EEVblog Electronics Community Forum
General => General Technical Chat => Topic started by: sunnyhighway on August 19, 2014, 01:22:51 pm
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I was looking for mains power sockets which can be secured with a key to prevent unauthorized use when I ran into this Plug Socket Safe-Imitation / Wall Socket Safe-concealed safe (http://www.lockmonster.co.uk/prod/plug-socket-safe-imitation-wall-socket-safe-concealed-safes.html).
Although it’s not wat I was looking for, I was able to appreciate the level of innovation and originality at first.
Only 2 seconds later the words ”Darwin award candidate” came into mind.
Have you you ever seen something that seems like a brilliant design, but actually is a genuine Darwin award candidate?
EDIT: fixed url
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Is the key big enough that it won't fit into the "hot" contact holes?
More and more of the mains power receptacles that I see available at retail here in the US include an automatic shutter that protects the hot and neutral slots.
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Why? it's not a real socket....
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It's been a requirement since sometime in the 1970s that those square pin UK sockets have some means of shuttering the live contacts - specifically to thwart the aspirations of potential Darwin Award candidates, and inquisitive youngsters equipped with tools such as scissors. Often the shuttering is activated by insertion of the larger square earthing pin. Some designs require both L and N pins to be inserted simultaneously - otherwise the shutter jams shut.
But I agree. It's probably not the best idea to encourage insertion of metal objects into a mains socket!
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Why? it's not a real socket....
Couple of potential problems come to mind.
"Go into my office and stick the key in the thing that looks like a socket.... "
That or a child sees a grown up using that item and figures that's what sockets are for.
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Why? it's not a real socket....
Couple of potential problems come to mind.
"Go into my office and stick the key in the thing that looks like a socket.... "
That or a child sees a grown up using that item and figures that's what sockets are for.
Neither is an issue - Uk sockets are shuttered
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Why? it's not a real socket....
Couple of potential problems come to mind.
"Go into my office and stick the key in the thing that looks like a socket.... "
That or a child sees a grown up using that item and figures that's what sockets are for.
Neither is an issue - Uk sockets are shuttered
Shutter mechanisms can fail. Still a bad idea, in my opinion.
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Neither is an issue - Uk sockets are shuttered
Yeah, when I was in UK, had no adapter but really needed to charge a phone. It took me some effort and a screwdriver or something similar in the earth hole to be able plug euro charger in the UK socket. Really respect UK sockets after that.
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You will lose respect for UK plugs and sockets the first time you tread on an upturned plug in the middle of the night.
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Shutter mechanisms can fail. Still a bad idea, in my opinion.
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I've NEVER had a socket shutter break - even on really old sockets. The downside to our mains sockets, as Fred said, is when you step on one.
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Shutter mechanisms can fail. Still a bad idea, in my opinion.
I've NEVER had a socket shutter break - even on really old sockets. The downside to our mains sockets, as Fred said, is when you step on one.
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I've never had a fire in my kitchen, but I'm not throwing away my extinguisher.
Just because you've never seen one fail doesn't mean none do, and there's always some doofus trying to stick the key in a live socket that believes in "press harder." Thus, I still think it's a bad idea.
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More and more of the mains power receptacles that I see available at retail here in the US include an automatic shutter that protects the hot and neutral slots.
I really don't like those. I bought one accidentally when I thought I was buying a regular outlet and installed it in my kitchen. Then I couldn't figure out why the plug wouldn't go in the socket when I tried to plug my toaster in. It takes the force of Hercules and lots of wiggling combined with just the right tongue angle to get the plug to go in the socket...
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More and more of the mains power receptacles that I see available at retail here in the US include an automatic shutter that protects the hot and neutral slots.
I really don't like those. I bought one accidentally when I thought I was buying a regular outlet and installed it in my kitchen. Then I couldn't figure out why the plug wouldn't go in the socket when I tried to plug my toaster in. It takes the force of Hercules and lots of wiggling combined with just the right tongue angle to get the plug to go in the socket...
I agree. I suffer this everytime I plug the iphone charger. With the schukos it isn't as bad.
