Author Topic: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back  (Read 30728 times)

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Offline EEVblog

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #150 on: April 30, 2022, 11:10:38 pm »
I think he's referring to the US prison industrial complex, that uses prisoners in close to slavery conditions to produce a huge range of consumer products. Most countries only allow prisoners to produce things for the state, like military uniforms. There is a reason why certain groups really like private prisons, and having the world's large percentage of people incarcerated in the US.

I think having prisoners perform useful work is a good idea, it isn't slavery, it's punishment for committing crimes. Personally I think any proceeds should go toward reimbursing crime victims rather than profit for private prisons though.

Please do not derail this thread with slavery talk.
 
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Online coppice

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #151 on: April 30, 2022, 11:19:12 pm »
I think he's referring to the US prison industrial complex, that uses prisoners in close to slavery conditions to produce a huge range of consumer products. Most countries only allow prisoners to produce things for the state, like military uniforms. There is a reason why certain groups really like private prisons, and having the world's large percentage of people incarcerated in the US.

I think having prisoners perform useful work is a good idea, it isn't slavery, it's punishment for committing crimes. Personally I think any proceeds should go toward reimbursing crime victims rather than profit for private prisons though.
I agree that making prisoners work to help pay for the prison is a good idea. That's not what seems to happen, though. The poor old tax payers pay to run the prison, and someone else profits from the work the prisoners do.
 

Offline MrMobodies

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #152 on: May 01, 2022, 03:42:13 am »
Just found this:
https://www.androidpolice.com/youtube-is-now-hiding-the-like-count/
Quote
YouTube's messing with likes, and we can't hit dislike hard enough
BY JAMES PECKHAM PUBLISHED 3 DAYS AGO
Likes are hidden for some users

YouTube decided to hide the dislike counter from public view in late 2021, and it seems the service may now be experimenting with a similar change for likes on videos. Various YouTube users have taken to Reddit and Twitter to report the lack of a like counter in the normal position, and it's instead moved to the video's description. Reports from Reddit users u/morvexT and u/Ghostyscarab372 show videos without like counters, and some follow-up comments report the same issue. We've also seen three separate cases on Twitter with users complaining that the like counter has disappeared in the last 24 hours.

We haven’t been able to replicate the same interface as you can see on these social media posts, which makes us believe it’s a test limited to certain accounts. The like counter is still there for at least two Android Police writers, and there’s currently no confirmation of the experiment from YouTube itself.

One of these reports came from Twitter user @Thabet_Yusuf who confirmed that if they press on the description of the video they are still able to see the like counter. It seems YouTube isn't planning to hide likes away entirely as it did with dislikes, but it may be aiming to make them a touch harder to find than before. Usually, likes appear directly below the video.

So far, all the reports we’ve spotted seem to be for the mobile version of YouTube. We’ve yet to see anyone report this on desktop or devices such as Smart TVs and consoles. Are you finding the like counter has disappeared from your YouTube app? Let us know in the comments.

Looks like they are trying balance it out a bit, if they are going to hide the negative feedback counter why not do it to the other. Maybe they should have thought about this during their experiment early last year before their final decision.
 

Offline magic

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #153 on: May 01, 2022, 05:11:19 am »
Wonder what's the motivation for that :o

Concerns about people liking videos with many likes already out of peer pressure?
Some video promoted by YT didn't receive enough likes for their liking and they think it doesn't look good for them?
 :popcorn:
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #154 on: May 01, 2022, 08:16:29 am »
Looks like they are trying balance it out a bit, if they are going to hide the negative feedback counter why not do it to the other. Maybe they should have thought about this during their experiment early last year before their final decision.

They didn't think it through, they were pressured to do it by the the corporate media and other big accounts, and the whitehouse who were getting ratioed to hell.
 
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Online Zero999

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #155 on: May 01, 2022, 08:48:07 am »
(video)
As Dave pointed out on the comments section of this video, there is very little to be done other than providing feedback on this portion of the search results page. I personally don't see a problem with the "algorithm" as she mentioned: it is returning an unfiltered result based on what people actually search*. What one does with that information is what matters.

