Author Topic: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?  (Read 10422 times)

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Offline VK3DRB

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Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« on: September 06, 2014, 12:22:20 am »
http://media.theage.com.au/national/selections/sweden-vies-as-hightech-hub-5738252.html

One in five people in Sweden are employed in the technology sector. This poses the question... What is wrong with the rest of us?

What is it about Sweden... a smarter people, a better culture, or unlike most other countries do their politicians actually have a mission statement?

One of Australia's former Minister for Communications and Information Technology (Helen Coonan) proved during two interviews on the ABC that she had no idea what bandwidth was. Would things be a lot better if those with technical skills, enthusiasm and appreciation (like Dave) were at the helm setting policy, rather than ex-lawyer bozos?

Does anyone else know why the Swedes have done so well after Volvo and ABBA?




 

Offline GK

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2014, 01:15:10 am »
But have a look at what a large swath of those "technology" companies produce - bullshit like smart phone games and "apps" and personal virtual avatars for shoe fitting? Perhaps the Swedes have a lot of frivolous leisure time to burn and there is a larger than average vacuous void to fill with the production of this crap.

I almost ran over a woman transfixed on some stupid app on her dumb phone a while ago. If more of this is the future fruit of the science and technology industry then I'd prefer a return to the dark ages (almost). Tony Abbobt is the man! F%$# the NBN!

Oh, and it's a fine democratic tradition in our country that any sufficiently fortunate dumbo can hold any portfolio in government. You want a science minister (we still have one of those, don't we?) that has some kind of qualification and life experience in science? What? Are you mad?
 
« Last Edit: September 06, 2014, 01:24:07 am by GK »
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Offline Bored@Work

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2014, 01:16:45 am »
It is called socialism, the Swedish version. Not the bullshit Americans get in indoctrinated with under the name "Socialism".

In 2001 Forbes was shitting all over themselves trying to characterize what is going on in Sweden with all those bad, bad, socialism and new entrepreneurship http://www.forbes.com/global/2001/0319/034.html

Now, 13 years later Sweden still reaps what it sow at the end of the 90th -and still runs their socialistic society.
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Offline VK3DRB

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2014, 02:07:16 am »
It is called socialism, the Swedish version. Not the bullshit Americans get in indoctrinated with under the name "Socialism".

In 2001 Forbes was shitting all over themselves trying to characterize what is going on in Sweden with all those bad, bad, socialism and new entrepreneurship http://www.forbes.com/global/2001/0319/034.html

Now, 13 years later Sweden still reaps what it sow at the end of the 90th -and still runs their socialistic society.

It is likely Sweden has problems as well with rogue multinationals like Apple and Google. The big problem is companies like Apple and Google do everything in their power to minimise their taxes to obscenely low levels in the countries they do business in. It is up to the governments of the world to work together to bring them to account - literally.

In one large country, try and take a dollar away from a greedy billionaire, and they will call you a socialist. Increase the taxes on the super rich so they pay their fair share, and you are communist. But communism and capitalism meet at the same point - wealth and power in the hands of a few.





« Last Edit: September 06, 2014, 02:12:06 am by VK3DRB »
 

Offline miguelvp

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #4 on: September 06, 2014, 04:30:05 am »
I just wished I lived in a tax haven country to take the edge off, instead of in a place where the local corporations move money to other countries that offer them tax benefits.
 

Offline dannyf

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2014, 12:02:28 pm »
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One in five people in Sweden are employed in the technology sector. This poses the question... What is wrong with the rest of us?

Thing go in cycles. When a country / people are at their most prosperous, they tend to do stupid things. Initially, those stupid things wouldn't have significant negative impact but they have set up the country on the wrong path and lead them to their eventual demise.

That demise may take years or decades or centuries.

So the fact we cannot see the immediate negative impact of those things doesn't by itself mean those things have no negative impact.

In the case of Sweden, you have ample examples of demises there, over the last 10 - 30 years.

More in Europe and the US.
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Offline VK3DRB

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #6 on: September 06, 2014, 12:05:11 pm »
But have a look at what a large swath of those "technology" companies produce - bullshit like smart phone games and "apps" and personal virtual avatars for shoe fitting? Perhaps the Swedes have a lot of frivolous leisure time to burn and there is a larger than average vacuous void to fill with the production of this crap.

I almost ran over a woman transfixed on some stupid app on her dumb phone a while ago. If more of this is the future fruit of the science and technology industry then I'd prefer a return to the dark ages (almost). Tony Abbobt is the man! F%$# the NBN!

Oh, and it's a fine democratic tradition in our country that any sufficiently fortunate dumbo can hold any portfolio in government. You want a science minister (we still have one of those, don't we?) that has some kind of qualification and life experience in science? What? Are you mad?

