Author Topic: Keysight giving scopes away again  (Read 21028 times)

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Offline Bicurico

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #25 on: November 07, 2016, 01:42:56 am »
I agree.

This is probably how it happend:
The production manager said: "Hey, we have these devices in stock for too long/they are outdated/what so ever - let's do a huge marketing campain by just giving them away randomly!"
Then the legal department said: "Hmmmm... There may be some issues with some countries, regarding to free give aways..."
Then the commercial manager said: "Easy Peasy: let's give them away only to our best selling markets, where we are 100% sure, there is no issue."
The marketing manager however, did not say anything, because the CEO thought it was a waste of money to have one!

The result:
1) The great give away offends many people living in non-supported countries/states (including in the US!!!).
2) There is no aftermath to the give away: anyone can apply and then sell the device at eBay (never looks good for a brand to have their new products being sold at eBay for cheap)
3) Best selling countries are in less need of such a campain
4) This kind of campain fails to reach all those AMATEURS who WISHED they could put their hands on such a device
5) It makes no sense to offer these devices to companies: companies should purchase them!

Suggestion to do it better:
1) Have people submit WHY they want the price
2) Winners have to show one application on a blog/forum
3) Make the give away available globally, even if that means adding terms and conditions like: shipping, taxes and customs are at the expenses of the winner

Regards,
Vitor
« Last Edit: November 07, 2016, 01:46:33 am by Bicurico »
 

Offline nctnico

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #26 on: November 07, 2016, 07:53:55 am »
The result:
1) The great give away offends many people living in non-supported countries/states (including in the US!!!).
Though luck!
The problem with giving stuff away for free is that people always start whining about how something isn't fair or it isn't exactly what they want. Keysight would do themselves a favour to sell the equipment at 95% discounts or something like that. An MSO2000X series for the price of a Rigol1000Z for example.
Quote
4) This kind of campain fails to reach all those AMATEURS who WISHED they could put their hands on such a device
AFAIK several forum members managed to get one of the scopes given away earlier for (relatively) low prices so in the end all is well.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2016, 07:57:21 am by nctnico »
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Offline lukier

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #27 on: November 07, 2016, 08:27:36 am »
AFAIK several forum members managed to get one of the scopes given away earlier for (relatively) low prices so in the end all is well.

That's why I said it would be simpler to just put them on Keysight eBay Store :)

I was thinking about this marketing and I still don't get it. For example sample programs - clear as day, get our parts free either for education or when building a prototype and then you'll be ordering production quantities from us.

What ScopeMonths/CyberWeeks are supposed make me do?

a) I'm responsible for ordering a scope for my workplace (uni) or let's imagine I'm doing a startup company. I don't care that some guy won a scope, I cannot build my business model around blind chance. I have budget for equipment, required features for the project, deadlines and what I want is to get the features I need at the price I can pay, so here marketing would mean various deals like bundles, discounts, lower price for academia or discounts when buying in quantity etc.

b) I'm a hobbyist, I cannot put this as an expense and claim VAT return and the distributor prices are quite high, even for people with decent salaries. Of course I would like to win one, but the chances are poor, a lot of people win them just to put them on eBay/Craigslist or build water heaters at best. This too somehow doesn't convince me to spend few months of my savings on Keysight in particular.

On the other hand maybe I'm too harsh and maybe not all the scopes put on eBay/Craigslist after ScopeMonth were from people with no interest in electronics and wanted to make quick buck. Come to think of it I would probably do the same, as after selling 3000X or 4000X one can then buy much better used scope.
 

Offline rx8pilot

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #28 on: November 07, 2016, 08:48:13 am »
FWIW, I have a small/growing business and won a 6000x 6Ghz scope. In a practical sense, I did not have the financial capability to buy a scope like this without ignoring a lot of other financial challenges. It has put me on an upward path to designs that were otherwise out of my reach. A scope is such a central part of design and validation that it influences greatly the products I choose to design. The win has,  as expected, been a turning point for my ambitious business. Now that my design capacity has improved and has lots of room to grow, I have spent the money on a new lab and preparing to hire someone.

