Author Topic: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?  (Read 9841 times)

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Offline woody

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #25 on: November 15, 2017, 09:48:29 pm »
Who knows, maybe we can start some sort of class action against Autodesk for stealing from us? A V7 license devaluated overnight when this subscription model came to be.
 

Offline ebastler

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #26 on: November 16, 2017, 12:54:12 am »
Can the free version be installed and used without internet connection and also in case the autodesk servers are offline for more than 14 days?
1) Install EAGLE freeware
2) Sign in with your Autodesk credentials

Once the credentials are accepted you can literally disconnect the computer from WIFI, ethernet, etc.

So, the answer is no. You can not install and run the free version without internet connection or without the autodesk servers up and running.

Thank you for clearing that up Jorge.

Yeah, sure, that‘s terrible. And how would you get the software in the first  place if you don‘t have any internet connection at all, ever?

I don‘t like the subscription model either, and have no intention to switch over from my v7. But I truly consider that problem you chose to highlight a non-issue, Karel.
 

Offline KE5FX

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #27 on: November 16, 2017, 01:18:08 am »
Can I use the free version to open up an 8 year old file for a 6-layer PCB, remove an IC that was EOL by manufacturer and replace it with another non-pin-compatible IC, move a few traces and passives, and re-generate production files? If the answer is yes; can I do it legally with a free license since this is for commercial purposes?

Hi macegr,

It's nice to hear from you again. The answer to your question is no, the freeware version wouldn't allow you to modify the six layer board so there's no need to answer the second question. However, I've been thinking a lot about this long term support situation, it's been on my mind since this all started. I've never made anything that has required a guaranteed 10-15(or whatever time frame you want to put) year availability, but I know some of you do. Here's my question to you guys, and it's a real question, not trying to be polemic but I'm trying to understand the situation.

Let's say you have a customer and they enter into a contract with you where they will purchase X amount of product for the next 15 years, so you must now guarantee support for the product for that time frame. What happens if for whatever reason you have to close up shop 8 years into the contract? I know there are a lot of extenuating factors and clauses that can be in these sorts of things but what would be the general approach to handling that situation?

One difference is that the hypothetical company presumably didn't take any active steps to hose their customers, such as adding an intentional point of failure (server-based DRM in this case) to their existing product. 

Many products, especially mission-critical ones, either have second sources, or they do have contracts that guarantee availability over timeframes measured in decades, likely with IP escrow options to back up those guarantees.  However, Autodesk offers no such maintenance terms other than "It'll play for sure!  Trust us!" 

One reason why this is such a problem is that there is no other application that allows me to read, edit, and manufacture IP created with EAGLE.  By locking down your product, you're also locking down the data it was used to create.  My data. 

Casual hobbyists and electronics newbies may be okay with that, so if you can get them to pay, you're all set.  Those of us who make our living with your tools will switch to other EDA vendors who still offer perpetual license options.  Yes, we could use our V7 licenses forever, reinstalling them when needed, but dead software isn't useful to a growing business.

Of course, this was all explained to you quite clearly when the issue first arose, but who doesn't like to :horse:?
« Last Edit: November 16, 2017, 01:46:37 am by KE5FX »
 

Offline KE5FX

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #28 on: November 16, 2017, 01:22:41 am »
Yeah, sure, that‘s terrible. And how would you get the software in the first  place if you don‘t have any internet connection at all, ever?

From the same physical CD or downloaded setup program that I originally purchased.

PCs occasionally break, and software occasionally has to be reinstalled.  That option can no longer be counted on to be available when needed, years down the road.  If I can't exercise that option at an arbitrary future date without getting permission from Autodesk first, it's a problem. 
 

Offline tpowell1830

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #29 on: November 16, 2017, 01:33:23 am »
Can I use the free version to open up an 8 year old file for a 6-layer PCB, remove an IC that was EOL by manufacturer and replace it with another non-pin-compatible IC, move a few traces and passives, and re-generate production files? If the answer is yes; can I do it legally with a free license since this is for commercial purposes?

