I don’t see the fuss over wireless charging

[eti]

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Wireless charging - what’s the great “benefit” from a system where you have a pad that charges your phone **slower** due to coupling losses, than if you’d just plugged it into a cable? Also, you have to position the phone PRECISELY or the induction coils will be misaligned, and you can’t use your device - pick it up and make a call, et cetera, as it’s charging (obviously).

As was the case with NFC, about 7 years ago, and how (mainly) the Android ✌️“Community”✌️obsessed over it just for the sake of doing so (and using it as a reason to deride Apple for not implementing it 🙄), it seems like another fad wave which the net is riding, and apart from the ✌️“”inconvenience”✌️(? 🤣🤨) of plugging in a wire, what is the benefit?

Oh and let’s cancel out all nonsense comments about water and dust ingress. People will always find another way to damage their phone - ALWAYS. They drop them, sit on them, lose them… I don’t see a tiny socket as much of a problem.

Consumer technology circles seem to love to obsess over the latest gimmick, and it seems that rarely is any deep, high quality critical and objective thinking applied. I can understand electric toothbrushes having needed to use this for years - it’s a safety issue - but this? Hah!! Piffle.

[ataradov]

Wow, you lasted two whole days before creating another ranting thread.

Wireless charging is convenient and works reasonably well.  If you don't like it - don't use it. It is as simple as that.

[eti]

Wow, you lasted two whole days before creating another ranting thread.

Wireless charging is convenient and works reasonably well.  If you don't like it - don't use it. It is as simple as that.

Don’t be a troublemaker. I’m not “ranting”, this is a genuine topic and I’m curious as to what the fuss is about.

Don’t stir up unrest, that’s not nice. If you’re at a loose end, why not do something apart from “policing” the internet? I could comment on your posts, but I lack the will to do so - I don’t let people steal my peace - what you post is your concern, and if the mods take issue with you, that’s a personal issue between you folks.

Take care.

[ataradov]

There is not "fuss". It is a technology that many people find useful, so manufactures put it into the devices. If you personally don't find it useful - good for you, you can forget that it exists. You are not losing anything because my charging is less efficient than it could be.

Your approach to things can be applied to literally anything and it is not productive. What is the fuss with TV remove controls? Is it hard to go to the TV and switch channels? Only wasting more plastic on making those remotes. And you can lose them easily.

[eti]

There is not "fuss". It is a technology that many people find useful, so manufactures put it into the devices. If you personally don't find it useful - good for you, you can forget that it exists. You are not losing anything because my charging is less efficient than it could be.

Your approach to things can be applied to literally anything and it is not productive. What is the fuss with TV remove controls? Is it hard to go to the TV and switch channels? Only wasting more plastic on making those remotes. And you can lose them easily.

Leave the thread that you deem unworthy of time investment, then. If it’s not to your taste, feel welcome to spend energy more productively on topics you like. You’re not spoiling my day, I reject your negativity - spread it elsewhere, keep off my threads, please.

[CatalinaWOW]

This is not a personal attack.

Wireless charging is appealing to me (and obviously quite a few others).  The main benefit is not having to scramble for a cord end and plug it in when a charge is required.  Dropping the phone on a charging surface is a one handed operation, while plugging a charging cord in requires two.  (I have had charging stations that let me drop the phone onto a charging plug and liked that feature even though it required a custom cradle for the charger and had some other issues.)  Is it a world changing feature?  Of course not.  But most of the features on smart phones are not world changing, they are merely conveniences.  Alignment of the phone to the charger is not critical on the systems I have seen, and if you find it difficult to get adequate alignment simple mechanical guides are more than up to the job.

I agree that it is less efficient.  But losing a few watt-hours a day isn't going to be noticeable on my electric bill.  Since I usually charge my phone overnight fast charging isn't a huge factor to me.  My biggest use of it has come as the (non-replaceable) battery in my phone has aged and no longer can support a full heavy usage day.  So a few late in the day high speed energy dumps on those high usage days lets me eke out a few more months before I either do a risky battery replacement or replace the phone.  That has been averaging less than one day a week of needing a quick pump up over the last month or two.

You are right, having one less point of entry for water isn't going to make the phone safe forever and for everyone.  But it helps a little bit.  Kind of like eliminating the earphone plug.

Finally, like eliminating the earphone plug the fundamental reason may be packaging.  The antenna and transmitter for wireless earplugs is easier to package than the jack.  And some manufacturers have said the same about the charging plug.

So the fuss boils down to a convenience that some people find appealing, others find appalling and most say meh about.  Kind of like fast charging or cordless earphones.  Those that try to crucify a phone that doesn't have one of these conveniences is just trying to pick a fight.

[eti]

This is not a personal attack.

Wireless charging is appealing to me (and obviously quite a few others).  The main benefit is not having to scramble for a cord end and plug it in when a charge is required.  Dropping the phone on a charging surface is a one handed operation, while plugging a charging cord in requires two.  (I have had charging stations that let me drop the phone onto a charging plug and liked that feature even though it required a custom cradle for the charger and had some other issues.)  Is it a world changing feature?  Of course not.  But most of the features on smart phones are not world changing, they are merely conveniences.  Alignment of the phone to the charger is not critical on the systems I have seen, and if you find it difficult to get adequate alignment simple mechanical guides are more than up to the job.

I agree that it is less efficient.  But losing a few watt-hours a day isn't going to be noticeable on my electric bill.  Since I usually charge my phone overnight fast charging isn't a huge factor to me.  My biggest use of it has come as the (non-replaceable) battery in my phone has aged and no longer can support a full heavy usage day.  So a few late in the day high speed energy dumps on those high usage days lets me eke out a few more months before I either do a risky battery replacement or replace the phone.  That has been averaging less than one day a week of needing a quick pump up over the last month or two.

You are right, having one less point of entry for water isn't going to make the phone safe forever and for everyone.  But it helps a little bit.  Kind of like eliminating the earphone plug.

Finally, like eliminating the earphone plug the fundamental reason may be packaging.  The antenna and transmitter for wireless earplugs is easier to package than the jack.  And some manufacturers have said the same about the charging plug.

So the fuss boils down to a convenience that some people find appealing, others find appalling and most say meh about.  Kind of like fast charging or cordless earphones.  Those that try to crucify a phone that doesn't have one of these conveniences is just trying to pick a fight.

I don’t perceive it as an “attack”, you’re courteous and reasonable (I find that most people are)

Whilst you won’t notice much of a personal dent, financially, I find it a little contradictory in an overall industry sense that, on the one hand, everyone’s crowing about “carbon footprint” this, “efficiency” that, and the politicians and companies manipulate us with “ecowash”, and yet here we have a system which is by its very physics inefficient, and strangely the novelty factor of this seemingly “futuristic” technology seems to cancel and override the inherent inefficiencies, ALL of which are real, tangible cumulative power losses which add up to more waste and whatever else damages the environment - (seriously? Inductive transfer seen is “futuristic”, and yet is the oldest and most fundamental of electronics systems… okay then… if they think so 😁)

I’m neutral as regards the rather silly “bad” or “good” perspective - I simply don’t see it offers anything of any worth. The charging pad itself has to be plugged in which requires a cable - where’s the “benefit”?

[Berni]

It is a convenience factor thing.

Do you always need your phone changed quickly? Do you always hold it in your hands and never set it down somewhere? Don't think so. Just because your phone supports wireless charging doesn't mean you loose the ability to charge the old way over a USB port. Use if it you need a quick charge before you leave home or are actively using it while the battery is near dead.

Most people have certain spots where they leave there phone when not in use. I like to leave mine on my desk and i have a spot in my bedroom where i charge it overnight. I don't care how fast it charges, all i care is that i have a full battery by the time i wake up. To make this easier i have a magnetic USB adapter plugged in. All i have to do is bring the port close enough to the dangling cable end for the magnets to pull and with a click it grabs on and starts charging. In the morning i grab the phone and just yank it away for the charger cable to pop off. Saves a lot of hassle with grabbing the cable and fiddling with it to plug it in.

This is the same use case where wireless charging would come in useful, i could just toss it on a tray and it charges, pick it back up in the morning. But my phone doesn't have wireless charging and still has microUSB, yet after all these years of overnight charging the battery still lasts a few days on one charge no problem.

