Author Topic: Altium Just Lost a Sale  (Read 6237 times)

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Offline blueskull

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Re: Altium Just Lost a Sale
« Reply #25 on: July 28, 2018, 09:02:24 am »
Well CS does not even need cracking. You just export your license to a file and put it on as many machines as you like, I mean it's just crazy. China is china, no one in china cares about anyone or anything so long as they can make a buck. To be honest if CS carries on the way it is I would seriously consider a cracked AD, I paid my money....... I mean if the chinese can do it why shouldn't I ? I thought with the internet stopping piracy was easy and you can't design anything without an internet connection and if you spend £7500 on AD you bet you have an internet connection, no phoning home every 60s to validate your the only machine on this licence and it shuts down, simple as.

AD has the same license management system. A single alf file is all it takes.
 

Offline knapik

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Re: Altium Just Lost a Sale
« Reply #26 on: July 28, 2018, 09:06:43 am »
I unfortunately learned about Altium's non existent service when I was trying to apply for free trials late last year as I'm a student. I had been cheekily applying for free trials throughout the whole year as I didn't want to pirate it on principle. Throughout the year I noticed that they started filtering out temporary email addresses and I simply stopped getting a reply from Altium on those emails, so I decided to just make fake gmail accounts instead. Unfortunately they then released the "robot" for applying for free trials, and it went completely down hill since and all the efforts I took, even trying to bloody call them for a free trial didn't work and I never got a response. I just learned KiCAD instead, and honestly I prefer it at this point.
 

Offline Simon

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Re: Altium Just Lost a Sale
« Reply #27 on: July 28, 2018, 09:22:34 am »
I unfortunately learned about Altium's non existent service when I was trying to apply for free trials late last year as I'm a student. I had been cheekily applying for free trials throughout the whole year as I didn't want to pirate it on principle. Throughout the year I noticed that they started filtering out temporary email addresses and I simply stopped getting a reply from Altium on those emails, so I decided to just make fake gmail accounts instead. Unfortunately they then released the "robot" for applying for free trials, and it went completely down hill since and all the efforts I took, even trying to bloody call them for a free trial didn't work and I never got a response. I just learned KiCAD instead, and honestly I prefer it at this point.

So you tried to get free software and you complaining, you think your the only one trying to be clever. MicroChip also stopped giving samples to non business or university addresses as they got fed up with being played.
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Offline Simon

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Re: Altium Just Lost a Sale
« Reply #28 on: July 28, 2018, 09:23:05 am »
Well CS does not even need cracking. You just export your license to a file and put it on as many machines as you like, I mean it's just crazy. China is china, no one in china cares about anyone or anything so long as they can make a buck. To be honest if CS carries on the way it is I would seriously consider a cracked AD, I paid my money....... I mean if the chinese can do it why shouldn't I ? I thought with the internet stopping piracy was easy and you can't design anything without an internet connection and if you spend £7500 on AD you bet you have an internet connection, no phoning home every 60s to validate your the only machine on this licence and it shuts down, simple as.

AD has the same license management system. A single alf file is all it takes.

Well, maybe I should just do that.
https://www.simonselectronics.co.uk/shop
Varied stock of test instruments and components including EEVblog gear and Wurth Elektronik Books.
Also, if you want to get ripped off: https://www.ebay.co.uk/usr/simons_electronics?_trksid=p2047675.l2559
 

Offline knapik

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Re: Altium Just Lost a Sale
« Reply #29 on: July 28, 2018, 09:28:37 am »
I unfortunately learned about Altium's non existent service when I was trying to apply for free trials late last year as I'm a student. I had been cheekily applying for free trials throughout the whole year as I didn't want to pirate it on principle. Throughout the year I noticed that they started filtering out temporary email addresses and I simply stopped getting a reply from Altium on those emails, so I decided to just make fake gmail accounts instead. Unfortunately they then released the "robot" for applying for free trials, and it went completely down hill since and all the efforts I took, even trying to bloody call them for a free trial didn't work and I never got a response. I just learned KiCAD instead, and honestly I prefer it at this point.

So you tried to get free software and you complaining, you think your the only one trying to be clever. MicroChip also stopped giving samples to non business or university addresses as they got fed up with being played.