In a society that is more accepting of the trans community, such piece of information, despite distorted, could be the spark of a broader conversation about the word or even be used as PR currency in a partnership.

It's now gone. I did report it a few hours ago, so maybe that did the trick?
I didn't think the word transvestite is a slur. I suppose a good number of people don't know the difference between transgender and transvestite/cross-dresser, or whatever the accepted term is for a man dressed as a women. This isn't helped by the fact that it appears that some people who claim to be trans are just cross-dressers.

Yes, Google will just base its results on what people search and will display troll results, if trolled.
 

Offline HobGoblyn

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #156 on: May 01, 2022, 10:21:31 am »
Just found this:
https://www.androidpolice.com/youtube-is-now-hiding-the-like-count/
Quote
YouTube's messing with likes, and we can't hit dislike hard enough
BY JAMES PECKHAM PUBLISHED 3 DAYS AGO
Likes are hidden for some users

YouTube decided to hide the dislike counter from public view in late 2021, and it seems the service may now be experimenting with a similar change for likes on videos. Various YouTube users have taken to Reddit and Twitter to report the lack of a like counter in the normal position, and it's instead moved to the video's description. Reports from Reddit users u/morvexT and u/Ghostyscarab372 show videos without like counters, and some follow-up comments report the same issue. We've also seen three separate cases on Twitter with users complaining that the like counter has disappeared in the last 24 hours.

We haven’t been able to replicate the same interface as you can see on these social media posts, which makes us believe it’s a test limited to certain accounts. The like counter is still there for at least two Android Police writers, and there’s currently no confirmation of the experiment from YouTube itself.

One of these reports came from Twitter user @Thabet_Yusuf who confirmed that if they press on the description of the video they are still able to see the like counter. It seems YouTube isn't planning to hide likes away entirely as it did with dislikes, but it may be aiming to make them a touch harder to find than before. Usually, likes appear directly below the video.

So far, all the reports we’ve spotted seem to be for the mobile version of YouTube. We’ve yet to see anyone report this on desktop or devices such as Smart TVs and consoles. Are you finding the like counter has disappeared from your YouTube app? Let us know in the comments.

Looks like they are trying balance it out a bit, if they are going to hide the negative feedback counter why not do it to the other. Maybe they should have thought about this during their experiment early last year before their final decision.

Trouble is, almost every business on the planet goes out of their way to hide bad reviews, a while back Private Eye (uk magazine) had an article about trustpilot, saying how bad reviews of certain companies it’s parent company owns, seem to have disappeared.

As for things like Facebook, I loath Facebook, I’m on it to keep in touch with about 20 people where I grew up. Unfortunately this has the pain of getting all Facebooks ads.

One got my attention,  a washing machine manufacturer claiming quote

“ Xyz products are all Made in England to some of the most stringent design and manufacturing standards in the world.”  They also made a huge point about how their washing machines had hot fill as well as cold fill.

Someone asked “ what percentage is made in Britain, they replied 87% is made in their own factory”

I asked them how they arrive at 87%, is it by number of pieces, weight or size etc, pointing out that the most likely thing to go wrong are the electronics, and could they confirm what percentage of the electronics are made in the UK.

I also questioned their claim that having a separate hot fill in addition to cold fill would save the average UK householder with a combi boiler any money, again politely pointing out that for many householders it can take up to a minute before hot water reaches the tap, so in many cases the boiler would be kicking in to heat water after the machine had filled up, hence wasting money not saving it.

My post was removed and I have been banned from their site



« Last Edit: May 01, 2022, 10:23:09 am by HobGoblyn »
 

Offline madires

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #157 on: May 01, 2022, 11:19:11 am »
My post was removed and I have been banned from their site

You're meant to enjoy ads and to consume, not to ask reasonable questions. >:D On the bright side, you've learned that they are hypocrites and suppressing free speech.
 
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Offline madires

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #158 on: May 01, 2022, 12:16:11 pm »
The Day After The Google Video:
 

Offline cdev

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #159 on: May 01, 2022, 01:52:13 pm »
Although its not the main function of YouTube, there is absolutely no reason that you cant set up your own YouTube vote counter, except their trademarked name.

