Author Topic: Firefox 97.0 wtf video  (Read 1790 times)

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Online SiliconWizard

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Firefox 97.0 wtf video
« on: February 08, 2022, 07:02:17 pm »
Just updated to Firefox 97.0. Was greeted with an update page (as usual with a 'major version' update), but it has a freaking video on it. The video is a WTF pile of crap (IMHO).
OTOH, pretty much unable to figure out what was possibly new in this new 'major ( :-DD) version'.

But maybe I'm the only one having a problem with this video (and with the absolutely mind-boggingly stupid versioning scheme, which is yet another story)... What do you guys think?
 
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Offline MrMobodies

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Re: Firefox 97.0 wtf video
« Reply #1 on: February 08, 2022, 07:51:28 pm »
Joke: Was the dialogue/video also followed by a large dimming overlay too?
« Last Edit: February 08, 2022, 07:54:52 pm by MrMobodies »
 
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Offline Nominal Animal

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Re: Firefox 97.0 wtf video
« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2022, 08:43:59 pm »
Nobody seems to be interested in providing Tools anymore; they want you to use their Product instead.
 
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Online SiliconWizard

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Re: Firefox 97.0 wtf video
« Reply #3 on: February 08, 2022, 08:58:42 pm »
Nobody seems to be interested in providing Tools anymore; they want you to use their Product instead.

Yeah, and I guess web browsers are particularly prone to that, due to the fact they are - still - a major tool for conveying "information" to people.
But that is sad.

And yeah, the question of web browsers pops up frequently, and I still haven't found anything that really matches Firefox - for my own use and criterions - so I stick to it for now...
 

Offline magic

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Re: Firefox 97.0 wtf video
« Reply #4 on: February 08, 2022, 10:12:52 pm »
What do you guys think?
1. make browser vendors liable for all unpatched vulnerabilites in IE 6.0, Firefox 1.5 and so on
2. once they finally fix their shit, ban all browsers released past 2010 (or was it 2005 when it went to shit?)
3. bring back flash - I would rather have it as an optional plugin than part of HTML itself
4. nuke all of America so that the mistakes are not repeated too soon

Did I miss something important? ;D
 

Online Ed.Kloonk

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Re: Firefox 97.0 wtf video
« Reply #5 on: February 08, 2022, 10:26:03 pm »
.
Expert texpert choking smoker. I am the eggman.
 

Offline AntiProtonBoy

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Re: Firefox 97.0 wtf video
« Reply #6 on: February 08, 2022, 11:34:17 pm »
Nobody seems to be interested in providing Tools anymore; they want you to use their Product instead.
Reality is that tools don't make money when given away for free.
 

Offline MrMobodies

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Re: Firefox 97.0 wtf video
« Reply #7 on: February 09, 2022, 03:56:00 am »
Do you mean these tools that were depreciated/removed from 67+?

https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Tools/Deprecated_tools
Quote
Scratchpad
Scratchpad provided an environment for experimenting with JavaScript code. You can write, run, and examine the result of code that interacts with the web page.

Depreciated as from Firefox 72 (bug 1565380) https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1565380
:Harald Kirschner :digitarald 3 years ago
As bug 1133849 is in MVP state and enabled in Nightly, we should warn Scratchpad users that Console's new editor mode will replace Scratchpad...

Quote
WebIDE and Connect page
WebIDE allowed you to connect the Firefox Developer Tools to remote browsers, such as Firefox for Android. It was also intended to support application development for Firefox OS.

WebIDE was deprecated as of Firefox 69
Disabled as of Firefox 70 (bug 1539451) https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1539451
Removed as of Firefox 71 (bug 1539462) https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1539462
Julian Descottes [:jdescottes] 3 years ago
In Fx 69 we want to disabled WebIDE by default
https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1538632
The message should explain that WebIDE is being replaced by the new version of about:debugging, and should provide a link to about:debugging.

Quote
Canvas debugger
Canvas Debugger allowed users to inspect the canvas element and see how frequently a given function is called. It was deprecated due to lack of use. We do not have dedicated documentation for the Canvas Debugger.

