Take a look at my newly improved PCB viewer / Gerber Viewer

[zofz]

Adding IPC356 bare board flying probe test file, enables design browsing and components display. At the moment, there is no component library. Instead I am guessing using geometry of pads and components designator names from IPC356 testpoints. There is also a cross-check interface to OrCad schematic, see youtube video:
2 screen crosscheck
Free download zofzpcb.com

[CatalinaWOW]

Interesting.  I hadn't seen your program before.  For others equally ignorant, here is a link.

http://www.zofzpcb.com/

[timofonic]

Your software looks interesting, but your EULA scares me to shit pure steel bricks.

Why are you so restrictive on freeware? I don't get it!

What about FOSS and Linux support?

[AlfBaz]

If memory serves, there's a thread on here somewhere where Free_Electron and the OP exchanged ideas to improve it a year or so ago

Judging from those images, it looks like it has come a long way since then

[codeboy2k]

At first glance it looks great! good job!

The EULA is not that bad, it's freeware and you can basically do anything you want with it except sell it, decompile it, or otherwise try to figure out how it works.   Other than those restrictions, it's not that bad for a EULA.

It's not FOSS. 

I am running it on Linux, and it runs OK under Wine.  So far no major problems, and I've tried many features.  The application says it uses DirectX 9 and  Wine emulates/translates DirectX calls so it runs fast and is quite usable  There is some font issues that make the text of the menus difficult to read. I've never had font issues under Wine before, so I attribute this to the home-brew menu system this application is using.

I would love to see the cross-probing interface opened up, so that someone can plug it into KiCad.

Good job @zofz !

[BravoV]

Great stuff , thank you !   

I would love to see the cross-probing interface opened up, so that someone can plug it into KiCad.

+1 

[codeboy2k]

And if the cross-probing interface is opened up, I'd like to see it done over TCP/IP, even for a local connection.  This means that the app can run in Wine and still communicate to KiCad which will be running in Linux.    If it's a Windows DLL or some other proprietary windows message passing interface then it's not going to work cross platform or under emulations...

Using TCP for cross probing also opens up interesting other possibilities. For example, cross probing could also be be done between two gerber viewers on different hosts, not just between the gerbers and schematic capture.   Then you and a coworker can look at gerbers together for a collaboration. Or you and your board house...

[zofz]

Thanks,
TCP or UDP interface, crossprobe and navigation - i mean exact the same camera position and rotation,  that is what i am thinking of.  To form something like shared desktop.
Later, to overcome "corporate firewalls", it shoukd be using http and third server, maybe.

At the moment there are two: WM_COPYDATA and file based. I will put them to the webpage.

[alexanderbrevig]

Wow! Really cool stuff What lib are you using for 3d rendering?

[zofz]

The library: I needed to compress the layer vertex data, it is only 2D + Z[n] as constant. That somehow forced me to do direct shader programming. But there is a DXUT as a starting point.

[zofz]

The current cross-check interfaces description: WM_COPYDATA and file, can be downloaded at http://www.zofzpcb.com/Cross-Check.html

[zapta]

Free download zofzpcb.com

Windows only. Oh, well...

[timofonic]

Thanks,
TCP or UDP interface, crossprobe and navigation - i mean exact the same camera position and rotation,  that is what i am thinking of.  To form something like shared desktop.
Later, to overcome "corporate firewalls", it shoukd be using http and third server, maybe.

At the moment there are two: WM_COPYDATA and file based. I will put them to the webpage.

Your software seems very interesting, really.

Can you explain your reason to make a freeware with that kind of restrictive license? Or do you plan to eventually make it commercial?

If you plan to keep it freeware? Why that EULA? Why not making it Open Source?

Despite your software seems really very interesting with many nice feature, I'm afraid of propietary software these days for different reasons. Some of them are: Vendor lock-in, expensive cost, security, unable to modify or port it to other platforms...

[zofz]

Thanks,
TCP or UDP interface, crossprobe and navigation - i mean exact the same camera position and rotation,  that is what i am thinking of.  To form something like shared desktop.
Later, to overcome "corporate firewalls", it shoukd be using http and third server, maybe.

At the moment there are two: WM_COPYDATA and file based. I will put them to the webpage.

Your software seems very interesting, really.

Can you explain your reason to make a freeware with that kind of restrictive license? Or do you plan to eventually make it commercial?

If you plan to keep it freeware? Why that EULA? Why not making it Open Source?

Despite your software seems really very interesting with many nice feature, I'm afraid of propietary software these days for different reasons. Some of them are: Vendor lock-in, expensive cost, security, unable to modify or port it to other platforms...

yes, This is a question I ask myself too. The most important is: how can I continue to provide this software free of charge, and realize many ideas I have? vendor lock: I will not close any feature I have already opened. I might include some new features for a commerce, however. I may also convert zofzpcb to truly free software.  I do not know. I am letting to know, anyone who bothers to read, about any internet communication, in the help file, and I can expose the sources to some trusted authority, if required. What I have at the moment is a http query for a current version, a single text file loaded, containing the version number. zofzpcb.com/version/info.txt . I run your default browser, to display the help page. actions defined in the help menu. I have bought a certificate, so I am traceable and the program is protected against third party modifications on the download way. At the moment of crash, there is a possibility to automatically send a crash log/info/etc. all you can examine before sending, or chose not to send. (any way I need gerbers in case of debugging, so I need a email contact anyway). I was concerned that such question will be asked, but it was asked much later then I expected. hmm. anyway, the program is clean, the website uses google analytic. That is all.

[codeboy2k]

The current cross-check interfaces description: WM_COPYDATA and file, can be downloaded at http://www.zofzpcb.com/Cross-Check.html

Excellent! Thanks for your quick response to the suggestion too. I think the file based interface can work between Windows app on Linux and a native Linux app like KiCad

[zofz]

The current cross-check interfaces description: WM_COPYDATA and file, can be downloaded at http://www.zofzpcb.com/Cross-Check.html

Excellent! Thanks for your quick response to the suggestion too. I think the file based interface can work between Windows app on Linux and a native Linux app like KiCad

Anyway, i   am willing to create the tcp interface. And maybe Kicad have already something done about this. There also is a idea to make adobe pdf plugin, many cad systems create schematics with rich annotations. Then click able pdf.

Sent from my SM-T800 using Tapatalk

[Mechatrommer]

bug report...

1) color preset not saved correctly. when i set all layers colors and save, next time i changed color preset and set back to my theme, color changed to what i did not pick. the only way afaik to restore desired color is by saving rendered board in a file.
2) gui issue: why dont pan with right click? universe rotate for right click is less practical imho. keep pressing shift may induce carpal tunnel on my left hand. any other sw capable of single hand navigation.
3) gui issue: mousewheel scroll zoom too slow, i cant set the zoom rate. many scroll to get desired zoom may induce carpal tunnel in my index finger.
4) sometime saving and reloading color preset generates error (see attached picture)

my platform, WinXP SP3 32bit. anyway some of the previous issues discussed sometime ago have been solved, keep up the good work. i'm learning to populate 3d component, any easy clue without using orcad?

[Mechatrommer]

also how do it make the core/prepeg opaque? i dont have specific whole opaque gerber for the board, i only have board outline and zofpcb just render it as... an outline. i dont want to keep disabling and enabling the bottom (or top) layers/slikscreen/mask while rotating the pcb top to bottom and back. non opaque board messing the view with crisscrossing bottom and top traces (and copper pours) as arrowed below...

[Mechatrommer]

ok got it with "auto load function". i must say this App is several magnitude better than gEDA Gerber Viewer, gerv (functionally), even without 3d components i'm currently in. except the gui and some issues i raised earlier. i believe this App must be told to the world, it deserves recognition, keep it up!...

[Karel]

I'll give it a try when the open-source native Linux version has been released.

[timofonic]

I'll give it a try when the open-source native Linux multiplataform version has been released.

Fixed!

[MagicSmoker]

...
Despite your software seems really very interesting with many nice feature, I'm afraid of propietary software these days for different reasons. Some of them are: Vendor lock-in, expensive cost, security, unable to modify or port it to other platforms...

Uh... I'm pretty sure the OP said it's free... 

And to the OP - impressive job!

[Mechatrommer]

I'll give it a try when the open-source native Linux multiplataform multiplatform version has been released.

Fixed!

Fixed! ... until then, let us wingows and wine people enjoy the nice app, you can continue with gEDA.

[timofonic]

I'll give it a try when the open-source native Linux multiplataform multiplatform version has been released.

Fixed!

Fixed! ... until then, let us wingows and wine people enjoy the nice app, you can continue with gEDA.

I don't use gEDA. I'm an Eagle user slowly transitioning to KiCad.

I don't know weird programming languages and fork my EDA tool. I barely know about programming at all.

I'm a newbie and KiCad might be more than enough, just I miss better file format interoperability and better UX.

By the time I would need something like Altium, I hope KiCad got improved a lot and even being a contributor of it in some form.

[zofz]

bug report...