If you call it something else.

You should try doing that. Offer a means for people to vote on web content, and get people to use it. Slice and dice and sort in different ways.Give these web sites competition. They have become hugge monopolies that are stealing all thats interesting on the web and selling it to the biggest corporations to track people.

Ive set up my own search engine, so that I can avoid using Google. Its only accessible to me. Every day I spider a large number of sites. I save my index of their their content to a database. I use a search engine that pre-existed Google. I remember using it back then. (I also pre-exist Google and can prove it.) I refuse to use anything like their "YouTube App". I just use http GET and POST.

Just found this:
https://www.androidpolice.com/youtube-is-now-hiding-the-like-count/
Quote
YouTube's messing with likes, and we can't hit dislike hard enough
BY JAMES PECKHAM PUBLISHED 3 DAYS AGO
Likes are hidden for some users

YouTube decided to hide the dislike counter from public view in late 2021, and it seems the service may now be experimenting with a similar change for likes on videos. Various YouTube users have taken to Reddit and Twitter to report the lack of a like counter in the normal position, and it's instead moved to the video's description. Reports from Reddit users u/morvexT and u/Ghostyscarab372 show videos without like counters, and some follow-up comments report the same issue. We've also seen three separate cases on Twitter with users complaining that the like counter has disappeared in the last 24 hours.

We haven’t been able to replicate the same interface as you can see on these social media posts, which makes us believe it’s a test limited to certain accounts. The like counter is still there for at least two Android Police writers, and there’s currently no confirmation of the experiment from YouTube itself.

One of these reports came from Twitter user @Thabet_Yusuf who confirmed that if they press on the description of the video they are still able to see the like counter. It seems YouTube isn't planning to hide likes away entirely as it did with dislikes, but it may be aiming to make them a touch harder to find than before. Usually, likes appear directly below the video.

So far, all the reports we’ve spotted seem to be for the mobile version of YouTube. We’ve yet to see anyone report this on desktop or devices such as Smart TVs and consoles. Are you finding the like counter has disappeared from your YouTube app? Let us know in the comments.

Looks like they are trying balance it out a bit, if they are going to hide the negative feedback counter why not do it to the other. Maybe they should have thought about this during their experiment early last year before their final decision.

Trouble is, almost every business on the planet goes out of their way to hide bad reviews, a while back Private Eye (uk magazine) had an article about trustpilot, saying how bad reviews of certain companies it’s parent company owns, seem to have disappeared.

As for things like Facebook, I loath Facebook, I’m on it to keep in touch with about 20 people where I grew up. Unfortunately this has the pain of getting all Facebooks ads.

One got my attention,  a washing machine manufacturer claiming quote

“ Xyz products are all Made in England to some of the most stringent design and manufacturing standards in the world.”  They also made a huge point about how their washing machines had hot fill as well as cold fill.

Someone asked “ what percentage is made in Britain, they replied 87% is made in their own factory”

I asked them how they arrive at 87%, is it by number of pieces, weight or size etc, pointing out that the most likely thing to go wrong are the electronics, and could they confirm what percentage of the electronics are made in the UK.

I also questioned their claim that having a separate hot fill in addition to cold fill would save the average UK householder with a combi boiler any money, again politely pointing out that for many householders it can take up to a minute before hot water reaches the tap, so in many cases the boiler would be kicking in to heat water after the machine had filled up, hence wasting money not saving it.

My post was removed and I have been banned from their site
« Last Edit: May 03, 2022, 10:50:06 pm by cdev »
"What the large print giveth, the small print taketh away."
 

Offline magic

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #160 on: May 01, 2022, 05:40:58 pm »
They didn't think it through, they were pressured to do it by the the corporate media and other big accounts, and the whitehouse who were getting ratioed to hell.
They said they hid dislike conuters to discourage downvote brigading of videos.
SJWs have always been the main victims of downvote brigading.
Google is full of SJWs.

Connect the dots, Dave. Google cares about it more (or at least as much as) the media and surely more than the White House.
 