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Funny here shuttered sockets are required since the 1970's. Tomorrow I would like to go to the crushing at the NRCS where they are crushing a load of confiscated sub standard fake wall outlets and paraffin stoves. All fakes or potential explosions, and all marked as passing safety standards.
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I agree. It's probably not the best idea to encourage insertion of metal objects into a mains socket!
You guys are right. Should've been a proper fused lead that, when rotated 90deg, only the earth pin turns to unlock the outlet. Even better if that lead is connected to a lamp. (Because then it can be a "magic lamp". herr herr) :phew:
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If the goal of the product is to hide a compartment. I think it does it fairly well. Most people are not going to stick anything in a power socket, other than a plug. If this looked like the other outlets in my house, I would be happy with it. The only thing that is required is that you be able to accept a plug and not power anything. So it is at worst and annoyance to someone.
Really the only downside is if kids see you unlocking it. However, I would think that you would secure the room before opening a hidden storage like this, so I really don't see an issue.
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The thing I noticed about the UK style sockets & plugs - is the thread pitch of the wiring screws -- they're so coarse - maybe 15 tpi - that i don't think I've EVER found a plug or socket with all three conductors tightly screwed in !
All types of daily use or vibration seems to loosen these little buggers too easily.
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The thing I noticed about the UK style sockets & plugs - is the thread pitch of the wiring screws -- they're so coarse
Oh. I don't think I've ever noticed that. I guess I'll have to measure a couple of examples and see what the thread pitch looks like. Watch this space...
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Neither is an issue - Uk sockets are shuttered
Yeah, when I was in UK, had no adapter but really needed to charge a phone. It took me some effort and a screwdriver or something similar in the earth hole to be able plug euro charger in the UK socket. Really respect UK sockets after that.
UK style shuttered sockets are also used in Malaysia. A common item there is a plastic disk with holes to accomodate the active and neutral pins of another plug and a plastic pin to go into the earth of the wall socket, opening the shutter and allowing its easy use with various 2 pin plugs.
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Neither is an issue - Uk sockets are shuttered
Yeah, when I was in UK, had no adapter but really needed to charge a phone. It took me some effort and a screwdriver or something similar in the earth hole to be able plug euro charger in the UK socket. Really respect UK sockets after that.
UK style shuttered sockets are also used in Malaysia. A common item there is a plastic disk with holes to accomodate the active and neutral pins of another plug and a plastic pin to go into the earth of the wall socket, opening the shutter and allowing its easy use with various 2 pin plugs.
The UK style shuttered sockets are used in most ex-British Empire countries which left the Empire after they were introduced. India left early, and still uses the older round pinned British sockets. Malaysia left later and uses the modern British sockets.
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That's one reason why I like living in north America, stepping on a power plug here is bad enough as it is, but in the UK? :scared:
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More and more of the mains power receptacles that I see available at retail here in the US include an automatic shutter that protects the hot and neutral slots.
I really don't like those. I bought one accidentally when I thought I was buying a regular outlet and installed it in my kitchen. Then I couldn't figure out why the plug wouldn't go in the socket when I tried to plug my toaster in. It takes the force of Hercules and lots of wiggling combined with just the right tongue angle to get the plug to go in the socket...
I put the shuttered 'safety' sockets in the granddaughter's bedroom at the request of SWMBO. Plugging anything in does take a little extra force but the strength of Hercules isn't needed nor did I have to have the correct tongue angle. I believe that I used Leviton receptacles.
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In 1979, I had a neighbour over the road who wired a 3 pin mains plug onto his phone, and wired mains sockets in the wall around his house with the telephone line daisy chained between each special mains socket. The theory was he could plug the phone into any of these special sockets. So he effectively had a portable phone.
It all worked well until one of his kids plugged the phone into a real mains socket. The phone could have rung... rather than 70V RMS at 20 Hz, it would have been 240V RMS at 50 Hz into the ringer. It blew the crap out of the phone.
