Circuit Maker - It Lives!

[zapta]

I'm not talking about you in particular, Zapta.  I don't understand why there's such a fuss over this.  don't like it, don't use it.  simple.  complaint without the ability to make a change is wasted energy, just like this post right here, so go ahead, future reader, fail to read this entire thing and declare me a moron.

Hi Rigby, negative feedback is just as valid as positive feedback. 

You wouldn't complain about posts here how great this product is but you complain about negative opinions.

Your post seems to me as attempt to censor this discussion, presenting opinions you don't like as illegitimate.

[c4757p]

devil's advocate:  If you name your project properly it won't collide with anyone else's name.  Just don't use overly generic project names...  "test" is not descriptive.  "power supply" is not descriptive.  Name the thing what it actually is and does and chances are you won't collide.  the easiest way around it is to just prefix (or suffix) the project name with your nickname or something.  "Rigby_test" for example.  No one else is going to use that.

This is a workaround, not a justification.

how do you search a natively open ecosystem if everything is named "test" and "power supply?"  suppose you use a few of those power supply designs?  how do you differentiate them?

ah nevermind i'm done arguing.  I don't understand why engineers, of all people, flip their shit over compromises.  EVERYTHING in engineering is a compromise between time, cost, reliability, and complexity, among other things.  You can't have it all.  You just can't.

So, the problem is that this new thing isn't like your favorite thing.  So what?  "I'LL COMPLAIN ABOUT IT" <-- that's the answer?  Seriously?  for an ENGINEER? 

Fucking hell, I do not understand people.  Most people are just consuming resources for no net gain to society, or even themselves, and I'm sick of it. 

I'm not talking about you in particular, Zapta.  I don't understand why there's such a fuss over this.  don't like it, don't use it.  simple.  complaint without the ability to make a change is wasted energy, just like this post right here, so go ahead, future reader, fail to read this entire thing and declare me a moron.

Nobody's flipping shit, don't be a prat. We (or some of us) just think CircuitMaker is silly and useless.

[Rigby]

I'm not talking about you in particular, Zapta.  I don't understand why there's such a fuss over this.  don't like it, don't use it.  simple.  complaint without the ability to make a change is wasted energy, just like this post right here, so go ahead, future reader, fail to read this entire thing and declare me a moron.

Hi Rigby, negative feedback is just as valid as positive feedback. 

You wouldn't complain about posts here how great this product is but you complain about negative opinions.

Your post seems to me as attempt to censor this discussion, presenting opinions you don't like as illegitimate.

My life is filled with people who talk themselves out of everything good for them.  I'm really tired of it.

My personal opinion is that I haven't used Circuit Maker enough to have a valid opinion, yet.  I was a beta tester, and I used it for weeks before I was even allowed to talk about it.

There are literally thousands of people in the world who can tell someone that "X" isn't an option, or that "Y" can't be done.  It pisses me off when people do it to themselves.

Nevermind.  Nothing is ever good enough for you people and everything new sucks.  I get it, now.  You're all delicate little individuals who all have the right to free applications custom built for your own specific workflow and your own specific needs, and anything that falls short is completely irredeemable, and worth exactly nothing.  Got it.

[zapta]

Nevermind.  Nothing is ever good enough for you people and everything new sucks.  I get it, now.  You're all delicate little individuals who all have the right to free applications custom built for your own specific workflow and your own specific needs, and anything that falls short is completely irredeemable, and worth exactly nothing.  Got it.

We don't judge it by some ideal reference, we judge it by comparing to competing products. 

Eagle runs on my OS of choice and allows me to control my files. That's elementary.

[Zeta]

...
I don't understand why engineers, of all people, flip their shit over compromises.  EVERYTHING in engineering is a compromise between time, cost, reliability, and complexity, among other things.  You can't have it all.  You just can't.

So, the problem is that this new thing isn't like your favorite thing.  So what?  "I'LL COMPLAIN ABOUT IT" <-- that's the answer?  Seriously?  for an ENGINEER? 

it is actually easy to understand. You just have to remember that, despite what they call themselves,  most people here are NOT engineers.

devil's advocate:  If you name your project properly it won't collide with anyone else's name.  Just don't use overly generic project names...  "test" is not descriptive.  "power supply" is not descriptive.  Name the thing what it actually is and does and chances are you won't collide.  the easiest way around it is to just prefix (or suffix) the project name with your nickname or something.  "Rigby_test" for example.  No one else is going to use that.

They should probably place "OwnUserName_" as default prefix for all new projects. Had they done that from the beginning, I bet no one would have cared.

I don't care if project names have to be unique. I just hope they are not using project names as unique identifier. That would be dumb and could be the source of unnecessary limitations in project management operations.