Offline SiliconWizard

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #161 on: May 01, 2022, 06:06:44 pm »
The Day After The Google Video:


Saw that. Fran raises very valid points, but this is nothing new really. This has been a problem ever since 'search engines' have existed.
When the Internet started becoming popular, web sites collecting personal information started to appear - that was even before Google did it. Those web sites were dedicated to providing information on as many people as possible, without their consent, of course. Those were meant to become giant directories.
This has just gotten worse, but the idea has been around for a long time now. Causes major privacy issues.

One additional point Fran makes is the fact that Google helps sustaining some "questions" about people or facts by providing "frequenly asked questions" about the name or topic you're searching. It's one of the most idiotic (well, not for Google, of course) feature one could think of. It's about as bad as constantly pushing results of surveys about what people would vote right before an election.

Is there a way of changing that? I'm unfortunately not sure, as there are way too many interests at stake here.
 

Offline NiHaoMikeTopic starter

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #162 on: May 01, 2022, 09:36:37 pm »
Although its not the main function of YouTube, there is absolutely no reason that you cant set up your own YouTube vote counter, except their trademarked name.

If you call it something else.

You should try doing that. Offer a means for people to vote on web content, and get people to use it. Slice and dice and sort in different ways.
Already done for dislikes, it would just be a small tweak to track likes as well.
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/return-youtube-dislikes/
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Offline EEVblog

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #163 on: May 02, 2022, 01:42:27 am »
They didn't think it through, they were pressured to do it by the the corporate media and other big accounts, and the whitehouse who were getting ratioed to hell.
They said they hid dislike conuters to discourage downvote brigading of videos.
SJWs have always been the main victims of downvote brigading.
Google is full of SJWs.
Connect the dots, Dave. Google cares about it more (or at least as much as) the media and surely more than the White House.

That's the public excuse, and you believed it,  :-DD
But yes, a few SJW's were also some of the complainers, which is why it was made the focus of the public excuse.
 

Offline magic

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #164 on: May 02, 2022, 05:31:06 am »
Google helps sustaining some "questions" about people or facts by providing "frequenly asked questions" about the name or topic you're searching. It's one of the most idiotic (well, not for Google, of course) feature one could think of. It's about as bad as constantly pushing results of surveys about what people would vote right before an election.
99% of Google traffic is people searching for information rather than political opinion and the suggestions are fairly useful. If anything, I'm bothered by the screen estate they take when they are not :P

When I type "bipolar transistor", the suggestions are "how BJT works" or "what are BJT applications".
When I type the name of a local shopping mall, the suggestions are "what brands have their stores there" or "what are the opening hours".

For the remaining 1%, Google is very well aware of their influence and of course always working to "improve". Hence the removal of "Clinton email scandal" and similar problematic queries. I'm sure that "is public personality X a woman" fits this category, as long as the public personality is big enough for anyone to care, because lack of serious customer support and emergency-driven moderation is another hallmark of Google. The idea that they don't care about their influence is asinine, they are highly obsessed with using it to further their private interests, not only in politics but even more so in technology. It's just that they are cheap bastards too so there is only so much they can do with the drones they are willing to hire and the task is immense.

That's the public excuse, and you believed it,  :-DD
But yes, a few SJW's were also some of the complainers, which is why it was made the focus of the public excuse.
So who were the main complainers and why would they give rat's ass in the first place?
Reminder that the votes still exist, they just aren't shown to the proles.
Reminder that the algorithms are already "improved" to ignore "wrong" votes and guide the proles to "authoritative" sources.

Also, reminder that Google CFO admitted to having cried after Clinton's wife's election loss :-DD
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #165 on: May 02, 2022, 06:29:01 am »
That's the public excuse, and you believed it,  :-DD
But yes, a few SJW's were also some of the complainers, which is why it was made the focus of the public excuse.
So who were the main complainers and why would they give rat's ass in the first place?
Reminder that the votes still exist, they just aren't shown to the proles.

Yes, and they lied, it's not to protect creators, because creators still get bombarded with the dislike count every day.
 