They then called Telecom (a government monopoly) for a service call. Telecom owned all phones in homes and the customers rented them. The galah over the road was taken to court for damaging the phone and was fined accordingly. He should have also been presented with a Darwin Award... the Missing Link Encouragement Award.
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I put the shuttered 'safety' sockets in the granddaughter's bedroom at the request of SWMBO. Plugging anything in does take a little extra force but the strength of Hercules isn't needed nor did I have to have the correct tongue angle. I believe that I used Leviton receptacles.
It is a Leviton socket in my case. Some plugs go in more easily than others. The pins on my toaster plug seem to have particularly "square" ends and the receptacle really doesn't like it.
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and lots of wiggling combined with just the right tongue angle to get the ... in the socket...
OK - someone finally had a reason to put all those words into a single post.
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I have had a shutter fail on sockets several times in each case they failed in such a manner that the plug could not be inserted, they were all MK brands UK made and fitted in the 70's.
Why would any one leave a plug on the floor where the pins can be bent by treading on them also why would any one walk around without some form of foot wear.
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why would any one walk around without some form of foot wear.
Because, it's my house, I want to be comfortable.
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why would any one walk around without some form of foot wear.
Because, it's my house, I want to be comfortable.
And to be properly "earthed" :-)
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why would any one walk around without some form of foot wear.
Because, it's my house, I want to be comfortable.
And to be properly "earthed" :-)
Well of course, I don't want to lose connection to mother nature.
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Why would any one leave a plug on the floor where the pins can be bent by treading on them also why would any one walk around without some form of foot wear.
I notice that Dave often does his videos with no foot wear :)
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I have had a shutter fail on sockets several times in each case they failed in such a manner that the plug could not be inserted, they were all MK brands UK made and fitted in the 70's.
Why would any one leave a plug on the floor where the pins can be bent by treading on them also why would any one walk around without some form of foot wear.
Or to take a different perspective: who the hell always ensures that their plugs are kept away from the floor, and who the hell wears hardsoled footwear at all times in their house?!
I personally think the UK socket is quite a robust and elegant design; it's earthed, fused, polarised, the pins are partly shrouded and thick enough that it's almost impossible for a typical person to bend them unassisted.
I've seen UK sockets fail in both closed and open ways, though very rarely the latter and then it was usually due to dampness causing the retaining spring to corrode. I don't think I've ever seen a failure in a socket which requires the positive and negative gates to be simultaneously pushed, that's a pretty effective safeguard.
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Am in UK.
Years and years ago a friend was building a house and as a temporary measure he needed power in one of the rooms so made up some extensions from bits of cable, some 13-amp plugs and some wall sockets that were lying loose.
He wasn't careful enough though and electroluted the pet dog (it lived).
Turns out he didn't care what was at the end of each cable.....and had ended up with a free plug at the end of one of the runs...........240VAC at the plug, not the socket!................The poor dog was only in there sniffing around on the floor.
Ian.
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I worked with an arrogant electronics technician some years ago who one day, left a live 240 mains cable unterminated lying on his workbench (plugged in and switched on). The three wires at the other end were stripped bare. When I kindly questioned him over the potential safety hazard, he replied "Anyone bastard who touches anything on this bench without authorisation deserves to be electrocuted." With that he went home, leaving the thing live.
He wins the Official Moron's Prize Pack.
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Please tell me the next morning he set his steel coffee mug too close to the hot leg.... I really love a happy ending.
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I would have aimed a heat gun at the cable and let it relax a little so it drooped onto the chair............
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(http://i.imgur.com/BgFbt.jpg)
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I've seen sockets on the splashback behind the sink in kitchens in US houses on TV. Always seemed rather dangerous to me. In the UK you are not allowed to have sockets near sources of water.
GFCI only.
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It's fine, they drain themselves:
(http://i.imgur.com/OTY0I.jpg)
(http://www.reddit.com/r/funny/comments/16r90n/im_not_an_electrician_or_anything_but_i_dont/ (http://www.reddit.com/r/funny/comments/16r90n/im_not_an_electrician_or_anything_but_i_dont/))
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The attached image of a playset on the roof saves space and thins the herd.
re: SirNicks post with self draining outlet: Now there's something you don't see every day. I once turned on a hallway light and found the globe half full of water. A roof vent had developed a small leak and the water found its way into the fixture. Except for a rusted nail on the vent there was no sign of water.
