Looking to buy a new monitor, some opinions would be appreciated

[Simon]

at 30Hz i scroll smoothly. You want to know what made my scrolling smooth? It's gonna hurt because it's not what you thought it would be: turning 4 of my 8 CPU cores off! Yup, web scrolling is CPU dependant, if I reduce the active cores so that there is more RAM speed per core i get smooth scrolling plus my CPU will auto overclock a bit more as it has more thermal capacity per core....... but by all means do what you need to to feel like your doing better than everyone else.

[beanflying]

Seriously not hurt other than my Brain? You seriously you cripple your processor so you can scroll properly? Nobbling your CPU is just

Your 'method' has ZERO basis in logic, technology or Engineering or even dare I say it common sense. If you want to lock in a lower frame rate then do it with reduction of FPS on your system.

Slow response is not smooth either just your brain thinks it is. Research why most films stick to 24FPS or take the time to look at the link above and why it was such a stir at the time.

And if you must knobble your FPS then this might be of use https://www.guru3d.com/files-details/rtss-rivatuner-statistics-server-download.html

[Simon]

I did not reduce my core rate to make scrolling smoother. I just noticed that apart from overall system responsivenell this was also a side effect.
What i am trying to explain is that getting equipment with big numbers on it may be a complete waste of time. So you display refreshes at 120Hz, woo hoo, well done you. but what steps does the screen scroll in?

[beanflying]

What you are trying to 'demand' is our eyes agree with your brain which they don't. If 30FPS suits your brain then so be it.

Even in CAD at that would be terrible and there is no way I would even contemplate halving my current frame rate. In a Video editing enviroment 50-60FPS is 'normal' and at 30FPS is likewise going to be painful and no one doing video would put up with it as a work situation.

You need to face it high frame rates have a place in Gaming and there is ZERO evidence to prove the contrary. The Jury is well and truely in and the evidence is there to PROVE this is beneficial.

Likewise those who continue to claim the Earth is Flat also doesn't make it true.

As to screen 'scroll' rate 1:1 and that is why Freesync/Gsync and Low Rate refresh monitors exist.

[Simon]

I'm not saying that i prefer 30Hz but i can hardly tell the difference between 30 and 60. Films run no higher than 30Hz so going to 60Hz will only affect PC stuff where i could not care less. Ultimately everything in the chain needs to be able to work at that speed. I guess that at 4K i will get better response at 30Hz than 60Hz and as i can't see the difference particularly if 4K 60Hz is too much load so lags anyway i may as well stick to 30Hz.

My point about reducing CPU count increased scrolling smoothness was simple to point out that the whole chain needs to support what you want.

As for CAD, 3D cad will on my machine mith what i use not refresh at 60Hz on 4K, even 30Hz is a problem. for PCB's why do i want smoothness? I use a grid, stuff will snap into place anyway. and I am pretty sure that I am not making routing decisions in 16ms.

[ogden]

I guess that at 4K i will get better response at 30Hz than 60Hz and as i can't see the difference particularly if 4K 60Hz is too much load so lags anyway i may as well stick to 30Hz.

Bottleneck could be video adapter. Culd you tell models of: CPU, video card, monitor? I ask about monitor because looking for my next IPS monitor as well, your hands-on experience feedback may be helpful because LG 27" 4K IPS is in the list.

[Karel]

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/what-did-you-buy-today-post-your-latest-purchase!/msg2588547/#msg2588547

[Simon]

I guess that at 4K i will get better response at 30Hz than 60Hz and as i can't see the difference particularly if 4K 60Hz is too much load so lags anyway i may as well stick to 30Hz.

Bottleneck could be video adapter. Culd you tell models of: CPU, video card, monitor? I ask about monitor because looking for my next IPS monitor as well, your hands-on experience feedback may be helpful because LG 27" 4K IPS is in the list.

it's a ryzen 7 with 3.2GHz RAM and an Nvidia P400 Card that will do 3x 4K monitors. It's aimed at CAD stations so probably not great for silly video work but I do'n do any of that.