1) color preset not saved correctly. when i set all layers colors and save, next time i changed color preset and set back to my theme, color changed to what i did not pick. the only way afaik to restore desired color is by saving rendered board in a file.
2) gui issue: why dont pan with right click? universe rotate for right click is less practical imho. keep pressing shift may induce carpal tunnel on my left hand. any other sw capable of single hand navigation.
3) gui issue: mousewheel scroll zoom too slow, i cant set the zoom rate. many scroll to get desired zoom may induce carpal tunnel in my index finger.
4) sometime saving and reloading color preset generates error (see attached picture)

my platform, WinXP SP3 32bit. anyway some of the previous issues discussed sometime ago have been solved, keep up the good work. i'm learning to populate 3d component, any easy clue without using orcad?

Thanks,
1. color save/restore bug report is clear.
2. Possibly no one uses right-drag anyway. I would not destroy too much, if I make camera rotation on shift-right drag and use right drag for moving. I will consult a long time user for this. The other way is to make everything configurable, but that makes me feel pain.
3. OK, I will think about a nice and simple way to adjust (or dynamically auto-adjust) the zoom speed.
4. A troll must have been changing the code when I was not looking OR unknown are paths of the user.

[zofz]

The way to show components is to load IPC356 file. As Wikipedia lists, this file is possible to export by (almost) all CAD packages. Full name: bare board electrical test file (or flying probe test file). I will read it if it contains net names, and designators, so recreating this file via CAM software from Gerber makes no sense. Problems: load example 1, check the file there.

[zofz]

also how do it make the core/prepeg opaque? i dont have specific whole opaque gerber for the board, i only have board outline and zofpcb just render it as... an outline. i dont want to keep disabling and enabling the bottom (or top) layers/slikscreen/mask while rotating the pcb top to bottom and back. non opaque board messing the view with crisscrossing bottom and top traces (and copper pours) as arrowed below...

It looks like some aspects of my stack-layer are not intuitive. I am doing auto insert of FR4 if you set the board thickness. This is quite hidden, one must select the board outline to see the total-thickness setting (and the board outline must be there...). It is the second time I see that someone missed this. - Important! Of course Auto does it all, if it works...    Of course you have discovered the "volume" slider later.

[alank2]

I checked out your viewer the other day zofz - it is pretty cool.  Keep up the good work!

[free_electron]

just tried one of my 'monsters' ... took over 3 hours to load and crunch but  renders perfectly

[nctnico]

Unfortunately it doesn't work from Windows in a Virtualbox even with directx9 installed (Why isn't that included? It doesn't make sense to distribute software without it's key components). Too bad there is no native Linux version...

[timofonic]

 I was going to try it in VirtualBox

[timofonic]

Any news?

[zofz]

A new version!
As requested:
Component individual hide and swap to bottom (for THT) options.
Right mouse button drag moves the PCB,
Additionally:
zofzproj file saves colors and layer on/off state, 10 recorded camera orientation positions,
Variable additional layer types, (not by auto-load yet)
Plus:
many bug fixes.
nothing about Linux/OSX yet
http://www.zofzpcb.com/Gerber-Viewer-Download.html

[timofonic]

This library might be useful for you...


https://github.com/bkaradzic/bgfx

[c4757p]

Sweeeet, I'll have to give it a test.

Linux would be nice, I suppose, but it's nice enough that you put in all this effort and just give it away. I just stick it in a VM.

[rx8pilot]

I love it. Really nice addition to my layout work flow.



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

[Jay_Diddy_B]

Hi,

I have been using ZofZ for a few years now.

I would just like to say thank you. It is a great tool !!

Regards,

Jay_Diddy_B

[sleemanj]

Tried this tool, it crashed on my gerbers (using under VMWare mind you).

You can grab them here if you want to test:

http://sparks.gogo.co.nz/crashygerb.zip

FWIW, these gerbs were created as a merge of a number of boards with a (still beta) panelizing tool.  Some other gerb viewers also have problems with them, so you are not alone.

Circuit People's tool gets it right

KiCad's gerbview mostly gets it right (some silk funnyness).

The current git version of Geda's gerbv gets it right provided you increase the maximum arperture parameters from 102 to something larger (and recompile).  These gerber's include polygons with a couple hundred parameters (100+ points), going by comments in gerbv's source it may be that there used to be a limit of 50 points in the gerber spec, but the current gerber spec I believe may have up to 5000 points.

[zofz]

This library might be useful for you...


https://github.com/bkaradzic/bgfx

Thanks, a quite interesting idea. By reading the doc, I found out that I can use compiled shaders from direct3D in openGL 
But the biggest part of code to handle would be DXUT - and especially DXUTgui - that is a user interface framework for Direct3D. As far as I see, there is no abstraction layer for this in bgfx and I still need to find a new fitting GUI "widget" library, common for both Direct3D and OpenGL, then convert to it, first in the windows version.

[kc8apf]

This library might be useful for you...


https://github.com/bkaradzic/bgfx

Thanks, a quite interesting idea. By reading the doc, I found out that I can use compiled shaders from direct3D in openGL 
But the biggest part of code to handle would be DXUT - and especially DXUTgui - that is a user interface framework for Direct3D. As far as I see, there is no abstraction layer for this in bgfx and I still need to find a new fitting GUI "widget" library, common for both Direct3D and OpenGL, then convert to it, first in the windows version.

A lot of the 3D apps I've worked on separate the 2D UI from the 3D rendering.  The 2D UI is implemented in a per-platform fashion using the native OS widgets.  The 3D rendering is tied to a canvas placed in the 2D UI.  3D text is still an issue but that's rather unavoidable.

[zofz]

Tried this tool, it crashed on my gerbers (using under VMWare mind you).

You can grab them here if you want to test:

http://sparks.gogo.co.nz/crashygerb.zip

FWIW, these gerbs were created as a merge of a number of boards with a (still beta) panelizing tool.  Some other gerb viewers also have problems with them, so you are not alone.

Circuit People's tool gets it right

KiCad's gerbview mostly gets it right (some silk funnyness).

The current git version of Geda's gerbv gets it right provided you increase the maximum arperture parameters from 102 to something larger (and recompile).  These gerber's include polygons with a couple hundred parameters (100+ points), going by comments in gerbv's source it may be that there used to be a limit of 50 points in the gerber spec, but the current gerber spec I believe may have up to 5000 points.

OK, I can repeat the crash - thanks. In my case it seems to be related to drills. Also - need to remember - I need to implement a step and repeat and the new nested repeat commands. Might be important for panelizing. About the number of parameters - I have been already making problems to myself  and hopefully solved it. see the picture - it is a single aperture

[zofz]

This library might be useful for you...


https://github.com/bkaradzic/bgfx

Thanks, a quite interesting idea. By reading the doc, I found out that I can use compiled shaders from direct3D in openGL 
But the biggest part of code to handle would be DXUT - and especially DXUTgui - that is a user interface framework for Direct3D. As far as I see, there is no abstraction layer for this in bgfx and I still need to find a new fitting GUI "widget" library, common for both Direct3D and OpenGL, then convert to it, first in the windows version.

A lot of the 3D apps I've worked on separate the 2D UI from the 3D rendering.  The 2D UI is implemented in a per-platform fashion using the native OS widgets.  The 3D rendering is tied to a canvas placed in the 2D UI.  3D text is still an issue but that's rather unavoidable.

Maybe that was a wrong decision. I wanted the performance even on weak graphic cards. I have seen performance boost when using 3D only / full screen mode. (e.g. the old method - allow to reduce resolution in 3D mode.) Now this is not that important and it would be a opportunity to switch to use the OS native GUI. I have to think it over.

[zofz]

Tried this tool, it crashed on my gerbers (using under VMWare mind you).

You can grab them here if you want to test:

http://sparks.gogo.co.nz/crashygerb.zip

FWIW, these gerbs were created as a merge of a number of boards with a (still beta) panelizing tool.  Some other gerb viewers also have problems with them, so you are not alone.

Circuit People's tool gets it right

KiCad's gerbview mostly gets it right (some silk funnyness).

The current git version of Geda's gerbv gets it right provided you increase the maximum arperture parameters from 102 to something larger (and recompile).  These gerber's include polygons with a couple hundred parameters (100+ points), going by comments in gerbv's source it may be that there used to be a limit of 50 points in the gerber spec, but the current gerber spec I believe may have up to 5000 points.

The bug was related to the board outline processing. I am in the middle of other fixes, but here is a current build which can read your project.
http://www.zofzpcb.com/Download/ZofzPCBpre.exe
BTW, the first point of every outline loop in combined.GKO is repeated twice - this should be no real problem, however.

[rx8pilot]

Just downloaded the latest, works great. Really appreciate this useful tool!

[sleemanj]

The bug was related to the board outline processing. I am in the middle of other fixes, but here is a current build which can read your project.

  Nice one

[timofonic]

Quote from: zofz on January 19, 2016, 05:24:39 AM>Quote from: timofonic on January 10, 2016, 02:25:00 AM

This library might be useful for you...