NFC also has its uses. There are tags that can be detected by the phone to trigger common tasks, there are devices that can easily pair up via NFC from a simple tap (Got a wifi label printer that does it). Also contactless payment cards use this protocol, so my phone can present itself as my bank card, no special Apple Pay or GooglePay or something needed, the POS terminal just thinks its talking to the card from my small local bank that happens to have a NFC app available.

Yes some of the funky new wireless technology is just a fad and gimmick to wow the consumers with a shiny new thing. But some parts are genuinely useful.

[eti]

It's a daft gimmick. If it was that amazing, why was this very well known aspect of physics, not implemented in phones many decades ago? An oscillator and a coil are not technological advancements - the marketing and fad wave took over.

With all respect, I find people are easily sold on things they could easily dismiss as pointless, were they not already ¾ of the way on being convinced into a new gadget purchase. I've yet to hear an actual, tangible, logical benefit for it over a simple, basic plug and socket, because I don't see there IS one. If it's that convenient and time saving, why are all phones sold not using it exclusively? Because it's a gimmick.

It takes two hands to steer a car, and yet I see no one saying what a nuisance that is - I don't see the "convenience" of saving oneself the hardship of having to pause a second, plug a wire in and carry on. Lol!


As for NFC, let's just say that Apple are the ONLY company which finally made it come into its own, transparently, seamlessly, ubiquitously and not merely be a bullet point on an Android device page for nerds to thrill over. As for many things, Apple may not be "first!!!", but they make very sure that, if they consider and invest in a thing, it becomes invisible and often the best.

I recall when my friend used to mock me that my iPhone didn't support bluetooth file transfer. Fine - mock away - it's not like I designed the thing. But the idiocy of sitting in my kitchen for ONE HOUR with his Samsung, trying to execute something as basic as sending me a 500MB video to me, OVER BLUETOOTH 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️ and then via "Android Beam" and about 10 other useless Samsung "features", was one of the most ridiculous fails I've ever remembered.

Then, Apple releases "Airdrop" and all this horse #### vanishes, but back on the Samsung planet, they're still messing about with 90s protocols and quasi-oddball half baked Android things. Wow.

I've yet to have AirDrop fail me, and for iOS to Android/PC transfer I use "Send Anywhere" which I've used for a few years now - in fact I've sent 27GB of media from my iPhone to my Android phone just an hour ago, in 20 mins!

I digressed. I felt it... 😁

[ataradov]

Why LTE speeds were not implemented before? We knew how to transmit radio waves long before the wireless phones.

The physics are known, but the manufacturing and semiconductor technologies required to support modern charging are not trivial. And may be that is why you perceive this technology as inefficient - you think of it in terms of the 60 or something like that.

But if you think it is a gimmick - then don't use it, surely the rest of the people will realize the same and abandon it soon.

[eti]

[Excluding forum members in this statement, due to the fact of your very membership, you are above average in understanding electronics and physics]

I see one very obvious factor that has caused the perception that this "WOW! STAR TREK TECK!", as is evidenced by the huge amount of technical ignorance (forgivable, we aren't ALL interested in electronics or engineering) on one of, I am sure, countless internet threads: https://www.reddit.com/r/changemyview/comments/9zqhi3/cmv_wireless_charging_is_a_useless_fad/

The sheer "Star Trek" factor, perceived by the world at large, is staggering, and somewhat amusing - have a read of that link - the misunderstanding and apparent perceived gains, are nothing short of "wow.... ok..... wow....  "

This is me in critical thinking mode, please do not take offence - I am not giving it to you - I have no offence, nor personal judgment re using it - I just see it as objectively illogical, and wasteful in myriad senses.

[eti]

Why LTE speeds were not implemented before? We knew how to transmit radio waves long before the wireless phones.

The physics are known, but the manufacturing and semiconductor technologies required to support modern charging are not trivial. And may be that is why you perceive this technology as inefficient - you think of it in terms of the 60 or something like that.

But if you think it is a gimmick - then don't use it, surely the rest of the people will realize the same and abandon it soon.

May I parse all your threads, and form similar conclusions in regard to the discussions you are interested in, and attempt to convince you not to form opinions? Please, with all kindness, you may be better served to spend time on other things. Thank you.

[Haenk]

Honestly, what's wrong with you?

I kept 2 (good) smartphones alive, that had USB-port issues. Just used the Qi charger I had. Replacing the port was not an option. So there you have it, wireless charging obviously does have some very good use, it saved 2 smartphones from E-waste. And: Had my familiy members used the wireless charging from day one, the USB ports would have been fine, likely forever.
On the otehr hand, I do have 3 tables and 2 more smartphones with damaged USB ports, repairing is pointless as those are now pretty worthless, so a spare part is more expensive than a working device. Qi charging would have kept them in use.

If you don't like it, don't use it or don't buy it.

[eti]

Honestly, what's wrong with you?

I kept 2 (good) smartphones alive, that had USB-port issues. Just used the Qi charger I had. Replacing the port was not an option. So there you have it, wireless charging obviously does have some very good use, it saved 2 smartphones from E-waste. And: Had my familiy members used the wireless charging from day one, the USB ports would have been fine, likely forever.
On the otehr hand, I do have 3 tables and 2 more smartphones with damaged USB ports, repairing is pointless as those are now pretty worthless, so a spare part is more expensive than a working device. Qi charging would have kept them in use.

If you don't like it, don't use it or don't buy it.

Who said anything is “wrong” with me? That’s pretty personal - would I be so rude to ask you that? It sounds like you’re rather careless with your devices if you have THAT many with damaged ports - never once had a charging socket broken on decades of many many phones. Use what you like - I’m not questioning PEOPLE, I’m questioning the logic of the system.

Gosh people love being “the offended generation” 😁

[racemaniac]

Honestly, what's wrong with you?

I kept 2 (good) smartphones alive, that had USB-port issues. Just used the Qi charger I had. Replacing the port was not an option. So there you have it, wireless charging obviously does have some very good use, it saved 2 smartphones from E-waste. And: Had my familiy members used the wireless charging from day one, the USB ports would have been fine, likely forever.
On the otehr hand, I do have 3 tables and 2 more smartphones with damaged USB ports, repairing is pointless as those are now pretty worthless, so a spare part is more expensive than a working device. Qi charging would have kept them in use.

If you don't like it, don't use it or don't buy it.

Who said anything is “wrong” with me? That’s pretty personal - would I be so rude to ask you that? It sounds like you’re rather careless with your devices if you have THAT many with damaged ports - never once had a charging socket broken on decades of many many phones. Use what you like - I’m not questioning PEOPLE, I’m questioning the logic of the system.

Gosh people love being “the offended generation” 😁

Dude, learn to chill.

This thread started with you ranting on wireless charging, and why you think it's absolutely worthless.

And when people give you clear usecases on why they think it is useful. And put downsides (such as efficiency) into perspective, all you do is dig your heels deeper, and go on the attack.

And then you say everyone else is offended while you seem to take any objection to your opinion as something that needs to be immediately attacked & rectified, since you obviously can't be wrong.

As others have already said many times in this thread: if you don't like it, don't use it or don't buy it, but you've already received plenty of answers on why people do like to use it, and why they think it's not a complete waste. You can disagree with that, but i'm not sure why you're trying to convince people that something they know is useful & convenient for them, isn't useful & convenient for them.

[Raj]

I find wireless charging to be quite an odd thing to implement in consumer device just for the sake of it. Sure there are use cases like waterproofing or ability to implant device into our body or something.
A better way to charge would be to have conductive surfaces on the device, you drop the device onto a pad and pogo pins or something mechanical on the pad, sends electricity into the device. Ofc you'll need systems to detect the presence of device for safety reasons but it'll be relatively extremely efficient.
The problem of alignment is present in both wireless and my method. People try to solve it by implementing multiple coil design. I think, just having sloped surfaces like a funnel would solve it alongside gravity. or electromechanical pusher that pushes the device into it's position.

I also find it funny that Wifi exists, has higher speeds and still we send data over bluetooth. You can theoretically send data over wifi using quazi-FTP protocol but you can't since no one programmed that.

I am a hater of modern phones. You can't achieve the level of customization using root or jailbreak that a true open source OS can provide. Most phones now days are ultra locked down and have features for the sake of it and look the same. They say, android is open source but all opensource implementations are pretty awful.