Offline magic

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #166 on: May 02, 2022, 07:12:18 am »
For the record, protecting creators' fragile egos by hiding the information from them wasn't really the official goal. The stated goal was to protect creators' fragile egos by discouraging downvote bombing in the first place, by reducing its effectiveness. And they have AB tests to "prove" that it works, or at any rate appeared to work before everyone knew what's going on, because I'm sure that if you want to troll/downrank/annoy a specific creator, you can still do it and all the trolls know it well.
https://blog.youtube/news-and-events/update-to-youtube/

<tinfoil hat on>
Whether they really believe the above or not, what I'm saying is that the downvote raids bother YT as much as they bother their big customers, because they too often affect sorts of content that YT is as much happy to promote as the legacy media, be it for political or financial reasons. They are all one nest of snakes and I doubt that much external coercion was necessary to produce this change.
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #167 on: May 02, 2022, 08:34:24 am »
For the record, protecting creators' fragile egos by hiding the information from them wasn't really the official goal. The stated goal was to protect creators' fragile egos by discouraging downvote bombing in the first place, by reducing its effectiveness.

They very specifically said in the video and demonstrated it with screen shots that they were hiding away the dislike count so that creators would have to go to specifically extra effort to find it. They lied, that isn't the case as I demonstrated in my video.
 

Offline Nominal Animal

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #168 on: May 02, 2022, 10:40:34 am »
Now, how do we convince Google to get rid of that horrible c-slur for those of us having a traditional biological gender identity?

By c-slur, I of course mean "cis".  :'(

Words cannot express the depth of my hurt and sadness whenever I see that slur thrown around like it was nothing.
Why is it that my emotions do not matter?
 
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Online Zero999

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #169 on: May 02, 2022, 12:49:59 pm »
Now, how do we convince Google to get rid of that horrible c-slur for those of us having a traditional biological gender identity?

By c-slur, I of course mean "cis".  :'(

Words cannot express the depth of my hurt and sadness whenever I see that slur thrown around like it was nothing.
Why is it that my emotions do not matter?
I agree. I have to restrain myself from retaliating with another c-word.
 

Online rsjsouza

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #170 on: May 03, 2022, 12:17:41 am »
It is because the infinitesimal minority of "non-c" people that gives two hoots to categorize others this way is extremely loud, coercitive and obnoxious.
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Offline SiliconWizard

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #171 on: May 03, 2022, 01:22:47 am »
Some of them are pretty loud activists indeed, but that's a very, very small minority. Those people alone wouldn't have the power to be coercitive in any way. So, while they are certainly involved, that's not were the power and interests behind it lie.
 

Online coppice

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #172 on: May 03, 2022, 01:45:18 am »
Some of them are pretty loud activists indeed, but that's a very, very small minority. Those people alone wouldn't have the power to be coercitive in any way. So, while they are certainly involved, that's not were the power and interests behind it lie.
Long term studies of the effectiveness of movements says you only need about 3% of people pushing an agenda, and the rest of the population may cave. People see a substantial group, and think it represents a broadly held view. However, they may be looking at hundreds, while the country has a population of 10s of millions.
 

Offline cdev

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #173 on: May 03, 2022, 02:56:03 am »
Do you mean like how a certain global hegemon promoted a divide and conquer ethos in the last century.. except now?  Because thats what I find particularly irksome.. I see that as happening. Unnecessarily dividing people.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2022, 02:58:29 am by cdev »
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Online Zero999

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Re: Youtube/Google is evil, time to fight back
« Reply #174 on: May 03, 2022, 07:07:59 am »
Some of them are pretty loud activists indeed, but that's a very, very small minority. Those people alone wouldn't have the power to be coercitive in any way. So, while they are certainly involved, that's not were the power and interests behind it lie.
Long term studies of the effectiveness of movements says you only need about 3% of people pushing an agenda, and the rest of the population may cave. People see a substantial group, and think it represents a broadly held view. However, they may be looking at hundreds, while the country has a population of 10s of millions.
Another problem is, it's impossible to tell how many are really people are really trans and how many are cross-dressers. The two get conflated these days and many of the latter become convinced they're really trans.
 


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