Hi macegr,

It's nice to hear from you again. The answer to your question is no, the freeware version wouldn't allow you to modify the six layer board so there's no need to answer the second question. However, I've been thinking a lot about this long term support situation, it's been on my mind since this all started. I've never made anything that has required a guaranteed 10-15(or whatever time frame you want to put) year availability, but I know some of you do. Here's my question to you guys, and it's a real question, not trying to be polemic but I'm trying to understand the situation.

Let's say you have a customer and they enter into a contract with you where they will purchase X amount of product for the next 15 years, so you must now guarantee support for the product for that time frame. What happens if for whatever reason you have to close up shop 8 years into the contract? I know there are a lot of extenuating factors and clauses that can be in these sorts of things but what would be the general approach to handling that situation?

I have never found a pleasing way to answer the concern "What happens if Autodesk disappears in X time? Under this model I can't continue to use EAGLE" though I'm still trying to find an answer. It seems to me that there is a direct parallel between the hypothetical situation above and when EAGLE users tell us that they don't want to be hosed if Autodesk closes shop. What's the difference? Why do your customers feel OK entering into these contracts with that same possibility looming, but some EAGLE users don't feel comfortable with the long term prospect of Autodesk. I'm having trouble seeing the difference between both scenarios.

If anyone can enlighten me I would really appreciate it.

Thanks for the attention guys.

Best Regards,
Jorge Garcia

Hi Jorge, in response to your contract example, both parties negotiate a free market contract, whereas, the contract, or license for cloud based subscription software tools, and not just Eagle, but AutoCAD, Inventor, etc. is a one sided contract developed by the provider, in this case, Autodesk. If I were involved with the provider side of that contract and was shutting down operations, I would bend over backwards to try and help alleviate problems for that person/company that I entered into the contract with. Most goliath software companies like Microsft, Autodesk, Siemens, etc. just do not try very hard to alleviate the wake of a failed software venture, in my previous experience with them, and there have been a number of occasions where I had to deal with this situation.

I have Autocad 2000 which I can use to open a dxf file (which was developed by Autodesk) for 2d CAD drawings and modify the drawing and export as dxf and load into a modern version of AutoCAD, ProgeCAD, DraftSight, etc. I will still be able to maintain drawings created with AutoCad 2000 10 years from now if needed.

The point with subscription services that gets stuck in my throat is that I no longer can use Eagle, or any other subscription software tools, if the connection gets cut, either by Autodesk stopping the service or my internet is not connected, or I am out of Territory. I am bound by the EULA terms that Autodesk created and I could not freely negotiate those terms.

Having the software tool locally based on my PC and not in the cloud, or internet gives me the freedom to continue using the same version on into perpetuity if needed, even if the product is discontinued, as opposed to being simply screwed if the service gets shutdown bu Autodesk.

Don't get me wrong, I am not zeroing in on Autodesk, per se, but the subject was for Eagle, and the OP's questions were debating the advantages and disadvantages of going subscription. I don't like subscription software service in general because of my stated rationale above.

With that I wish you well and I can only hope that Autodesk starts using a customer centric approach to this type of licensing, maybe cooler heads will prevail, who knows.
PEACE===>T
 

Offline Mr. Scram

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #30 on: November 16, 2017, 03:04:52 am »


Yeah, sure, that‘s terrible. And how would you get the software in the first  place if you don‘t have any internet connection at all, ever?

I don‘t like the subscription model either, and have no intention to switch over from my v7. But I truly consider that problem you chose to highlight a non-issue, Karel.
You can generally find software long after a company has perished. Without servers that's no use. Why need activation to begin with?
 

Offline VEGETA

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #31 on: November 16, 2017, 06:24:03 am »
Quote
Yes, we could use our V7 licenses forever, reinstalling them when needed, but dead software isn't useful to a growing business.

Which is why people should not touch Eagle now, but go get CircuitStudio. In my opinion, cloud-based PCB design software is not good at all. If you want such a feature, then they can add it as a feature within the software but not the main thing. Like a button called "Store in cloud" where you store and update your project in their servers.

 

Offline macegr

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #32 on: November 17, 2017, 07:42:50 am »
I have watched SaaS, cloud-hosted applications, subscriptions, and microtransactions with amusement over the past few years. It was always a no-brainer wave of the future...if you were a financial strategist selling an idea to management within a company. It was absolutely never about providing a better experience for the customer.