>https://github.com/bkaradzic/bgfx

Thanks, a quite interesting idea. By reading the doc, I found out that I can use compiled shaders from direct3D in openGL 
But the biggest part of code to handle would be DXUT - and especially DXUTgui - that is a user interface framework for Direct3D. As far as I see, there is no abstraction layer for this in bgfx and I still need to find a new fitting GUI "widget" library, common for both Direct3D and OpenGL, then convert to it, first in the windows version.



bgfx author is quite supportive, I'm sure he'll provide you sueful feedback about that. It's  used in a very wide variety of software, from CAD/CAM to videogames.

Blender and many other tools use OpenGL. What's wrong with that?

There's ImGUI that started as code for Media Molecule's Tearaway game.

>

ImGUI: A bloat-free graphical user interface library for C++.

• Outputs vertex buffers to be rendered the 3D-pipeline enabled application.
• Fast.
• Portable.
• Renderer agnostic.
• No specific build process is required. You can add the .cpp files to your project or #include them from an existing file.
• Self-contained within a few files that you can easily copy and compile into your application/engine: imgui.cpp, imgui.h, imgui_demo.cpp, imgui_draw.cpp, imgui_internal.h, imconfig.h (empty by default, user-editable), stb_rect_pack.h, stb_textedit.h, stb_truetype.h
• No external dependencies.
• Your code passes mouse/keyboard inputs and settings to ImGui (see example applications for more details).
• As opposed to UI for the average end-user, it’s designed to:
• Enable fast iteration.
• Empower programmers to create content creation tools and visualization/debug tools.
• It favors simplicity and productivity.
• Toward this goal it lacks certain features normally found in more high-level libraries.


• Particularly suited to integration in:
• Realtime 3D applications.
• Fullscreen applications.
• Embedded applications.
• Games.
• Any applications on consoles platforms where operating system features are non-standard.

[printedcircuit]

can anyone tell me if this software
1. can measure the size of the keepout layer like cam350?
2. can automatically find and output the width of the smallest via, narrowest trace/space?

[zofz]

can anyone tell me if this software
1. can measure the size of the keepout layer like cam350?
2. can automatically find and output the width of the smallest via, narrowest trace/space?

Hi, there is no automatic DFM/DRC check at the moment. There are:
1. manual distance measurements,
2. netlist check
I forgot about displaying the diameter by mouse hover, I did not finish it - will be done very next version.

[Philfreeze]

I am impressed, this looks gorgeous and it is free. Well done OP. 

[Rutger]

Nice job, I like it, it worked with some Altium generated gerber files. 

[Iwanushka]

zofz,

Very impressive work you have done, this project saved my life (well at least countless hours trying to trace the board and check/compare footprints, component orientation, etc), was working on a project that was made by a very good programmer, but as we know most programmers assume that you "know all", and in the end I had somewhat broken bom, pdf with schematics and gerbers with poor silkscreen with no outlines for component orientation.

It would be very nice if you will have free time and of course if it's possible to link Altium generated schematic PDFs to gerber viewer, so you can click on part in pdf and it shows on which two pads you need to solder the part when you have 6x6 matrix of identical pads which has no outline to show you on which two pads to put the part

P.S. it would be nice if you could setup some donation system (maybe paypal), so the guys and gals can support your work, as we know these things consume lots of time and you need to pay your bills...

Best Regards,
Mantas.

[vzoole]

Hi,

It is a really impressive software.
And non of pricey tools have similar nice 3D capability (except Zuken CR-8000 for 100000$).

But I'm in trouble with long name files.
I couldn't recognise layers manually as you can see on the picture.

[zofz]

zofz,

Very impressive work you have done, this project saved my life (well at least countless hours trying to trace the board and check/compare footprints, component orientation, etc), was working on a project that was made by a very good programmer, but as we know most programmers assume that you "know all", and in the end I had somewhat broken bom, pdf with schematics and gerbers with poor silkscreen with no outlines for component orientation.

It would be very nice if you will have free time and of course if it's possible to link Altium generated schematic PDFs to gerber viewer, so you can click on part in pdf and it shows on which two pads you need to solder the part when you have 6x6 matrix of identical pads which has no outline to show you on which two pads to put the part

P.S. it would be nice if you could setup some donation system (maybe paypal), so the guys and gals can support your work, as we know these things consume lots of time and you need to pay your bills...

Best Regards,
Mantas.

Hi Mantas,
Thanks,
I have been already investigating the PDF "crosscheck". Back then, I found that I would need the expensive SDK. I am looking at it again, using Spy++, but my only Altium PDF does not show the designator and pin number in the popup window. Maybe I need a different print options, but my Altium try-out period is over. Can you provide me a better pdf, e.g. from one of the demo projects?

[zofz]

Hi,

It is a really impressive software.
And non of pricey tools have similar nice 3D capability (except Zuken CR-8000 for 100000$).

But I'm in trouble with long name files.
I couldn't recognise layers manually as you can see on the picture.

Hi,
It is a pity that I decided to create my own GUI instead of using windows. That was because of better performance and possibility of a different resolutions in full-screen mode, where the GDI  is disabled. I have put the issue on the buglist - I see it not for the first time. I am still not certain how much should I optimize for 3D performance. Recently there is a lot more of graphic power in the standard PC, from the other side laptops and 4K...
Somehow I will solve it - let me think.

[ElektroQuark]

Any possibility to port to Linux?

I'm in the process of migrating completely to Linux and I will really miss ZofzPCB.

[zofz]

Any possibility to port to Linux?

I'm in the process of migrating completely to Linux and I will really miss ZofzPCB.

Hi, Linux and OSX port is on the list, but it is not a priority. I know it works with Wine - a temporary solution.

[Kjelt]

Looks great zofz, will try it out soon. 
Is there a possibility to generate pictures (bitmap) of the sides of the finished pcb so you can directly put them in the SMT assistant software?:
https://www.eevblog.com/forum/manufacture/smt-assistant-software-for-handplacing-parts-free-and-awesome/msg873696/#msg873696

[ElektroQuark]

I will try Wine. Thank you.

[Bud]

Here is some feedback

I have the program crashed all the time during navigating through the file folders on the hard drive when selecting a design to open. Win 7 64-bit, 32Gb RAM, Nvidia 570. I had to move the design files to a short path location (i.e. E:\Temp) to be able to open them.

3D SpaceNavigator mouse works in the program. I think it would be convenient if an option added to lock the mouse rotation point. Say, I mouse click in the center of the board and then lock it. Then the view will always rotate around the board center. It is annoying that accidental mouse move/click reposition the rotation center and the board all of a sudden moves in an unexpected way.

On a same note, it would be useful to add a "Reset view" or "Center view" or "Home" button to reset the view. The board flew away from the view once and I could not figure out how to get it back unless re-render it in the load menu.

EDIT:  One more: you should allow the user to select where to install the program. For now it is hard coded to be installed in c:\program files. I install all my programs on a different drive, keeping C for the system.

[zofz]

I have not been seeing the GUI crash, finally I have corrected 2 bugs. Last one is related to moving mouse during double-click, after reloading directory list. My mouse driver was probably removing this. Big thanks to two users who shared logs and helped me in debugging.
That alone would make a new release. I have started table based component library - a step before STEP mechanical CAD output. Now you can see standard frame lead packages. After I have all primitives, the lib should be populated faster now.

Youtube: https://youtu.be/4tTQO3qRJ_I

[PCB.Wiz]

I have not been seeing the GUI crash, finally I have corrected 2 bugs.

Wow- This is very impressive.

I quickly tested with
https://github.com/FPGAwars/icezum/tree/master/src-kicad
and used Altium File names.

It looks 99.5% ok, with some minor issues / quirks / puzzles

* Long file names do not fit in the file-views, and there seems no way to resize those ?
* I see a strange effect, where Holes with no traces, show under hover, but all those with traces show no holes ?
  ( The holes that do appear and tag, look fine, so the drill file must have read ok)
  Looks almost deliberate, but unexpected ?
* when I enable IPC356, 3D nicely (magically!)  appears in most cases, but in a one (U6) some strange slight spin is seen ?

 There are some vias-as-parts (Via**) still to be cleaned in this test example, so the large area over TQFP144 is a 'false positive'

 Addit: I see U6 is an unusual 16 pin SO (2/6/2/6), so maybe the angle is just a fit-artifact of trying to align over that ?
It seems to have different pin-pitch on each of 2 chosen pin sides ? - so is trying to make sense of the less common footprint.

[IanJ]

Hi,

Was looking for a standalone gerber viewer to work with Circuitstudio files......this seems to work fine.

One very small issue.......on one of my boards (still under dev) the silkscreen on the underside happens to cross directly over some THP's. From the topside looking through the holes you can see the silkscreen jumping across the pad......should really be broken by the pad/hole.

Not sure I like the non-standard looking GUI dialogues but that's a minor preference thing. All in all, one of the best gerber viewers I have tried.

Ian.

[PCB.Wiz]

.....on one of my boards (still under dev) the silkscreen on the underside happens to cross directly over some THP's. From the topside looking through the holes you can see the silkscreen jumping across the pad......should really be broken by the pad/hole.

Another angle is to say that is correct - usually silkscreen is pulled back from pads, and some EDA have a option to avoid pads, (I think some do this by 'plot-white') so anything that does not avoid pads (& holes), is considered an issue that needs upstream fixing.