Well, that is certainly one way to look at it at least. In my opinion at least, it would be smart if they took a Microsoft approach to their software, to allow students to freely use their software at home for their university projects, that way in the future they're more likely to actually want to support the product instead of just being put off from it as I was.
 

Offline Simon

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Re: Altium Just Lost a Sale
« Reply #30 on: July 28, 2018, 09:30:46 am »
that requires a university based agreement with Altium, did you ask?
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Offline knapik

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Re: Altium Just Lost a Sale
« Reply #31 on: July 28, 2018, 09:38:40 am »
Maybe not too heavily myself. My university does have Altium licenses for some computers and does at least somewhat teach us how to use it.
Starting with this year however, my partner was asking for a way to get a way to use the software at home for our university project and I believe the response he received was just a link to buy a student use license, which I do believe are at least comparatively much cheaper than a full use license. However, I'm quite poor and was already comfortable with KiCAD, so I didn't see the point in continuing.
 

Offline Simon

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Re: Altium Just Lost a Sale
« Reply #32 on: July 28, 2018, 10:35:55 am »
yes lots of companies have student licence agreements. If CS was better they could just point you at that but currently it's a joke and it deliberately can't open the new PCB file formats. So while Daves µCurrent is open source the altium files he provides are only semi readable. James was kind enough to convert it for me not that I had any use for it, it was simply an exercise in how compatible are AD and CS - not very from a production point of view.

We have this problem at work where siemens the bastards tat make solid edge will not open files produced by a newer version and i am quite certain it is an artificial limit and causes havoc at work as the whole office has to upgrade together so that they can open a project currently being worked on by someone else.
https://www.simonselectronics.co.uk/shop
Varied stock of test instruments and components including EEVblog gear and Wurth Elektronik Books.
Also, if you want to get ripped off: https://www.ebay.co.uk/usr/simons_electronics?_trksid=p2047675.l2559
 

Offline voltsandjolts

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Re: Altium Just Lost a Sale
« Reply #33 on: July 29, 2018, 06:14:13 pm »
So you prefer to keep using cracked Altium rather than CS because you installed CS (for about 5 mins) and got annoyed that CS shortcuts were different to what you expected. Thanks for your very professional in-depth review. I wish your lab the very best of luck.

I have a commercial copy under my name with active sub, but some of my coworkers use cracked copy.
The university only offers one legit seat of AD, and it is AD6 back to stone age, and we have somewhere 500 students in the dept. of ECE.
Some research groups or students may shell out some money for a student license, but some others will only buy software if the funding source pays for that.
Unfortunately, our department doesn't allow general purchasing orders to contain software orders, and all software orders must go through ECE IT department, which means piles of paperwork.

So at the end of the day, many students just use cracked AD in the lab. Professors don't care, since they don't do CAD works at all. They only care the boards delivered on time, they won't be bothered with Gerber and PCBDOC.
Please keep in mind that even a student license is purchased, it's still technically piracy, because student license doesn't allow you to do paid jobs, including grant money in university.
PhD students here are paid $2000 per month, and $1700 after tax, from which $1000 is the bare minimum to survive. We can't possibly afford a $10k software.
We do have unlimited Allegro license, but nobody likes to remote login to a Linux server to use a software that looks very Unix-y form the 90s.

The only reason I was able to afford a commercial copy of AD is because I like this thing too much (being a pirate user for years since Protel age), that I used my car fund to buy AD, and I spent the rest on a 20 year old Accord.
Unfortunately, I'm the only person I know in real life that uses a genuine copy of AD, despite more than half of the boards from our dept. are laid out using AD.
Like it or not, this is university.

Well, good on you, Blueskull for ponying-up the $$$ for AD...but your employer should be providing modern tools to help your lab team do their research. North Carolina State University has over 9,000 people on the pay roll (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Carolina_State_University), has currently raised $1300 millions endowment (https://campaign.ncsu.edu//) and in 2016 alone spent $490 millions on research expenditure (https://controller.ofa.ncsu.edu/financial-reports/). At least try getting a quote for some network academic licenses of AD.
 

Online ahbushnell

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Re: Altium Just Lost a Sale
« Reply #34 on: July 29, 2018, 06:57:39 pm »
So you prefer to keep using cracked Altium rather than CS because you installed CS (for about 5 mins) and got annoyed that CS shortcuts were different to what you expected. Thanks for your very professional in-depth review. I wish your lab the very best of luck.