You say, don't like it, don't buy it? I hate the notch but tell me a modern model without a notch is isn't sub power in other fields. Hate the camera bump and want a thicker phone with bigger battery or even other gimmicky features like second tiny screen? you're totally out of luck.

Also What's up with the government of the world? Why can't we get another band of radio just for lag free personal audio. Why does bluetooth perform so badly?

Honestly, what's wrong with you?

I kept 2 (good) smartphones alive, that had USB-port issues. Just used the Qi charger I had. Replacing the port was not an option. So there you have it, wireless charging obviously does have some very good use, it saved 2 smartphones from E-waste. And: Had my familiy members used the wireless charging from day one, the USB ports would have been fine, likely forever.
On the otehr hand, I do have 3 tables and 2 more smartphones with damaged USB ports, repairing is pointless as those are now pretty worthless, so a spare part is more expensive than a working device. Qi charging would have kept them in use.

If you don't like it, don't use it or don't buy it.

Not getting the right to repair doesn't mean plan b is better. If you had access to spares, you would have charged it wired way.

[IanB]

I tried out a wireless charger with my phone out of curiosity, but I don't use it. It provides no benefits for me.

Unless I glue down the magnetic base it still requires two hands to detach it from the phone, and without it I have no difficulty plugging in the charging cable when I want to charge the phone. It makes no difference whether the charging cable has a plug on the end of it or a magnetic charging puck on the end of it. Frankly the plug is lighter and easier to deal with.

The other thing that discourages me is the way the charging unit leaves marks on the phone case due to its limpet-like magnetic attraction.

[Berni]

Who said anything is “wrong” with me? That’s pretty personal - would I be so rude to ask you that? It sounds like you’re rather careless with your devices if you have THAT many with damaged ports - never once had a charging socket broken on decades of many many phones. Use what you like - I’m not questioning PEOPLE, I’m questioning the logic of the system.

Gosh people love being “the offended generation” 😁

You are the one in this thread that appears to get offended by everything. The others are just providing perfectly reasonable answers to what the use for wireless charging is, yet just rant on about it just because it doesn't line up with what you think about it.

There are lots of things that i don't find sensible myself, but i am perfectly fine with others finding it sensible. For example i don't see any sense in owning a fast sports car. Its expensive to buy, expensive to maintain, expensive to insure, unpractical, uncomfortable to drive, gets poor fuel efficiency and i can't drive it any faster on public roads anyway due to speed limits. But i don't go around saying that sports cars are stupid. I can see why someone else would indeed want one and enjoy having one. They might enjoy looking flashy in it, they might be a motoring enthusiast that likes interesting cars, or maybe they take it to track days and actually race it in a safe environment. Good on you, enjoy your fancy car.

[daqq]

There are areas where it is practical - sealed devices, whether consumer or industrial suddenly don't need an IP6x connector to charge. In other areas it's a minor convenience.

Yes, it's a gimmick, most of the time, some of the time it's not.

As was the case with NFC, about 7 years ago, and how (mainly) the Android ✌️“Community”✌️obsessed over it just for the sake of doing so (and using it as a reason to deride Apple for not implementing it 🙄), it seems like another fad wave which the net is riding, and apart from the ✌️“”inconvenience”✌️(? 🤣🤨) of plugging in a wire, what is the benefit?

Ah, yes, the "I don't use it, therefore it's the most idiotic thing conceivable" mentality.

Also, are them damn kids playing on your lawn again?

[MrMobodies]

I brought a few of these stands and not just for the 10w meagre wireless charging alone but  to stand the phones up.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B07PMLFBRR/

Enjoy rapid wireless charging with the sleek Galvanox Aluminum PowerStand - the upgraded 10W output supports Samsung's new Adaptive Fast Charge 2.0 standard (for all Galaxy S10 models) For your convenience this stand comes equipped with an international travel adapter - providing you with global charging options (80+ countries) right out of the box!
The PowerStand comes packed with great little features: 3-way adjustable indicator brightness (night mode), Charging interference alerts, redundant internal safety protections, Non-slip grip points and much more. Powered by USB C, the Powerstand is perfect for desktop and nightstand wireless charging applications. Built with the quality and solid feel you've come to expect from every Galvanox product.

I wouldn't be enjoying a charge rate of 10w an hour but if I use something in a certain way where a slow charge will do then it's there for that small convenience as well as to stand whatever up.

I had one phone that got scratched a bit on the display by it lying on the surfaces where I have tools all over the worktops.

I chose it also because of the hole at bottom for when I do have something that is plugged in and I could just pull it out underneath.

[Simon]

Wireless charging has pro's and cons. I don't know if it increases heat when charging. I have a pad in my car i can simply put it on to charge which saves cables trailing around. I have just replaced the battery and did try plugging it in which I have to do to the car for android auto anyway but meh it is more hassle. I have had instances of my phone loosing the connection to the car when the ire was nudged so I don't know if that is a sign of the socket already being dodgy despite having barely any use.

[xrunner]

My comments below pertain to an iPhone 6S

Wireless charging - what’s the great “benefit” from a system where you have a pad that charges your phone **slower** due to coupling losses, than if you’d just plugged it into a cable?

It's not a "great" benefit. It's an OK benefit. I like it because it's convenient. I don't give a flip how slow it is because when I charge it I'm not going anywhere for the rest of the day. However, it isn't particularly slow charging anyway. Seems pretty fast to me.

Also, you have to position the phone PRECISELY or the induction coils will be misaligned ...

Precisely? On mine you have to sit in on top of a round base. LOL I mean sure if it's sorta, kinda close, not inches away from the center it'll work but if you can't place it that well you probably have a hard time putting a toothbrush into your mouth.

and you can’t use your device - pick it up and make a call, et cetera, as it’s charging (obviously).

Well that is incorrect. I certainly can use it while it's wirelessly charging. All I have to do is pick it up along with the charging base (which isn't all that big) and use it. Is that a normal thing to do? No, but to address your assertion it certainly could be done.

Oh and let’s cancel out all nonsense comments about water and dust ingress ...

Request denied.

It keeps dust out of the lightning port. 

[xrunner]

Follow up ...

Using the iPhone 6S with aftermarket wireless charger operational in-hand.   

Is it normal - no.

Does it defeat the purpose of a wireless charger - yes.

It simply illustrates it can be done.

[PlainName]

It takes two hands to steer a car, and yet I see no one saying what a nuisance that is

Largely because most people leave one hand on the gear lever and rest the other arm on the door. And when they're not doing that they're using one hand to hold their phone, food, fag, whatever.

[PlainName]

I’m neutral as regards the rather silly “bad” or “good” perspective

No you aren't. Right after that you said:

It's a daft gimmick.

and also said:

I've yet to hear an actual, tangible, logical benefit for it over a simple, basic plug and socket, because I don't see there IS one.

right after someone told you exactly that.

The fact is that nothing anyone can say in this thread will affect your view in any way at all. You are not here for clarification or suggestions or 'to see the light'. You post these rants just to pick an argument.

The first few you got the benefit of the doubt on that, but your's as consistent on this as TreeFaringdon is at thanking every post.

[SiliconWizard]

There are *real* use cases for wireless charging. For instance, for devices that have no connector whatsoever and are 100% airtight. From a design and reliability POV, that's pretty good.

This isn't the case for typical mobile phones, though. Some people will find this useful for them, some won't. I personally do not care for this. Fast charging using a cable is more convenient for me. But in some cases - inside a vehicle for instance - that can still be handy.

But beyond any objective benefit, going wireless for electronic devices has been obsessing us for decades. It just looks neat. A trend we'd have a hard time reversing, even in cases for which it doesn't make sense.

[PlainName]

Fast charging using a cable is more convenient for me

I think I would like wireless charging (don't know because my phone doesn't have it). My phone typically stays put where it is for hours at a time, either bedside table or next to my keyboard. Often I go out without having planned first and find my phone isn't charged up and don't have time for even a fast charge. When I know I will be going out, I have to remember to make sure the phone is charged beforehand, and sometimes even then I forget. So I think in my case just having it trickle charge would be a plus (and, after all, one can still fast charge them when necessary).

Having the option would be cool. Like NFC, you don't have to use it,  but you can't if it's not there.

[james_s]

Largely because most people leave one hand on the gear lever and rest the other arm on the door. And when they're not doing that they're using one hand to hold their phone, food, fag, whatever.