Out here in customer-land, I've already seen signs of the backlash against this business model everywhere. Customers are beyond the "hmm, I guess that works" phase and already running into real problems caused by companies retaining the off-switch to their software or hardware. I've seen so much backlash I was completely floored in WTF mode when Autodesk announced Eagle subscription...can they not read the writing on the wall? Starting a new subscription application NOW?

Logitech recently announced that it will brick the Harmony Link hub, and tried to give a 30% off coupon to anyone who bought it more than 90 days ago. This (it now turns out, not given as a reason up front) was to fix a major security hole that couldn't be resolved by a software patch. But instead of announcing the problem and replacing the devices, Logitech though "Hey, we can just make those devices obsolete. I bet most customers will just grumpily buy a new one." Not until after a huge outroar and media attention did they promise to do the thing they should have done, and fix their mistake by replacing all the hardware.

Two things to learn from the above example: (1) a company will eventually screw you if you let them keep the off switch, and (2) if you complain enough the company might give in.
 

Offline Mr. Scram

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #33 on: November 17, 2017, 07:46:01 am »
There have been a number of physical products now that have been turned into expensive bricks by the manufacturer pulling the plug, sometimes just a handful of months after release. Maybe that's where legislators can come in, as these products are an artificial burden on the environment and contradict consumer law. I feel mobile phones are part of this story too, with hardware willing to keep going, but software support failing to keep things safe and operable.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2017, 07:47:46 am by Mr. Scram »
 

Offline fcb

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #34 on: November 17, 2017, 09:48:00 am »
We now have a fully loaded seat of Eagle and Fusion 360. The EE running it has taken to it like a duck to water.

From a business POV at this stage it makes far more sense than spending a fortune on Altium and then keeping it updated.

If/when there is a good business case to purchase a fully loaded seat of Altium, then we will - they offer an Eagle import tool.  However I'm hoping that Eagle will keep getting better - certainly the integration with Fusion is paying dividends as far as workflow and speed.

And learning a new tool doesn't actually take that long IMHO - layout skills are somewhat independent of tools.

Offline Karel

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #35 on: November 17, 2017, 11:24:17 am »
If/when there is a good business case to purchase a fully loaded seat of Altium, then we will - they offer an Eagle import tool.

Pay attention, check if the eagle import tool can deal with v8 and the changes and additions autodesk is making to the eagle format.

https://forums.autodesk.com/t5/eagle-forum/v8-x-gt-v7-x-backward-compatibility/td-p/6990931

Don't take the word of autodesk for that. They already showed they can't be trusted...
« Last Edit: November 17, 2017, 12:34:58 pm by Karel »
The difference between theory and practice is less in theory than
the difference between theory and practice in practice.
Expensive tools cannot compensate for lack of experience.
 

Offline sokoloff

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #36 on: November 17, 2017, 06:09:15 pm »
I also could convert to KICad and forget licensing issues altogether. I really tried hard (as you could see from previous posts I made here) but the single most important feature to me is eagle's roundtrip capability of switching seamlessly between schematic and layout work. Maybe I'm just to incompetent to design a system sequentially and unidirectionally just using the netlist to track changes consistently ...
I'm super-glad for Autodesk's change to a subscription-only model for Eagle, because that was finally enough for me to get over the perceived hurdle of trying to use KiCAD. I'd been a casual user of Eagle for a few years and the first time I installed KiCAD it didn't run, then a later trial ended up with the typical "open sores" experience of new software, and so I'd stayed with Eagle.

Now that I had motivation, I switched to KiCAD about a year ago and the software has improved quite a bit and there's clear momentum around the product. Yes, the workflow is different. Yes, I have to remember which randomly icon'd button to push to get to which tool. Yes, the cross-tool integration via the filesystem only is clunky and kludgy, but it works. And I can trust the dev team behind it more than I do Autodesk.

So, thanks Autodesk for the licensing change. You improved my life with that business decision.
 

Offline fcb

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #37 on: November 17, 2017, 06:45:56 pm »
Why the hate for Autodesk?  They provide good tools no? I guess you don't have to use them if you don't want to.

