General > General Technical Chat
Working with a Manufacturer to Repackage Their Silicon
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Someone:

--- Quote from: coppice on April 27, 2020, 01:55:18 pm ---
--- Quote from: Someone on April 27, 2020, 10:37:19 am ---
--- Quote from: shanekent on April 26, 2020, 12:47:27 am ---Is it fair to assume that most manufacturers supply their die to a common assembly house to have them package it into the needed package?    Not something I had thought about as I figured the die creation and packaging happened in the same facility.
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Depends on the specific part, and scale of the manufacturer. For example smaller "fabless" groups will have several different companies in their production chain and one of them will do package assembly, with tested silicon from a fab (or intermediate test house), and packaging supplied from yet another manufacturer.

The only person who can answer your questions on price/availability is a company with the rights to the chip you are talking about (the publicly visible brand on the chip may not be that company).

--- End quote ---
Its not just fabless companies. Most people who do a large percentage of their wafer fabrication in house subcontract a large percentage of their assembly and test work these days.

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... for example. An example at the other end of the business size scale would be intel who were packaging their lower cost US fabbed processors in lower cost countries. But are there no fabless groups with in house packaging? No. Its pretty much impossible to say anything for certain about a part unless you are getting that info from the manufacturer.
coppice:

--- Quote from: Someone on April 27, 2020, 11:07:47 pm ---An example at the other end of the business size scale would be intel who were packaging their lower cost US fabbed processors in lower cost countries.

--- End quote ---
I don't think that is quite what you meant. All mainstream semiconductor packaging moved to lower cost countries in the 1960s, because it was labour intensive. It never moved back. Some of those cheap labour places, like Taiwan, are now high cost places, but the work stays there because of automation. The question is whether the packaging plant is owned by the semiconductor vendor, or is a subcontract specialist assembly and test house.
shanekent:

--- Quote from: blueskull on April 28, 2020, 02:57:41 am ---I would be surprised to spend anywhere more than $0.5 on that package, and that's considering low quantity ($1k).

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At 10,000pcs, my current breakdown for a basic 28-PDIP adapter is approximately $0.65USD for the bare board, assembly, and cost of pins. I'd be more than interested in chatting with you a bit more if you have any suggestions for cost reduction.

Approximately $0.072 is from the fabrication, $0.375 is from the assembly, and $0.20 is from the pins.     There's another $0.077 from taxes/fees and shipping. That doesn't include the additional 25% tariffs being collected at by US customs at the moment.

-S
shanekent:

--- Quote from: blueskull on May 01, 2020, 04:26:06 am ---For the pins, my recommendation is to find a metal punching workshop to get custom made pins instead of using COTS.

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You pretty much read my mind here.   I've found some houses in Shenzhen that are going to etch/stamp a length of 14-pins out of a nickel/copper/stainless steel (depending on what I tell them) and then plate those parts in tin.   Those pins will be dropped into the adapter board and then wave soldered.  Then the top runner piece of metal that is holding the pins needs to be cut off.   I'm wondering if the metal house might be able to make the point where the pins are attached to the runner a bit thinner than the rest of the metal such that a simple bending motion on the runner will be enough the break the pins off of the runner. Kind of like how a paperclip snaps off after a few bends....

Even then, the problem with this design is that the individual IC that the adapter is designed for costs approximately $1.25USD at high quantities which turns the finished assembly into $1.75 at high quantities assuming I can reduce the cost of the adapter board to $0.50/pc.     

This is kind of the reason that I was interested in exploring a repackaged silicon into the PDIP format that I need.   If the per unit cost of the PDIP ICs is less than the finished assembly at or around those same quantities, then I would prefer that.   It takes a lot of the logistics out of the situation as well as worrying about my customers mishandling the adapter and complaining.

-S
coppice:

--- Quote from: shanekent on May 01, 2020, 04:57:53 am ---
--- Quote from: blueskull on May 01, 2020, 04:26:06 am ---For the pins, my recommendation is to find a metal punching workshop to get custom made pins instead of using COTS.

--- End quote ---

You pretty much read my mind here.   I've found some houses in Shenzhen that are going to etch/stamp a length of 14-pins out of a nickel/copper/stainless steel (depending on what I tell them) and then plate those parts in tin.   Those pins will be dropped into the adapter board and then wave soldered.  Then the top runner piece of metal that is holding the pins needs to be cut off.   I'm wondering if the metal house might be able to make the point where the pins are attached to the runner a bit thinner than the rest of the metal such that a simple bending motion on the runner will be enough the break the pins off of the runner. Kind of like how a paperclip snaps off after a few bends....

Even then, the problem with this design is that the individual IC that the adapter is designed for costs approximately $1.25USD at high quantities which turns the finished assembly into $1.75 at high quantities assuming I can reduce the cost of the adapter board to $0.50/pc.     

This is kind of the reason that I was interested in exploring a repackaged silicon into the PDIP format that I need.   If the per unit cost of the PDIP ICs is less than the finished assembly at or around those same quantities, then I would prefer that.   It takes a lot of the logistics out of the situation as well as worrying about my customers mishandling the adapter and complaining.

-S

--- End quote ---
Most of the machines used to stuff through hole boards can form pins on the fly, from a reel of wire, and insert them. They can insert a square pin into a tight round hole, getting reasonable grip from the corners while allowing solder to flow. The was an economically import way to make low cost connectors in the 1970s and 1980s, when TVs, stereos, and other high volume low cost equipment was built from numerous boards with interconnecting leads. Those were mostly single sided boards, with pins making a very tight fit, but it works with PTH boards too.
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