Author Topic: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?  (Read 482205 times)

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Offline callipso

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1000 on: July 18, 2014, 04:42:18 pm »
I spent over 3 hours google image searching for something similar to the 'prototype' from the update some time ago (the one with the heatsinky-thingy around the lens) and haven't found anything, but then again, there are literally millions of photos of PCB on the net so...

IMO the picture is indeed shopped, with the original looking maybe something like picture attached. Maybe even the phone is shopped in (as implied by the B-W modified picture earlier in the thread.
I wonder... **BOOM
 

Offline Legit-Design

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1001 on: July 18, 2014, 04:53:44 pm »
I spent over 3 hours google image searching for something similar to the 'prototype' from the update some time ago (the one with the heatsinky-thingy around the lens) and haven't found anything, but then again, there are literally millions of photos of PCB on the net so...
IMO the picture is indeed shopped, with the original looking maybe something like picture attached. Maybe even the phone is shopped in (as implied by the B-W modified picture earlier in the thread.
To me the heatsink looks like they got something custom for their pcb. Maybe some local shop with a cnc machine did it from mu thermal drawings. If you want to prove something try calling the shops around that do that kind of stuff near where mu thermal people are located?
They most likely just had huge issues with thermal noise with their sensor with that 3d printed thermal lens holder. So they just decided to oversize the heatsink. Or maybe the heatsink has same mass and is intended to simulate their final case which should be made from aluminium? I find that to be the most logical conclusion.
 

Offline Refrigerator

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1002 on: July 18, 2014, 05:34:56 pm »
I spent over 3 hours google image searching for something similar to the 'prototype' from the update some time ago (the one with the heatsinky-thingy around the lens) and haven't found anything, but then again, there are literally millions of photos of PCB on the net so...
IMO the picture is indeed shopped, with the original looking maybe something like picture attached. Maybe even the phone is shopped in (as implied by the B-W modified picture earlier in the thread.
To me the heatsink looks like they got something custom for their pcb. Maybe some local shop with a cnc machine did it from mu thermal drawings. If you want to prove something try calling the shops around that do that kind of stuff near where mu thermal people are located?
They most likely just had huge issues with thermal noise with their sensor with that 3d printed thermal lens holder. So they just decided to oversize the heatsink. Or maybe the heatsink has same mass and is intended to simulate their final case which should be made from aluminium? I find that to be the most logical conclusion.
Or the whole thing is just a steaming pile of turd. :D
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Offline Fraser

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1003 on: July 18, 2014, 06:31:03 pm »
I note the comments regarding Mu and FLIR......FLIR are not a bunch of twerps unlike Mu.

FLIR have demonstrated the FLIR One at exhibitions and released sample units. To achieve this they need to have a fully working camera core and I have no doubt that they do. The core that fits into the FLIR One is truly tiny by TIC standards. If the release of the FLIR One is taking longer than expected it is a good sign. Who wants a product that has not had the bugs pulled out of it ? A prototype on public test is the proof of existence that I expect and FLIR has provided.

Mu are acting like total pillocks regarding NDA's........ a fully cased prototype may be shown without breaching any NDA's and it is patently obvious that Mu are a pretty dodgy bet when it comes to them delivering anything.

Those who are hanging in there in the hope of a product should ask themselves if this overdue design is likely to be bug free in its first release (if such ever occurs). What real chance would there be of Mu addressing such bugs ..... from recent comm's I suggest that they should expect very poor after sales support from this company. Unlike FLIR  ;)

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Offline PlainName

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1004 on: July 18, 2014, 09:31:11 pm »
Quote
I note the comments regarding Mu and FLIR

You know, not everything is meant to be taken literally and/or seriously. Sometimes we have a bit of fun. 'Humour', it's called.

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Offline Fraser

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1005 on: July 18, 2014, 10:03:07 pm »
Sarcasm, the lowest form of wit.

Whatever  ::) ...... life is way too short already  ;)
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Offline callipso

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1006 on: July 18, 2014, 10:45:24 pm »
I spent over 3 hours google image searching for something similar to the 'prototype' from the update some time ago (the one with the heatsinky-thingy around the lens) and haven't found anything, but then again, there are literally millions of photos of PCB on the net so...
IMO the picture is indeed shopped, with the original looking maybe something like picture attached. Maybe even the phone is shopped in (as implied by the B-W modified picture earlier in the thread.
To me the heatsink looks like they got something custom for their pcb. Maybe some local shop with a cnc machine did it from mu thermal drawings. If you want to prove something try calling the shops around that do that kind of stuff near where mu thermal people are located?
They most likely just had huge issues with thermal noise with their sensor with that 3d printed thermal lens holder. So they just decided to oversize the heatsink. Or maybe the heatsink has same mass and is intended to simulate their final case which should be made from aluminium? I find that to be the most logical conclusion.