Bugzilla issue: bug 1403938 https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1403938
Removed as of Firefox 67
Soledad Penades [:sole] [:spenades]  4 years ago
The Canvas Debugger is one of our less popular features. But it is also not maintained, and not new features have been added in a while, while bugs and intermittents _do_ happen from time to time. Additionally, it is built with XUL and it's hard to find people who are proficient on it in order to keep working on it.

Quote
Web Audio editor
The Web Audio Editor allowed you to examine an audio context constructed in the page and provided a visualization of its graph. This gave a high-level view of its operation, and enabled you to ensure that all the nodes are connected in the way you expect. It was possible to edit the AudioParam properties for each node in the graph. Some non-AudioParam properties, like an OscillatorNode's type property, were displayed and editable as well. It was deprecated due to lack of use.

Bugzilla issue: bug 1403944 https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1403944
Removed as of Firefox 67
Soledad Penades [:sole] [:spenades] 4 years ago
The WebGL Shader Editor (Web Audio Editor) is one of our least popular features. But it is also not maintained, and not new features have been added in a while, while bugs and intermittents _do_ happen from time to time.Additionally, it is built with XUL and it's hard to find people who are proficient on it in order to keep working on it.

Soledad Penades [:sole] [:spenades]  4 years ago
Welp, copy pasting. Yes! I meant the Web Audio panel.

Quote
Shader editor
The Shader Editor allowed users to examine and edit the source of the WebGL vertex and fragment shaders. It was deprecated due to low usage and maintenance costs.

Bugzilla issue: bug 1342237 https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1342237
Removed as of Firefox 67
Bryan Clark (DevTools PM) [:clarkbw] 5 years ago
Lets remove the Shader Editor from DevTools.
I do think this use case is important and we need to continue to support the ability for tools like this to be created, however I don't think that currently we're adequately addressing the needs of this use case and more importantly we are shipping a bad product. This tool is fairly broken, does not (nor planned to) support WebGL2, sees very little usage, and is not actively maintained.


I see Palemoon still has them except for WebIDE which doesn't seem present above but not sure if they are broke or maintained for the above issues.

Reality is that tools don't make money when given away for free.

Interesting you mean they may be merging/removing and depreciating stuff that they themselves may still be using despite what they say above so they can make more money or for some other similar motive?
« Last Edit: February 09, 2022, 04:10:17 am by MrMobodies »
 

Offline Nominal Animal

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Re: Firefox 97.0 wtf video
« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2022, 09:14:07 am »
Nobody seems to be interested in providing Tools anymore; they want you to use their Product instead.
Reality is that tools don't make money when given away for free.
Why should tools 'make money' in the first place?  Seriously.

A huge part of the internet infrastructure and high-performance computing world is built with tools given away for free: Linux kernel and Linux distributions like Debian and old RHEL; GNU development tools like GCC, GNU C library, Make, Autotools, etc.; server software projects like Apache and Nginx; programming language projects like Perl, PHP, Python, and Ruby; and so on.  Even Wikipedia, if you consider it a tool.
If those tools weren't free, the world today would look very, very different.

As time progresses, an increasing number of these want to convert their popularity into profits, turning themselves from tools into profit-making Products.
This is a problem.

RHEL used to be the choice on the server side, but was turned into a product, making it (and its derivatives like CentOS and ScientificLinux) much less useful.  Indeed, both ScientificLinux and CentOS have been discontinued.  Things like appliances are not built on top of the existing Linux distributions and knowledge; their firmware is shoddily cobbled together by commercial teams that produce a productized fork they maintain for a year or two if at all, then abandon, leaving the users of the appliances at risk of exploitation, forcing them to 'upgrade' to newer hardware.  Which of course acts as planned obsolescence, and is a desirable feature in a product for the vendors.

Just because the tools are free, do not mean they do not need support.

I have always supported the tools I use by contributing development and bugfixing time.  It would be even better for organizations to examine their free tool use, and occasionally provide grants to projects that maintain the most useful tools.  This has nothing to do with ethics, and everything to do with pure self-interest: if the continued existence of a tool is in your own interest, ensuring its maintenance and further development via grants, bugfix bounties, or hardware donations is in your own interest.
Those without significant financial means, can instead contribute time, for example in translations, documentation, or development.  Those with financial means, should put their money where they get the most out of it in the long term.

