Author Topic: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette  (Read 56553 times)

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Offline Bud

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #25 on: March 02, 2024, 12:40:03 am »
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Offline tszaboo

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #26 on: March 02, 2024, 09:56:49 am »
This is the scene along a freeway concrete dividing barrier.

And this is the same picture for Africa:

90% of the trash is being disposed uncontrollably. Did you ever wonder where all that plastic in the ocean comes from? Do you really think its the plastic straws served in the mcdonalds in Brussels? While we struggle to get the remaining 0.1% of our trash under control, all of it ends up on the side of the road and in the rivers in Africa. And nothing is being done about it.
 

Offline AVGresponding

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #27 on: March 02, 2024, 10:09:51 am »
Nitpicking I know, but that looks more like India than Africa to me...
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Offline tszaboo

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Offline Andy Chee

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #29 on: March 02, 2024, 12:14:20 pm »
Do you really think its the plastic straws served in the mcdonalds in Brussels?
Well it could be?  What does Brussels do with its plastic waste?  Several years ago, Australia used to ship its plastic waste to China.  I'm sure some European countries used to ship their plastic waste to Africa.

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2023/nov/17/waste-plastic-eu-ban-exports-non-oecd-countries

But the vape freeway photo is not in Africa or China, it is in Melbourne, Australia.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2024, 12:16:29 pm by Andy Chee »
 

Offline SiliconWizard

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #30 on: March 03, 2024, 02:14:52 am »
Oh yes, for sure, we do have a lot of plastic waste that we send to poor countries. The above mentioned EU ban is not applicable yet if I'm correct, still being discussed? But even so, companies will easily find ways to circumvent that and send the waste to countries that are not in the list, as the article itself says.

One huge source of plastic waste is not McDonald's straws, it's plastic bottles for water and soda. And I still don't see these banned anywhere.

And yes, oceans are now pumped full of microplastics that you find inside fishes. That's yummy. Would you like some pink rice right from the lab to go with your plastic fish?
 

Offline AVGresponding

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Offline Andy Chee

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #32 on: March 03, 2024, 08:17:46 pm »
Oh yes, for sure, we do have a lot of plastic waste that we send to poor countries.
It's not dodgy technology, but shipping waste to poor countries is definitely dodgy!

Not just shipping plastic waste, but shipping e-waste is only going to grow as technology grows (not forgetting that disposable vapes are e-waste).

I do my best to pick stuff out of the e-waste to reuse in my own electronics projects, but I'm only one person!
« Last Edit: March 03, 2024, 08:22:19 pm by Andy Chee »
 

Offline SiliconWizard

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #33 on: March 03, 2024, 09:42:02 pm »
Nitpicking I know, but that looks more like India than Africa to me...
Source: https://www.forbesafrica.com/focus/environment/2022/04/28/a-waste-of-time-when-will-the-circular-economy-come-around/

Lazy journalism strikes again...

Tineye shows three results for that pic, all in Bangladesh, so my guess of India was pretty close. Seems to be an Alamy stock pic: https://alamy-ltd.ewrvdi.net/c/77643/748811/10905?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.alamy.com%2Fdhaka-bangladesh-03rd-feb-2022-a-man-seen-ride-tricycle-pass-by-plastic-waste-on-an-agricultural-field-in-gazipur-credit-sopa-images-limitedalamy-live-news-image459912857.html


Yes, that looked more like an asian country than Africa.
And yes, just because you see a picture in a news article doesn't mean it's genuinely what it's claimed to be. Sometimes it's out of laziness, sometimes it's for propaganda.
 

Online Zero999

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #34 on: March 03, 2024, 09:49:49 pm »
Nitpicking I know, but that looks more like India than Africa to me...
Source: https://www.forbesafrica.com/focus/environment/2022/04/28/a-waste-of-time-when-will-the-circular-economy-come-around/

Lazy journalism strikes again...

Tineye shows three results for that pic, all in Bangladesh, so my guess of India was pretty close. Seems to be an Alamy stock pic: https://alamy-ltd.ewrvdi.net/c/77643/748811/10905?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.alamy.com%2Fdhaka-bangladesh-03rd-feb-2022-a-man-seen-ride-tricycle-pass-by-plastic-waste-on-an-agricultural-field-in-gazipur-credit-sopa-images-limitedalamy-live-news-image459912857.html


Yes, that looked more like an asian country than Africa.
And yes, just because you see a picture in a news article doesn't mean it's genuinely what it's claimed to be. Sometimes it's out of laziness, sometimes it's for propaganda.
It could be North Africa, which is Islamic and the people there have a similar skin type to those in South Asia.
 

Offline tszaboo

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #35 on: March 03, 2024, 09:54:13 pm »
Nitpicking I know, but that looks more like India than Africa to me...
Source: https://www.forbesafrica.com/focus/environment/2022/04/28/a-waste-of-time-when-will-the-circular-economy-come-around/

Lazy journalism strikes again...