I always was told to never rest a hand on the gear lever, it wears out the shift forks in the gearbox.

[PlainName]

I suspect most people didn't get your good education, or forgot it right after gaining a license

[james_s]

One of my friends was a professional mechanic and rebuilt a bunch of gearboxes, I generally took his advice.

[langwadt]

Largely because most people leave one hand on the gear lever and rest the other arm on the door. And when they're not doing that they're using one hand to hold their phone, food, fag, whatever.

I always was told to never rest a hand on the gear lever, it wears out the shift forks in the gearbox.

and don't have a big bundle of keys hanging in the ignition

[IanB]

I think I would like wireless charging (don't know because my phone doesn't have it). My phone typically stays put where it is for hours at a time, either bedside table or next to my keyboard. Often I go out without having planned first and find my phone isn't charged up and don't have time for even a fast charge. When I know I will be going out, I have to remember to make sure the phone is charged beforehand, and sometimes even then I forget. So I think in my case just having it trickle charge would be a plus (and, after all, one can still fast charge them when necessary).

I think you are missing the point that wireless charging is exactly like wired charging. In both cases there is a wire plugged into a USB adapter, which is plugged into a wall outlet. The only difference is, that in one case the wire has a tiny little USB C plug on the end of it, in the other case the wire has a big heavy wireless charging puck on the end of it.

If you don't already have a charging wire where you put down your phone, then wireless charging isn't going to help you. Wireless charging is only wireless over that last fraction of an inch when it reaches your phone. The rest of it is just as much wired as any other charging method.

The exception is maybe the wireless charging pad in your car, which is an obvious convenience.

[PlainName]

I think you are missing the point that wireless charging is exactly like wired charging.

No, I am not, honest

It is different in that one doesn't mess around plugging in cables. I know the phone needs to be in exactly the right place, but it already is so there would be no difference in that regard. All that would change is that I wouldn't have to remember to plug the cable in (and, just as importantly, unplug it).

For instance, my phone right now is where it usually is but it's not plugged in. Should I plug it in? It generally needs doing so every other day, or topping up if I have a trip planned. But maybe it's already charged? Thinking about it, on a run yesterday it happened to be quite low because I forgot to top up, but I'm sure I charged it when I got back (I can remember the 'unplug me now' alert; or I think I do, but with so many so regularly...)

Just not having to check if it needs charging and plugging it in (or not) would be fine with me.

[Berni]

The point of wireless charging in phones is to make "plugging in" so easy that you don't even notice it.

If you have your phone charging on your desk via USB and you get a phone call, then you will likely fist fumble with the cable to unplug it, take the call, then place it back down without plugging it in.

If you have a wireless charger you just pick up the phone as you always would, take the call and then place it back down at what point it starts charging again. There was 0 extra effort taken to disconnect the phone from the charger and connect it again. The result being that you introduce your phone to the charger more often, making it less likely that you get caught with an empty battery when you need to go outside.

I am really bad at remembering to charge my phone, so even tho i could go for a few days on a battery i still just plug it in before going to sleep and be sure i always start the day on 100% battery. I keep putting my phone in the same select few spots anyway so that i can quickly find it when i need it, if some of those spots feature wireless charging that means i never actually have to charge my phone, the battery is just magically near 100% all the time.

[PlainName]

I think you are missing the point that wireless charging is exactly like wired charging.

Of course, as previously mentioned, I don't have wireless charging so my comment are supposition on what I imagine the experience to be. Might turn out to be a poor experience, or  better than expected.

So, for reference, do you have wireless charging? Is your downer on it due to experience or also based on supposition?

[IanB]

So, for reference, do you have wireless charging? Is your downer on it due to experience or also based on supposition?

Yes, I have a wireless charger, but I don't find a compelling reason to use it. I have a "charging station", which is a desk with some chargers sitting on it. When my phones are running low and need charging, I just put them on the charging station and plug them in overnight. I don't find any trouble plugging in the cable (the Apple Lightning connector makes a satisfying "click" when you plug it in and feels very slick).

I also have the Apple wireless charger on the charging station. However, it has strong magnets and sticks to the phone with limpet-like force. If I try to pick up the phone, the charger comes with it and needs two hands to detach. This is slightly annoying, and to be avoided I would have to glue down the charging base with Blu Tack or double-sided tape or something. It just doesn't add value for me to use this charging method when the cable is so easy.

[PlainName]

it has strong magnets and sticks to the phone with limpet-like force

I can see that would be a bit of a downer. It would put me right off!

[Raj]

it has strong magnets and sticks to the phone with limpet-like force

I can see that would be a bit of a downer. It would put me right off!

Funny, cause they copied Motorola Z, and failed to make it as good. Motorola Z, itself didn't have any magnets, but it did attract magnets  with such strength that I used to hang it on my metal almirah using hard drive voice coil magnet. Plus to prevent it from slamming into magnet, you could place the magnet on nonmagnetic area (the center) and slide it over to the magnetic area (the edges)

[Berni]

The magnets in wireless chargers are more to help you locate the correct location by feel without looking at it, it only starts transmitting once it detects a phone there. So the charger you have is probably just very poorly designed to have magnets that are stronger than the weight of the unit itself.

And yes pretty much all phones that feature wireless charging will stick to a magnet because they have a ferrite plate inside that helps form a better magnetic coupling for the receiving coil.

Tho if a magnet is so strong that it lifts the charger, i would be a bit concerned with such a strong field saturating the ferrite core coil in the phone and making it perform a lot worse. Or are the magnets perhaps set up just to grab the edges of the ferrite, leaving the center free of DC field.

[PlainName]

pretty much all phones that feature wireless charging will stick to a magnet because they have a ferrite plate inside

Would it be strong enough to use with one of these car mounts:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/? B01MU4ZU2H

[PlainName]

Why don't we let this thread fade into oblivion in peace?

Perhaps because we are still learning things and able to discuss same without ad hom put downs?

I wonder... if you do to a party and chat with some person about, say, how wet and rainy the weather is, then someone else joins in and you move on to how nice the summer war, then someone else comes along and you all talk about building snowmen. You pause for breath, see the original other person has pushed off to get a beer, so you say to everyone "Sorry, the bloke is gone so we have to stop talking now", and you all drift off.

I don't think it works like that.

[Just_another_Dave]

There are *real* use cases for wireless charging. For instance, for devices that have no connector whatsoever and are 100% airtight. From a design and reliability POV, that's pretty good.

This isn't the case for typical mobile phones, though. Some people will find this useful for them, some won't. I personally do not care for this. Fast charging using a cable is more convenient for me. But in some cases - inside a vehicle for instance - that can still be handy.

But beyond any objective benefit, going wireless for electronic devices has been obsessing us for decades. It just looks neat. A trend we'd have a hard time reversing, even in cases for which it doesn't make sense.

Not just 100% airtight devices, but also those ones that need to be used underwater. Sealing a device that has no electric ports is easier, being that the reason why electric toothbrushes used wireless charging before mobile phones

[IanB]

Tho if a magnet is so strong that it lifts the charger, i would be a bit concerned with such a strong field saturating the ferrite core coil in the phone and making it perform a lot worse. Or are the magnets perhaps set up just to grab the edges of the ferrite, leaving the center free of DC field.

Apple's design has a ring of small magnets inside the phone, and matching magnets on the charging puck. When you place the phone on the charger, the magnets line up and position the phone in exactly the right position for optimum charging.

[RJSV]

   A bunch of FUSS about consumer products is a good thing. Especially some valid complaints; but I tend to try to skip-read over (any) personal stuff. That guy ain't likely to stray onto my front lawn anyway. I LOVE to tear apart and criticize consumer products, for fit, simple controls, surprise clever features, etc etc

   For personal directed crits, maybe try watching:
   "Housewives of New York..." or some such.

   I'm looking for opinions... on that charging method, so here I am.
   Thanks, eti, "...play on, brother..." -- Jimi Hendrix

[RJSV]

Oh yeah...AND:  How come no one has brought up the radiated energy issue, similar to potential cancer causing radio-EM beaming into your sleep-bed at close range (?)

[Cyberdragon]

Oh yeah...AND:  How come no one has brought up the radiated energy issue, similar to potential cancer causing radio-EM beaming into your sleep-bed at close range (?)