[wasyoungonce]

Many thanks zofz.  Nice program.  Noticed using Eagle it wanted the ".dri" file not the txt drill file.  Some parts not rendered properly but that's probably the IPC D 356 and eagle.  now I just have to read up the help files on how to use correctly.

 

[zofz]

I quickly tested with
https://github.com/FPGAwars/icezum/tree/master/src-kicad
and used Altium File names.

I will download and test. I do not see the board outline on the screen shot - it might be source of problems with solder mask.

[zofz]

.....on one of my boards (still under dev) the silkscreen on the underside happens to cross directly over some THP's. From the topside looking through the holes you can see the silkscreen jumping across the pad......should really be broken by the pad/hole.

Another angle is to say that is correct - usually silkscreen is pulled back from pads, and some EDA have a option to avoid pads, (I think some do this by 'plot-white') so anything that does not avoid pads (& holes), is considered an issue that needs upstream fixing.

I could do the subtracting (silkscreen minus solder mask), as a option. But first I need to rewrite the flattening - it takes too long time for some projects, and I do not want to make it more complicated now.

[zofz]

Many thanks zofz.  Nice program.  Noticed using Eagle it wanted the ".dri" file not the txt drill file.  Some parts not rendered properly but that's probably the IPC D 356 and eagle.  now I just have to read up the help files on how to use correctly.

 

I still need to add more components to tables, and tune up pin-pad ordering/fitting, e.g. using the above project (https://github.com/FPGAwars/icezum/tree/master/src-kicad) as a next example for testing. Also, It must be possible to overwrite the automatic guessing of components.
dri and txt is a bit of the problem because of Altium/Eagle file naming schema - I need to think about it.

[wasyoungonce]

I had a look at the IPC D 356 file on parts particularly the x,y,r sizes positions.  As you can see, a few parts were not rendered or are not right: 

Capacitors rendered too low in height;
a few T092 transistors not rendered correctly, their tops are too low like the caps); 
An IC wide SOIC16 not rendered at all; Inductor not rendered (looks like SIL pins);
JST XH 2.5mm pitch connector not rendered (base of board);
Another ZR 1.5mm pitch JST not rendered properly (near LQFP64);
Crystal HC49S not rendered correctly;
wire pads not rendered correctly (look like pins) (VIAs ok);
Image sensor ICX453AQ (large device) not rendered properly, should be on bottom "16" layer.

Is there a way I can fix these issue?   I have played with Eagle 3D and POV Ray and made my own parts before.  But, that might give a nice image, but it's just eye candy, it hasn't the in depth analysis and details your program has! 

Don't worry about the part off the board, that's just me!

[zofz]

Wow- This is very impressive.
I quickly tested with
https://github.com/FPGAwars/icezum/tree/master/src-kicad
and used Altium File names.

It looks 99.5% ok, with some minor issues / quirks / puzzles

* Long file names do not fit in the file-views, and there seems no way to resize those ?
* I see a strange effect, where Holes with no traces, show under hover, but all those with traces show no holes ?
  ( The holes that do appear and tag, look fine, so the drill file must have read ok)
  Looks almost deliberate, but unexpected ?
* when I enable IPC356, 3D nicely (magically!)  appears in most cases, but in a one (U6) some strange slight spin is seen ?

 There are some vias-as-parts (Via**) still to be cleaned in this test example, so the large area over TQFP144 is a 'false positive'

 Addit: I see U6 is an unusual 16 pin SO (2/6/2/6), so maybe the angle is just a fit-artifact of trying to align over that ?
It seems to have different pin-pitch on each of 2 chosen pin sides ? - so is trying to make sense of the less common footprint.

Finally I had a moment to invastigate it a bit.
1. Board Outline file was assumed to be .gbr - it looks that it should be .gm1  - I have changed it by hand or should that be a rule?
2. KiCad generated plated and not plated drill files. Both files should be plated. I am not drilling thru the top/btm copper in a case of not plated holes, assuming the copper is not there. This is why the holes was not visible from top/bottom.
3. Many components are not correctly represented.
3.1 QFP table needs update - maybe the fpga have a bit different dimensions.
3.2 The non-standard QFP should be represented by pad-extruded-universal-type, it is represented by strange SO. - this clearly is my bug.

link to gerbers + config file (0.5MB)https://www.zofzpcb.com/bugpic/icezum_jul27.zip

link to rendered board file (2.5MB)https://www.zofzpcb.com/bugpic/icezum_jul27-rendered.7z

[zofz]

I had a look at the IPC D 356 file on parts particularly the x,y,r sizes positions.  As you can see, a few parts were not rendered or are not right: 

Capacitors rendered too low in height;
a few T092 transistors not rendered correctly, their tops are too low like the caps); 
An IC wide SOIC16 not rendered at all; Inductor not rendered (looks like SIL pins);
JST XH 2.5mm pitch connector not rendered (base of board);
Another ZR 1.5mm pitch JST not rendered properly (near LQFP64);
Crystal HC49S not rendered correctly;
wire pads not rendered correctly (look like pins) (VIAs ok);
Image sensor ICX453AQ (large device) not rendered properly, should be on bottom "16" layer.

Is there a way I can fix these issue?   I have played with Eagle 3D and POV Ray and made my own parts before.  But, that might give a nice image, but it's just eye candy, it hasn't the in depth analysis and details your program has! 

Don't worry about the part off the board, that's just me!

The only information i have from ipc356 is:
pad/hole x,y, pad size x,y, net-name, component designator.
So I can combine pads to form components and get a little clue what this might be: R,L,C,Q,U,J... So obviously I have no clue what is the height of the electrolytic cap.

My first step was to display a kind of extruded pads, then adding component body to it. This is allowing to e.g. highlighting a pad or a component, or point it by the mouse and identifying it on the right panel.
In this release I have been adding a table based library, including R and C (and L) 0603, 0802.., leaded 2 row and 4 row L and J-lead packages. The tables are not complete yet. So far it is possible to distinguish J from L lead, just from the footprint size.
If the table-component does not fit nicely, the program should default to the older "extruded" representation.

I am targeting STEP output, maybe as a freemium feature. So I still need to finish the tables and add another level of detail, for mechanically rich components like connector and switches - STEP model load.

In the meanwhile, I am trying to load BOM and identify columns, map components from BOM to IPC356. Unfortunately there are very fuzzy rules about component naming and component footprint naming. The BOM file load is already implemented, but it is only used to display component info on the right panel. Not for selecting the 3D shapes.

When BOM file read is working correctly, I can use the information, maybe checking by an Internet distributor website, what are the actual capacitor sizes, ceramic and electrolytic. This information is generally not present in a CAD PCB project, I need to (re)construct it by other means, asking the user for it, in the last instance. (Now you can hide or swap THT to another side, by a right mouse click menu)

Thanks for showing me what components I need to take care of next, and showing me the bugs. I would appreciate to get Gerbers, ipc356 and BOM, if it is possible, by the nature of the project (OSH vs. commercial).
Btw, the board outline is probably not identified correctly, as I see on the picture.

[wasyoungonce]

zofz...many thanks here are the gerbers, IPC D 356  and BOM.  Zipped.

I tried some editing of the IPC file...it didn't change things I wanted. 

.....Now you can hide or swap THT to another side, by a right mouse click menu...

Yes noticed this.  This helped on the image sensor ICX453AQ.  Which is a 34 pin (extra) wide DIP.  These are not common IC packages, had to make my own, so no tables will match it.  It was rendered on the top...I clicked it to the bottom.  Damn excellent feature.

Brendan

[PCB.Wiz]

Great - That's looking  improved

1. Board Outline file was assumed to be .gbr - it looks that it should be .gm1  - I have changed it by hand or should that be a rule?

KiCad usually puts Board outline on layer Edge.Cuts
I applied the Altium naming, as that seemed to import better, so I guess that maps Edge.Cuts to some Gerber name.

2. KiCad generated plated and not plated drill files. Both files should be plated. I am not drilling thru the top/btm copper in a case of not plated holes, assuming the copper is not there. This is why the holes was not visible from top/bottom.

I'm not following this exactly ?
I would expect all holes to appear in the viewer, and if there is some means to show plated/non plated that is nice.
Even just a hover-check would be ok, but a copper/fibreglass type colour render for plated/npth would be cool...

ie a hole should not be discarded or not shown in a viewer.

In the test I did,  it looked like the non-trace-connected holes did render as expected.

[PCB.Wiz]

...... So obviously I have no clue what is the height of the electrolytic cap.
...
In this release I have been adding a table based library, including R and C (and L) 0603, 0802
..
In the meanwhile, I am trying to load BOM and identify columns, map components from BOM to IPC356. Unfortunately there are very fuzzy rules about component naming and component footprint naming.

Tables and BOM mapping can give good results, but are of course more work.

Some simpler means to communicate height is needed.. I did see someone mention a nifty trick a while back, of using the Line width to encode the Height.

I just tried this in KiCad, and it saves and Gerber plots to 6 decimals in mm.