I looked briefly at KiCad - but what I don't want to have to understand how to build my CAD tools, or fear them being 'unfinished'.

What sold me on Eagle/Fusion 360 was that they both just worked well seperatley AND played nicely together.  It's a nice workflow. And I like the subscription model - we hire our staff by the month, why their some of the tools?  This also gives Autodesk an incentive to improve the tools to retain customers.

Offline sokoloff

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #38 on: November 17, 2017, 06:53:12 pm »
Why the hate for Autodesk?  They provide good tools no? I guess you don't have to use them if you don't want to.
No hatred on my part; they make a business decision to go left; I make a business decision that I don't want to go with them. No hard feelings or hatred.

What sold me on Eagle/Fusion 360 was that they both just worked well seperatley AND played nicely together.  It's a nice workflow. And I like the subscription model - we hire our staff by the month, why their some of the tools?  This also gives Autodesk an incentive to improve the tools to retain customers.
When a staffer leaves, do you need to keep paying them to continue to use what they did while in your employ? We have invention and copyright assignment documentation to ensure that when they stop working for us and we stop paying them, that we can still use their 'works made for hire' that we paid them to create.
 

Offline Mr. Scram

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #39 on: November 17, 2017, 06:57:45 pm »
Why the hate for Autodesk?  They provide good tools no? I guess you don't have to use them if you don't want to.

I looked briefly at KiCad - but what I don't want to have to understand how to build my CAD tools, or fear them being 'unfinished'.

What sold me on Eagle/Fusion 360 was that they both just worked well seperatley AND played nicely together.  It's a nice workflow. And I like the subscription model - we hire our staff by the month, why their some of the tools?  This also gives Autodesk an incentive to improve the tools to retain customers.
You argue that the quality of a tool doesn't include the model, TCO and long run reliability. I would. No hate, just calculated sense.
 

Offline macegr

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #40 on: November 17, 2017, 07:16:42 pm »
The only reason I care about Eagle going subscription / internet-tethered is that I like the tool and want to keep using it. I like all of Autodesk's software, in fact. I've told many people starting out in EE or ME design to try Eagle and Inventor.

If I didn't like the software I wouldn't give a rat's ass about the licensing or the product.

If I was a casual user who didn't plan to use the software for more than a year or two, such as a student or someone designing throwaway baubles, I also wouldn't care.

I'm not sure why Autodesk thinks it's a good idea to position themselves as a disposable commodity.
 

Online H.O

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #41 on: November 17, 2017, 09:11:45 pm »
Hi macegr,

It's nice to hear from you again. The answer to your question is no, the freeware version wouldn't allow you to modify the six layer board so there's no need to answer the second question. However, I've been thinking a lot about this long term support situation, it's been on my mind since this all started. I've never made anything that has required a guaranteed 10-15(or whatever time frame you want to put) year availability, but I know some of you do. Here's my question to you guys, and it's a real question, not trying to be polemic but I'm trying to understand the situation.

Let's say you have a customer and they enter into a contract with you where they will purchase X amount of product for the next 15 years, so you must now guarantee support for the product for that time frame. What happens if for whatever reason you have to close up shop 8 years into the contract? I know there are a lot of extenuating factors and clauses that can be in these sorts of things but what would be the general approach to handling that situation?

I have never found a pleasing way to answer the concern "What happens if Autodesk disappears in X time? Under this model I can't continue to use EAGLE" though I'm still trying to find an answer. It seems to me that there is a direct parallel between the hypothetical situation above and when EAGLE users tell us that they don't want to be hosed if Autodesk closes shop. What's the difference? Why do your customers feel OK entering into these contracts with that same possibility looming, but some EAGLE users don't feel comfortable with the long term prospect of Autodesk. I'm having trouble seeing the difference between both scenarios.

If anyone can enlighten me I would really appreciate it.

Thanks for the attention guys.

Best Regards,
Jorge Garcia

I don't think people are that concerned with Autodesk declaring bankruptcy and dissapearing from the market taking EAGLE with it into the grave. It COULD of course happen and it's certainly something to concider but what I do think people are more concerned with and what I think is much more likely to happen is this:

1) Autodesk decides to ditch EAGLE because they don't make enough money due to not being able to convince/fool enough people into the subscription model. With a perpetual license what I have when you decide to pull the plug I still have and can still use tomorrow. With a subscription model I can't because there's no longer any "service" so I'm screwed.

