Author Topic: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement  (Read 4602 times)

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Offline KeanTopic starter

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Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« on: June 07, 2023, 05:46:03 pm »
We knew it was coming...

Just posted by Autodesk at https://www.autodesk.com/support/technical/article/caas/sfdcarticles/sfdcarticles/Autodesk-EAGLE-Announcement-Next-steps-and-FAQ.html

Quote
Effective June 7, 2026, Autodesk will no longer sell nor support EAGLE. New and active Fusion 360 and Fusion 360 with EAGLE Premium subscriptions will continue to give you access to Fusion 360 electronics as well as EAGLE Premium functionality until EAGLE is no longer supported in June 2026.

Fusion 360 with EAGLE Standard subscriptions will no longer renew after June 7, 2024. It’s recommended to subscribe to Fusion 360 for access to the electronics workspace.

A subscription to Fusion 360 includes fully integrated CAD, CAM, CAE, and PCB functionality and includes up to 999 schematics, 16 layers, and an unlimited board area.

More detail at the link...
 

Offline Infraviolet

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #1 on: June 08, 2023, 12:15:38 am »
For free users then, the short answer is to stick with a pre-autodesk eagle version (if you've ever touched a later version use the options to export for older eagle versions) or move to KiCAD (which can also import eagle files from at least some eagle versions).
 
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Offline james_s

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #2 on: June 08, 2023, 12:23:22 am »
It was pretty obvious from the start that this was going to happen. I don't know anyone who still uses Eagle, I bet they never had more than a few thousand subscribers.
 
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Online KE5FX

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #3 on: June 08, 2023, 01:46:25 am »
Open-source it, Autodesk.  Its value went to zero the minute you put your hands on it, but there's still room for redemption.

(Also, I would like a pony and a Gulfstream V to haul it around in.)
 
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Offline Pack34

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #4 on: June 08, 2023, 01:49:40 am »
End of an era. It was the first ecad tool I learned.

The wording is confusing. Is Eagle and Fusion 360 PCB considered two different products?
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #5 on: June 08, 2023, 04:07:31 am »
 
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Offline EEVblog

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #6 on: June 08, 2023, 04:43:04 am »
The wording is confusing. Is Eagle and Fusion 360 PCB considered two different products?

IIRC the PCB part of Fusion 360 spun off from the Eagle code base?
 

Offline JPortici

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #7 on: June 08, 2023, 05:17:20 am »
It was pretty obvious from the start that this was going to happen. I don't know anyone who still uses Eagle, I bet they never had more than a few thousand subscribers.

But it did take them longer than i expected. Way longer
 

Offline Jeroen3

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #8 on: June 08, 2023, 07:13:52 am »
The wording is confusing. Is Eagle and Fusion 360 PCB considered two different products?

IIRC the PCB part of Fusion 360 spun off from the Eagle code base?
Yes, it is also still using the same xml file format. It is now embedded within fusion360 and uses about 20 times as much ram.
We use it for boards. You can work with it, a few improvements on routing were made. It can now export ODB++.
They are slowly adding stuff. But overall experience remains slow and buggy.
 

Offline Pack34

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #9 on: June 08, 2023, 07:35:10 pm »
The wording is confusing. Is Eagle and Fusion 360 PCB considered two different products?

IIRC the PCB part of Fusion 360 spun off from the Eagle code base?
Yes, it is also still using the same xml file format. It is now embedded within fusion360 and uses about 20 times as much ram.
We use it for boards. You can work with it, a few improvements on routing were made. It can now export ODB++.
They are slowly adding stuff. But overall experience remains slow and buggy.

So it sounds like this announcement really isn't a big deal? You already can't buy it as a standalone and I don't believe you could for years. Seems like Fusion 360 PCB itself is continuing on. Just now looking up some videos of it and it looks like they really overhauled the UI.

Personally, I don't see the huge desire/need to integrate ECAD and MCAD into the same tool. Just feels like it makes the final product much more bloated. All they need to be able to collaborate is to be able to move 3D models back and forth. Bring-in your board outline from a DXF, export a final STEP file of the design so you can fit check. It doesn't need to be the same physical program.
 

Offline james_s

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #10 on: June 09, 2023, 12:41:09 am »
It was pretty obvious from the start that this was going to happen. I don't know anyone who still uses Eagle, I bet they never had more than a few thousand subscribers.

But it did take them longer than i expected. Way longer

Big companies always move slowly. It could have gone on for years without earning any profit before they finally threw in the towel. I've seen more than once where a company that ought to know better falls for the sunk cost fallacy and continues developing a product long after it should be obvious that it's going to fail.
 