That allows line widths to .01 mm and gives up to 4 more digits for height, which could be (fixed point) any  of 9.999mm or 99.99mm or 999.9mm
Pick one - perhaps 99.99mm, covers reasonable heights, and anything > 100mm can always use a 3D table, and 99.99 tolerates 5 decimal digit mm gerber files as 99.9mm . (not all PCB products can plot to 6 decimals in mm)

This could give a simple user-3D-option, whereby they can just edit their library, and not need any more associations at all.

KiCad can currently create and plot footprint info to these non copper layers

PFR_Widths-F.Fab.gbr
PFR_Widths-F.SilkS.gto
PFR_Widths-F.CrtYd.gbr
PFR_Widths-B.Fab.gbr
PFR_Widths-B.SilkS.gto
PFR_Widths-B.CrtYd.gbr

Q: Is there enough info in the IPC356 and gerber files to relate outline info to a component ?  My guess is no ?

I'm wondering about the best way to extrude here...

I see Kicad can remove Silkscreen over Pads, which it does by a simple dual plot process in one file
 first Outlines at %LPD*%  (Plot Dark),
 then Pads(mask) at %LPC*% (Plot Clear) to remove any silk outline info within the pad regions

That could allow an outline on Silk layer, (safely removed over pads), but the pre-removal outline is fraction-scaled-extruded to give height.


User would nominate the Gerber file containing the (fractional encoded) height info, and the rest is simple software ?

[zofz]

Great - That's looking  improved

1. Board Outline file was assumed to be .gbr - it looks that it should be .gm1  - I have changed it by hand or should that be a rule?

KiCad usually puts Board outline on layer Edge.Cuts
I applied the Altium naming, as that seemed to import better, so I guess that maps Edge.Cuts to some Gerber name.

There are so many options or styles. Maybe I should read the file description file for the major packages - of course the format (or rather layout) is temporary - not too stable, or, perform more testing...
Note: you are free to modify "%APPDATA%\ZofzPCB\CAM_Load_Rules.txt - If you then send it to me, it will be beneficial for the community and the next update will not overwrite your changes.

2. KiCad generated plated and not plated drill files. Both files should be plated. I am not drilling thru the top/btm copper in a case of not plated holes, assuming the copper is not there. This is why the holes was not visible from top/bottom.

I'm not following this exactly ?
I would expect all holes to appear in the viewer, and if there is some means to show plated/non plated that is nice.
Even just a hover-check would be ok, but a copper/fibreglass type colour render for plated/npth would be cool...

ie a hole should not be discarded or not shown in a viewer.

In the test I did,  it looked like the non-trace-connected holes did render as expected.

Yes, you are right - that is a bug. (Now on BugList.)
Note - the non-plated holes are there, if you look inside or strip one copper layer - they are just covered by non-drilled copper. And this have to be changed. By the way - it is possible to assign different colors to plated and to non-plated holes.
Adding metallic and FR4 reflection http://www.rastertek.com/dx11tut10.html would be the best.
The plated/non-plated have influence on the netlist checking.

[zofz]

...... So obviously I have no clue what is the height of the electrolytic cap.
...
In this release I have been adding a table based library, including R and C (and L) 0603, 0802
..
In the meanwhile, I am trying to load BOM and identify columns, map components from BOM to IPC356. Unfortunately there are very fuzzy rules about component naming and component footprint naming.

Tables and BOM mapping can give good results, but are of course more work.

Some simpler means to communicate height is needed.. I did see someone mention a nifty trick a while back, of using the Line width to encode the Height.

I just tried this in KiCad, and it saves and Gerber plots to 6 decimals in mm.

That allows line widths to .01 mm and gives up to 4 more digits for height, which could be (fixed point) any  of 9.999mm or 99.99mm or 999.9mm
Pick one - perhaps 99.99mm, covers reasonable heights, and anything > 100mm can always use a 3D table, and 99.99 tolerates 5 decimal digit mm gerber files as 99.9mm . (not all PCB products can plot to 6 decimals in mm)

This could give a simple user-3D-option, whereby they can just edit their library, and not need any more associations at all.

KiCad can currently create and plot footprint info to these non copper layers

PFR_Widths-F.Fab.gbr
PFR_Widths-F.SilkS.gto
PFR_Widths-F.CrtYd.gbr
PFR_Widths-B.Fab.gbr
PFR_Widths-B.SilkS.gto
PFR_Widths-B.CrtYd.gbr

Q: Is there enough info in the IPC356 and gerber files to relate outline info to a component ?  My guess is no ?

I'm wondering about the best way to extrude here...

I see Kicad can remove Silkscreen over Pads, which it does by a simple dual plot process in one file
 first Outlines at %LPD*%  (Plot Dark),
 then Pads(mask) at %LPC*% (Plot Clear) to remove any silk outline info within the pad regions

That could allow an outline on Silk layer, (safely removed over pads), but the pre-removal outline is fraction-scaled-extruded to give height.


User would nominate the Gerber file containing the (fractional encoded) height info, and the rest is simple software ?

Maybe easier is to add a column to the BOM file? There should be a number of universal fields in the component description in any CAD package.
However, using a reference to a component distributor index gives more options. It is also beneficial to the assembly shop. Also, eg. the immediate price calculation, auto-loading of 3D models,  DFM tests...
Farnel have API for their database queries. Generally it is possible to parse any distributor web page - the information there is somehow systematic - they need to be indexed by Google, to some extend...
I have been making calculations of such index file size - it is not soo big, if a proper compression-schema (dictionary tree) is used. That is probably easier to download the whole index once per month or so, then wait for the website to answer, for each part.

[PCB.Wiz]

Maybe easier is to add a column to the BOM file? There should be a number of universal fields in the component description in any CAD package....

Yes, I agree a BOM extension is useful, but BOMs can get complex, and they are not always PCB-Centric.
Some are controlled from the SCH side, and others are run by SpreadSheet/DataBase managers... so getting the information into the BOM, can involve many steps and turf arguments....

My suggestion was not meant to displace BOM, just to give a very simple means to 'sneak' Height info into standard Gerber Files.
It is not as 'clever' as full mapping, but it is simple to implement for the user, and I think does not need too much software inside a viewer ?

I'll check other PCB sw for Gerber precision support. KiCad looks very good here, with 6 decimals in mm.
 
Addit:
KiCad defaults to this useful 1 um precision.
%FSLAX46Y46*%
G04 Gerber Fmt 4.6, Leading zero omitted, Abs format (unit mm)*

Mentor's PADS has some strange historic limit of 8 digits in Gerber, plus it internally stores to only 5 decimal digits-mm, so it can only give
%FSLAX35Y35*%
ie 3.5, which is still enough to export PCBs of 999.99mm to 99.9mm of suffix-height precision, using the 3.5 format.

I would propose that mm units be the default for suffix-height.
%MOMM*%

[zofz]

Maybe easier is to add a column to the BOM file? There should be a number of universal fields in the component description in any CAD package....

Yes, I agree a BOM extension is useful, but BOMs can get complex, and they are not always PCB-Centric.
Some are controlled from the SCH side, and others are run by SpreadSheet/DataBase managers... so getting the information into the BOM, can involve many steps and turf arguments....

My suggestion was not meant to displace BOM, just to give a very simple means to 'sneak' Height info into standard Gerber Files.
It is not as 'clever' as full mapping, but it is simple to implement for the user, and I think does not need too much software inside a viewer ?

I'll check other PCB sw for Gerber precision support. KiCad looks very good here, with 6 decimals in mm.
 
Addit:
KiCad defaults to this useful 1 um precision.
%FSLAX46Y46*%
G04 Gerber Fmt 4.6, Leading zero omitted, Abs format (unit mm)*

Mentor's PADS has some strange historic limit of 8 digits in Gerber, plus it internally stores to only 5 decimal digits-mm, so it can only give
%FSLAX35Y35*%
ie 3.5, which is still enough to export PCBs of 999.99mm to 99.9mm of suffix-height precision, using the 3.5 format.

I would propose that mm units be the default for suffix-height.
%MOMM*%

Yes, the solution is technically possible. But I believe this feature will be rarely used, especially after the final solution is implemented. The height is not the only problem. See attached picture, also with capacitors. I need to solve the components dimensions and shapes input, in more universal way.
Take example of outline drawing - quite simple rules, but often there is a problem - there are many concepts, e.g. draw it on mechanical or on keep-out.
The structure of my setup file (.camset) is xml. I am already storing there some component settings. So if designer wants to play with different parameters, the simple way would be: Text-edit for start - more automatic and graphical edit later.
I still need to gain some experience with different BOM files.
It would be great to gain access to some repository of 3D models, without a need of loading each component by hand. I could index models my own way (by footprint fitness) so it is not much work to get a proper view..., so I need to learn STEP.
 

[zofz]

Right-click menu for component model and parameters (like elcap height) - I am still working on it. I hope to release this in couple of weeks.

[S13]

Very impressed with this Gerber Viewer! 

Thumbs up from me, and i will certainly give it a try 

[zofz]

I have published a test version featuring component shape adjustments. The settings are stored in .camset and .zofzproj files.



short youtube video:

download: https://www.zofzpcb.com/Gerber-Viewer-Download.html look for "Current Build, Pre-Alpha".
After installation, enable the "ParamTables" option in Components / Models License menu.