2) Autodesk decides to raise the price by a factor at your discretion because the revenue from the few people you DID convince/fool into the subscription model isn't enough.  With a perpetual license I can decide if I think the new price is fair for the "upgrade". With a subscription model I can't do that. If I don't pay the new price I can no longer use the software so I'm screwed.

3) Autodesk decides to change the capabilities of the various "plans" possibly forcing customers into a "bigger", more costly plan in order to be able to keep working. With a perpetual license the capabilities in my payed for version only changes if and when I decide, with a subscription model YOU decide what the version I pay for should be capable of at any given point in time. You can dumb it down forcing me into a "bigger", more costly plan so I'm screwed.

You're free to price your product any way you see fit and I'm free to decide if the product offered is worth that price. The difference is that once I payed for a perpetual license I retain the right to use that software for as long as I see fit - not for as long as YOU see fit. It'll have the same capabillities it had when I bought it and it won't cost me another cent. What I pay for today I can still use tomorrow or 5 years from now.

With the subscription model I don't know what it's going to cost me to being able to work on my files tomorrow or 5 years from now because you (Autodesk) retain the right to change the price I "have" to pay each month/year in order to be able to do that. I'm free to not pay of course but if I don't I can no longer use my files.
« Last Edit: November 17, 2017, 09:13:59 pm by H.O »
 

Online janoc

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #42 on: November 18, 2017, 01:18:38 am »
Why the hate for Autodesk?  They provide good tools no? I guess you don't have to use them if you don't want to.

I looked briefly at KiCad - but what I don't want to have to understand how to build my CAD tools, or fear them being 'unfinished'.

What sold me on Eagle/Fusion 360 was that they both just worked well seperatley AND played nicely together.  It's a nice workflow. And I like the subscription model - we hire our staff by the month, why their some of the tools?  This also gives Autodesk an incentive to improve the tools to retain customers.

Just wait until one of those "improvements" that come as forced updates breaks something.

Our company uses Fusion360 to open CAD files from clients and we had all sorts of nice surprises already. One week a script runs, the next it is broken because of an API behavior change and the week after it works again - but something else is broken now!

Once you get invested in the tool, those updates and "improvements" become your worst nightmare - you don't want to constantly fiddle with the tooling in the middle of a project in order to adapt it to whatever changes the vendor did behind your back all the time, it won't help you get anything done. It also makes reproducible results very hard to achieve because you never know what the tool will do since it can change behind your back.

Fusion360 is not a serious CAD tool, IMO. You are being used as a beta tester and are paying for the privilege to boot.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2017, 01:22:58 am by janoc »
 

Offline fcb

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #43 on: November 18, 2017, 12:30:50 pm »
I get the "tool security" argument - but for me it doesn't matter too much.  OK, let's put it another way, in my 26+ years of designing stuff I have never been scuppered by not being able to "open" a PCB in a PCB design tool (or code, or drawings).

I always create PDF schematics, Gerbers and paper copies of every revision of every design. I have never had to re-issue old Gerbers if I need to 'duplicate' a product, 'cause there are always bigger problems (component obsolescence, casing process issues, etc..) - those combined with everything I've learnt since the original has meant it's always quicker and more efficient to respin a design.

Also, we rarely give clients the actual design files, just schematics and Gerbers (we have zero objection to giving them the files, it just never comes up - and they can't verify them with out buying a license for whatever, which bizarrely can cause more of a headache than just not supplying the files).  I guess I treat the SCH/PCB tool files as an 'intermediate' format, much like my notebook.

And yes, Autodesk could put the prices up - or tier the product offering more.  And if the functionality improves then why not?  If Eagle became an Altium grade product then I'm sure they would try and charge more.