Ahh shit...here we go again...

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/dodgy-technology/do-cellphones-actually-give-you-cancer/

[boB]

Only reason I ever used a pad for my cell phone is to reduce wear and tear on the USB charging connector on the phone.

[Raj]

Only reason I ever used a pad for my cell phone is to reduce wear and tear on the USB charging connector on the phone.

You'll be throwing that phone away, way before the charger and phone's appeal dies.
But you'll sure reduce battery's life from having it hot while charging wirelessly.

[SiliconWizard]

Only reason I ever used a pad for my cell phone is to reduce wear and tear on the USB charging connector on the phone.

You'll be throwing that phone away, way before the charger and phone's appeal dies.
But you'll sure reduce battery's life from having it hot while charging wirelessly.

Yeah. I haven't had a USB connector failure on a cell phone in ages, even after several years of use each.

Now I don't think temperature is higher when charging wirelessly. I haven't noticed that, and I can't really see a reason either as long as both the charging pad and the receiving end in the phone are designed decently. And, as the charging current through wireless charging is usually much lower than when using a cable, the battery actually doesn't heat up as much while charging.

[Berni]

I have a Samsung Galaxy J7 phone from 2016 and it was charged overnight for most of its life. The battery can still last over a whole weekend no problems. And even if it does fail the battery is user replaceable by simply taking off the clipped on back cover. Tho id more likely get a new phone instead to avoid the Android version getting too old to run most apps(This is the ultimate death timer for all smartphones, even if the hardware holds up).

Wireless charging should not be a problem as long as you don't try to get really fast charge rates out of it.

As for USB ports breaking. I have never broken one myself, but have had to replace a lot of USB ports in phones/tables for other people. Ranges from connectors that don't make connection anymore, to ones where the internals are a mangled mess to ones that are ripped completely off the board. You might take care of your connectors, most people don't.

[Raj]

I have a Samsung Galaxy J7 phone from 2016 and it was charged overnight for most of its life. The battery can still last over a whole weekend no problems. And even if it does fail the battery is user replaceable by simply taking off the clipped on back cover. Tho id more likely get a new phone instead to avoid the Android version getting too old to run most apps(This is the ultimate death timer for all smartphones, even if the hardware holds up).

Wireless charging should not be a problem as long as you don't try to get really fast charge rates out of it.

As for USB ports breaking. I have never broken one myself, but have had to replace a lot of USB ports in phones/tables for other people. Ranges from connectors that don't make connection anymore, to ones where the internals are a mangled mess to ones that are ripped completely off the board. You might take care of your connectors, most people don't.

Interesting...I too have to replace some usb ports on other people's phones, but usually the fault was caused by them dropping it while having it connected, corrosion and carrying it while charging in pocket (battery bank, but usually this is also accompanied by the port being fully SMD). The only time I've damaged a usb port was on an arduino leonardo when I accidently applied lever like pressure onto the port. the socket was full SMD, (didn't have any through hole protrusions that go through PCB to distribute forces. )

[www.MKRD.info]

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Wireless charging - what’s the great “benefit” from a system where you have a pad that charges your phone **slower** due to coupling losses, than if you’d just plugged it into a cable? Also, you have to position the phone PRECISELY or the induction coils will be misaligned, and you can’t use your device - pick it up and make a call, et cetera, as it’s charging (obviously).

As was the case with NFC, about 7 years ago, and how (mainly) the Android ✌️“Community”✌️obsessed over it just for the sake of doing so (and using it as a reason to deride Apple for not implementing it 🙄), it seems like another fad wave which the net is riding, and apart from the ✌️“”inconvenience”✌️(? 🤣🤨) of plugging in a wire, what is the benefit?

Oh and let’s cancel out all nonsense comments about water and dust ingress. People will always find another way to damage their phone - ALWAYS. They drop them, sit on them, lose them… I don’t see a tiny socket as much of a problem.

Consumer technology circles seem to love to obsess over the latest gimmick, and it seems that rarely is any deep, high quality critical and objective thinking applied. I can understand electric toothbrushes having needed to use this for years - it’s a safety issue - but this? Hah!! Piffle.

I don't want to wear out the USBC connector. It was way worse with the MicroUSB connectors. And dirt always gets in there!!!

[Halcyon]

I don't see this as "piffle" at all, In fact, it's great to have the option. I just ordered the new Google Pixel phone and one of my major purchase decisions came down to the fact it has wireless charging built-in (my current phone doesn't).

I'm a reasonably heavy user of my phone so it's not unusual to have to charge it at least once throughout the day. Whether or not you use USB-C or Apple Lightning ports, they will eventually wear out, become loose, fill with dust, whatever. Sure, if I need a quick charge, I'll be plugging it in, but for the most part, I'll be using the wireless charging pad beside my bed when I go to sleep at night. It's sitting there for 6-8 hours, so I really don't care how slowly it charges.

Not having a charging cable dropped on the floor after I wake up is another advantage for me, which means the robotic vacuum will no longer get stuck after it wraps the damn thing up in the cleaning brushes.

Then there is the dreaded "moisture warning" which halts charging if moisture is detected in the port. Whether you're the type of person who uses their phone in wet weather, around swimming pools or just takes it in to the bathroom while showering/bathing, this is another excellent use-case for wireless charging.

Wireless charging is just another option for consumers. I'd rather have it than not. It's far from a gimmick and has actual legitimate uses.

As was the case with NFC, about 7 years ago, and how (mainly) the Android ✌️“Community”✌️obsessed over it just for the sake of doing so (and using it as a reason to deride Apple for not implementing it 🙄), it seems like another fad wave which the net is riding, and apart from the ✌️“”inconvenience”✌️(? 🤣🤨) of plugging in a wire, what is the benefit?

To address your comments about NFC, it's an industry standard and has only grown to be more popular. Sure the whole "sharing files by touching phones" thing was a bit gimmicky, but the applications for NFC are far beyond that.

I used to keep my bank cards on my phone as a "backup" to my physical plastic cards in my wallet. But I'm now shifting entirely to using NFC on my phone. Whether it's payment for $1 or $10,000, the use of cash in Australia is significantly less than card payments (I haven't touched cash in over 10 years). Then there are other applications such as NFC-based hotel room keys and building access. To enter the building at work, I use my phone. Same as getting to work: Public transport, whether it be bus, train, ferry, tram are all based on the same NFC-based system. Here, we also have digital drivers licences, so for me, I really have no need to carry a physical wallet or plastic cards anymore.

Wallets can be lost and I don't fancy anyone who would pick mine up to know where I live or be able to spend money from my bank account. Having everything on my phone means it's secure and only I can access it, even if I lose my phone.

Then there are NFC-based hardware security keys. I use my YubiKey a lot for multi-factor authentication.

[AVGresponding]

I don't see this as "piffle" at all, In fact, it's great to have the option. I just ordered the new Google Pixel phone and one of my major purchase decisions came down to the fact it has wireless charging built-in (my current phone doesn't).

I'm a reasonably heavy user of my phone so it's not unusual to have to charge it at least once throughout the day. Whether or not you use USB-C or Apple Lightning ports, they will eventually wear out, become loose, fill with dust, whatever. Sure, if I need a quick charge, I'll be plugging it in, but for the most part, I'll be using the wireless charging pad beside my bed when I go to sleep at night. It's sitting there for 6-8 hours, so I really don't care how slowly it charges.

Not having a charging cable dropped on the floor after I wake up is another advantage for me, which means the robotic vacuum will no longer get stuck after it wraps the damn thing up in the cleaning brushes.

Then there is the dreaded "moisture warning" which halts charging if moisture is detected in the port. Whether you're the type of person who uses their phone in wet weather, around swimming pools or just takes it in to the bathroom while showering/bathing, this is another excellent use-case for wireless charging.

Wireless charging is just another option for consumers. I'd rather have it than not. It's far from a gimmick and has actual legitimate uses.

As was the case with NFC, about 7 years ago, and how (mainly) the Android ✌️“Community”✌️obsessed over it just for the sake of doing so (and using it as a reason to deride Apple for not implementing it 🙄), it seems like another fad wave which the net is riding, and apart from the ✌️“”inconvenience”✌️(? 🤣🤨) of plugging in a wire, what is the benefit?