[calli]

I was looking for a 3D Gerber View and found this.

I am quite new to this all, using Easy EDA and the Gerbers from them will let your viewer error on

%FSLAX24Y24*%
or
G90*

Am *I* doing something wrong or is it the Gerber file?

Best,
Carsten

[zofz]

I was looking for a 3D Gerber View and found this.

I am quite new to this all, using Easy EDA and the Gerbers from them will let your viewer error on

%FSLAX24Y24*%
or
G90*

Am *I* doing something wrong or is it the Gerber file?

Best,
Carsten

This are OK. can you send me your gerbers? let me see this - bug@zofzpcb.com

[zofz]

I was looking for a 3D Gerber View and found this.

I am quite new to this all, using Easy EDA and the Gerbers from them will let your viewer error on

%FSLAX24Y24*%
or
G90*

Am *I* doing something wrong or is it the Gerber file?

Best,
Carsten

Hi Carsten,
thanks for the Gerbers - I found the problem.
It is an extra space between '*' and '%FSLAX24Y24*%' just after the star in the previous line. Some time ago I have removed all spaces in pre-processing, what was just a hot fix. That was not the greatest move, since spaces are actually allowed, but only in the comments (like G04). Now, I have it done 'the right way' - just accepting stray spaces, but, as it shows, not in all conditions.
I have fixed this already, I will publish the hot-fix version shortly (just looking to solve one more bug).
If you like to test it before the release, just remove the space from all your gerbers, last header comment line, after the star.

[calli]

Thanks!

Works now perfect with Easy EDA Gerbers.

Carsten

[xtlc]

Hello zofz

I looked at your project and I sometimes follow this blog, so I thought I maybe can ask here: I sometimes put parts on pcbs, that are not in your database - for example I use many spring contacts and so on - usually I only have STP files for 3d data. Is there any way I can import them into the ZofzPCB 3D Gerber Viewer?

[zofz]

Hello Xtlc,
I have the documentation for STEP ap242 and I am working on a whole PCB + components export. It is simpler then component import, so it makes sense to start from this side. And I have already promised the export. About the import - what is a pitty, the step ap214/203 does not provide higher level information, e.g. about contacts. With my own library, I can do automatic fit and (later) provide footprint/component fit information (DFM). In the meanwhile, I am adding couple more of components, this time in a very universal parametric form - see pictures.

[xtlc]

Thanks for your reply.

Can I suggest to have a ZIF connector? Maybe for starters just length, height, width and pins to adjust manually?

[zofz]

ZIF connector is a quite reasonable choice, you mean the tape connector, of course. And the SMD barrel power, as I already have the body.  Probably in the next cycle, as I am finishing the update right now.

[xtlc]

I am thinking about a variety of these:



Also I'd love to see them in here (as they are only defined by their WxHxD and number of pins and rows of pins. Working height and so on is just an extra not really important for the mechanics, as you can alter it by altering the H(eight) of the part:

[zofz]

  Spring contacts - OK, I can build it out of existing primitives (vertical cylinders).

[zofz]

I have fixed a .zofzproj file bug and going with the flow, I have added encryption and LZMA compression to the file format. The file is a binary, private, annotated mesh. - a single file containing the whole project.
I did it, because I want to pass the component generator allowance (license) to the whoever like to open this file, in a view only mode.
Scenarios:

• PCB designer sends his project to a client, client does not need to have a license to see the components.
• Show a PCB based product on the Internet, without publishing the production files.
• Something like PDF, in a sense that browser can open the link in a similar fashion.

In the "View Only" mode, "Files" menu will be removed, Stackup will be read-only, etc. I am thinking about making it hard to produce the physical PCB, out of the view file. I am continuing with the following options:

• Allow Orthogonal FOV
• Allow Screenshot
• Allow Netlist Names Display/Browse
• Allow Component Names Display/Browse

Is there anything else, you would like me to add or block, in the View-Only mode?
BTW, the zofzproj file size have changed from 32M to 5.5M, for the demo1 PCB, making it more convenient for email or download.
What do you think about the idea?

[xtlc]

Hi ... any updates?

[zofz]

Here is the update.

• After publishing the version 1.0.5, i have fixed immediately visible, small bugs, mysteriously appearing just after the release.
• I was trying to promote the new feature of the read-only free viewing of premium saved mesh files - it looks like almost in vain.
• It is about time to clean the backlog. I took one hard old bug, I am deeply in - almost done.
• I look forward to do the components, we talked about - I will really enjoy modeling it.
• I just found out that someone have published a zofzpcb crack - from the youtube screen capture I can see he really dig into the machine code. He was also complaining on me, but i do not understand Greek. I am confused.
• February was a great month, meaning number of licenses sold. The numbers are not going to keep, unfortunately. But it have covered the direct expenses, like STEP AP242 documentation, code signing certificate (it is needed), hosting, and a luxury indemnification insurance I tough I will need, last year.

[zofz]

I am here to see my work plan. The point 3 is done.



This is my test bench screenshot, the effect I was debugging for couple of last months - transparency gradient - the hollow display.
Too bad, I just have couple of hours per week for the project. 
Finally, time for a pleasure of modeling more components

[PlainName]

I just found this - a stunning piece of work!

Just a small problem at the moment - the menu stuff is semi-transparent background, and with the white text I find it very hard indeed to read. Could there be an option to make the menu background solid, or at least less transparent? Ideally, follow the system setting, but I guess you're not keen on standard GUI look and feel

[xtlc]

Yeah ... the custom GUI is probably the biggest flaw in this amazing piece of software

[zofz]

I needed to make a vertical sheet metal object, including spiting and thickens changes. This will be for FFC/PFC, board-2-wire connectors, etc. Finally, the modeling time!

[zofz]

now what? how is this FFC build?
https://youtu.be/2_5Mih9Yy98

[zofz]

OK, I could not think of an abstract enough shape model for FFC connector, I have passed the problem to the user. Here is the simple "body" editor (not a pin editor, this will come later).
I will make it available for test very soon.

[zofz]

Hi,
Please check the beta version https://www.zofzpcb.com/Download/ZofzPCBtest.exe
features:

• body editor - pin editor is still to be implemented
• undo/redo
• RGB/HSV color picker
• save in camset and in zofzproj file
• highlight selected primitive, checkbox - display only the edited part

If you like to buy the license, for only 10% of the price, please use the code "eevblog90" - thanks for following the topic.
The code is active over the weekend.

[GeorgeOfTheJungle]

  Impressive! 

[free_electron]

idea's :

- save as step ? ap214 if possible ?
- copper area extraction ? hover or click on track/polygon and it gives you square mm of copper and total length ( first pad to last pad . in case of branch : to branch point)
- realtime size/width view ? point to a spot and it shows trace width at that position for the currently active layer. if pointed object is a pad : length and width and possible hole size.
- object browser : shows all objects in design in tabular format. table allows filtering. for example : object type : pad , holesize 0.8mm : highlight all. object type trace ,width 6mil , via , pad size 0.5mm.

this thing has evolved quite a bit .. good job !

working on altium script to do crossprobing

[zofz]

Thank you,
I have just published the hotfix - bugs I saw directly after the big release. That means now it is STEP output, as free_electron suggests. I have got myself the ISO-242 (214 is included) and that is 600MB of html text. Awful. But step by step I am starting to understand this. Export should be easy.
I am also geting requests for ipc2581 and, recently ODB++.
To close the requests list, also the STEP input, for mechanically critical components.

free_electron - if you need any help or a specific IPC, let me know.
the latest video: https://youtu.be/-2ot6YFyJWQ - body builder in action 

[dimbmw]

Tried the software. Liked it!

I think I’ve noticed a bug though. I’ve seen how after net highlight the via would turn 90 degrees (the hole axis). Didn’t do a screenshot, sorry. But that looked weird.

Would be also great to have the net just change color when highlight, with no blinking.

Also I am only reviewing the layouts, and gerber files are being sent to me by a remote contractor, so components do not show when I import, i guess I am missing some files or maybe its because I am using a free version. Is there a way for a software to guess the components by footprints and populate the board? That would be awesome.

[zofz]

Hi Dimbmw,
Thanks,
1. There is a keyboard shortcut "Ctrl-N" to circle via 3 ways of displaying the selection. The second mode exposes the selected connection, showing it "on top" of other elements, normally covering the selected connection. It looks weird. Maybe you have selected this, pressing Ctrl-N instead of "N" ? See https://www.zofzpcb.com/help.html#LabM.2
2. There would be a way to display a single color selection, but it needs more clicks. It would make sense when using the natural color view.

• Go to View/Color-Picker, move the top slider to the left
• Select "Edit Layer Type Color" radio button, select "Copper" on the dropdown just below it.
• The "Net-ID" color slider should appear above H,S,V sliders. Move it to the right.
• Press Set All Net Colors: to Copper button. Now the view should be like natural, again.
• Now, you will be able to use "N" to select a single connection and set this connection color using sliders, one by one if you like.