Kind of awesome.

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Offline lukier

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #29 on: November 07, 2016, 09:11:30 am »
FWIW, I have a small/growing business and won a 6000x 6Ghz scope. In a practical sense, I did not have the financial capability to buy a scope like this without ignoring a lot of other financial challenges. It has put me on an upward path to designs that were otherwise out of my reach. A scope is such a central part of design and validation that it influences greatly the products I choose to design. The win has,  as expected, been a turning point for my ambitious business. Now that my design capacity has improved and has lots of room to grow, I have spent the money on a new lab and preparing to hire someone.

Good for you :) (although I'd prefer businesses paying for stuff, this is a for profit activity, additionally companies have a lot of tax and accounting tricks anyway, expenses, deductions, none of this available to a hobbyist, other companies sales people more likely to reply to emails etc - imagine me as a hobbyist and I would like to buy Qty 5 of some Broadcom part and get their NDA-ed datasheet :), not a good example because they probably wouldn't talk to you as a small business either, but you get the point ).

The point is how you winning 6000X in a random contest convinces me to raise Purchase Request at work to buy Keysight stuff - I think it's a non sequitur.

I see some marketing in giving scopes away to video bloggers, might be good for brand visibility, but still not extremely convincing in the end when it comes to spending thousands of pounds.
 

Offline rx8pilot

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #30 on: November 07, 2016, 10:55:41 am »
Keysight built a business on professional users. While some hobbyists and semi-pro customers buy Keysight products, my guess is that they are barely a blip in the annual report. My business has done giveaways with excellent long term benefit. It generates awareness and positive buzz with commercial customers that have no issue with the price. Just because its a business does not mean they buy whatever they want by just generating a magic PO. Capital equipment purchasing decisions are a critical component of a live or die analysis. Obviously some big businesses have a huge budget - most have to think real hard about buying a $20-$50k scope.

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Offline Brumby

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #31 on: November 07, 2016, 01:47:14 pm »
5) It makes no sense to offer these devices to companies: companies should purchase them!

On this point, I might suggest there is real value.

Often one of the main issues for a manufacturer/distributor/supplier is getting a foot in the door.  If you have someone who's a Tek fanboy in a place of influence on purchasing, then you have to get past them with a product before the hands-on crew can check it out in the workplace and then provide their input into the purchasing process.

Putting a freebie in their hands has the potential to encourage purchase of further units.
 

Offline rx8pilot

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #32 on: November 07, 2016, 02:14:55 pm »
Putting a freebie in their hands has the potential to encourage purchase of further units.

That is exactly what I do in my own business. There are barriers beyond the price tag to get new business from a company that uses a competitive product. I regularly do freebies and demo's to try to get a company to latch on to what I am trying to sell them. Once they have a few in operation - the internal users figure out a way to get the purchasing people to buy more - often dozens at a time. I cam referring to specialized industrial equipment.
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Offline ez24

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #33 on: November 07, 2016, 04:38:04 pm »
I am referring to specialized industrial equipment.

Such as ?
YouTube and Website Electronic Resources ------>  https://www.eevblog.com/forum/other-blog-specific/a/msg1341166/#msg1341166
 

Offline rx8pilot

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #34 on: November 07, 2016, 04:46:26 pm »
I make products for motion picture camera systems. Rather small audience at the high end of the market.

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Offline Brumby

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #35 on: November 07, 2016, 05:37:18 pm »
I make products for motion picture camera systems. Rather small audience at the high end of the market.

(He also has the gear to develop induction heating solutions - so he's looking to move onto bigger and better products!)
 
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Offline lukier

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #36 on: November 07, 2016, 07:21:55 pm »
Putting a freebie in their hands has the potential to encourage purchase of further units.

Again, how giving one random guy/small business a scope once a year in a contest is going to encourage the other 99.999999% of businesses around the world (that didn't win) to buy Keysight (so they can get the foot in the door).