To address your comments about NFC, it's an industry standard and has only grown to be more popular. Sure the whole "sharing files by touching phones" thing was a bit gimmicky, but the applications for NFC are far beyond that.

I used to keep my bank cards on my phone as a "backup" to my physical plastic cards in my wallet. But I'm now shifting entirely to using NFC on my phone. Whether it's payment for $1 or $10,000, the use of cash in Australia is significantly less than card payments (I haven't touched cash in over 10 years). Then there are other applications such as NFC-based hotel room keys and building access. To enter the building at work, I use my phone. Same as getting to work: Public transport, whether it be bus, train, ferry, tram are all based on the same NFC-based system. Here, we also have digital drivers licences, so for me, I really have no need to carry a physical wallet or plastic cards anymore.

Wallets can be lost and I don't fancy anyone who would pick mine up to know where I live or be able to spend money from my bank account. Having everything on my phone means it's secure and only I can access it, even if I lose my phone.

Then there are NFC-based hardware security keys. I use my YubiKey a lot for multi-factor authentication.

I've never had a charging port wear out on a phone, and I'm one of those old farts that only gets a new phone when they absolutely have to (I'm up to my third ever smartphone now, and though the previous two still work they are suffering from OS bloat eating their storage away, making them non-optimal for daily use). If you're breaking them I'd suggest you take more care and don't run the charging cable where you trip over it every time you walk past it!

And before you say "well you obviously keep them on a pedestal and never put them through normal daily use", I work in construction and regularly have pockets full of dust and grit, including the one my phone lives in. I've sat on them, dropped them, occasionally thrown them (the OS/UI on my Cat S61 is infuriatingly shite) and the only failures I have had are screen protectors. I'm not going to count the faulty USB controller on the S61 as that's just bad internal design/parts and nothing to do with the actual port/cable.

[PlainName]

If you're breaking them I'd suggest you take more care

I wonder how we'd feel about bare wires on stuff. If you're getting a shock you should take more care. With that attitude we'd probably not have goretex boots (if your feet get wet try not to walk in puddles) and many other things that fix apparently 'not being careful' problems.

[AVGresponding]

If you're breaking them I'd suggest you take more care

I wonder how we'd feel about bare wires on stuff. If you're getting a shock you should take more care. With that attitude we'd probably not have goretex boots (if your feet get wet try not to walk in puddles) and many other things that fix apparently 'not being careful' problems.

And the logical extension of your implied argument leads to the kind of nanny-state bs that we see in California. There's a middle ground somewhere I'm sure, but of course we can argue about where exactly that is for the next million years and not come to agreement.

My personal opinion is, if you have a potentially fragile device that costs a significant amount of money and resources to replace, you should treat it with a bit more care than if it was an old football.

[PlainName]

And the logical extension of your implied argument leads to the kind of nanny-state bs that we see in California.

Of course not. There is nothing being mandated here, just a user saying they would quite like to use wireless charging. If anything, your approach of "try being more careful" is what would lead to mandatory carefulness.

I think you are assuming the ask is for "make devices more robust and less fragile", but that's the needed approach to stick with cables. Having wireless doesn't mean it is more robust - it can be just as fragile.

[woody]

If you're breaking them I'd suggest you take more care

Sure, but care does not always prevent malfunction.

My current Samsung is 3 years old and well taken care of. Looks and feels like new. It came with a USB-C port so myopic me is able to insert a charge cable blindly. Still, all of a sudden it refused to charge from the USB port. Fortunately this phone also charges wirelessly. Which means that I don't have to replace it. +1 for wireless charging!

[AVGresponding]

I guess I just believe in taking personal responsibility. Seems to be a rare thing these days.

[Berni]

There is also a factor of luck when it comes to connector reliability. Sometimes you take care and the connector breaks, sometimes you are careless but never do something bad enough to it to really break it.

Not sure how it is with USB-C, but i have replaced a lot of microUSB connectors in peoples phones and tablets over the years. They mash huge amounts of dirt in it without ever blowing into the connector to clear it out, people drop phones with the cable attached, people trip over charging cables, some force connectors in without aligning them properly...etc

Once you go to wireless charging all of these things don't happen anymore. Also any violent event that would destroy the wireless charging ability of the phone would likely also destroy the phone itself. It is also more convenient if you always leave the phone in the same spot, then you can keep your phone always charged by simply putting a wireless charging station under that spot.

Yes wireless is less efficient, but so it driving 130km/h on the highway, yet people still do it because driving a more efficient fuel saving speed (around 90) is less convenient.

[PlainName]

I guess I just believe in taking personal responsibility.

I am sorry but I think I've missed some important part of this. I suspect that we are participants in different arguments, so perhaps you could explain again why you think a wireless charging feature is bad. I am missing where personal responsibility comes into it, and potential California-style legislation.

[AVGresponding]

There is also a factor of luck when it comes to connector reliability. Sometimes you take care and the connector breaks, sometimes you are careless but never do something bad enough to it to really break it.

Not sure how it is with USB-C, but i have replaced a lot of microUSB connectors in peoples phones and tablets over the years. They mash huge amounts of dirt in it without ever blowing into the connector to clear it out, people drop phones with the cable attached, people trip over charging cables, some force connectors in without aligning them properly...etc

Once you go to wireless charging all of these things don't happen anymore. Also any violent event that would destroy the wireless charging ability of the phone would likely also destroy the phone itself. It is also more convenient if you always leave the phone in the same spot, then you can keep your phone always charged by simply putting a wireless charging station under that spot.

Yes wireless is less efficient, but so it driving 130km/h on the highway, yet people still do it because driving a more efficient fuel saving speed (around 90) is less convenient.

Wireless is less efficient. I frequently have pockets full of brick dust, yet somehow I don't break my phone's USB connector. Maybe I should sell blow jobs?

I guess I just believe in taking personal responsibility.

I am sorry but I think I've missed some important part of this. I suspect that we are participants in different arguments, so perhaps you could explain again why you think a wireless charging feature is bad. I am missing where personal responsibility comes into it, and potential California-style legislation.

IT'S. LESS. EFFICIENT.

Insignificant for one individual user, granted, but multiplied by several billion users, it adds up.

The personal responsibility part comes in a) there, and b) in not being so f*****g clumsy as to break a $1k phone because I was so stupid as to b1) lay the charging cable in a position where it could be tripped over, and b2) not f*****g being so clumsy as to trip over a cable.

[Halcyon]

I've never had a charging port wear out on a phone, and I'm one of those old farts that only gets a new phone when they absolutely have to (I'm up to my third ever smartphone now, and though the previous two still work they are suffering from OS bloat eating their storage away, making them non-optimal for daily use). If you're breaking them I'd suggest you take more care and don't run the charging cable where you trip over it every time you walk past it!

And before you say "well you obviously keep them on a pedestal and never put them through normal daily use", I work in construction and regularly have pockets full of dust and grit, including the one my phone lives in. I've sat on them, dropped them, occasionally thrown them (the OS/UI on my Cat S61 is infuriatingly shite) and the only failures I have had are screen protectors. I'm not going to count the faulty USB controller on the S61 as that's just bad internal design/parts and nothing to do with the actual port/cable.

That's all well and good (and great for you), but my current phone (which I've had for 3 years has developed a dicky port after being plugged/un-plugged about 5 or 6 times a day over it's life. The fact is, data ports are one of more consumable components of a phone. So much so, in many phones they are designed to be on separate sub-boards for this very reason. It happens far more than you probably think it does. After working in Digital Forensics for a law enforcement agency and literally having to replace dozens of the damn things, it's usually the first thing I suspect when I have issues acquiring data.

I take care of my phones, probably more than most people (it has no cover, yet I've never cracked a screen or damaged it in any other way). Ports failing over time is just a fact of life, just like the battery wearing out and losing capacity. It happens.

[AVGresponding]

I must just be an outlier   

[Halcyon]

I must just be an outlier   

I'm not suggesting that everyone will experience it, this is probably the 5th or 6th "smart phone" I've owned and never have I had a problem with ports before, they are actually quite robust. However they are subject to a lot of mechanical wear and tear and stresses. They also tend to fail "gradually", for example, they may charge but the data pins refuse to work, or they'll charge using bog-standard 5v USB power, but not at the higher negotiated voltages.

But not having to plug a cable in and to have my phone charge overnight by simply placing it down beside my bed is a nice feature.