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Why? it's not a real socket....
Couple of potential problems come to mind.
"Go into my office and stick the key in the thing that looks like a socket.... "
That or a child sees a grown up using that item and figures that's what sockets are for.
Neither is an issue - Uk sockets are shuttered
Shutter mechanisms can fail. Still a bad idea, in my opinion.
That's true, but it still doesn't mean it's a bad idea. The earth pin is larger than the live and neutral, so it would be perfectly safe if the key is too big to fit in the live or neutral socket, but more information is required to make that decision. It would be safer if the key were made of a non-conductive material, although it might not be as durable.
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More and more of the mains power receptacles that I see available at retail here in the US include an automatic shutter that protects the hot and neutral slots.
I really don't like those. I bought one accidentally when I thought I was buying a regular outlet and installed it in my kitchen. Then I couldn't figure out why the plug wouldn't go in the socket when I tried to plug my toaster in. It takes the force of Hercules and lots of wiggling combined with just the right tongue angle to get the plug to go in the socket...
Yes I hate those TR receptacles, they are required now in all residential installations. They cost as much as spec grade but they're built like the cheap builder grade crap. I've had to put them in to pass the inspection then change them out with spec grade stuff. Harder to get the plugs in, harder to probe for testing, but a determined kid will still figure out a way to poke something in there. Better to teach kids not to poke things in sockets than to rely on gimmicks to prevent it.
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why would any one walk around without some form of foot wear.
Because, it's my house, I want to be comfortable.
I never wear any footwear in the house other than socks. There's a shoe rack by the door, shoes off before coming up the stairs, keeps the carpet much nicer not having dirty shoes treading all over.
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Do you really think all those posters will be expecting a reply after 5 years. >:D
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I have had a shutter fail on sockets several times in each case they failed in such a manner that the plug could not be inserted, they were all MK brands UK made and fitted in the 70's.
Why would any one leave a plug on the floor where the pins can be bent by treading on them also why would any one walk around without some form of foot wear.
I think it’s hilarious how some people are surprised that many people dislike wearing footwear all the time. Heck, I avoid wearing any kind of wear if I can avoid it! 😂 If I’m home alone, there’s a 99% chance I’m wearing some pajama shorts, at most!! (Frying bacon naked is a mistake you make once, and only once!)
why would any one walk around without some form of foot wear.
Because, it's my house, I want to be comfortable.
I never wear any footwear in the house other than socks. There's a shoe rack by the door, shoes off before coming up the stairs, keeps the carpet much nicer not having dirty shoes treading all over.
I prefer the Japanese custom (which is also very common in Europe) of expressly prohibiting shoes indoors: guests take their shoes off at the door, too.
Removing shoes whenever possible also allows both the feet and shoes to dry out, significantly reducing foot odor. Humans didn’t even have foot odor until we came up with modern footwear.
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One thing I always thought would be fun is to setup a power outlet where you actually have to bridge the hot and neutral to make it activate something. It would freak people out. Like have it activate a latching relay that turns on the lights. Top outlet for on, bottom outlet for off. :-DD Imagine getting home with a friend and you just immediately stick a paper clip in the outlet "What are you doing!?!" *click* lights turn on.
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I have had a shutter fail on sockets several times in each case they failed in such a manner that the plug could not be inserted, they were all MK brands UK made and fitted in the 70's.
Why would any one leave a plug on the floor where the pins can be bent by treading on them also why would any one walk around without some form of foot wear.
I think it’s hilarious how some people are surprised that many people dislike wearing footwear all the time. Heck, I avoid wearing any kind of wear if I can avoid it! 😂 If I’m home alone, there’s a 99% chance I’m wearing some pajama shorts, at most!! (Frying bacon naked is a mistake you make once, and only once!)