[MosElec]

1.  You can make custom, non-Ciiva (was Octopart) parts.  Woo hoo!
2.  You can define your PCB from selected objects!

Thanks for the update. I finally got a chance and gave it a try. It's critical that the tool allows custom component, though Ciiva library is a good start (quite like the lifecycle status bar and possible substitutes, http://ciiva.com/part/lm339n-1152799).
As the Beta version, I wouldn't complain too much and hope for some quick improvement in a not too distant future. I am seriously thinking of switching the tool to circuitmaker for my students.

[timb]

I'm not talking about you in particular, Zapta.  I don't understand why there's such a fuss over this.  don't like it, don't use it.  simple.  complaint without the ability to make a change is wasted energy, just like this post right here, so go ahead, future reader, fail to read this entire thing and declare me a moron.

Hi Rigby, negative feedback is just as valid as positive feedback. 

You wouldn't complain about posts here how great this product is but you complain about negative opinions.

Your post seems to me as attempt to censor this discussion, presenting opinions you don't like as illegitimate.

My life is filled with people who talk themselves out of everything good for them.  I'm really tired of it.

My personal opinion is that I haven't used Circuit Maker enough to have a valid opinion, yet.  I was a beta tester, and I used it for weeks before I was even allowed to talk about it.

There are literally thousands of people in the world who can tell someone that "X" isn't an option, or that "Y" can't be done.  It pisses me off when people do it to themselves.

Nevermind.  Nothing is ever good enough for you people and everything new sucks.  I get it, now.  You're all delicate little individuals who all have the right to free applications custom built for your own specific workflow and your own specific needs, and anything that falls short is completely irredeemable, and worth exactly nothing.  Got it.

No, that's not it at all and nobody is saying this.

This is SPARTA BETA!!! The idea is to give complaints/constructive criticism/bug reports to make the software better. That's exactly what we're doing.

Despite what Google thinks, betas aren't finished products.


Sent from my Tablet

[ludzinc]

News from the CM Forum - Looks like CM is going to include CircuitHub and Oshpark integration.

13 hours ago by Dan Fernsebner / ALTIUM / UNITED STATES
Reply|Quote
Post ID: 597960
Jay,

Funny your requesting such a thing as we are in the process of completing the final integration with CircuitHub.  There will be Fabricate" or "Make It" buttons within CM and on the CM website under releases (see screen shot) that will upload the design to CircuitHub and go through the normal process of analyzing the design, producing the BOM, and issuing a quote based on board quantity and delivery time frame.  The other intent is we will be able to flag all parts in the Ciiva library that have gone through a successful fabrication.  A component that has gone through a successful fab will be given a part "weight".  The fabrication weight will be one factor of the part rating algorithm that we are creating.  This new part rating should give users high confidence when selecting various components.  We will also include PCB images of the final boards made by CircuitHub as part of the project.  Depending upon how the project is licensed it will give other users the ability to produce the same design from the projects page if they choose to do so.  (See screen shot of new project page mockup - note this may not be how the final page looks)

We should be entering the initial closed beta in the coming weeks.  We want the new functionality to go through a small set of testers first to ensure the workflow is solid before releasing to the open beta community.  If you would like to be part of this closed beta let me know.

To ensure everyone - we will not be locking CM to any specific fabricator.  Those that want to etch their own boards, use their own machines, or go to any fabricator/assembler they want; we will always support this.  Our intent is to make the concept to creation process as easy as possible.  There are many new Makers who don't know where to go or who to use.  We will also be adding OshPark as a secondary option shortly.

Kind regards,
Dan

This is big.

[c4757p]

Big?

[miguelvp]

That's awesome news Ludzinc.

The first fabricator that pops out might get my first CM order if the price is right

[EEVblog]

I'm not talking about you in particular, Zapta.  I don't understand why there's such a fuss over this.  don't like it, don't use it.  simple.  complaint without the ability to make a change is wasted energy, just like this post right here, so go ahead, future reader, fail to read this entire thing and declare me a moron.

Altium have asked for feedback, that includes complaints about the way it works the approach they are taking.

[EEVblog]

I did some corporate BS training a few months back.  They claim only 1 in 20 people complain.  Complaints are how most companies get feedback.

Altium are famous for only hearing feedback they want to hear. Deliberately wording customer polls to reinforce a direction they want to go in etc.
See no evil, hear no evil should have been the company motto.
Things seems to have a changed for the better since the board shakeup though.

[Icchan]

Altium are famous for only hearing feedback they want to hear. Deliberately wording customer polls to reinforce a direction they want to go in etc.
See no evil, hear no evil should have been the company motto.
Things seems to have a changed for the better since the board shakeup though.