Online H.O

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #44 on: November 18, 2017, 02:00:35 pm »
Quote
I get the "tool security" argument - but for me it doesn't matter too much.  OK, let's put it another way, in my 26+ years of designing stuff I have never been scuppered by not being able to "open" a PCB in a PCB design tool (or code, or drawings).
But isn't that because once you payed for the software that was used to create those designfiles you "owned" it and you can keep it "forever". Even if the company went away or the product was killed you CAN still install the software (provided you have the appropriate environent) and mess around with your files as much as you want. I personally don't think it's likely that you'll be able to do that 5-10 years down the road with software on subscription.

One can argue that that with software on subscription you can pay for a month or two while you produce the files and then 5 years from now, when you need to change something you can pay for another month and come out way cheaper than with a perpetual license but then we have the issue of file formats etc, there's nothing saying the they won't change the file format so that 5 year old file won't open properly. Altium or OrCAD or whatever can do that too of cource but somewhere along the road you either made the decision to upgrade making your old files incompatible or you made the decision not to upgrade and stuck with the version that served you well.

Quote
And yes, Autodesk could put the prices up - or tier the product offering more.  And if the functionality improves then why not?  If Eagle became an Altium grade product then I'm sure they would try and charge more.
Of course they can and of course they will. The problem is that now, with the subscription model, it's no longer my decision if the features they've added are worth the increased cost to me. I either pay the increased subscription fee and get the features (weather I need them or not) OR I stop paying (always an option of course) but then I can't use the software - at all - anymore.

I know I might be overly sceptical here and it might be that "everything" is going this way and I should just adapt but I won't because I really don't like the concept (and I've shown that with my wallet by buying CircuitStudio). YMMV of course.
 

Offline fcb

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #45 on: November 19, 2017, 03:11:51 pm »
H.O - I agree.  In time I may want to open an Eagle file, and find that I can't.  And because of the subscription model I can't just run a stored instance of the layout software - However, in the last 26 years I have never had to do this. And my business doesn't rely on being able to do this.

If I take a product I designed in 2007, it is now in it's 5th iteration and will shortly be starting it's 6th) - each one has had a new PCB from scratch as improvements in performance, DFM, etc.. have made it far quicker to re-lay the design each time.

I started out with a license for EasyPC (www.numberone.com) back in the days it was DOS, I still have a license for the top-of-the-range version.  They just haven't moved as fast as the others.  Probably down to the fact that they only get £60 from me every year or so rather than £60 every month (as per eagle) - developers are expensive (they also have a more expensive package called Pulsonix apparently, but never bothered with that - my opinion when I met them at EDS this year was to focus on just one really good package, they nodded politely, but I expect they'll carry on as they are).

I suspect that as the complexity of the packages increases, there will be a gentle culling of the lower-middle ground players. Especially as the benefits of CAD tool integration become more routinely demonstrated.




Offline macegr

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #46 on: November 19, 2017, 07:33:35 pm »
Are these very simple PCBs where you can do a complete from-scratch design over six revisions? I've put 80 hours into a single PCB. My clients aren't going to pay me $10,000 - $20,000 because I chose the wrong tool and can't make a small change without redoing the whole board.
 
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Offline station240

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #47 on: November 19, 2017, 08:09:05 pm »
While I do agree Autodesk aren't going to go broke overnight, they can still create huge problems with this subscription model.
Simply releasing a new version of Eagle that is incompatible in some way with previous files, or does one way changes to files it loads, would do it.
Take for instance Eagle 7.5's changes the libraries.

I still haven't had the time to go back and fix/redo my Eagle libraries, given what Autodesk have done to the software ownership, I likely never will.
What flaws Eagle had/has could be overlooked given it's cheap, no nonsense licensing, not any more.

Autodesk always has shot themselves in the foot with their software licensing, where legit customers have to crack the software anyway to avoid issues in re-installing.
 
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Offline cdev

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #48 on: November 19, 2017, 08:32:29 pm »
They should make a program available to convert previous Eagle files to Kicad format.
"What the large print giveth, the small print taketh away."
 

Offline expinkolator

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Re: Why is everybody ranting about Autodesk's Subscription-Model?
« Reply #49 on: November 19, 2017, 10:39:30 pm »
Autodesk think a subscription model will make them more money. Most customers agree which is why most customers don't want a subscription model.

How complicated does it need to be?
 


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