Offline JPortici

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #11 on: June 09, 2023, 01:57:32 pm »
Personally, I don't see the huge desire/need to integrate ECAD and MCAD into the same tool. Just feels like it makes the final product much more bloated. All they need to be able to collaborate is to be able to move 3D models back and forth. Bring-in your board outline from a DXF, export a final STEP file of the design so you can fit check. It doesn't need to be the same physical program.

but them being on the same package reduces a lot of exporting/importing steps. It's nice to have when you have different people working at enclosure and board. Of course when you use a pre-made enclosures (for which is wish there would be more STEP files available) you can import the model and all the relevant details before you start drawing the PCB
 

Offline Doctorandus_P

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #12 on: June 09, 2023, 02:24:23 pm »

but them being on the same package reduces a lot of exporting/importing steps. It's nice to have when you have different people working at enclosure and board. Of course when you use a pre-made enclosures (for which is wish there would be more STEP files available) you can import the model and all the relevant details before you start drawing the PCB

Meh,
I use KiCad and FreeCAD myself, and the "KiCad Stepup Workbench" in FreeCAD is quite powerful. FreeCAD does have a bit of a *&^%$#@! user interface, but apart from that it works quite well with KiCad. I've seen demo's of importing a 3D model of an Hameg enclosure in FreeCAD, making an offset from a contour and then push that directly into KiCad in a 5 minute demo, and half the time of the demo was for "video / tutorial things".

But also, when the mechanical and the electrical guys in a company are separate teams, then they can both do their thing in their own software, and then every now and then synchronize their efforts with a few imports and exports.

I also wonder how big the overlap is to people wanting both mechanical and PCB design, and combining both programs would just add a lot of extra crud for those people. To me it makes much more sense to keep those programs separated, but it is a plus if there are good import / export functions between those programs, so my views are pretty much on par with Pack34 in this regard.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2023, 02:26:13 pm by Doctorandus_P »
 

Offline PlainName

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #13 on: June 09, 2023, 04:44:47 pm »
I don't use Eagle, but if I did I would also be inclined to have separate programs for PCB and mechanical. However, Labcenter's Proteus is a good PCB tool which also includes simulation. You can not just simulate the electonics but run programs on your not-yet-built processor-based PCB to debug the code before sending off to manufacture. It strikes me that the overlap there is similar to the overlap with Eagle/Fusion - I've never used the feature but I see users that make extensive use of it and it seems to be in demand. Perhaps we are just olde phartes that haven't got with the flow yet.
 

Offline XFDDesign

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #14 on: June 09, 2023, 06:39:01 pm »
The writing for this outcome was on the wall when AutoDesk took over Eagle. The instant they said, "No subscriptions!" you knew the subscriptions were coming and they were just lying about it. I switched to KiCad back then and have only become more satisfied with the new tool. Eagle died long ago.
 
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Offline boB

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #15 on: June 09, 2023, 06:58:06 pm »

We, at two companies now have been using Eagle for 23+ years.   I used to use PADS and OrCad before that.

We bought 13 seats of Eagle and are at version 6.50  which works just fine for us.  It was like the Hackaday article said....  Smaller companies could afford Eagle but not what Autodesk has made of it after version 7.

KiCad is getting better and better but still doesn't have quite the feel when panning and zooming that Eagle has/had.  Someday we may switch but
right now, why fix something that just isn't broken ?

boB
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Offline james_s

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #16 on: June 09, 2023, 07:01:01 pm »
The writing for this outcome was on the wall when AutoDesk took over Eagle. The instant they said, "No subscriptions!" you knew the subscriptions were coming and they were just lying about it. I switched to KiCad back then and have only become more satisfied with the new tool. Eagle died long ago.

The fact that they clearly lied through their teeth was a real turnoff for me. They explicitly said no subscription and then only about a month later announced it was going subscription. They either knew damn well that was the plan when they said it wasn't, or it is a case of gross incompetence. Either way it is unacceptable and severely tarnished the image of the company.
 

Offline floobydust

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #17 on: June 09, 2023, 07:23:45 pm »
It's straight out of the asshole MBA playbook: money is cheap, borrow lots and buy up smaller, successful companies.
This gives Wall Street and investors the illusion of growth- when actually you're just increasing in size, incompetence included. Don't forget AutoDesk offered Altium a $3.9B takeover bid 06/2021  :o

AutoDesk long-term debt is $2.3B and the approach was reasonable back when interest rates were low and megalomania the way to run a business. Dinosaurs used this strategy as well.
But now, imagine the costs in servicing that debt. All of these companies that used the borrow borrow borrow strategy are up the creek now because they have to pay more for their loans.
And of course they have no real notion of managing their acquisitions, making sustainable money, outside of gouging their customer base. I expect mismanagement and death of many cash cows.

Saddest part is the Hackaday article comments people lamenting what small business is going to do, they need a stable low cost tool instead of this subscription-based greed and screw you over system.
 

Offline james_s

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #18 on: June 09, 2023, 07:46:41 pm »
Well small businesses can use KiCad, it can do everything that Eagle could do, and the UI is of comparable quality. I used Eagle briefly and it's pretty clunky and kludgey too.
 