I will think about making a one more display mode, later on.

3. Yes, that would be a great feature to display the components without loading the IPC-356 bare board test point file (also called "pcb netlist"). This may be easy to do, by using GerberX2 annotations - very similar concept to ipc356. This I have on my task list. But the greatest thing would be to do it from the pure image of pads and silkscreen. I would be happy to have time for this task.

[zofz]

Update on STEP export:
There is a great 3D library - Open-Cascade. I am about half of way implementing the export, it seems.
Lucky me - I can use Solidworks for debugging,  See the picture

[free_electron]

Great !. I am after exporting the copper to step (including correct copper thickness : keep in mind that the copper in the vias is less than the copper in the layers. so we must be able to specify base copper thickness + plating thickness. We need to be able to set this per layer to use laser vias or plugged vias.

[zofz]

Many questions: Do we need internal layers? The step file grows substantially. (is anyone going to use this for thermal simulation?)
Where/what is the diameter of the micro-via? The micro-via is v-shaped, not cylindrical. So far, I am using the exit diameter.
Usually the manufacturer declares that the end (result) diameter of a drill (after metalization) is to be specified, but my experience is that the correction is sometimes forgotten. And the correction is not applied to the vias (drills below some diameter, right?

[zofz]

I have broken the ice, but still the most complex primitives are to be converted.

[olkipukki]

I have broken the ice, but still the most complex primitives are to be converted.

What about silkscreens?
Are these in scope?

[free_electron]

I have broken the ice, but still the most complex primitives are to be converted.

excellent work !

[zofz]

I have broken the ice, but still the most complex primitives are to be converted.

What about silkscreens?
Are these in scope?

I have made checkboxes for the external copper and silkscreen. I do not know if anything else makes sense.
If it is exported for the thermal simulation, then everything would be needed, but it will drive people to problems, because of the file size, memory and time used. So, only the copper and silkscreen for this version.

[E-Design]

I have broken the ice, but still the most complex primitives are to be converted.

What about silkscreens?
Are these in scope?

I have made checkboxes for the external copper and silkscreen. I do not know if anything else makes sense.
If it is exported for the thermal simulation, then everything would be needed, but it will drive people to problems, because of the file size, memory and time used. So, only the copper and silkscreen for this version.

Great work! Which copper features will not be included in STEP export? This has good application for thermal simulation. I think people are already used to large file sizes and for systems doing thermal sim, memory is not an issue. I would suggest you offer the feature and the users can decide if the files are too unmanageable.
Again, great job..

[olkipukki]

I have made checkboxes for the external copper and silkscreen. I do not know if anything else makes sense.
If it is exported for the thermal simulation, then everything would be needed, but it will drive people to problems, because of the file size, memory and time used. So, only the copper and silkscreen for this version.

That's great!
Looks like there is option do to a proper STEP export and, as example, 3D rendering later.
When are you planning to release this?

Don't worry too much, people who want to do a thermal simulation, shouldn't have any issues with size, memory and CPU power 


 

[zofz]

Feature freeze. I will do some debugging of the most obvious or critical problems I already see. Then I have to pack a dozen of Open Cascade dlls and I can publish the beta version. It was much more guessing than I would wish. But at least, i know what to google now 
The 32-bit nature of the current code is the limit of the memory hungry Open Cascade library. The board on the picture takes 1G to do the export  . Sooner or later I have to switch to 64bit.

[emsnickw]

I would love to see a browser-based version of this. Very cool.

[zofz]

I would love to see a browser-based version of this. Very cool.

check out https://www.altium.com/viewer/ design and gerber viewer, 2D and 3D

[Marcel_X]

I have broken the ice, but still the most complex primitives are to be converted.

What about silkscreens?
Are these in scope?

I have made checkboxes for the external copper and silkscreen. I do not know if anything else makes sense.
If it is exported for the thermal simulation, then everything would be needed, but it will drive people to problems, because of the file size, memory and time used. So, only the copper and silkscreen for this version.

Fantastic work! I've been using the free version of ZofzPCB for a few years now and it has improved greatly over time.
When I read STEP export was implemented, I immediately bought a license. In the past I had to export my design as a DXF, read it back into Fusion 360 and extrude the board outline to have at least a 3D model of the board itself.

But it would be nice to be able to set the thickness of the PCB and copper layers in the Export dialog box. It seems that the PCB thickness by default is now 1.355mm and the copper layer thickness is 35um. I can manually change these values in Fusion 360 by extruding the board and copper layers, but it would be nice as an option in ZofzPCB.
And maybe an option to export the soldermask as well. Using the same colors as chosen in the Color Picker or Color Preset menus?

Also, I cannot find the checkbox for the silkscreen... Have I missed anything?

Anyway, great work! Thanks!

[zofz]

Hi Marcel_X,
Thank you.

The thickness of the PCB volume is the sum of everything what is between the top and bottom copper, in the stackup setup.
Also the copper thickness is taken from the stackup setup.
But, the board and the copper color is constant. I was a bit afraid about the core through the solder mask color vs core color only, I just set a constant value. I could be more innovative here and use transparency multiplication, maybe later.

Electronic projects are more complex then what is typically rendered by the CAD programs. The underlaying library (Open Cascade) eats a lot of RAM. The limit is 2GB, as the ZofzPCB is 32-bit program. That was far from being a problem before, but now it is a serious limitation. For example the DEMO 1 will not convert to STEP, if all options are enabled (default). That justifies my decision of not including other layers into the export.

My plan is to expel the feature into a separate 64-bit module ASAP. It is faster, safer and more efficient then convert the whole thing to 64 bit. Also, it will cover the fact of substantial memory leak during saving the STEP, as the module will unload after the job is done. I would then permit myself to add other layers to the options.

Still some questions: semi-transparency in STEP, should I try to bulge the external layers on the underlaying copper or just position it above?

In the meanwhile, my try on iPad, using Fusion 360: https://youtu.be/K4Ly607Xv3s

[i_like_sparks]

Just tried this. Quite impressive, but please please please use the OS functions for the file open & dialog boxes instead of rolling your own. The OS file open dialog is there for a reason so users can build muscle memory. For example, your confirmation dialogs all have the "Yes" button on the right side. In Windows, the right side is always the "No" or "Cancel" button.

And do away with the color gradients and custom dialog colors. It just makes software look amateurish, no professional software does this nowadays.

[PlainName]

please please please use the OS functions for the file open & dialog boxe

Twenty extra votes for this. I use Listary, which can auto-populate file dialogs amongst other things. Most apps I do a file open, activate Listary, there I am in the project structure in the gerber folder. With roll-your-own dialogs I'm forever traversing trees many many levels deep, thinking bad thoughts about wheel re-invention. Not helped that it's difficult to read the stuff in the dialog anyway, and I always click the wrong anonymous blob icon.

This is a great app, but I hate using it a lot of the time

[zofz]

There are 2 main problems 1. flattening stall bug, 2. GUI
I just started to work on #1. I have promissed full stackup STEP and some BOM file functionality, related to diferent population options.
In 2018 I have made an atempt, to replace the GUI, using ribbon and drag and drop for composing the stackup.

if you are intersted why the hell, I started this incompatible GUI: https://www.zofzpcb.com/FAQ.html#nonGDIgui
and you can download half made program: https://www.zofzpcb.com/Download/Ribbon.exe
But there were more important things to do, like componetnts models and STEP export - I am trying to find a way to convert to full time, like a snail probing different directions.
But I can get rid of transpariences and swap yes/no buttons - no problem.

[PlainName]

Gotta say that the ribbon looks immensely more usable than the hard-to-read purple on  blue/red stuff, so gets my vote

I appreciate that early decisions which have to be made can act like a ball and chain later, and it gets harder to change things the longer they're around. Indeed, sometimes even starting again from scratch with 20/20 hindsight doesn't work

[zofz]

Please use the poll: http://www.rkursem.com/poll/view.php?id=560a61933da77818a

[PlainName]

Done 

[nigelwright7557]

free software is pretty much the only thing that is given away.
i dont see scopes etc being given away.
on the one hand great for software users but bad for business.
i sell pcbcad software and have done for 28 years.
i used to do ok but competition has pretty much killed it so now no incentive to take it to the next stage.
innovation killed.

think how much better your software would be if it was funded properly?
take on more programmers to increase productivity.

[PlainName]

i dont see scopes etc being given away.

Hardware designs are. Clearly, you can't give away physical stuff because each single instance costs you. Although that hasn't stopped people giving actual hardware away. However, the designs and everything that don't have a per-instance cost are given away.

think how much better your software would be if it was funded properly?
take on more programmers to increase productivity.

Not quite that simple. You might have a significant number of users for your free or low-cost product, but double the price and watch most of them disappear. Where is the funding going to come from for the new mouths you now have to feed? Maybe bumping up the price of the product to compensate, and now you have an even more niche clientele.

There are numerous instances of products that had a loyal user-base, who would pay upgrade fees as a matter of course because without thinking about it, and then either the company or product got bloated by the success (with the price to match) and suddenly the upgrades needed thinking about, and that's the loyal inertia-driven income stream gone.