Tineye shows three results for that pic, all in Bangladesh, so my guess of India was pretty close. Seems to be an Alamy stock pic: https://alamy-ltd.ewrvdi.net/c/77643/748811/10905?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.alamy.com%2Fdhaka-bangladesh-03rd-feb-2022-a-man-seen-ride-tricycle-pass-by-plastic-waste-on-an-agricultural-field-in-gazipur-credit-sopa-images-limitedalamy-live-news-image459912857.html


Yes, that looked more like an asian country than Africa.
And yes, just because you see a picture in a news article doesn't mean it's genuinely what it's claimed to be. Sometimes it's out of laziness, sometimes it's for propaganda.
A) Having it on another continent doesn't make it any better.
B) If you watched the latest episode of the Grand tour, every single town they visited was completely littered with trash.
C) just look at videos like these:

 

Offline AVGresponding

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #36 on: March 04, 2024, 06:21:08 am »
Nitpicking I know, but that looks more like India than Africa to me...
Source: https://www.forbesafrica.com/focus/environment/2022/04/28/a-waste-of-time-when-will-the-circular-economy-come-around/

Lazy journalism strikes again...

Tineye shows three results for that pic, all in Bangladesh, so my guess of India was pretty close. Seems to be an Alamy stock pic: https://alamy-ltd.ewrvdi.net/c/77643/748811/10905?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.alamy.com%2Fdhaka-bangladesh-03rd-feb-2022-a-man-seen-ride-tricycle-pass-by-plastic-waste-on-an-agricultural-field-in-gazipur-credit-sopa-images-limitedalamy-live-news-image459912857.html


Yes, that looked more like an asian country than Africa.
And yes, just because you see a picture in a news article doesn't mean it's genuinely what it's claimed to be. Sometimes it's out of laziness, sometimes it's for propaganda.
A) Having it on another continent doesn't make it any better.
B) If you watched the latest episode of the Grand tour, every single town they visited was completely littered with trash.
C) just look at videos like these:


I wasn't arguing against any points whatsoever, I was merely pointing out that the stated location did not match the picture. Like I said, nitpicking.
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Offline tszaboo

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Online Zero999

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #38 on: March 25, 2024, 07:22:31 pm »
The UK is also banning disposable vapes. The stated reason is to protect children, but I don't think it'll make much difference to children and support it to protect the environment. Unfortunately they also want to ban tobacco, but that's another story.
https://educationhub.blog.gov.uk/2024/01/29/disposable-vape-ban-and-what-it-means-for-young-people/
 

Offline SiliconWizard

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #39 on: March 25, 2024, 07:36:19 pm »
Does the UK want to ban Kate as well? :-X
 

Offline NiHaoMike

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #40 on: March 26, 2024, 03:16:15 am »
The UK is also banning disposable vapes. The stated reason is to protect children, but I don't think it'll make much difference to children and support it to protect the environment. Unfortunately they also want to ban tobacco, but that's another story.
A tobacco ban would be a great thing, even if it only applies to the use of tobacco products in public. It's one thing for people to pollute their own bodies, it's another when it pollutes the air near others and when it adds to healthcare costs. (The health insurance I get through work charges a hefty extra for smokers, but ecigs without tobacco are currently exempt from that.)
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Online Zero999

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #41 on: March 26, 2024, 09:10:50 am »
The UK is also banning disposable vapes. The stated reason is to protect children, but I don't think it'll make much difference to children and support it to protect the environment. Unfortunately they also want to ban tobacco, but that's another story.
A tobacco ban would be a great thing, even if it only applies to the use of tobacco products in public. It's one thing for people to pollute their own bodies, it's another when it pollutes the air near others and when it adds to healthcare costs. (The health insurance I get through work charges a hefty extra for smokers, but ecigs without tobacco are currently exempt from that.)
Smoking is already banned in the UK in enclosed public spaces. Passive smoking outdoors is less of a risk.

Tobacco taxes more than pay for the increased health care costs.

Why not ban junk food and alcohol then? The US tried the latter and it didn't work. Oh perhaps cars should also be banned too: fewer road fatalities, less obesity has people are forced to cycle and walk to the bus stop/train station.
 

Offline tszaboo

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #42 on: March 26, 2024, 10:46:17 am »
The UK is also banning disposable vapes. The stated reason is to protect children, but I don't think it'll make much difference to children and support it to protect the environment. Unfortunately they also want to ban tobacco, but that's another story.
A tobacco ban would be a great thing, even if it only applies to the use of tobacco products in public. It's one thing for people to pollute their own bodies, it's another when it pollutes the air near others and when it adds to healthcare costs. (The health insurance I get through work charges a hefty extra for smokers, but ecigs without tobacco are currently exempt from that.)
Smoking is already banned in the UK in enclosed public spaces. Passive smoking outdoors is less of a risk.