The underlying problem is that many humans really cannot understand the economics of common goods; they only understand products and market economy.  We can see this well in e.g. air quality: since everybody needs to breathe air, and nobody has to pay for breathing air, people are demanding others fix the air quality issues (pollution and whatnot), instead of doing something themselves first.  Yet, air is a common good, and pure self-interest should dictate that every single self-aware individual maintains the common goods they rely on.

Key point is that although TANSTAAFL is absolutely true, it does not mean that paying up front for things and making everything a Product is the way to go.  It only means everything has a cost, even if it is voluntary (as in the case of common goods and free/open software).  As your reliance on a specific free good grows, its importance to you grows, so it makes a lot of sense to use some resources to bolster that free good you rely on.
It really is very simple.  It is just that most humans have been successfully programmed to think solely in terms of Products, because that way Marketing is an effective tool to part a fool from his money and resources.  Pooling resources to bolster a shared (free) common good is not communism/socialism –– no matter how badly Marketing wants to label it as such ––, and is just a rational, efficient way to maintain common goods.

:blah: :rant: :popcorn: :horse:
 
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Offline PKTKS

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Re: Firefox 97.0 wtf video
« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2022, 11:57:47 am »
Nobody seems to be interested in providing Tools anymore; they want you to use their Product instead.
Reality is that tools don't make money when given away for free.
Why should tools 'make money' in the first place?  Seriously.

A huge part of the internet infrastructure and high-performance computing world is built with tools given away for free: Linux kernel and Linux distributions like Debian and old RHEL; GNU development tools like GCC, GNU C library, Make, Autotools, etc.; server software projects like Apache and Nginx; programming language projects like Perl, PHP, Python, and Ruby; and so on.  Even Wikipedia, if you consider it a tool.
If those tools weren't free, the world today would look very, very different.

As time progresses, an increasing number of these want to convert their popularity into profits, turning themselves from tools into profit-making Products.
This is a problem.

RHEL used to be the choice on the server side, but was turned into a product ...

Absolute true..

Truth is the internet is being privatized  by huge pockets corps.

Fairly easy to see:
- FTP is no more.. old stuff needs to be washed out by Drive X,Y,Z
- Chat and gazillion protocols (IRC etal) are old they need the fubar applets
- All evil TCP/IP free stack is insecure and need proprietary protocols and proprietary chips
- So... browsing stuff should be different ?

No way.  A browser MUST be a proprietary applet and the image render on all gizmos ("TVs" pocket cells outdoor midia adverts..)  must  be property of some group... partners alike.

The vertical control of "mainstream desktop"  started by late 80s with a single supervisor  implementing strict control over all resources..  OS/2 was the first mass product doing that.
Followed by early 90s versions  of the desktop property MS buz..

X86 (succeeded by XOrg) was the unique alternative to put a degree of freedom on what you can see and display ...  and is being privatized as well..

Just see how "the remote desktop" protocol is now a property and no longer a plain tool very simple made by XOrg..   

Without demolishing the whole thing the privatized media will not continue the 90s mainstream buz...  as soon as the computer  display requires ONLY  proprietary drivers to function..
the whole stack is again privatized by huge pockets..

What new this single supervising enforcement daemon from the 80s/90s brings?
Nothing .. is the replay of the same thing ..

again.. this time made on top of modern tools
What else to expect..
same people same game same buz.
they are just using what they are forced to do now...
so the whole alternative must look old insecure.. ugly and non functional..
Anyone can see that easily by demolishing all nix best practices..

AKA.. remove the tools.
make them products..
OUR corp. (fill blank) products.

Paul
 
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Offline MrMobodies

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Re: Firefox 97.0 wtf video
« Reply #10 on: February 09, 2022, 09:12:24 pm »
I created an account on Palemoon long ago but it got closed due to inactivity as I wanted to start a thread to see if I can get some help on seeing it is possible to port or make some extension that I like that is only available on new Firefox/Chrome to Palemoon.