Offline floobydust

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #19 on: June 09, 2023, 08:25:28 pm »
It's unfortunate all the corporate energy goes into increasing their subscriber base and getting more money out of them - instead of innovating, adding features and debugging. Altium included.
 

Online nctnico

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #20 on: June 09, 2023, 08:28:24 pm »
Personally, I don't see the huge desire/need to integrate ECAD and MCAD into the same tool. Just feels like it makes the final product much more bloated. All they need to be able to collaborate is to be able to move 3D models back and forth. Bring-in your board outline from a DXF, export a final STEP file of the design so you can fit check. It doesn't need to be the same physical program.
I disagree with that. Recently I went through a product development cycle for a product that needs to be as small as possible. Up to the point I needed really accurate 3D models for all parts of the PCB to make sure the casing fits. But it still resulted in chicken & egg situations and vague requirements as I didn't know the mechanical limits and the mechanical designer didn't know how small the electronics could be. For the project the end result still isn't super optimal but good enough. For such a project it is handy if you can replace a component on the PCB and immediately cycle through the mechanical design with the mechanical designer. IOW: for products which are a tight fit, I certainly see an upside to having a tight integration between the mechanical and electronics side of a product.
There are small lies, big lies and then there is what is on the screen of your oscilloscope.
 

Offline JPortici

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #21 on: June 09, 2023, 10:59:44 pm »

but them being on the same package reduces a lot of exporting/importing steps. It's nice to have when you have different people working at enclosure and board. Of course when you use a pre-made enclosures (for which is wish there would be more STEP files available) you can import the model and all the relevant details before you start drawing the PCB

Meh,
I use KiCad and FreeCAD myself, and the "KiCad Stepup Workbench" in FreeCAD is quite powerful. FreeCAD does have a bit of a *&^%$#@! user interface, but apart from that it works quite well with KiCad. I've seen demo's of importing a 3D model of an Hameg enclosure in FreeCAD, making an offset from a contour and then push that directly into KiCad in a 5 minute demo, and half the time of the demo was for "video / tutorial things".

But also, when the mechanical and the electrical guys in a company are separate teams, then they can both do their thing in their own software, and then every now and then synchronize their efforts with a few imports and exports.

I also wonder how big the overlap is to people wanting both mechanical and PCB design, and combining both programs would just add a lot of extra crud for those people. To me it makes much more sense to keep those programs separated, but it is a plus if there are good import / export functions between those programs, so my views are pretty much on par with Pack34 in this regard.

Let's just say that i would appreciate the extra layer of convenience
Having a piece of software in which there is a single project and I do not have to touch anything that YOU are doing but i can see the outputs combined at any time, and YOU do not have to touch anything i'm doing but you can see the outputs combined at every time and we can both share notes.
Not having to do manual export/conversion/import is always nice.

Not that i would ever, EVER use fusion 360. I tried and it looks like a potentially great product, but subscription only and having your data on the cloud.. why would anyone fall for that? i really don't understand. The moment i have to submit my data on the cloud and depend on that, no alternative, i'm out.

Also, it sucks completely that if kicad would ever integrate mechanical design it would have to pass through freeCAD. Because the workflow is questionable at best but the freeCAD community is adamant in being different rather than being as good as, or better. As Kicad was before they managed to appease both the "different" crowd and the others, used to other tools, but for the time being i have little faith in freeCAD growing up.
I was actually discussing this today with a colleague, i updated inkscape to 1.2 the other day and was greeted with the new UI. of course you can find backslash on the internet, to me it was "FINALLY" they moved on from the good old fashioned "this is a linux thing get used to it" look with icons that would look better made on paint instead of gimp, and clunky UI overall. Reallly feels a much more professional product (and i was productive on it before, it was just unnecessary painful compared to almost any other paid product
« Last Edit: June 09, 2023, 11:02:22 pm by JPortici »
 

Offline macegr

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #22 on: June 10, 2023, 06:41:18 am »
As Kicad was before they managed to appease both the "different" crowd and the others, used to other tools, but for the time being i have little faith in freeCAD growing up.

I was limping along with an old (paid, professional) license of Eagle until Kicad finally allowed reversing the Y axis to the same direction used by every other CAD program. That was my canary, over the years I'd check back in on Kicad and keep finding that dead canary. Suddenly I checked in to find the option for reversed Y axis released, I figured that was a really good sign and dove in to find that many other stupid decisions were overruled and resolved. So I made the switch.
 
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Offline twistedresistor

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #23 on: June 14, 2023, 10:41:52 am »
Well. R.I.P. EAGLE.
And thanks to Richard Hammerl, Joern Paschedag (and Jorge Garcia pre AD) who were saints in the EAGLE newsgroups. No matter how stupid the question and no matter how often it was already asked, they always helped.
 
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Online SiliconWizard

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Re: Autodesk EAGLE Announcement
« Reply #24 on: June 15, 2023, 09:38:18 pm »
No kidding.

Wondering what Adafruit and Sparkfun, that are heavy users of EAGLE, are going to decide.
 


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