Here is a good application the Swedes invented... Skype.

Tony Abbott bragged a couple of years ago he did not know how to use a laptop, identifying himself as an idiot. Tony Abbott also decided not to bother with a Minister of Science and Technology. The bloke is a short sighted fool.

Having lived in Austin Texas what really impressed me was their superior culture to technology. Electronics companies everywhere in a small city. IBM, Qualcomm, Dell, Texas Instruments, Motorola, and others. What have you in your neighbourhood that is a technology brand known by consumers the world over?



« Last Edit: September 06, 2014, 12:09:25 pm by VK3DRB »
 

Offline dannyf

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #7 on: September 06, 2014, 12:15:47 pm »
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Here is a good application the Swedes invented... Skype.

Not sure if it is good - the jury is still out on that one.

Those guys are incredibly lucky, however.

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identifying himself as an idiot.

There are plenty of idiots who are super-proficient in laptops / computers; And there are plenty of geniuses who don't use laptops / computers. The use of a computer doesn't make you a genius or idiot. The only sure thing  you can count on is that only an idiot will use that as a standard to judge if a person is an idiot or not.

Quote
Having lived in Austin Texas what really impressed me was their superior culture to technology.

You have the initial flight of tech companies from the north east to California; and then from California to Texas, Arizona, or Colorado, etc.

It is incredibly insightful to see what those folks were running away from, :)
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Offline zapta

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #8 on: September 06, 2014, 07:11:08 pm »
One in five people in Sweden are employed in the technology sector. ..

Any notable achievements?
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Online NANDBlog

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #9 on: September 06, 2014, 09:07:15 pm »
One in five people in Sweden are employed in the technology sector. ..

Any notable achievements?
Gamma knife, dynamite, electrophoresis, digitizer, tetra pak. Not to mention Nobel was from there.
 

Offline miguelvp

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #10 on: September 06, 2014, 09:12:49 pm »
This century after one in five are in the technology sector?
 

Offline dannyf

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #11 on: September 06, 2014, 09:16:27 pm »
Quote
Not to mention Nobel was from there.

Diary products, chocolates, mechanical watches (that's almost a scam, however).

....

The list is fairly long.

But that doesn't mean that their socialism is good - who's to say they wouldn't have done far better had they embraced capitalism?
« Last Edit: September 06, 2014, 09:53:55 pm by dannyf »
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Offline nixxon

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #12 on: September 06, 2014, 09:37:15 pm »
It is called socialism, the Swedish version. Not the bullshit Americans get in indoctrinated with under the name "Socialism".
(...)

It is called "Social democracy".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy

or The Nordic model (or Nordic capitalism or Nordic social democracy)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model
« Last Edit: September 06, 2014, 09:39:23 pm by nixxon »
 

Offline zapta

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #13 on: September 06, 2014, 09:45:03 pm »
One in five people in Sweden are employed in the technology sector. ..

Any notable achievements?
Gamma knife, dynamite, electrophoresis, digitizer, tetra pak. Not to mention Nobel was from there.

Nobel died more than 100 years ago. Did you have to go that far to find notable technological achievements?

The OP implied that Sweden is a technological marvel that we should all emulate.
Drain the swamp.
 

Offline dannyf

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #14 on: September 06, 2014, 10:28:13 pm »
Quote
It wouldn't surprise me if the upward mobility in such a society is small.

Doesn't seem to me that I was far off there.

Here is a list of the richest people in sweden: http://www.worldsrichpeople.com/richest-people-in-sweden.html

Count the number of times the word "inherited" showed up on that list, :)

To me, Sweden is a heaven for the rich far more than it is for those poor who want to move up through hard work.
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Offline zapta

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #15 on: September 06, 2014, 11:06:39 pm »
It is called "Social democracy".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_democracy

or The Nordic model (or Nordic capitalism or Nordic social democracy)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model

From the second link:

"Overall tax burdens (as a percentage of GDP) are among the world's highest; Sweden (51.1%), Denmark (46% in 2011),[22] and Finland (43.3%), compared to non-Nordic countries like Germany (34.7%), Canada (33.5%), and Ireland (30.5%)."

"Sweden at 56.6% of GDP, Denmark at 51.7%, and Finland at 48.6% reflects very high public spending.[16] One key reason for public spending is the large number of public employees. These employees work in various fields including education, healthcare, and for the government itself. They often have lifelong job security and make up around a third of the workforce (more than 38% in Denmark)."

Its socialism but with less corruption that the usual.

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Offline G0HZU

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #16 on: September 06, 2014, 11:37:47 pm »
The swedes have always been my favourite customer at my place of work (comms/defence). They are the most relaxed and pleasant, have good humour, are always polite and respectful and are also the brightest with the best attention to detail.

