Author Topic: Intel to Purchase Altera?  (Read 14494 times)

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Offline German_EETopic starter

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Intel to Purchase Altera?
« on: March 27, 2015, 08:58:34 pm »
Should you find yourself in a chronically leaking boat, energy devoted to changing vessels is likely to be more productive than energy devoted to patching leaks.

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Offline photon

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #1 on: March 27, 2015, 09:15:24 pm »
Just a rumor, but an interesting one. I have also heard the rumor of Samsung buying AMD. That would give Intel some heartburn.
 

Offline calexanian

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #2 on: March 27, 2015, 10:59:08 pm »
Oh let the FPGA DSP shit storm begin.
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Offline BloodyCactus

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #3 on: March 27, 2015, 11:08:31 pm »
Just a rumor, but an interesting one. I have also heard the rumor of Samsung buying AMD. That would give Intel some heartburn.

doubt it, someone else buying AMD invalidates AMD's x86 license (as I udnerstand it), which leave what, the  ATI stuff and not much else.
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Offline photon

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #4 on: March 27, 2015, 11:38:40 pm »
Just a rumor, but an interesting one. I have also heard the rumor of Samsung buying AMD. That would give Intel some heartburn.

doubt it, someone else buying AMD invalidates AMD's x86 license (as I udnerstand it), which leave what, the  ATI stuff and not much else.
Interesting. I did not know that.
 

Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #5 on: March 27, 2015, 11:39:25 pm »
I have a vague recollection that back in the days of DIL, 5V UV eraseable parts, Intel were a second source for Altera's EP6xx PLDs (or was it the other  way round?).
ISTR these were really nice devices in their day, as they had lots of macrocells, and they were less tightly dedicated to pins than the 22V10s etc.of the day. so you could have buried logic. I think they also had a T-type flipflop mod which was handy for big counters .
 
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Offline digsys

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #6 on: March 28, 2015, 12:00:21 am »
Quote from: mikeselectricstuff
I have a vague recollection that back in the days of DIL, 5V UV eraseable parts, Intel were a second source for Altera's EP6xx PLDs (or was it the other  way round?).
Well, in OZ, I was a customer support engineer for TI, and bought their first re-badged Altera EPxxx development kit. As a developer,
I got it 50% off, only $12,000 :-) .. I finally gave it away a few WEEKS ago at EEVMartys last sale ! They were awesome chips back then.
Quote from: mikeselectricstuff
ISTR these were really nice devices in their day, as they had lots of macrocells, and they were less tightly dedicated to pins than the 22V10s etc.of the day. so you could have buried logic. I think they also had a T-type flipflop mod which was handy for big counters . 
Yup, all the above and more
« Last Edit: March 28, 2015, 02:27:31 am by digsys »
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Offline marshallh

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #7 on: March 28, 2015, 02:03:37 am »
My greatest fear is they will try to shoehorn their crappy x86 into an FPGA when it doesn't need to be there.
Intel have tried (and failed) to get some momentum going before by slapping Atoms onto fpga boards.

If you're going to turn a SoC into a space heater, at least do it properly. Netburst or GTFO!  :palm:
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Offline photon

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #8 on: March 28, 2015, 02:48:45 am »
Again, Intel buying Altera is a rumor, but if true the synergy is, as I understand it, that Intel is currently the fab for Altera's 14nm fpga. Intel obviously needs to keep it's fabs busy, if it is to prosper going forward, but does not have the experience of a TSMC as a foundy provider. Having Altera in house removes that problem.
 

Offline Alexei.Polkhanov

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #9 on: March 28, 2015, 03:38:17 am »
Pretty sad if it happens. Certainly there will be benefits but Intel is big almost monopoly already :( I naturally hate all big orgs and governments - give too much control into singe hands and they will start abusing it in most unimaginable way. Like one guy who came back from hospital, after being hit by a train, said, while trashing boiling teapot on a stove - "You have to kill them while they are still small!".
 

Offline miguelvp

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #10 on: March 28, 2015, 04:38:40 am »
Data centers are big business.
Servers with attached FPGAs to alleviate the protocol overhead is becoming the norm.
Intel has a long collaboration with Altera specially on their new Stratix 10 series that uses Intel's 14nm Tri-Gate technology.

I posted a boring video about this a while back, I'll relink it if I find it.

Anyways, it just makes sense but it's still just a rumor.

Edit: found the link:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/microcontrollers/intel-unveils-a-new-xeon-chip-with-integrated-fpga/

and the two year old almost boring video (wasn't too boring for me):



More info on the Stratix 10:
https://www.altera.com/products/fpga/stratix-series/stratix-10/overview.html
« Last Edit: March 28, 2015, 04:45:25 am by miguelvp »
 

Offline Gribo

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #11 on: March 28, 2015, 08:37:28 am »
I still have an erasable  I5180 (Altera EP1800) somewhere in my component bin..
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Offline danfo098

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Offline marshallh

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #13 on: June 01, 2015, 03:55:32 pm »
I don't see how this can end well for the users of lowend parts (us)...
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Offline miguelvp

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #14 on: June 01, 2015, 04:08:00 pm »
I don't see how this can end well for the users of lowend parts (us)...

