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Mostly dodgy: SARS-Cov-2 rapid tests

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mazurov:

--- Quote from: dunkemhigh on January 20, 2022, 10:42:05 pm ---What is the risk aspect in wearing masks?

--- End quote ---
In the states you can be [verbally] attacked by a redneck or someone else who is too eager to force their opinion on you. Risk-averse people may get uncomfortable.

Personally, I like wearing a mask. Makes ignoring other people easier.

Zero999:

--- Quote from: AVGresponding on January 20, 2022, 10:29:45 pm ---
--- Quote from: dunkemhigh on January 20, 2022, 10:24:03 pm ---
--- Quote --- The type of mask that most people use, which is recommended by the government and has even been mandated at various points in the pandemic, is completely useless at preventing the spread of SARS-Cov-2.
--- End quote ---

Is that 'completely useless' as in 'has zero detectable effect' or as in 'isn't 100% effective'?

--- End quote ---

A brief look at the numbers in the link provided show it's not very effective, though still better than nothing, as the reduction in spread isn't down in the noise, so it's a real effect.

As Zero999 points out, the risk/benefit equation is complex, I think it remains to be seen which side of the scale weighs most.

--- End quote ---
It's not statistically significant. Cloth masks might have a small effect, but they appear not to be worth it.


--- Quote from: dunkemhigh on January 20, 2022, 10:42:05 pm ---
--- Quote ---As Zero999 points out, the risk/benefit equation is complex
--- End quote ---

What is the risk aspect in wearing masks?

--- End quote ---
Reread the post. I'm not anti-mask, just anti-ineffective-mask.

I admit, I do wear a mask, but only because it makes others around me, who are ignorant of its ineffectiveness feel better.


--- Quote from: dunkemhigh on January 20, 2022, 10:28:23 pm ---

--- Quote ---showing the excess myocarditis events, per million, in men under 40
--- End quote ---

Is that deaths or merely 'events' that required intervention?
--- End quote ---
Events that required intervention. Please read the study. It's very well written, in plain English.


--- Quote ---How does that compare to the equivalent unvaccinated Covid stats (deaths or interventions, as the case may be)?
--- End quote ---
I would like to see data on the number of COVID-19 deaths in different age groups, separated by sex and co-morbidities, vs vaccination, but haven't been able to find it. Note that the study was performed when the more virulent variants: Delta and Alpha were in wide circulation. Even if the data exists, now the milder Omicron has replaced Delta, it shifts the risk vs benefit analysis somewhat.

Figures can be manipulated. The number of COVID-19 deaths, in previously healthy people, with no co-morbidities, from March 2020, to September 2021 is 17,371, concentrated in the older population. They were 3774 COVID-19 deaths in the under 65s. I'd like to see the number for the under 18s. Now I'm fully aware that there are many people with long term health problems, who would have lived for many years, had it not been for COVID, so it's not a simple calculation.
https://www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/transparencyandgovernance/freedomofinformationfoi/deathsfromcovid19withnootherunderlyingcauses?s=09

I'm not anti-vax. I'm just anti-unnecessary-vaccination. I rushed out to get vaccinated, when it was first offered to me. It made sense to vaccinate all healthy adults, including men under 40, especially when Delta was the most prevalent, but I'm sceptical of boosters in healthy adults, especially now we have milder Omicron.

dunkemhigh:

--- Quote ---Cloth masks might have a small effect, but they appear not to be worth it.
--- End quote ---

Worth what?

I am sceptical of claims that cloth masks are useless. I know they are not perfect but studies I've seen have suggested they do have an effect for the wearer, just not particularly high. However, the primary benefit is for other people and I've not yet seen an actual study on that aspect. Nevertherless, a simple experiment shows they have significant effect on expelled material.

So far as I'm aware, most of the 'they are useless' justifications are based on the size of Covid molecules vs size of hole in the cloth, which is not an appropriate metric.


--- Quote ---Events that required intervention. Please read the study. It's very well written, in plain English.
--- End quote ---

Well that's what I figured, but I wanted to check that I hadn't missed something.


--- Quote --- I'm sceptical of boosters in healthy adults, especially now we have milder Omicron
--- End quote ---

Well, the chart shows that if one is going to have a booster, mRNA isn't the best choice. The others seem fine. But, again, this is just unrelated numbers and you might as well quote road deaths (since you will likely be traveling to get a jab).  For it to mean anything they numbers need to be compared against non-vaccinations (no Covid, no jabs, nothing, as the control, and no-jabbed Covids as the alternative).

As it happens, I appear to be prone to blood clots and have to take medication for the rest of my life to protect against them. If SAGE or equivalent say I should have a booster I will have one (I already get the flu jab every year and the after-effects of the Covid jabs reminded me exactly why I don't even think about not having one). OTOH, if Johnson says I should have one I'd probably be scouring the net looking for what his kickback is :)

Simon:
sorry but this will just go into a political mess soon like ass covid threads do - thread locked. We do not do covid here, this is an electronics forum.

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