From business point of view it doesn't matter at all - I cannot build my business plan on one to a million chance of winning a scope. Much more likely I would have to pay for one so then the price and features matter.
 

Offline Brumby

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #37 on: November 07, 2016, 08:54:28 pm »
Putting a freebie in their hands has the potential to encourage purchase of further units.

Again, how giving one random guy/small business a scope once a year in a contest is going to encourage the other 99.999999% of businesses around the world (that didn't win) to buy Keysight.

Testimonials, industry reports and reviews, word of mouth, networking, street cred.......


Quote
From business point of view it doesn't matter at all - I cannot build my business plan on one to a million chance of winning a scope. Much more likely I would have to pay for one so then the price and features matter.
From YOUR perspective, you are absolutely correct - but that's not the point.  The point is that WHEN you get around to purchasing a scope, you are more likely to go for a Keysight if you have a few extra positive 'vibes' around.  It's not a guarantee - but the chances will be greater.  If Keysight improves their chances across a few industries, they are going to make more sales.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2016, 08:56:16 pm by Brumby »
 

Offline lukier

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #38 on: November 07, 2016, 09:17:57 pm »
...if you have a few extra positive 'vibes' around...

You have to admit that's not very convincing :) Positive vibes might work on some people buying iPhones, but not an order of magnitude more expensive specialist gear.

In the end what really matters is price, features and quality. Tek can give even more MDOs to video bloggers and I still wouldn't buy one even if I had truck loads of money from VCs.

On the other hand I never requested samples from Linear, their parts are expensive, but I love to use them if I can (quality, excellent documentation including Jim Williams' app notes).
 

Offline kaz911

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #39 on: November 07, 2016, 10:23:36 pm »
...if you have a few extra positive 'vibes' around...

You have to admit that's not very convincing :) Positive vibes might work on some people buying iPhones, but not an order of magnitude more expensive specialist gear.

In the end what really matters is price, features and quality. Tek can give even more MDOs to video bloggers and I still wouldn't buy one even if I had truck loads of money from VCs.

On the other hand I never requested samples from Linear, their parts are expensive, but I love to use them if I can (quality, excellent documentation including Jim Williams' app notes).

I like both my Tek MDO and my Agilent MSOX - they each serve their own niche on my desk - and gets about equal usage. Yes the MDO UI is slow - but there are some nice features on the MDO that my Agilent does not have.
 

Offline Brumby

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #40 on: November 07, 2016, 11:45:12 pm »
...if you have a few extra positive 'vibes' around...

You have to admit that's not very convincing :) Positive vibes might work on some people buying iPhones, but not an order of magnitude more expensive specialist gear.

This is not going to be a demonstrable effect.  It is more a statistical influence.

The single fact I can offer is that these prizes are not given for no reason.

Perhaps you would be more comfortable with the simple idea that these giveaways
 - raise the profile of the Keysight brand
 - get interested parties to look at the products on offer
 - have those parties imagine having a Keysight scope on their bench and, thus add a little desire.  A desire which some people will be in a position to fulfill.
 

Offline lukier

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #41 on: November 08, 2016, 12:06:33 am »
This is not going to be a demonstrable effect.  It is more a statistical influence.

The single fact I can offer is that these prizes are not given for no reason.

Perhaps you would be more comfortable with the simple idea that these giveaways
 - raise the profile of the Keysight brand
 - get interested parties to look at the products on offer
 - have those parties imagine having a Keysight scope on their bench and, thus add a little desire.  A desire which some people will be in a position to fulfill.

I think the whole vibes thing and "little desire" is typical modern marketing of consumer products. In Keysight's case this would mean students and hobbyists at best, not their serious volume business customers.