I see the opposite. Intel needs the IP, and Altera needs the financial security. And servers need cost reduction to be competitive.

I think in CPU dedicated FPGAs are a great fit for servers as Google and Microsoft have been demonstrating.
 

Offline daqq

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #15 on: June 01, 2015, 04:37:24 pm »
Good bye anything in TQFP...
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Online tszaboo

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #16 on: June 01, 2015, 04:48:46 pm »
I don't see how this can end well for the users of lowend parts (us)...

I see the opposite. Intel needs the IP, and Altera needs the financial security. And servers need cost reduction to be competitive.

I think in CPU dedicated FPGAs are a great fit for servers as Google and Microsoft have been demonstrating.
Well but there is that
Quote
data center and Internet of Things market segments.
I think Intel has a great misunderstanding how the MCU market works, like their led blinky 256MB ram Galileo, on the other hand it is possible that people from altera will get to key positions and they will have the final saying.
Not to mention, Intel once again may produce ARM processors (A9-A57), which can be a market changes in a lot of segments.
 

Offline John_ITIC

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #17 on: June 01, 2015, 05:00:16 pm »
I have a feeling that business in the US is going down the drain. Overall, I've seen a very sluggish economy the last couple of years. Companies being sold must mean that they are not making money. If huge companies like Broadcom and Altera are being sold off, It must mean they are struggling and want to pass responsibility to someone else.

Any opinions on this?

The last time I saw this was in 2007 before the bottom fell out...
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Offline free_electron

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #18 on: June 01, 2015, 05:48:08 pm »
so they've come full circle. the first EPLD ( EPLD610 and 910) were intel designs. Altera spun those and then cut the cord with intel. the last couple of years altera had been running their silicon in intel's fabs anyway. so they've come home...
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Offline Mechanical Menace

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #19 on: June 01, 2015, 06:12:09 pm »
Any opinions on this?

There are 2 main reasons for buyouts from the buyers pov, bring competition in house or adding another income stream. A company that can't make you money (either directly or by limiting losses) isn't a viable purchase.
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Offline John_ITIC

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #20 on: June 01, 2015, 08:20:35 pm »
Any opinions on this?

There are 2 main reasons for buyouts from the buyers pov, bring competition in house or adding another income stream. A company that can't make you money (either directly or by limiting losses) isn't a viable purchase.

Yes but there's also companies that are struggling to make money, they know it but the buyer might not be fully aware of it. The buyer thinks they will do a better job and the merger goes forward. A couple of years later, the merged company is again sold to someone else, passing along the hot potato. I've seen this trend in the protocol analysis business where CATC got acquired by LeCroy, who in turn got acquired by Teledyne. Based on financials, the engineering costs in the U.S. are too high so profit per employee is not very good. Another example is the Skype Acquisition by Ebay which flopped and was then sold off.
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Offline daqq

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #21 on: June 02, 2015, 04:59:45 am »
Quote
Maybe new Xeon Phi will introduce programmable logic?

Or even more crazy, new i7 will introduce fabric?
There are such things AFAIK: http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/184828-intel-unveils-new-xeon-chip-with-integrated-fpga-touts-20x-performance-boost
Also there was an Atom core coupled to an FPGA kind of device.

Well, such things would be cool and all - it's not that that I'm worried about - Intel has a rather, well, corporate approach to everything - I get the vibe out of them that they don't give much crap about the little guy - which I am. Unless you count the Edison thingie, which is nice, but assumes you want to buy a module and work around that, not a part you can solder somewhere. The lower end stuff might disappear. Also, Intel's already got a lot going on. The best I can hope for is that they leave the core business and products alone and improve upon them, while integrating the programmable fabric onto the next gen CPUs.


Oh, and I dearly hope AMD will NOT acquire Xilinx, because then we're royally screwed.
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Offline andersm

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #22 on: June 02, 2015, 09:49:43 am »
Oh, and I dearly hope AMD will NOT acquire Xilinx, because then we're royally screwed.
I don't think they take IOUs.

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Offline shanky887614

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Re: Intel to Purchase Altera?
« Reply #24 on: June 02, 2015, 10:20:00 am »
if Samsung bought amd then got an x86 license they could make massive improvements.

a lot of amd chips are still built on 32nm waffers while intel are onto say 16nm but the biggest difference is the IPC count.

it will get interesting if amd manage to boost it. it might kick intel into gear to start increasing performence again.  (there hasnt been a massive improvement over the last few generations, the mobile market might be different though)
 


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