I don't actually think there IS a board. That's why I searched all over the net - to find what is the thing in the picture they used. I think they just found a picture of something electronic (what might resemble a thermal imager) and shopped the screenshot (or maybe the phone altogether) into it.
I wonder... **BOOM
 

Offline Legit-Design

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1007 on: July 18, 2014, 11:25:24 pm »
Not having any board and need to photoshop even the basic things seems little too far fetched to me.

They showed one of the "PHD in physics" guys with eagle on the computer? Not that hard to flip out one a board that does something. Or maybe just has some screw holes for that aluminium lump and footprint for the Wifi board. For all we know they could have used all this time looking at tutorials on YouTube on how to make a board with eagle. And they have said before that they ordered "reflow oven". Any kid with youtube and some extra cash can do those things these days, maybe excluding the thermal imager part.
 

Offline mamalala

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1008 on: July 19, 2014, 11:08:05 am »
I spent over 3 hours google image searching for something similar to the 'prototype' from the update some time ago (the one with the heatsinky-thingy around the lens) and haven't found anything, but then again, there are literally millions of photos of PCB on the net so...

You may try the Google image search function. At least that should help you to narrow down the images to look at.

http://www.google.com/insidesearch/features/images/searchbyimage.html

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Offline EEVblog

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1009 on: July 19, 2014, 11:55:28 am »
I don't actually think there IS a board. That's why I searched all over the net - to find what is the thing in the picture they used. I think they just found a picture of something electronic (what might resemble a thermal imager) and shopped the screenshot (or maybe the phone altogether) into it.

Whether or not it's actually their board or an off-the-shelf demo board, all evidence points toward it being a legit thermal sensor board.
But in either case it is clear it is a prototype/demo board and not any form of production or pre-production board as they are implying.
The original board they showed certainly appeared to have the components they mentioned at the time, i.e. a redpine wifi module, and an Atmel SAM processor.
So they have been playing with something, but they still can't show a single image is beyond me.
 

Online fcb

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1010 on: July 19, 2014, 12:23:04 pm »
Interesting the FLIR still haven't released the ONE yet or communicated recently (the last email from FLIR was on 31st Jan).
An update from their CEO in June said it's expected late July, as reported here.
Thanks for that link - I didn't see it before.

My comment wasn't meant to tar FLIR with the same brush as mu-optics, rather that I find it a little odd that FLIR haven't communicated to those that have signed up for FLIR ONE updates since Jan.  Especially odd since there has been some sort comment from FLIR regarding the ONE since then.

I wonder if they announced something way before it was ready for some other purpose? - they certainly don't seem to use the "lets show you whats brewing in R&D" playbook.  I can't see any benefit to going early with the FLIR ONE, in-fact I can see a number of reasons not to announce it early (including a little bit of Osbourne effect on the low end E range).

As for mu-optics, has no-one bothered going round to their offices and asking a question - there must be someone local to them who has backed their KS, perhaps this isn't the sort of thing to do in the USA.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2014, 12:42:46 pm by fcb »
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Offline callipso

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1011 on: July 19, 2014, 01:29:02 pm »
I spent over 3 hours google image searching for something similar to the 'prototype' from the update some time ago (the one with the heatsinky-thingy around the lens) and haven't found anything, but then again, there are literally millions of photos of PCB on the net so...

You may try the Google image search function. At least that should help you to narrow down the images to look at.

http://www.google.com/insidesearch/features/images/searchbyimage.html

Greetings,

Chris

Tried that of course, but no fruit, unfortunately.
I wonder... **BOOM
 

Offline callipso

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1012 on: July 19, 2014, 01:41:18 pm »
I don't actually think there IS a board. That's why I searched all over the net - to find what is the thing in the picture they used. I think they just found a picture of something electronic (what might resemble a thermal imager) and shopped the screenshot (or maybe the phone altogether) into it.

Whether or not it's actually their board or an off-the-shelf demo board, all evidence points toward it being a legit thermal sensor board.
But in either case it is clear it is a prototype/demo board and not any form of production or pre-production board as they are implying.
The original board they showed certainly appeared to have the components they mentioned at the time, i.e. a redpine wifi module, and an Atmel SAM processor.
So they have been playing with something, but they still can't show a single image is beyond me.