[Simon]

And yes LG 4K IPS monitor is a dream to work with. Superb colour depth it's like working with shiny photo paper but not glary as it's a matt finish. It cost as much as the 43" 4K IPS screen, I just wish I could affort a 43" screen of the same quality.

[ogden]

it's a ryzen 7 with 3.2GHz RAM and an Nvidia P400 Card that will do 3x 4K monitors.

Unless plugged in wrong PCIe slot and not getting all the (16) lanes needed, that card is more than capable of showing anything you throw at it on 4K 60Hz display. Well, supposedly over proper DP v1.4 - capable cable (w/o DP->HDMI converter as well). What you say about non-smooth scrolling and especially your solution, is strange. My immediate check would be - download gpuz utility and verify that graphics card bus interface is reported as PCIex16 3.0 @ x16 3.0.

[Simon]

But whatgenerates the original data, does it come from the CPU by any chance? 400MHz on paper per processor, not to mention the 2 threads per processor and that DDR4 is hardly the real speed, it runs at about 50% actual speed often so i could be looking at the equivalent of 100MHz per thread..... on an old processor with RAM that ran at 90+% the theoretical data rate.

[ogden]

But whatgenerates the original data, does it come from the CPU by any chance? 400MHz on paper per processor, not to mention the 2 threads per processor and that DDR4 is hardly the real speed

What you are talking about? 

All 8 cores can run at specified clock frequency, at the same time. Ryzen 7 + 3.2GHz DDR4 can copy RAM->RAM at around 40 Gbytes/sec, not bottleneck at all. PCIe v3 speed is 15.75 GB/s (×16 lanes). 4K screen at 32bits/color takes 3840 × 2160 x 4 = ~33 MBytes. Multiply that by 60 fps and result is 1.9 Gbyte/s. Any questions?

[Simon]

Uh, but backgroung tasks will always be using the other cores + virtual cores, you have 16 processes trying to access RAM at once. I don't knw all the ins and outs all i can say is that having less CPU's makes the system more responsive. I don't need 8 cores running at 100% so....

[Simon]

Remember th more levels of DDR you have the more organised you data needs to be in just the right way to maximise bandwidth. If you have 16 concurent processes trying to get data too and from RAM i wager it's going te be pretty chaotic.

Every time there is another release of DDR, I run a speed test with sisosoft sandra and every time the efficiency goes down, the more DDR "x" there is the less of the actual bandwidth seems to be useful for general computing. so i have 3200MHz of bandwidth and 16 concurrent processes: 3200/16 = 200MHz, given my last test putting RAM bandwidth efficiency at 50% that is 100MHz per core.

I think multiproccesor systems are great at true multithread and large applications but actual system responsiveness is not great. If you are running a huge scientific simulation sure chuck all the cores you have at it, it will over time be faster. but if you want brute responsiveness less cores more RAM bandwidth.

[ogden]

so i have 3200MHz of bandwidth and 16 concurrent processes: 3200/16 = 200MHz, given my last test putting RAM bandwidth efficiency at 50% that is 100MHz per core.

This would be true ONLY in case you have 16 concurrent processes each running at 100% CPU load and all processing huge amounts of RAM, all the time missing cache. Rarely any computer experience such situation because why the hell you need to continuously move gigantic amounts of data w/o even taking CPU time to do ANY processing? BTW on my win10 system I have just browser currently running and there are 190 processes and 2200 threads. By increasing CPU core count twice, you decrease OS thread switching overhead two times.

I think multiproccesor systems are great at true multithread and large applications but actual system responsiveness is not great.

Better know instead. Information about multiprocessing internals including RAM arbitration in MP systems is all over the internet. What operating system do you run? If you want smooth GUI experience, it shall be workstation OS (not windows server) and processor scheduling optimized for foreground applications:

[Simon]

Like i sad it's just a subjective impression that the system is more responsive with 4 cores (+ 4 virtual bollocks) than 8+8, i had the same at work on an old i7 with 4+4 cores, switching off some of the cores made the system more responsive and the CAD software worked better because it is strictly single thread and crap and it's no coincidence that the reseller of the software recomends dual core systems or did when you could buy dual core.

