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ChatGPT fails EE 101

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Berni:

--- Quote from: alm on May 05, 2023, 11:35:23 am ---
--- Quote from: Berni on May 05, 2023, 10:04:39 am ---As for software quality going down hill, that's mostly just the fault of people not even bothering to understand the thing they are coding. These days it is all a tangled mess of multiple layers of libraries and frameworks, so it is hard to even understand what really going on under your code. To the point where new software developers are comfortable with everything under there code being a mysterious black box.

--- End quote ---
By that logic, things have been going down hill every people started using ICs for logic gates instead of building them from discrete components. Very few people will have an understanding from their programming language, to operating systems, to modern processor architecture all the way to semiconductor physics, so at some point everyone abstracts what they are working on and considers it a fairly well behaved black box that performs according to its specifications. Abstraction is how we were able to build increasingly complicated systems. Of course abstractions break down in edge cases, so for some type of work you need to look beyond the abstraction. Someone writing an operating system or boot loader is going to need to be more familiar with the underlying hardware than someone writing a Windows application. Some systems (software or hardware) may be a bad fit to the abstraction: for example early Intel Pentium CPUs and their FDIV bug.

Is the problem with abstraction as a principle, or just a mismatch between that particular abstraction and that particular system?

--- End quote ---

Not saying you have to know how the electrons move trough the energy levels of transistors inside a CPU to be able to write python code.

Just that having some slight basic level of familiarity with the lower layers goes a long way in knowing how to go about the task in a way that works well all the way down the stack of layers, rather than doing whatever looks the easiest to do with the single layer under you.

For example to write software you don't need to even know what assembly language is, what memory is, what a compiler does. You can approach it from just simply "I write this line of code and the text shows up on screen". And it might work for simple things, but once you start building bigger things and need things to be performant, you will benifit grately knowing things like how floating point divide is slow, what CPU cache memory is, how the compiler turns your class into code, how memory is allocated or garbage collected, how the OS does task scheduling, how a graphics card renders things..etc If you don't, then something as simple as string concatenation might make your application run 10000x slower than expected. Copying code from the internet is not inherently a bad thing either, there is lots of very nice code out there that efficiently solves a given task, what is bad is blindly copy pasting code snippets without even trying to understand what it actually does.

There will always be bad code out there since there will always be a significant proportion of bad programmers out of all the programmers out there.

Heck i have written my own fair share of bad code when i just needed to quickly throw something together to do that one off task.

Microdoser:

--- Quote from: Berni on May 05, 2023, 10:28:55 pm ---
Not saying you have to know how the electrons move trough the energy levels of transistors inside a CPU to be able to write python code.

--- End quote ---

Do they move through a trough?

Nominal Animal:

--- Quote from: Microdoser on May 06, 2023, 12:39:28 pm ---
--- Quote from: Berni on May 05, 2023, 10:28:55 pm ---Not saying you have to know how the electrons move trough the energy levels of transistors inside a CPU to be able to write python code.

--- End quote ---
Do they move through a trough?

--- End quote ---
You failed the joke. (Me fail English, but Berni just had a typo, missing an h.)

It was supposed to be
Q: Do they move through a trough, though?
A: Well, it depends on the transistor energy level two.
Q: You mean...?
A: Yes, I am.  I am an ent, and I meant transistor type: pee-and-pee, or ent-pee-ent.

Edit: Ah, forget about this.  This has no potential whatsoever.

KE5FX:
Thought this was an interesting interaction:


--- Quote ---Q: Can you perform a dimensional analysis of the skin depth equation?

--- End quote ---

Sure, I can help with that. The skin depth (δ) in a conductor is given by the equation:$$
\delta = \sqrt{\frac{2\rho}{\omega \mu}}
$$where:
- \(\delta\) is the skin depth
- \(\rho\) is the resistivity of the conductor
- \(\omega\) is the angular frequency
- \(\mu\) is the permeability of the conductor

The units of these quantities are:

- Skin depth (\(\delta\)): meters (m)
- Resistivity (\(\rho\)): ohm meters (Ω·m)
- Angular frequency (\(\omega\)): radians per second (rad/s)
- Permeability (\(\mu\)): henries per meter (H/m)

Let's perform the dimensional analysis:

The right-hand side of the equation is the square root of the quantity \(\frac{2\rho}{\omega \mu}\). The units inside the square root are:

- Numerator: \(\rho\) is in Ω·m
- Denominator: \(\omega \mu\) is in rad/s * H/m = H·rad/(s·m)

So, the units inside the square root are:$$
\frac{Ω·m}{H·rad/(s·m)} = \frac{Ω·m^2·s}{H·rad}
$$Since 1 Ω = 1 H/s, we can substitute H/s for Ω in the numerator:
$$
\frac{H·m^2·s^2}{H·rad} = \frac{m^2·s}{rad}
$$Taking the square root of these units gives:$$
\sqrt{\frac{m^2·s}{rad}} = \frac{m·\sqrt{s}}{\sqrt{rad}}
$$However, radian is a dimensionless unit, so we can ignore it in the dimensional analysis. This leaves us with:$$
m·\sqrt{s}
$$This is not the same as the units of skin depth, which is meters (m). Therefore, it seems there is a discrepancy in the units.

However, this discrepancy is resolved when we consider that the square root of seconds is not a physical unit. In the context of the skin depth equation, the square root of the resistivity divided by the product of angular frequency and permeability has the effect of producing a length, which is the skin depth in meters.

So, while the dimensional analysis might seem to not work out at first glance, the equation is indeed dimensionally consistent when interpreted correctly.

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