Anyway, I suspect this is a clear out before MegaZoom V. Doesn't cost them much, creates some stir and displays the brand.  Also recently, for example, you can get DSOX2002A for free if you buy B2901A SMU (the price for the SMU alone is the same):
http://uk.farnell.com/keysight-technologies/b2901a-dsox2002a/source-measure-unit-200v-10a-31/dp/2580169
 

Offline Keysight DanielBogdanoff

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #42 on: November 08, 2016, 10:19:31 am »
Hi Everyone,

I was travelling last week so I wasn't able to get in on the conversation sooner.

Here's some non-legally-binding clarifications:
1. You get one entry before Cyberweek, then can get one additional entry per day during Cyberweek.
2. You have to have a valid business address to win, this is related to customs and fulfillment from our end. Start a C-Corp if you win, or something like that if you really want it.
3. These aren't "left over" stocking units. We're giving away new units as a thank-you to the community as a whole. From a marketing perspective it's not so bad for us either in the big picture.
4. Regional exclusions - these are nearly exclusively a  local rules & laws thing. Brumby, we're working very hard to get Australia included in Scope Month 2017, hang in there.
5. Please don't message me asking to get your country included, we're doing all that we can to include as many people as possible. If you're concerned that your local rules and regs are too stringent on this type of thing, work with your local government to effect change!  :-+
6. Taxes - this hasn't come up yet, but if your region makes you pay taxes on winnings then you owe taxes on the winnings. Get a tax-professional to help you if you win and are concerned about it.

w.r.t. the Scope Month winners, a few have sadly sold their winnings but there are a lot of really happy users out there that kept them!

-Daniel

 
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Offline nctnico

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #43 on: November 08, 2016, 11:09:49 am »
4. Regional exclusions - these are nearly exclusively a  local rules & laws thing. Brumby, we're working very hard to get Australia included in Scope Month 2017, hang in there.
Belgium and The Netherlands are excluded as well but countries like France and Germany are not. I'd like to take a shot at the MSOS404A even if I have to promise not to sell it :box:
Quote
w.r.t. the Scope Month winners, a few have sadly sold their winnings but there are a lot of really happy users out there that kept them!
How is that sad? The winners got money to buy something else and the scopes found a good home to lead a most useful life.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline Brumby

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #44 on: November 08, 2016, 07:15:04 pm »
4. Regional exclusions - these are nearly exclusively a  local rules & laws thing. Brumby, we're working very hard to get Australia included in Scope Month 2017, hang in there.

On behalf of all Aussies.....

 :-+  :-+ :-+  :-+ :-+  :-+ :-+  :-+ :-+  :-+ :-+  :-+ :-+  :-+ :-+  :-+ :-+  :-+ :-+  :-+
 

Offline JPortici

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #45 on: November 09, 2016, 07:25:02 am »
carlos did!

At least 180 countries out of 200 are not listed. No need to post about all of those...

Yes, but Portugal is part of the EUROPEAN UNION and as such it gives a really bad light to Keysight's policy if they treat member States in different manners.

They do the same with the USA. I consider it unacceptable.

And this is why I post about it.

Regards,
Vitor
yes but different states have a different legislation in such matters.. and of course keysight's market is different in different EU countries
 

Offline bitseeker

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #46 on: November 09, 2016, 08:14:38 am »
Here's some non-legally-binding clarifications:
1. You get one entry before Cyberweek, then can get one additional entry per day during Cyberweek.

Thanks for the non-legally-binding clarifications, Daniel. I got my pre-week entry in. Glad to hear the first hints of a Scope Month 2017. :-+
I TEA.
 

Offline ProBang2

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #47 on: November 09, 2016, 02:50:43 pm »
 

Offline bitseeker

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #48 on: November 09, 2016, 02:56:19 pm »
Well, well. Thank you very much, ProBang2. :clap:
I TEA.
 

Offline Keysight DanielBogdanoff

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Re: Keysight giving scopes away again
« Reply #49 on: November 16, 2016, 10:14:25 am »
We have the live streams set up in YouTube for the giveaway, FYI. You can set up a reminder inside YouTube.

Link: https://www.youtube.com/KeysightOscilloscope
 
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