Reading a few subjects I found something about Firefox doing Cryptocurrency a founder is not pleased about it:

https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?f=65&t=27765
Quote
Mozilla is getting into crypto.
Post by Daikun » 2022-01-04, 05:41
On New Year's Eve, Mozilla made this Tweet announcing their intent to accept donations in cryptocurrency.

The founder responded and he is NOT happy.

https://twitter.com/jwz/status/1478022085737803776
Quote
Mozilla @mozilla Dec 31, 2021
Dabble in @dogecoin ? HODLing some #Bitcoin & #Ethereum?

We’re using @BitPay
 to accept donations in #cryptocurrency

https://bitpay.com/100257/donate?

Quote
jwz Replying to  @mozilla
Hi, I'm sure that whoever runs this account has no idea who I am, but I founded @mozilla  and I'm here to say fuck you and fuck this. Everyone involved in the project should be witheringly ashamed of this decision to partner with planet-incinerating Ponzi grifters.

Quote
Re: Mozilla is getting into crypto.
Post by moonbat » 2022-01-04, 05:44
Ooh, JWZ himself!
Also, totally not surprised to see them focusing on everything other than their shitty browser.

Is there anything with that or the way they are doing it?

Seeing his website he did work on the browser in 1998:

https://www.jwz.org/about.html
Quote
1998
I was the accidental impetus for Netscape's decision to release the browser source code, and I was one of the creators and curators of the Mozilla Organization during the first year of its life. We coordinated the open source development of the browser, which eventually became Firefox.
I've written a lot of other software, too. You can find it all on my hacks page. I've also done a bit of writing about software, which is on doc.


https://www.theverge.com/2022/1/6/22870787/mozilla-pauses-crypto-donations-backlash-jwz
Quote
Mozilla, the nonprofit organization that makes the Firefox web browser, announced Thursday that it would be pausing the ability to accept cryptocurrency donations following significant backlash spurred in part by a Mozilla founder, Jamie Zawinski (via Business Insider). Zawinski, who stopped working for mozilla.org in 1999, tweeted scathing criticism to a December 31st Mozilla tweet promoting that it accepted cryptocurrency donations. Mozilla began accepting bitcoin for donations in 2014.

That was the about year I stopped updating it completely and just continuted with Firefox 22 until late 2017 when things stopped working on webapges. That was a time when they had the flashplayer package embedded in In Firefox program folder that would run on a blank page and take up huge amounts of memory until it caused it to hang. Killing the flashplayer (like I did in 22 and before without a problem when it hanged say during youtube) would cause a overlay message covering up the content to say the tab has crashed when it hasn't. Artificially done to make it look the whole page has "crashed" no other details tells me bugger all as to why/very insulting and condescending to the user. When it was just one component not needed in non video content. I thought VERY STUPID. A little system notification at the top to say that the component (flash player) has stopped working would have been good enough than hide everything on the tab and tell me no details about the issue. I thought that was it for Mozilla. I think they fixed that in about 75 where I was experimenting with it in 2020 and I didn't have issues like that happening.

Looks like they stopped accepting it for now:
https://www.techrepublic.com/article/mozilla-stops-accepting-cryptocurrency-wikipedia-may-be-next-are-dominos-falling/

 

Offline Bassman59

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Re: Firefox 97.0 wtf video
« Reply #11 on: February 11, 2022, 05:25:36 pm »
Looks like they stopped accepting it [Cryptocurrency] for now:
https://www.techrepublic.com/article/mozilla-stops-accepting-cryptocurrency-wikipedia-may-be-next-are-dominos-falling/

Maybe the real reason for this is that ... nobody was donating using Bitcoin or other cryptocurrency? Why support a feature nobody uses? I read through the rest of this thread and your other one and saw that FF has been deprecating (not "depreciating," as they say ... words have meaning!) various features for lack of use.

And why would anyone use crypto as a currency to buy something when tomorrow that crypto's value might be 10% more? Why would anyone accept crypto in exchange for goods or services when tomorrow that crypto's value might be 10% less?
 
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