 

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #17 on: September 07, 2014, 11:34:17 am »
One in five people in Sweden are employed in the technology sector. ..

Any notable achievements?
Gamma knife, dynamite, electrophoresis, digitizer, tetra pak. Not to mention Nobel was from there.

Nobel died more than 100 years ago. Did you have to go that far to find notable technological achievements?

The OP implied that Sweden is a technological marvel that we should all emulate.
The fact that it is still considered as the highest achievement in science tells it all.
 

Offline vk6zgo

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #18 on: September 07, 2014, 01:14:23 pm »
Quote
Increase the taxes on the super rich so they pay their fair share

For that sentence to be meaningful and fair, you have to define "super rich/rich" and "fair share".

This reminds me of an interview I heard yesterday of an advocate of higher minimum wages. She cited a recent survey where 90%+ of the people surveyed voiced their strong support for a "fair wage" for those minimum wage workers -> she used that as her basis for a $15/hr new minimum wage.

One would have to be severely intellectually challenged to not see the flaw in her argument there.

PS: I was actually surprised that the 90% number wasn't higher, :)

Considering that surveys are done using a fairly small sample,pollsters usually take pains to cover as wide a range of socio-economic groups as they can.
I assume your argument is that it was taken exclusively among those who would benefit.

Her argument was superficial,but no more than your own.
 

Offline vk6zgo

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #19 on: September 07, 2014, 01:28:20 pm »
http://media.theage.com.au/national/selections/sweden-vies-as-hightech-hub-5738252.html

One in five people in Sweden are employed in the technology sector. This poses the question... What is wrong with the rest of us?

What is it about Sweden... a smarter people, a better culture, or unlike most other countries do their politicians actually have a mission statement?

One of Australia's former Minister for Communications and Information Technology (Helen Coonan) proved during two interviews on the ABC that she had no idea what bandwidth was. Would things be a lot better if those with technical skills, enthusiasm and appreciation (like Dave) were at the helm setting policy, rather than ex-lawyer bozos?

Does anyone else know why the Swedes have done so well after Volvo and ABBA?

Bandwidth has only one real meaning--------- the width of Electromagnetic spectrum occupied by a signal,or available for such a signal.
Many IT people misuse the term "bandwidth".to indicate  what you might call  more correctly "virtual bandwidth".

Modern digital compression & modulation methods offer ways to reduce the real bandwidth required for a signal well below that for the raw signal----in other words "virtual bandwidth".

Computer people delight in taking well known terms & giving them silly new meanings.
Remember the computers with a "Turbo" button?
 

Offline zapta

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #20 on: September 07, 2014, 01:40:07 pm »
The fact that it is still considered as the highest achievement in science tells it all.

Granting prizes is not a technological achievement.
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Offline dannyf

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #21 on: September 07, 2014, 02:11:39 pm »
Quote
The fact that it is still considered as the highest achievement in science tells it all.

I think it tells far more about those people who considered it as the highest achievement in science than about science itself.

Quote
I assume your argument is that it was taken exclusively among those who would benefit.

You assumed wrong.
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Offline vk6zgo

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #22 on: September 07, 2014, 02:42:53 pm »
Quote
The fact that it is still considered as the highest achievement in science tells it all.

I think it tells far more about those people who considered it as the highest achievement in science than about science itself.

Quote
I assume your argument is that it was taken exclusively among those who would benefit.

You assumed wrong.

I guess I must be "severely intellectually challenged" then! ;D
 

Offline dannyf

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #23 on: September 07, 2014, 03:51:36 pm »
Quote
I guess I must be "severely intellectually challenged" then! ;D

The good news is that you are in good company, :)

Most people are "reasonable" in their own ways. So most people would want a "reasonable" wages for everyone, even though "reasonable" wages may mean differently for different people.

The survey explored that fuzziness. Rather than presenting a specific number or a range of numbers (so to eliminate such subjectivity), they asked if the subject supported "reasonable" wage - obviously most of them said "yes".

The lady then translated that support for "reasonable" but undefined wage as a basis to justify her specific demand for minimum wage, to imply that 90%+ of the people surveyed supported her specific minimum wage. When in fact, those people only supported an undefined "reasonable" wage because that was the question asked of them.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to spot such dishonest propagandists - I think they teach that in elementary schools. But it is unfortunate that people like the lady prey on the less-than-informed.
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Online NANDBlog

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Re: Why has Sweden got it right with high tech?
« Reply #24 on: September 07, 2014, 06:55:19 pm »
Quote
The fact that it is still considered as the highest achievement in science tells it all.

I think it tells far more about those people who considered it as the highest achievement in science than about science itself.


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