| General > General Technical Chat |
| Why do "programmers" call themselves... "engineers"?! |
| << < (8/45) > >> |
| soldar:
I have no problem with software people calling themselves engineers. The etymology of engine and engineer is from Latin "ingenium" meaning talent or device product of talent, intelligence. In Spanish the word "ingenio" still has both meanings, "clever" and "engine" and you can see they are related in the sense that an engine would be invented by someone with ingenuity, someone ingenious. If someone designed an ingenious solution to a problem of any kind, or he invented a clever joke or play on words, then he is ingenious. |
| Nominal Animal:
I've never considered myself a software engineer, but I do apply engineering principles to software design and implementation. By engineering principles, I mean science on the theoretical side, experience on the practical side, and rational thinking (AKA reasoning) between the two. |
| SiliconWizard:
--- Quote from: Nominal Animal on November 16, 2019, 08:54:43 pm ---I've never considered myself a software engineer, but I do apply engineering principles to software design and implementation. By engineering principles, I mean science on the theoretical side, experience on the practical side, and rational thinking (AKA reasoning) between the two. --- End quote --- That sounds like engineering principles indeed. Unfortunately, I tend to agree with Dijsktra's point, which I think still holds true. What we commonly call "software engineering" these days has not much to do with what you just said above. I think the main part "borrowed" from general engineering is more like project management principles (writing specs, choosing solutions, implementing, version control, testing, meetings ;D ) than anything else. I think there is actuallya lot less "science" used in day-to-day software "engineering" than in any other engineering field. Of course the question is with the term, discipline and practice of "software engineering" in general. Lots of people are writing software with engineering principles, and at least with embedded software, completely tied to other engineering fields. |
| tggzzz:
--- Quote from: Nominal Animal on November 16, 2019, 08:54:43 pm ---I've never considered myself a software engineer, but I do apply engineering principles to software design and implementation. By engineering principles, I mean science on the theoretical side, experience on the practical side, and rational thinking (AKA reasoning) between the two. --- End quote --- I am always dismayed by people who loudly proclaim that only theory/practice (delete as applicable) is necessary, and that the other is bunkum. You need both! Nonetheless there are probably more cargo-cult software writers than hardware creators. |
| magic:
--- Quote from: tggzzz on November 16, 2019, 06:56:51 pm ---It would also help if you addressed the substantive points. --- End quote --- Nothing can help because I don't think it's a serious discussion :) But if you want me to honestly elaborate on your errors, --- Quote from: tggzzz on November 16, 2019, 05:31:09 pm --- --- Quote ---how intel can issue bugfixes to its x86 processors that are installed on motherboards in customers premises Because the CPU runs software, duh. Or by recall, like the FDIV bug. --- End quote --- No, they issue microcode updates which change the processor's capabilities and operation. They would have made it unnecessary to recall processors because of the FDIV bug. --- End quote --- This is exactly what I said, the CPU runs software so they send you a different software if something goes wrong. Kinda like firmware update to your cloud toaster when it kernel-panics on attempt to join your WLAN so you can't eject the toast. And yes, a microcode update would allow the FDIV bug to be fixed, if that stupid lookup table in the FPU were turned into SRAM. Which is more die area and power consumption in an already hot and crowded subsystem, so I totally doubt that anyone does it in practice. But modern x86 is of course not something that's going to appear on zeptobars tomorrow so we may inconclusively argue about it until death parts us. --- Quote from: tggzzz on November 16, 2019, 05:31:09 pm ---I wondered if someone would pick up on that, but it would be more enlightening if you addresses the substance of the key point. --- End quote --- You ask me to stop nitpicking about formal languages and say once more that a description of some FSM, uploadable to some hardware for execution, is software? :horse: |
| Navigation |
| Message Index |
| Next page |
| Previous page |