Customer should be the "king and country" in any product for any company. Since if the customers needs aren't in the top of the TODO-list the product will be superseded by another that does listen to the customers and offer better service.

The only reason Altium is not losing their big customers is because changing the software ecosystem is a huge and expensive undertaking for any company invested in Altium. But they should understand that the state of affairs don't stay such forever.

[LabSpokane]

Altium are famous for only hearing feedback they want to hear. Deliberately wording customer polls to reinforce a direction they want to go in etc.
See no evil, hear no evil should have been the company motto.
Things seems to have a changed for the better since the board shakeup though.

Customer should be the "king and country" in any product for any company.

Yes and no. Customers are important. They just aren't always right. Software that caters to every piece of client feedback received generally ranges from terrible to awful. I would argue that Altium's excessive use of online focus groups is why this deployment is a train wreck.

By all means listen to the customer, but for goodness' sake, distill that feedback into a consistent, sustainable, coherent product. Great products get built by people with vision and drive, not by committees of ten thousand.

[mswhin63]

This is so true, I just saw a forum post on DesignSpark that requests a DesignSpark user to make changes to an existing project because they are Altium users.

This is the reason why I am learning multiple packages now.

Customer should be the "king and country" in any product for any company. Since if the customers needs aren't in the top of the TODO-list the product will be superseded by another that does listen to the customers and offer better service.

The only reason Altium is not losing their big customers is because changing the software ecosystem is a huge and expensive undertaking for any company invested in Altium. But they should understand that the state of affairs don't stay such forever.

[Zeta]

Yes and no. Customers are important. They just aren't always right. Software that caters to every piece of client feedback received generally ranges from terrible to awful. I would argue that Altium's excessive use of online focus groups is why this deployment is a train wreck.

By all means listen to the customer, but for goodness' sake, distill that feedback into a consistent, sustainable, coherent product. Great products get built by people with vision and drive, not by committees of ten thousand.

That is the wisest post I've read on this forum.
although, I would go beyond and say customers most of the time are wrong and don't know what they want.

[Professor]

Hi All, I felt obligated to make an account to give back to the world that has provided me with such great insights into PCB design software.

The conspiracy theories about stealing your designs is a little unwarranted, it's public because they want the parts data for analytics purposes (ie to give to the distributors and maybe even manufacturers for the purposes of foresight) ... there is a lot of *potential* money in this... I think this is great news for an enduser. Maybe phrase your feedback along the lines of "I don't care if you take data on the amount of parts I use but I want to keep my finished product to myself" ... I wouldn't be surprised if CM gets integrated with manufacturing addins like CircuitHub.

Anyway feel free to PM me if you want to know more.

[EEVblog]

By all means listen to the customer, but for goodness' sake, distill that feedback into a consistent, sustainable, coherent product. Great products get built by people with vision and drive, not by committees of ten thousand.

Sure, but Altium was a company driven entirely by vision and drive under founder Nick Martin. So much so that the words "iron first" were often bandied about.
The problem was he had the wrong vision, that of FPGA's, and they wasted the entire company fortune on it for over 10 years. Customers were left dumbfounded at their direction.
The result was it failed, and the only reason the company didn't go out of business was the loyal customer base and lack of competition in the price bracket.
Remember, this is the PCB tool company that was so vision driven, the PCB tool literally became optional extra! 

[EEVblog]

That is the wisest post I've read on this forum.
although, I would go beyond and say customers most of the time are wrong and don't know what they want.

Except for black and white cases like "We only want the PCB tool, we don't need FPGA". You ignore feedback like that at your peril.

[alexanderbrevig]

I really like Altium, for some reason things mostly work as I expect them to. We are on the same wavelength and in phase. But the Circuit Maker... I can't seem to feel at home.
I miss my shortkeys 

Because of this I'm using KiCAD for personal projects now. Recently ported 'everything' over (I know I didn't)...
I kind of like the FOSS aspect of it too, so there's that. There is something ideologically intriguing about making open things with open tools. 

[zapta]

How is Circuit Maker doing?  Didn't hear it mentioned much recently. Did it capture a significant market share?

[Warhawk]

Does anyone actively use Circuit Maker ? I have not heard about it for a while...
I made one board using CM and then gave up. That community stuff really bothers me. Here is just one example. I took a component which should had been in TSSOP but somebody was lazy to make a new one component from scratch, so he added a new revision with QFN package. I could not find a way how to report it neither add comment to the revision.

Everything else was pretty good.

[mikeselectricstuff]

How many designs are visible in the "community"?

[ehughes]

A bunch!

http://workspace.circuitmaker.com/Projects

[Negative-Bias]

I got to say all this software completely loses me "lost in space" I've watched Dave and others use it, however when I try and use it, what's left of the brain disengages