euro.who.int/dmdb/
Many deaths per year attributed to envenomation from wasp/bee/hornet in Finland alone. Question remains is exposure higher? or health care worse? or both? We can make easier guesses for countries such as Kazakhstan.
 

Offline Bashstreet

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #35 on: November 23, 2017, 07:16:50 am »
Edit: oh my, allergies! Bee sting.
X23 Contact with hornets, wasps and bees
this dominates deaths from poisonous/venomous animals in the above plot. Similarly W55 Bitten or struck by other mammals includes boring things like cows on farms.
Well in Finland (what is very dangerous place) in average one person yearly dies from hornet/bee/wasp stings like i said must be the polar bears...
Thats not the figures they're reporting:
http://data.euro.who.int/dmdb/
Many deaths per year attributed to envenomation from wasp/bee/hornet in Finland alone. Question remains is exposure higher? or health care worse? or both? We can make easier guesses for countries such as Kazakhstan.

I Would know about that.

I just know in average one person dies from wasp etc stings yearly in Finland.
 

Offline Someone

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #36 on: November 23, 2017, 07:23:58 am »
Edit: oh my, allergies! Bee sting.
X23 Contact with hornets, wasps and bees
this dominates deaths from poisonous/venomous animals in the above plot. Similarly W55 Bitten or struck by other mammals includes boring things like cows on farms.
Well in Finland (what is very dangerous place) in average one person yearly dies from hornet/bee/wasp stings like i said must be the polar bears...
Thats not the figures they're reporting:
http://data.euro.who.int/dmdb/
Many deaths per year attributed to envenomation from wasp/bee/hornet in Finland alone. Question remains is exposure higher? or health care worse? or both? We can make easier guesses for countries such as Kazakhstan.

I Would know about that.

I just know in average one person dies from wasp etc stings yearly in Finland.
You say that without presenting any qualification or authority, while the official coroners reports submitted to the international databases say its 3 or so. Lets consider who to trust? Feel free to present any references and data you like rather than insisting that we're wrong.
 

Offline Bashstreet

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #37 on: November 23, 2017, 07:27:16 am »
Edit: oh my, allergies! Bee sting.
X23 Contact with hornets, wasps and bees
this dominates deaths from poisonous/venomous animals in the above plot. Similarly W55 Bitten or struck by other mammals includes boring things like cows on farms.
Well in Finland (what is very dangerous place) in average one person yearly dies from hornet/bee/wasp stings like i said must be the polar bears...
Thats not the figures they're reporting:
http://data.euro.who.int/dmdb/
Many deaths per year attributed to envenomation from wasp/bee/hornet in Finland alone. Question remains is exposure higher? or health care worse? or both? We can make easier guesses for countries such as Kazakhstan.

I Would know about that.

I just know in average one person dies from wasp etc stings yearly in Finland.
You say that without presenting any qualification or authority, while the official coroners reports submitted to the international databases say its 3 or so. Lets consider who to trust? Feel free to present any references and data you like rather than insisting that we're wrong.

Long term average death rare from bee/wasp etc sting deaths in Finland is 1.2 for example in 2014 4 people died from bee strings between 2007 to 2009 none.

You can study the Finnish death records here.

http://www.stat.fi/til/ksyyt/index.html
 

Offline aargee

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #38 on: November 23, 2017, 07:28:43 am »
I seem to remember (citation unavailable) that most snake bite injuries come from people trying to kill the snake.
Not easy, not hard, just need to be incentivised.
 

Offline Bashstreet

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #39 on: November 23, 2017, 07:48:31 am »
I seem to remember (citation unavailable) that most snake bite injuries come from people trying to kill the snake.

Well never good idea to try go and use fist to kill a snake  :popcorn:
« Last Edit: November 23, 2017, 07:55:09 am by Bashstreet »
 

Offline Lord of nothing

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #40 on: November 23, 2017, 11:19:57 am »
 :scared:
Quote
Being trampled to death by cows is a thing.

I dont know what Animal could you kill you in Austria. We have just ~3 Bears
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Offline Bashstreet

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #41 on: November 23, 2017, 11:34:11 am »
:scared:
Quote
Being trampled to death by cows is a thing.

I dont know what Animal could you kill you in Austria. We have just ~3 Bears

Hey by those statistics Austria is almost dangerous as Finland.. Must be all those cows with bells that come over the border from Switzerland with murderous goals.
Of course as healthcare is so much poorer in Austria and Finland people kicked by cows or mauled by polar bears do not get same level of help.  :wtf:
 

Offline Bashstreet

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #42 on: November 23, 2017, 12:06:33 pm »
What kinds of animals still kill people in Europe?
Some areas have pretty bad Lyme disease, I hear. Malaria is said to be making a come back in Greece.

Thank God for good old safe Europe with no dangerous wild creatures
The data is not perfect (reporting inconsistencies) and the vertical scale is logarithmic to fit the labels but Australia is far from the worst place to risk your life from animals, below is reliable data plotted across Europe and adding Australia for comparison.
Not from hard statistics but based on news stories I've seen, the deadliest animal in Europe happens to be homo sapiens.  Their target often are other homo sapiens.

In Australia, humans don't have to worry much about being rape by a spider or mugged by a croc.  In Europe, homo sapiens being mugged or rape by another homo sapiens is a daily thing.
We have the statistics freely available, you can check that all you like. From the European Detailed Mortality Database we can see how countries compare for their rates of assaults causing death (attached below) and Australia is quite a bit higher than the average european nation, so with that and the relative rates of deaths from animals (venomous or otherwise) the data shows the exact opposite of your suggestion.