You wouldn't in my house, unless it's the height of summer, because I keep it cool with the thermostat set to just 15oC. I don't understand why some people heat their homes to subtropical temperatures and walk around in shorts. I much prefer to have my home cool and wear long trousers and a thick jumper. It's much more healthy, better for the environment and saves money too. I often have to wear shorts at work, because they have the heating on too high and it does annoy me.
Removing shoes whenever possible also allows both the feet and shoes to dry out, significantly reducing foot odor. Humans didn’t even have foot odor until we came up with modern footwear.
Not being too hot helps a lot. I often take my shoes off at work and get stupid comments from colleagues, but I tell them I don't have foot odor, because I keep my feet cool. At home I have a separate pair of shoes for indoor use to help prevent mess, but I often forget to change so still walk dirt in.
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I have had a shutter fail on sockets several times in each case they failed in such a manner that the plug could not be inserted, they were all MK brands UK made and fitted in the 70's.
Why would any one leave a plug on the floor where the pins can be bent by treading on them also why would any one walk around without some form of foot wear.
I think it’s hilarious how some people are surprised that many people dislike wearing footwear all the time. Heck, I avoid wearing any kind of wear if I can avoid it! 😂 If I’m home alone, there’s a 99% chance I’m wearing some pajama shorts, at most!! (Frying bacon naked is a mistake you make once, and only once!)
You wouldn't in my house, unless it's the height of summer, because I keep it cool with the thermostat set to just 15oC. I don't understand why some people heat their homes to subtropical temperatures and walk around in shorts. I much prefer to have my home cool and wear long trousers and a thick jumper. It's much more healthy, better for the environment and saves money too. I often have to wear shorts at work, because they have the heating on too high and it does annoy me.
Well, some people do overdo it. But in my case, due to my hand problems (which are quite sensitive to cold, alas), 15C would quite literally be torture. Years ago, at an old workplace, I actually had to wear gloves in the office, to prevent my hand from hurting (well, from hurting even worse...). If I'm not moving, my fingers and toes tend to get cold very fast.
As home, it's usually around 22-23C, which is a temp that isn't too hot for when I'm moving around doing stuff, getting hot, but not so cold that I can't sit around without being in cold agony. Usually, when hanging on the sofa, I'll just have a blanket over me. I do keep the bedroom cooler, so as to sleep better.
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I have had a shutter fail on sockets several times in each case they failed in such a manner that the plug could not be inserted, they were all MK brands UK made and fitted in the 70's.
Why would any one leave a plug on the floor where the pins can be bent by treading on them also why would any one walk around without some form of foot wear.
I think it’s hilarious how some people are surprised that many people dislike wearing footwear all the time. Heck, I avoid wearing any kind of wear if I can avoid it! 😂 If I’m home alone, there’s a 99% chance I’m wearing some pajama shorts, at most!! (Frying bacon naked is a mistake you make once, and only once!)
You wouldn't in my house, unless it's the height of summer, because I keep it cool with the thermostat set to just 15oC. I don't understand why some people heat their homes to subtropical temperatures and walk around in shorts. I much prefer to have my home cool and wear long trousers and a thick jumper. It's much more healthy, better for the environment and saves money too. I often have to wear shorts at work, because they have the heating on too high and it does annoy me.
Well, some people do overdo it. But in my case, due to my hand problems (which are quite sensitive to cold, alas), 15C would quite literally be torture. Years ago, at an old workplace, I actually had to wear gloves in the office, to prevent my hand from hurting (well, from hurting even worse...). If I'm not moving, my fingers and toes tend to get cold very fast.
As home, it's usually around 22-23C, which is a temp that isn't too hot for when I'm moving around doing stuff, getting hot, but not so cold that I can't sit around without being in cold agony. Usually, when hanging on the sofa, I'll just have a blanket over me. I do keep the bedroom cooler, so as to sleep better.
It sounds like poor circulation. Have you tried doing cardio? I find I keep warm more when I exercise regularly, than I do when I'm sedentary. I could cope with that temperature if I was lying down, on the sofa, watching TV, but would break sweat if I did something. Admittedly, 15°C is a little cool for me lounging on the sofa, so I sit in a sleeping bag, but then I get too hot, so I unzip it. I can't see myself ever living in a hot climate. The heatwave we had the summer just gone was torture. It got to 38°C, at high humidity where I live, so I found a nice cool river and went for a swim.