My point is that this is likely not *their* picture / board. If I were them, I wouldn't waste my scam money on buying a TIC board and NOT making more photos of it for the backers; I would either buy it and extensively document it OR steal that pic and gimp my UI into it.

On the side note I just realized that there is absolutely no moiré on the display, so the UI is 100% shopped in.
I wonder... **BOOM
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1013 on: August 02, 2014, 03:07:23 pm »
So, this project is dead, right?
No more dog and pony show for us?  :(
 

Offline firewalker

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1014 on: August 02, 2014, 03:11:04 pm »
I was hopping for an update when saw the thread! :( :( :(

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Offline CanadianAvenger

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1015 on: August 03, 2014, 02:34:01 pm »
I guess their end-game is to try and fade away. Someone who still has some skin in the game really needs to find an authority that can hold them accountable.
 

Offline firewalker

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1016 on: August 03, 2014, 05:16:35 pm »
Charging them with? Conspiracy to commit fraud?

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Offline mrflibble

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1017 on: August 03, 2014, 05:46:41 pm »
So, this project is dead, right?
No more dog and pony show for us?  :(
Well, the dog ran away while it still had the chance. Sadly the pony died and got skunked in that other open source related thread. :'(

Charging them with? Conspiracy to commit fraud?
You could probably charge them with conspiracy to commit disingenuous douchebaggery, but that's about it.

Maybe there will be another point in time at which they are "obliged" to make another update, at which point they will be really excited about something (hopefully involving hamsters this time). But I suspect that if there is no external impulse forcing them to do something it looks like the amusement is over. :-//
 

Offline Bored@Work

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1018 on: August 03, 2014, 06:47:18 pm »
Did I miss something? Some news headline along the line of "Ringleader Charles McGrath caught on the run with some ladies of ill repute in Vegas" No? Or did they just miss another deadline?
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Offline callipso

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1019 on: August 04, 2014, 05:00:09 am »
Hihi 69 :D
Sorry, couldn't resist... I'm afraid this is all we get, no "Sorry, out of cash due to refunds, no TIC for you." or something similar, just giving the term "vaporware" its true meaning...
« Last Edit: August 04, 2014, 05:05:50 am by callipso »
I wonder... **BOOM
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1020 on: August 04, 2014, 05:08:07 am »
Charging them with? Conspiracy to commit fraud?

As long as they tried (probably no matter how superficial), and didn't lie in their updates, there is nothing illegal about being grossly incompetent.
 

Offline Rasz

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1021 on: August 04, 2014, 08:09:27 am »
over $200K for maybe 1 hour per week of some interns time and couple of fake^^^special video effects, not bad at all.
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Offline callipso

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1022 on: August 04, 2014, 03:25:04 pm »
Charging them with? Conspiracy to commit fraud?

As long as they tried (probably no matter how superficial), and didn't lie in their updates, there is nothing illegal about being grossly incompetent.

I'm certain they DID lie in updates, e.g. with the P'n'P machines work... oh hang on, they didn't specify that the machines were building THEIR boards, they just said that it's amazing to watch them... Sneaky little assholes :D
« Last Edit: August 04, 2014, 03:27:30 pm by callipso »
I wonder... **BOOM
 

Offline Corporate666

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1023 on: August 04, 2014, 05:33:07 pm »
Charging them with? Conspiracy to commit fraud?

As long as they tried (probably no matter how superficial), and didn't lie in their updates, there is nothing illegal about being grossly incompetent.

I am no lawyer (thankfully!) but I think they could be likely successfully sued under "negligent fraud" - meaning if you make statements that you either know to be false, or (more importantly) should have known to be false... you're liable. 

A good lawyer would be able to dissect their original pitch and all the claims and statements they made that encouraged people to invest because they were going to make this happen, and show that they were in over their heads and failed to communicate that at the beginning or as they realized it going forward.

The bigger problem would be that they got $280k... but it's 1.5 years since they got that money.  It would be easy for a single person to burn through $280k on a development project like this inclusive of that person's salary... but with multiple people on the project?  I bet the money is all gone and there's nothing left for people to recover, even if they won a lawsuit.
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Online mikeselectricstuff

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Re: Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?
« Reply #1024 on: August 04, 2014, 05:42:07 pm »
This is how you do it properly mu guys - real sensor, real prototypes.

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/crowd-funded-projects/another-phone-connected-thermal-imager/
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