After a slight error I've reuploaded the animal threat comparing europe to Australia:

Seems like europeans are bad at treating venomous animal bites or are they actually more common?

Interestingly the "statistics" in the quoted picture without no resource material or no information how the craft had been constructed claims there are nearly 0.10 deaths per 100.000 people in Finland from "poisonous/venomous plants and animals"

That would mean approximately 5.5 yearly deaths.

In Finland deaths by Bee/wasps/hornets stings are in range of 1.2 deahts per year or 0.021 deaths per 100.000 people.

http://www.jacionline.org/article/S0091-6749(16)30367-0/fulltext

Last death by the only venomous snake the common adder happened almost 20 years ago 1998.

http://www.kyyn-rauhoittaminen-suomessa.com/

Mushrooms and some rare plants are another source of poisons in Finland.

From 1969–2006 there was 8 deaths result from mushroom poisoning (including long term deaths caused by liver or kidney failure)  0.2 people yearly or 0.0038 per 100.000 people

http://www.hus.fi/sairaanhoito/sairaanhoitopalvelut/myrkytystietokeskus/Julkaisuja/Sienimyrkytykset%20ja%20niiden%20hoito.pdf

There are some other poisonous plants in Finland but death caused by such plants is statistically nonexistent.

Question rises what are the claimed other deaths in the "statistic"

I have feeling situation is similar in Austria.. if someone bothers to make a study.

« Last Edit: November 23, 2017, 12:14:34 pm by Bashstreet »
 

Offline VK3DRB

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #43 on: November 23, 2017, 12:06:58 pm »
Years ago there was an electronics project in ETI to scare spiders away. It used ultrasonics. I built one and ran an experiment. They do not work. The same magazine has a high gain op-amp to connect to a cassette recorder AF input to record noises from ghosts. Also designed a pulse charger for NIMH batteries. Electronics hocus pocus.
 
But this isn't hocus pocus: A few years ago I was about to sleep, but in the twilight in the hallway outside the bedroom, I saw all these dark blotches on the wall. I turned on the light to discover an infestation of huntsman spiders. I killed about 30 to 40 babies and the huge mother which was nesting in a nearby linen cupboard. A week later a giant huntsman (maybe the dad) crawled on our bed up to the pillow area. I shoved it off and it hit the floor only to run under the bed which has about a two inch gap to the floor. Bloody terrifying. Around that time over few years, we would find an average of one to two per week inside the house.

Want to see what one looks like? The poms sent convicts to Australia. We sent them this....
http://www.news.com.au/technology/science/animals/giant-huntsman-spider-hitches-a-10000-mile-lift-to-uk-from-australia-in-familys-belongings/news-story/065d477f53e9fa1c59137b66bf3880e9
 

Offline Bashstreet

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #44 on: November 23, 2017, 12:32:41 pm »
Just noticed.... Belgium has 5 times the rate of deaths from poisonous/venomous animals and plants compared to turkey.... that i can say is pure bs  :palm:

 

Offline cdev

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #45 on: November 23, 2017, 01:12:17 pm »
In the US Southwest, every year around this time, huge male tarantulas (around the size of a human hand) migrate to find mates, in some areas its quite spectacular, (they can be seen all moving across the land at once, by the millions, when they find a female in her burrow they enter, have sex, and then they die.)

They do not bite. (at least the ones here in the US do not bite unless you are threatening them, and I don't think I have ever heard that they are venomous from anybody.)

Some people actually keep them as pets.

So, the article about the spider stowing away to the UK said huntsman spiders were not venomous? Are some species venomous and some not?

Do huntsman spiders bite people frequently? 

Where I live now we have both black widow spiders (not common) and I think also brown recluse spiders, but I have only seen the black widows a few times, and I don't know enough about brown recluse spiders appearance to recognize them.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2017, 01:42:44 pm by cdev »
"What the large print giveth, the small print taketh away."
 

Online Circlotron

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #46 on: November 23, 2017, 01:15:58 pm »
I dont know what Animal could you kill you in Austria. We have just ~3 Bears
And a blonde haired girl that breaks into houses and eats porridge that belongs to someone else?
 

Offline cdev

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #47 on: November 23, 2017, 01:49:13 pm »
Differences may be because of improved access to health care, in some countries, as much as actual incidence of injuries. For example..
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Echinococcosis is one of a great many endemic / tropical diseases of poverty, very common in Turkey..

Some tropical diseases are not treatable currently, or treatments are very costly or not very effective, largely because of lack of interest among drug manufacturers. ( Maybe this will change as they migrate northward and southward. )

The healthcare situation in Turkey (according to a Wikipedia article) is alleged to have improved a lot over the past few years (according to Turkish government sources which may not be telling the whole story)  I do know that Turkey as well as Mexico and India, and a number of other countries, are pushing hard to become destinations for cross border health related business from subsidized patients in the cash-strapped US and Europe.

Just noticed.... Belgium has 5 times the rate of deaths from poisonous/venomous animals and plants compared to turkey.... that i can say is pure bs  :palm:
« Last Edit: November 23, 2017, 02:16:53 pm by cdev »
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Offline Lord of nothing

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #48 on: November 23, 2017, 02:07:47 pm »
Quote
Turkey
isnt (in) Europe.
Made in Japan, destroyed in Sulz im Wienerwald.
 

Offline cdev

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Re: Why, Australia, WHY?
« Reply #49 on: November 23, 2017, 02:09:44 pm »
Some of Turkey is in Europe and most is in Asia.

Turkey straddles the border between Asia and Europe with Istanbul in both.
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