Tobacco taxes more than pay for the increased health care costs.

Why not ban junk food and alcohol then? The US tried the latter and it didn't work. Oh perhaps cars should also be banned too: fewer road fatalities, less obesity has people are forced to cycle and walk to the bus stop/train station.
When they banned it back home, I was a university student. It was quite refreshing that you could go to the local pub, and didn't have to throw all your clothes into the washing machine immediately after coming home.
There have been studies that time and time again proving that the taxes don't cover the increased healthcare costs. That being said, I don't think it should be banned, people should have the freedom to do unhealthy things if they choose to.
 

Online themadhippy

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #43 on: March 26, 2024, 02:17:59 pm »
Quote
There have been studies that time and time again proving that the taxes don't cover the increased healthcare costs.
no need to waste money on studies ,smoking in the uk cost the nhs about £3 billion,tax revenue from tobacco £10 billion for  2022-23.
 
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Offline NiHaoMike

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #44 on: March 27, 2024, 12:30:03 pm »
Why not ban junk food and alcohol then? The US tried the latter and it didn't work.
Rather than a ban, just raise taxes on them. Or ban certain ingredients that are common in junk food and are known to cause health problems, for example high fructose corn syrup.
Quote
Oh perhaps cars should also be banned too: fewer road fatalities, less obesity has people are forced to cycle and walk to the bus stop/train station.
Just massively raise the training required to get a driver's license.
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Offline SiliconWizard

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #45 on: March 28, 2024, 12:11:30 am »
I'm not for banning that altogether, it never works and can only favor trafficking and make things even worse.

One good step, I agree, would be to ban a number of specific chemicals that are used in most industrial cigarettes, and known to cause various problems. That is not "banning tobacco", would do absolutely nothing to favor trafficking (no customer will want an illegal product just because it contains nasty chemicals that provide no benefit to them, not even getting them high.)

Heck, we could even ban cigarettes, but not tobacco (as in the old days before industrial cigarettes became mainstream.) That would drastically reduce the number of smokers while not being a complete ban.

Same for food indeed.

But even that is dubious - as you mentioned, taxes that are raised from it all are so huge that no state can really afford to do without them.
If it loses 10 billions a year, that's 10 billions that people will have to pay another way, and all of them, not just those who chose to smoke.

Health costs resulting from that are much lower, as some have pointed out, and even so, the effect on health costs would be seen only maybe a full generation later. Not that it's a good reason for not doing it, but just mentioning that for a generation, people will HAVE to pay a lot more in other taxes to compensate.
 

Offline Rick Law

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #46 on: March 28, 2024, 01:45:23 am »
May be it is just around here (North East USA).  I see a good number of weed-smoking anti-tobacco folks here.  I would believe that their support of banning tobacco is health related if they also ban cannabis with equal enthusiasm.

If health is the focus, it is more important to ban cannabis than tobacco (lid or vape).  According to this[1] study by Medical Research Institute of New Zealand, cannabis is at least 2.5X to 5X worst.

References:

[1] Study Says Smoking Marijuana Worse for Lungs than Cigarettes
"Smoking a single marijuana joint is equivalent to smoking 2.5 to 5 cigarettes in terms of damage to the lungs, largely due to differences in how pot and cigarette users smoke... ... ..."

https://drugfree.org/drug-and-alcohol-news/study-says-smoking-marijuana-worse-for-lungs-than-cigarettes/
 

Offline Bud

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #47 on: March 28, 2024, 01:54:50 am »
Do not ban eSigs, we need free Li-ion batteries supply for our projects to keep coming.
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Online themadhippy

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #48 on: March 28, 2024, 01:58:41 am »

 

Online Zero999

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Re: Ecology vs Disposable Electronic Cigarette
« Reply #49 on: March 28, 2024, 08:14:22 am »
Why not ban junk food and alcohol then? The US tried the latter and it didn't work.
Rather than a ban, just raise taxes on them. Or ban certain ingredients that are common in junk food and are known to cause health problems, for example high fructose corn syrup.
Quote
Oh perhaps cars should also be banned too: fewer road fatalities, less obesity has people are forced to cycle and walk to the bus stop/train station.
Just massively raise the training required to get a driver's license.
Taxes are already high in the UK. Especially on cigarettes.

I doubt junk food taxes would work. There's already a sugar tax on soft drinks over a certain percentage of sugar, but the manufactures simply replaced some of the sugar with artificial sweeteners, which aren't proven to be any more healthy or result in weight loss. Food is already processed enough. I doubt anyone wants it to become more artificial to circumvent taxes.

The driving test is already difficult enough as it is. There's a computer based simulator and written exam as well as the practical test. A big weakness is, foreigners from countries with less stringent driving tests can come here and drive on an international license, but I doubt the government will stop that.
 


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