[nigelwright7557]

i think my main point was giving stuff away wont make you rich.
Easy-PC gave away one of their lesser pcb design packages and went on to sell the new version for £379 a go and did ok.
this killed off a lot of cheaper packages.
Kicad is now the main free package i have to compete with.
i agree about bloatware as Easypc forum is full of people complaining about bugs.

[nigelwright7557]

Not quite that simple. You might have a significant number of users for your free or low-cost product, but double the price and watch most of them disappear. Where is the funding going to come from for the new mouths you now have to feed? Maybe bumping up the price of the product to compensate, and now you have an even more niche clientele.

is it better to sell 100 with £1 profit or sell 1 with £100 profit?
with 100 times more customers there is more chance of attracting people who have problems.
i spend half my life hand holding because people dont understand the basics of pcb design.
some people just wont spend money, you would be gobsmacked how many customers i have talked to still on Win XP

[PlainName]

Swings and roundabouts. On the face of it, supporting 1 customer instead of 100 looks pretty good, but you're stuffed if that one customer decides he's no longer interested. Lost 20 of the 100 and there's probably another 30 waiting to tie you down in silly support calls

[E-Design]

i think my main point was giving stuff away wont make you rich.
Easy-PC gave away one of their lesser pcb design packages and went on to sell the new version for £379 a go and did ok.
this killed off a lot of cheaper packages.
Kicad is now the main free package i have to compete with.
i agree about bloatware as Easypc forum is full of people complaining about bugs.

Getting rich / making money isnt always the point. If that was your point, I think you might be in the wrong thread.
If you would like to offer software as a business there is nothing wrong with that, have at it.
Competing with the free stuff makes it better for the users. Because now, you have to offer something that's worth paying for.
Those who cant or wont compete, either improve their offerings-- or die away.. it it the natural law of things.

ZofZ is doing great things and he should keep going and keep a free offering. I for one, am thankful for his dedication.

[nigelwright7557]

Getting rich / making money isnt always the point. If that was your point, I think you might be in the wrong thread.
If you would like to offer software as a business there is nothing wrong with that, have at it.
Competing with the free stuff makes it better for the users. Because now, you have to offer something that's worth paying for.
Those who cant or wont compete, either improve their offerings-- or die away.. it it the natural law of things.

ZofZ is doing great things and he should keep going and keep a free offering. I for one, am thankful for his dedication.

with free offerings all that happens is companies see that and realise its pointless to develop software and walk away.
if i was starting out again i would avoid writing cad software like the plague.
i have found i have had to diversify into specialist hardware/software to compete.
making money is vital to fund software projects properly unless you have a day job too.

while i am impressed with his software i never use 3d viewers.
i just make sure my 2d components are correct sizes.

[Mechatrommer]

...for collision detection, before post-production disaster... today in order to compete, one need to be the best (better service better product better price better offering etc) otherwise they will just die like the rest...

[Quarlo Klobrigney]

First of all, thanks for the software. I had been using it on and off for a few years now. Nothing commercial, just my own PCBs. I would use it to verify other viewers that just seemed to misbehave. Yours ran without issue as a visual confirmation. I downloaded the latest version and started to play around with which features are free and which are not. No problem with licensing some extras. Well I was able to right click on the component and do adjustments to shape, size etc. Now when I right click on the component, I cannot adjust anything as the "Body Builder" menu option is gone. Is there a limitation as to how many times I can use that function? I've used it for about a day, See the attached "Modify" photo. Thanks.

Quote from: zofz on 2017-02-26, 23:41:03

Right-click menu for component model and parameters (like elcap height) - I am still working on it. I hope to release this in couple of weeks.

[zofz]

First of all, thanks for the software. I had been using it on and off for a few years now. Nothing commercial, just my own PCBs. I would use it to verify other viewers that just seemed to misbehave. Yours ran without issue as a visual confirmation. I downloaded the latest version and started to play around with which features are free and which are not. No problem with licensing some extras. Well I was able to right click on the component and do adjustments to shape, size etc. Now when I right click on the component, I cannot adjust anything as the "Body Builder" menu option is gone. Is there a limitation as to how many times I can use that function? I've used it for about a day, See the attached "Modify" photo. Thanks.

Quote from: zofz on 2017-02-26, 23:41:03

Right-click menu for component model and parameters (like elcap height) - I am still working on it. I hope to release this in couple of weeks.

It looks like the "Parametric" model generator is disabled. It could be caused by the end of license validity, as the modeler is a "premium" feature. Or it can be caused by configuration - see picture.
There is a promo-code: EEVBlog60 valid to the end of weekend, 60% reduction. 

[Quarlo Klobrigney]

 I downloaded the free version. So the real answer is that it was working and has a limited time functionality? You haven't quite answered the question.

[zofz]

I downloaded the free version. So the real answer is that it was working and has a limited time functionality? You haven't quite answered the question.

The same image can operate in the premium mode and in the free mode:
There are 3 demo designs included.
The program loads one demo design, after the other, by first 3 starts.
I want the user to see the demos in a fully loaded mode, of course. So the program acts in the premium mode, whenever the demo is loaded. This includes the Parametric Modeler and the STEP file export.
This mode override ends, when you load your own design.
In case no valid license key is stored in the program, after the 3 demos are shown, the program randomly shows a nagging info. The popping up nagging message can be disabled by switching off the Parametric Modeler. Go to menu: Components / Model Generator / Extruded (free)
Or, of course, by a license key. There you can have date based, 30-day, free license per email address.

[Jay_Diddy_B]

Hi ZofZ and the group,

Does anybody know if the viewer supports blind vias? That vias that only go from layer 1 to 2 on a 4  layer board.

Many thanks!!

Regards,
Jay_Diddy_B

[zofz]

Hi ZofZ and the group,

Does anybody know if the viewer supports blind vias? That vias that only go from layer 1 to 2 on a 4  layer board.

Many thanks!!

Regards,
Jay_Diddy_B

yes.
If auto-load does not recognize the drill files from-to values in the filenames, please adjust it before rendering. If you have laser vias, you can also adjust the style and direction. All of this settings, in the Drill-Plate stackup list, before rendering.

[nigelwright7557]

Amazing graphics, very impressed.
Do I need a pcb viewer ?
No, my pcb libraries already shows the exact component outline.

[zofz]

Windows UI, Internal layers STEP, new Flattening ---> version 2.0


Download: https://www.zofzpcb.com/Gerber-Viewer-Download.html

[nigelwright7557]

Very clever software and very pretty drawings too.
However never had a use for a 3d PCB viewer.
I just make sure my library component outlines are correct in the first place.

[PlainName]

I guess that means you don't need to trouble yourself with this, then.

[sleemanj]

For somebody who never uses 3d viewers you sure do like to post a lot in this thread nigelwright7557

[zofz]

update:

A lot of bug fixes. UI and flattening/triangulation.

new features:

• marking and measurements between multi-selected objects (like two tracks) https://www.zofzpcb.com/Measurements-Table
• STEP export where objects are grouped by Net. Should be helpful for EM-FEM Simulation

There will be no hotfix/updates for a couple of months now - I have started ODB++ and a bunch of functionality related to handling multiple PCBs, like comparison and piggy-back arrangements.

I have started a Users' Forum   https://www.zofzpcb.com/forum/ - please visit, and register, of course - don't let me down!

FREE License Program for Open-Source-Hardware designers https://www.zofzpcb.com/reg/OSH-Free-License

The net-ordered STEP export image:


And the use-case:


see https://www.zofzpcb.com/Gerber-to-STEP-Export for details.

[zofz]

Hi,
long time.

Version 3 is out and fairly seasoned (3.2.1)

What is new:

• ODB++
  I kind of completed the task, the program reads Gerber, ODB++, and IPC2581 now. This is the free offering.
  
• Board revision compare, multiple PCB loading capability, allowing to show assemblies. I have decided that this will be the premium offering.
  
• DX9 updated to DX11 - a time-consuming task related to fighting the "well-known vulnerabilities".
  
• A number of small improvements, like searching sub-directories in Gerber Autoload

[Microdoser]

Interesting app, I'll have a look

[SiliconWizard]

Just for the record, I tried running it (portable version) with Wine on Linux, and it does, really, not work properly. There are odd resource problems apparently - no menu, missing strings, etc.
But the demo board appears to load fine (on its own) and the 3D viewer seems to work well and snappy. So making it work with Wine is probably not that far away. I can help with testing if you're interested.

[zofz]

Yes, I have lost the compatibility; the program has problems running on Wine. I guess I am using too many of the new Windows features in the UI. BTW, Wine is quite good when installing the software instead of using the 'portable' version.
I need to go back to Linux and Wine. In some sense, time works in my favor as the Wine improves.

And ZofzPCB works on the M1-ARM Mac! See zofzpcb forum topic

Someone also requested improvement for Linux on the forum, I will be continuing the discussion there: another zofzpcb forum topic

[Quarlo Klobrigney]

Have you tried using Bottles in Linux?
It was the only way I could install and use stubborn Windows programs.
I would post a link, but you can do the usual program installer in whatever flavour of Linux you use.

[Quarlo Klobrigney]