[Berni]

I must just be an outlier   

I also so far have not destroyed a USB port on my own phone.
But that does not mean that USB ports are indestructible and have a failure rate of 0%. Reliability can't be determined by a single data point.

I have seen lots of other people destroy USB ports. I even had to fix a fair few USB ports in other peoples phones and tablets. So clearly they do break for the average user. The more tech knowledgeable people are a minority among the users. Typical users often can't even tell the difference between a miniUSB microUSB and USB-C, it is all a small USB connector for them, if it doesn't fit into the phone then the just have 'the wrong one'.

Wireless charging is a technology that is not plagued by this issue. Most abuse violent enough to damage the wireless charging system on a phone would likely also destroy the rest of the phone too, so it doesn't matter if the charging broke when the phone doesn't even turn on anymore. However a USB connector in practice tends to die sooner than the rest of the phone, making the otherwise perfectly working phone unusable as it can't be charged. Most people will throw away the phone as a result, creating more e-waste. So this also offsets the fact that wireless charging wastes a bit of power during transfer. Sure it makes phones use more energy, but energy and resources are also used for making new phones to replace dead ones.

At the end of the day you still have a choice to use wireless charging or not. Even if your phone has it, you can still choose to never use it and stick to USB. If you enjoy the convenience of just plonking down a phone and having it magically charge then use it. I would personally want wireless charging, but the phones i was looking for that had it cost too much (Samsung reserves this feature for the high end Sxx models) so i bought a phone without it. I didn't feel like the convenience of it was worth the price tag.

[artag]

I haven't broken a phone connector, yet.

But I've broken endless micro-usb connectors on arduinos and teensies. They're particularly prone to being ripped off the board because there's no protection at all, not even the phone case to stop it getting leverage. And I've also broken some just by insertion after first damaging a charger plug and not noticing before it destroyed a socket.

I haven't broken a USB C socket yet, but they still have a fragile central leaf and it's in the hard-to-replace pcb-mounted part, not in the cable. That's frankly stupid design - no excuse for that at all unless it's intended to require more phone replacements.

Meanwhile, I've just started using the higher power 15W Qi devices. First test, a 15W transmitter with an old 5W receiver, both cheap noname products, not Apple or Samsung. It's *much* less fussy about alignment - will happily tolerate 10mm gap and offset while still claiming a link. I will have to see what the power transfer is like.

[Halcyon]

The other application I find wireless charging extremely useful is in vehicles. Many vehicle mounts/docks include a charger built-in. Super handy for keeping the battery topped up when you're perhaps using your phone for navigation or have the display constantly on.

Phones are no longer just a communications device for many people, but are basically an extension of their normal desktop or laptop computers.

[Halcyon]

Wireless charging - what’s the great “benefit” from a system where you have a pad that charges your phone **slower** due to coupling losses, than if you’d just plugged it into a cable?

I made an interesting observation over the last few weeks, which actually makes this statement partially untrue (depending on the phone you have).

I just bought myself a Google Pixel 7 which includes "Adaptive Charging". This isn't a new feature in Android, but it is dependent on the model (my old phone didn't have it).

Essentially, instead of just ramming as much energy into the battery as possible (even when plugged in), it will change the way it charges based on individual habits. For example, I noticed when I go to bed and charge my phone, it reduces the charge rate significantly, so that it slowly charges the battery to full in the 8-9 hours that I'm asleep. I woke up 2 hours earlier than normal this morning and eventually got up because I couldn't get back to sleep. I noticed that the phone was still charging and was only up around the 86% mark.

Obviously this is done to extend the life of the battery and it's quite a neat idea.

[Berni]

This 'Adaptive charging' sounds like a really nice feature.

My phone doesn't have it, but i do it artificially by using the slower charger i could find for overnight charging. Most of my charging happens there so it should reduce the charging strain on my battery. Tho the phone does have a feature to stop charging at 85% battery charge, so i don't have my phone sitting at 100% charge all night.

I keep the fancy fast charger in a different spot for when i need a quick top up before going out.

[Halcyon]

This 'Adaptive charging' sounds like a really nice feature.

My phone doesn't have it, but i do it artificially by using the slower charger i could find for overnight charging. Most of my charging happens there so it should reduce the charging strain on my battery. Tho the phone does have a feature to stop charging at 85% battery charge, so i don't have my phone sitting at 100% charge all night.

I keep the fancy fast charger in a different spot for when i need a quick top up before going out.

Not sure if it's a feature of Android 13, or whether it requires specific hardware to be present in the phone. I haven't done any reading on it.

But yeah, there are obviously benefits to slow charging, wireless or otherwise.

[PlainName]

If I'd put my phone on charge and got up a bit early to find it's not charged, I'd be a bit miffed. What about when you have to get up early for that trip out of town or something? You'd have to remember to disable the clever stuff (if you can) before you go to sleep.

[Halcyon]

If I'd put my phone on charge and got up a bit early to find it's not charged, I'd be a bit miffed. What about when you have to get up early for that trip out of town or something? You'd have to remember to disable the clever stuff (if you can) before you go to sleep.

Like with most things on Android, it's ultimately up to the user. You can disable that functionality completely if you want to, at the expense of battery longevity. The choice is yours. This is perhaps where the benefits of using a slower charger might actually be advantageous.

The nice thing is, if you use your phone as your alarm to wake up, it knows what time the battery needs to be fully charged by and adapts accordingly, even if you don't have a set bedtime routine. You can also temporarily interrupt the "bedtime routine" if you want to.

[PlainName]

I'd like to think it is up to the user, and I'd be happy with that. But... a recent update to something has had the OS regularly telling me there are x number of apps I haven't used for a month and now their permissions are removed. WTF?!? And you can't easily find which ones it's just zapped, and if you list all the ones that have been zapped, fix one go back to the list and wait half a day for it to be populated again so you can move onto the next one. It's massively stupid and ill thought out. But you cannot disable it. All you can do is mark an app as "DON'T FUCK WITH THIS", but it's a massive drag, which shouldn't be necessary, to go through every app doing that. And then remembering next time you install an app to do it.

[SiliconWizard]

As with almost everything else these days, the progressive, creeping removal of peoples' control over their own lives and belongings is mind-boggling and seems to be getting worse at an alarming pace.

Yes, Android is doing more and more stuff behind your back with fewer and fewer user options to enable/disable those features or even adjust them to your preferences.
Same with most commercial OSs these days.
Same with pretty much anything.

Be happy they are just annoying you with Android settings, for tomorrow they'll tell you how, when and where to pee, and you'll obey.

[Halcyon]

I'd like to think it is up to the user, and I'd be happy with that. But... a recent update to something has had the OS regularly telling me there are x number of apps I haven't used for a month and now their permissions are removed. WTF?!? And you can't easily find which ones it's just zapped, and if you list all the ones that have been zapped, fix one go back to the list and wait half a day for it to be populated again so you can move onto the next one. It's massively stupid and ill thought out. But you cannot disable it. All you can do is mark an app as "DON'T FUCK WITH THIS", but it's a massive drag, which shouldn't be necessary, to go through every app doing that. And then remembering next time you install an app to do it.

I believe you can disable the "Play Protect" service to turn off this behavior. I'm not going to test it as I prefer it.

[Berni]

I'd like to think it is up to the user, and I'd be happy with that. But... a recent update to something has had the OS regularly telling me there are x number of apps I haven't used for a month and now their permissions are removed. WTF?!? And you can't easily find which ones it's just zapped, and if you list all the ones that have been zapped, fix one go back to the list and wait half a day for it to be populated again so you can move onto the next one. It's massively stupid and ill thought out. But you cannot disable it. All you can do is mark an app as "DON'T FUCK WITH THIS", but it's a massive drag, which shouldn't be necessary, to go through every app doing that. And then remembering next time you install an app to do it.

You can just disable the feature, or just disable the notification for it.

The notification spam is one thing that is indeed a bit of a problem on Android. Every time i get a new phone i have to spend the first week pressing disable on the annoying notifications that i don't want. But you only have to do that one time, all the annoying ones pop up in the first few days never come up again once disabled.

As for revoking permissions on unused apps, it is a security thing. It won't do anything on any app you use regularly. As for any app that you use every few months the only difference is that you will be promoted again to allow access again when the app tries to do the thing. It won't remove the app or its data or anything. This is to prevent old obsolete forgotten apps getting hijacked with malware by pushing out an update for those apps (be it by developers or someone hacking the developers account).