I have a commercial copy under my name with active sub, but some of my coworkers use cracked copy.
The university only offers one legit seat of AD, and it is AD6 back to stone age, and we have somewhere 500 students in the dept. of ECE.
Some research groups or students may shell out some money for a student license, but some others will only buy software if the funding source pays for that.
Unfortunately, our department doesn't allow general purchasing orders to contain software orders, and all software orders must go through ECE IT department, which means piles of paperwork.

So at the end of the day, many students just use cracked AD in the lab. Professors don't care, since they don't do CAD works at all. They only care the boards delivered on time, they won't be bothered with Gerber and PCBDOC.
Please keep in mind that even a student license is purchased, it's still technically piracy, because student license doesn't allow you to do paid jobs, including grant money in university.
PhD students here are paid $2000 per month, and $1700 after tax, from which $1000 is the bare minimum to survive. We can't possibly afford a $10k software.
We do have unlimited Allegro license, but nobody likes to remote login to a Linux server to use a software that looks very Unix-y form the 90s.

The only reason I was able to afford a commercial copy of AD is because I like this thing too much (being a pirate user for years since Protel age), that I used my car fund to buy AD, and I spent the rest on a 20 year old Accord.
Unfortunately, I'm the only person I know in real life that uses a genuine copy of AD, despite more than half of the boards from our dept. are laid out using AD.
Like it or not, this is university.
So your university condones theft? 
 

Offline blueskull

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Re: Altium Just Lost a Sale
« Reply #35 on: July 29, 2018, 07:41:41 pm »
At least try getting a quote for some network academic licenses of AD.

We actually have an academic license in our group, and I did call AD sales, they said we can use it for paid educational research on the phone, though this contradicts their written license agreement.

We are not short on money, but you really need to appreciate how much management BS is happening in university. Literally professors have no idea what their students are doing, except for the final result.

Purchasing anything over $5000 or any software will be logistics nightmare, and even if that gets approved, OIT will set up some sort of local license server and other BS even there is only one user.

So your university condones theft? 

Plausible deniability. They put notes that use of pirate software is strictly prohibited on university owned computers, but no one enforces, and for sure no one cares about what you install on your own computer.

Professors really can't care, they don't even know. They don't care what CAD you are using, they won't care even if you use DaveCAD. They only want measured data. Literally if you can measure data from thin air, they will be happy.

What is being practiced by students is far from what the professors know.

----------------------------- RANT -----------------------------

Something that I can rant on is how inefficient the purchase system works at my uni. I was able to earn an MSEE and PhD in 4 years only because I was very active on finishing tasks and meeting deadlines, even if that means I need to pay from my own pocket.

I think somewhere around half of my stipend went to parts and gears and software, and my parents really supported me strongly with money. I can't say this for everyone else.

Two previous PhDs in my group, each took about 7 years to graduate, both wasted 2~3 years hanging around doing nothing for the lacking of funding.

Even with funding, sometimes the purchasing department can take 1~2 weeks to get simple off-the-shelf parts to you, and for rapid trial-and-error prototyping, that's not acceptable.

Again, we have money, a lot of them, but the bureaucracy shows its finest moments when the lowest ranked people (students) need helps.
 

Offline Spark-Doctor

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Re: Altium Just Lost a Sale
« Reply #36 on: July 31, 2018, 08:41:54 pm »
CircuitStudio support is via Element14, however *some* licensing issues or issues with Vault sign in may require them to involve Altium to solve, but normally this would be via Element14 rather than Altium directly, to avoid these sorts of communication problems.

Hi James and thanks for replying. I can understand what you are saying but why, after downloading the trial am i sent emails directly from Altium support? Surely Elerment14 should be sending out the emails and then i would know who to contact in the first place to get help. Instead, i receive an email directly from Altium saying to contact them if there is a problem. I ask and i don't get a reply. That's not customer service.
 

Offline Simon

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Re: Altium Just Lost a Sale
« Reply #37 on: July 31, 2018, 08:56:40 pm »
For the same reason 9 months into your first CS year they contact you trying to sell AD.....
https://www.simonselectronics.co.uk/shop
Varied stock of test instruments and components including EEVblog gear and Wurth Elektronik Books.
Also, if you want to get ripped off: https://www.ebay.co.uk/usr/simons_electronics?_trksid=p2047675.l2559
 


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