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But in my case, due to my hand problems (which are quite sensitive to cold, alas), 15C would quite literally be torture. Years ago, at an old workplace, I actually had to wear gloves in the office, to prevent my hand from hurting (well, from hurting even worse...). If I'm not moving, my fingers and toes tend to get cold very fast.
As home, it's usually around 22-23C, which is a temp that isn't too hot for when I'm moving around doing stuff, getting hot, but not so cold that I can't sit around without being in cold agony. Usually, when hanging on the sofa, I'll just have a blanket over me. I do keep the bedroom cooler, so as to sleep better.
It might be worth getting your doctor to check you for Reynaud syndrome (if you get colour changes). Mind you, the main treatment is keeping your fingers and toes well covered, although there are drug treatments for more severe cases.
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I kind of want one (UK version, I live in the USA)
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It sounds like poor circulation. Have you tried doing cardio? I find I keep warm more when I exercise regularly, than I do when I'm sedentary. I could cope with that temperature if I was lying down, on the sofa, watching TV, but would break sweat if I did something. Admittedly, 15°C is a little cool for me lounging on the sofa, so I sit in a sleeping bag, but then I get too hot, so I unzip it. I can't see myself ever living in a hot climate. The heatwave we had the summer just gone was torture. It got to 38°C, at high humidity where I live, so I found a nice cool river and went for a swim.
I can confirm that doing cardio does help a bit, with the same effects you describe. (As does being in better shape in general. Higher resting metabolism, etc.) I really need to start going to the gym again, even though it's something I have never managed to enjoy doing. :/
(I am OK with hot weather though, since I grew up in a place that gets plenty hot in the summer.)
It might be worth getting your doctor to check you for Reynaud syndrome (if you get colour changes). Mind you, the main treatment is keeping your fingers and toes well covered, although there are drug treatments for more severe cases.
Hmm. I don't get color change, so I don't think one could say I have this. But while reading the wiki article about it, it did say that ADHD meds can exacerbate it, and so that might partly explain it in me. (It also said that some joint and connective tissue disorders can cause it, and given that I do have sensitive joints and tend to scar easily, both of which are symptoms of some of those disorders, I suppose it's possible that I could have a mild case of something like that.)
I also have a pet theory that my hands and feet feel cold because they're giving off tons of heat, thus losing it. (Many a partner has told me that I am an oven in bed, radiating tons of heat.) :p When I first go to bed, I frequently have to cycle between sticking my feet out to cool them, and pulling them back in because they get cold, until my body temperature has begun to drop and I've reached thermostasis with the bed.
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It sounds like poor circulation. Have you tried doing cardio? I find I keep warm more when I exercise regularly, than I do when I'm sedentary. I could cope with that temperature if I was lying down, on the sofa, watching TV, but would break sweat if I did something. Admittedly, 15°C is a little cool for me lounging on the sofa, so I sit in a sleeping bag, but then I get too hot, so I unzip it. I can't see myself ever living in a hot climate. The heatwave we had the summer just gone was torture. It got to 38°C, at high humidity where I live, so I found a nice cool river and went for a swim.
I can confirm that doing cardio does help a bit, with the same effects you describe. (As does being in better shape in general. Higher resting metabolism, etc.) I really need to start going to the gym again, even though it's something I have never managed to enjoy doing. :/
I also hate the gym so I exercise outside. I cycle to work and go on a 20 minute, 6 mile cycle ride at lunch time.
I also have a pet theory that my hands and feet feel cold because they're giving off tons of heat, thus losing it. (Many a partner has told me that I am an oven in bed, radiating tons of heat.) :p When I first go to bed, I frequently have to cycle between sticking my feet out to cool them, and pulling them back in because they get cold, until my body temperature has begun to drop and I've reached thermostasis with the bed.
I'm the other way round if anything. I go to bed cool and wake up hot.