The average user doesn't tend to care about security at all, so sometimes platforms add security features that are turned on by default, but can be turned off if the user really wants to.

[PlainName]

You can just disable the feature, or just disable the notification for it.

Disabling the notification just doesn't tell you its happened. Doesn't stop it happening.

If you know how to disable the protect feature I would love to know - despite a big incentive to find out (pushing the coronary back 5 years) I've not been able to discover how.

As for revoking permissions on unused apps, it is a security thing. It won't do anything on any app you use regularly.

Seems to me that if something is malicious it's going to be bad pretty quickly, like before you uninstall it as being rubbish. There are apps I really don't use for 6 months or so, and then I do use them and don't want to dick around figuring out why they no longer work. For instance, Glimpse I use when the onboard tracker on a bike is having problems so I can be tracked in real-time, but since the trackers are pretty reliable it doesn't get fired up much. Fing I use when there's a network issue I am tracking down but, as these things tend to go, things work fine for months so I don't fire it up. In both examples, when I need to use the app it is an instant need - it is meant to Just Work and after bloody Protect has borked them they don't.

[Berni]

You can disable PlayProtect entirely under the settings for "Biometrics and security" on my phone, so i don't see the problem. Just turn it off if you don't want it.

The malicious part is pushing an update out that sneaks malicious functionality into a formerly popular app. By default apps automatically receive updates, so the app developers can push out new software patch to millions of phones at the press of a button. The developer themselves could have malicious intent for a cashgab in the form of selling information, or the developers login credentials might have gotten into the wrong hands, allowing a malicous entity to push out an update in there name. So removing permissions of apps causes these apps to be once again sandboxed into where they can't do any harm, this reduces the potential attack surface by a little bit.

Go try using an iPhone where you don't even get to see the filesystem.

[Simon]

If you get it for free you can only complain to your lawmakers.

[PlainName]

Arse about face, I think. If it's free there's no contract so law (and it's makers) aren't involved. Pay money and you have an actual lever to sort things (which, realistically, would be to stop paying and go somewhere else).

[PlainName]

You can disable PlayProtect entirely under the settings for "Biometrics and security" on my phone, so i don't see the problem. Just turn it off if you don't want it.

Not on my phone. A bit of research today shows that it can be turned off under Play store settings, which I have done.

So thanks for the nudge. When I looked before (when it first started happening) there was no indication that it could be turned off so either the ability to do so is more recent than that or I just couldn't find the right search terms (or not enough people had been annoyed about it to make waves on the interwebs).

[PlainName]

You can disable PlayProtect entirely under the settings for "Biometrics and security" on my phone, so i don't see the problem. Just turn it off if you don't want it.

Not on my phone. A bit of research today shows that it can be turned off under Play store settings, which I have done.

So thanks for the nudge. When I looked before (when it first started happening) there was no indication that it could be turned off so either the ability to do so is more recent than that or I just couldn't find the right search terms (or not enough people had been annoyed about it to make waves on the interwebs).

Wrong wrong wrong wrong 

Disabling Play Protect merely stops the malware scanning. It doesn't stop the completely ridiculous removal of permissions - the damn thing did it again last night. Location permission removed from GPS app, microphone permission removed from sound meter app. Obviously not used often, but when I do want to use them I want them to bloody well work and not spend time trying to figure out when they won't.

[Halcyon]

Can't you just disable it from happening on a per-app basis? It seems that a few minutes of your time could have resolved this?

The principle of least privilege is a pretty standard security measure in computing and whilst I get there are some edge-cases, that's why the option to allow/disallow it for certain applications exists. It's really no different to application whitelisting/blacklisting on your PC.

At least you have the option to customise it. If you were an Apple user, it would be their way or no way.

[David Hess]

Wireless charging is convenient, and removes the unreliability of mechanical connectors.

[PlainName]

Can't you just disable it from happening on a per-app basis?

In theory, yes. But it takes half a minute or so to do that for each app that's in the list, and eventually you lose the will to live. Plus that app you installed 4 months ago and haven't used much gets stiffed - I couldn't see a way to mark an app as ignore other than by letting it be caught and then removing it.

Once or twice is a surprise. Five or ten times is annoying. When it's potentially a couple of hundred times you want to shoot someone.

Edit: it's like spam. When it's not happening to you, you don't see the fuss. Get regular unstoppable spam and you'll soon be seeking retribution, though.

[Halcyon]

Can't you just disable it from happening on a per-app basis?

In theory, yes. But it takes half a minute or so to do that for each app that's in the list, and eventually you lose the will to live.

This is my point, even this should be limited to a small number of applications for 99.9% of users and something you only need to do once.

[eti]

I guess I just believe in taking personal responsibility. Seems to be a rare thing these days.

May I ask if there is a specific reason why you use that ghastly, unreadable typeface?

[eti]

As with almost everything else these days, the progressive, creeping removal of peoples' control over their own lives and belongings is mind-boggling and seems to be getting worse at an alarming pace.

Yes, Android is doing more and more stuff behind your back with fewer and fewer user options to enable/disable those features or even adjust them to your preferences.
Same with most commercial OSs these days.
Same with pretty much anything.

Be happy they are just annoying you with Android settings, for tomorrow they'll tell you how, when and where to pee, and you'll obey.

At some point someone will paste in the oft-claimed (and selectively misunderstood) “bbbbbut it’s open sauce and customisable” (both of which take great liberties with fact and imagination 🤣)

Android is a ubiquitous OS which has precisely the value and worth attributed to it by Google when they give it away to any old schmuck. iOS is locked down and ACTUALLY SECURE, and when one knows how to use one iPhone, one knows how to use all of them.

The product manufacturer is put in the position of making the best decision for the user (iOS) vs the “¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I dunno - try it and see - not our problem!” Of Google.

[PlainName]

iOS is locked down and ACTUALLY SECURE

https://www.cvedetails.com/vulnerability-list/vendor_id-49/product_id-15556/Apple-Iphone-Os.html

"Total number of vulnerabilities : 2820"

For instance (with my emphasis):

An out-of-bounds write issue was addressed with improved bounds checking. This issue is fixed in iOS 15.7.1 and iPadOS 15.7.1, iOS 16.1 and iPadOS 16. An application may be able to execute arbitrary code with kernel privileges. Apple is aware of a report that this issue may have been actively exploited

[Berni]

There is no point in debating if Android or iOS is better.

Every user has there own preferences on how they want there device to work. So for some kinds of people Android is better suited and for some iOS is better suited. Just use what you think works better for you.

Each has its own strengths and flaws. My own preference is Android, but i can see why some people would prefer iOS.

[PlainName]

i can see why some people would prefer iOS

Indeed, there is no problem with people preferring one or the other - whatever floats your boat. The reason I posted the link was because eti doesn't have a simple preference, per se, but is what you would call a fanboy, delights in rubbishing anything that isn't Apple, and making out that Apple kit has no faults (sorry, can't be bothered with the caps) and should be desired by any thinking user.

[David Chamberlain]

[Halcyon]

Android is a ubiquitous OS which has precisely the value and worth attributed to it by Google when they give it away to any old schmuck. iOS is locked down and ACTUALLY SECURE, and when one knows how to use one iPhone, one knows how to use all of them.

It depends on how you define "secure", what tools someone uses etc...

Both iOS and Android are exceptionally secure for the average user, provided you use a strong passcode/PIN and don't install anything dodgy (and yes, malicious software exists on Apple devices too).

If you're using a 4-digit PIN, expect that to be cracked or bypassed immediately, if not, within minutes on both Apple and Android* devices. There are caveats however. Some of the more obscure Android devices are extremely difficult to break into, even with an insecure passcode. The later versions of the Google Pixel's are also not very well supported from a security researcher's standpoint.

There is no point in debating if Android or iOS is better.

Every user has there own preferences on how they want there device to work. So for some kinds of people Android is better suited and for some iOS is better suited. Just use what you think works better for you.

Each has its own strengths and flaws. My own preference is Android, but i can see why some people would prefer iOS.

Exactly. Neither is "better", they are just suited for different use-cases. It's like arguing whether Linux is "better" than Windows... it just depends.

Personally, there are things I just can't do on Apple devices, so that rules them out entirely for me.