[beanflying]

I guess that at 4K i will get better response at 30Hz than 60Hz and as i can't see the difference particularly if 4K 60Hz is too much load so lags anyway i may as well stick to 30Hz.

Bottleneck could be video adapter. Culd you tell models of: CPU, video card, monitor? I ask about monitor because looking for my next IPS monitor as well, your hands-on experience feedback may be helpful because LG 27" 4K IPS is in the list.

it's a ryzen 7 with 3.2GHz RAM and an Nvidia P400 Card that will do 3x 4K monitors. It's aimed at CAD stations so probably not great for silly video work but I do'n do any of that.

Your P400 is a problem, it lacks memory and speed to manage even one 4K monitor in a working environment. The 3 x 4K on the spec sheet is an optimistic video playback spec where far less work is done by the GPU/frame.

Even the RX580 I have in my new Ryzen box will be limited in frame rate at 4K which is why I am more inclined to go QHD instead. My reason to consider 4K is to maybe put a decent card instead of the 580 in it since the release of the 5700 and 5700XT have made it closer to affordable.

[Simon]

Well i just wanted something cheap at the time.

[BrianHG]

Pseudo 16K camera down-sampled to Youtube 8K here (Quality comparison between camera and film resolutions):

[BrianHG]

Pseudo 16K camera down-sampled to Youtube 8K here (Quality comparison between camera and film resolutions):

Holy shit, looking at the video's example digital zoom in at the 1080p, if I were to download the example 16k footage and tile display that with multiple 1080p projectors at 100 inch each, not only would the picture something like as tall as a 3 story apartment building, but, standing only 2 meters away from the display, it would be as sharp and clear as a single 100 inch 1080p still camera image.

If I were to create a 16k projector and display that image at only 100 inches, even looking at it with a 10x magnifying glass, that image would be as sharp and clean as life itself.

[beanflying]

Part of the reason I wanted to be able to play easily with 4K coming in on my new box. Drone footage can be a little off target and for smaller ones fixed zoom so you can digitally zoom in and centralize a target or track a different path to that flown. ** Not the reason I am considering a 4K monitor as you can edit 4K footage on a 1080P if you 'have to' but it sucks fairly much.

If it is only for online or youtube uploads then 1080P is still heaps for a final job IMO. Different if you are processing for other final uses.

[beanflying]

Well worth a look if you are considering a new monitor for work or play. Not just another gamer FPS or die review site 

https://www.rtings.com/monitor

For my options waiting to see what some actual user experiences are with the new LG 27GL850-B 27" 144Hz IPS Flat. Next alternate all rounder is the Gigabyte AD27QD Both have very good (for high refresh rate monitors) DICp without paying both arms and a leg for a professional colour grading monitor.

There is a few others based on the same panel if you have G-Sync compatible cards. The two above are freesync compatible.

[beanflying]

And for those who added to my thinking the result is on the bench and it is HUGE 

Front to back it is 250mm to the screen front if you are looking at desk or bench use so as planned I will be wall mounting it which will get it back to about the same 100-120mm of my current Samsung. It comes with all the leads including power adapter for most countries (win for me I get a second 110V earthed IEC for my few bits of TEA on the transformer)

Why this and not wait for the LG  It was a complete coin toss but there is some very small gains with the Gigabyte over it. Reasons not to buy ACER is some apparent quirks ASUS using apparently the same panel was only 8 bit and 100% RGB unlike the other three. Also I scored a hefty evilbay discount code and got it to my door for $800 AUD inc Tax which is a touch under $500 USD without tax.

The soon to be unused stand is btw excellent smooth tilt pan swivel and height adjustable. Best I have come across anywhere on any screen!

Yes the RGB worked once but it won't be staying on because  gamer rgb head watches the rear of their screen. 

Screen on stock settings is way more vibrant than anything I can get on my current Samsung cheapy and just so much screen real estate to play with. Hot plugged it and hooked straight up with the RX580 allowing dual screen with no settings changes as to be expected in 2019 I guess 

[Black Phoenix]

Yes the RGB worked once but it won't be staying on because  gamer rgb head watches the rear of their screen. 

BUT BUT RGB gives more frames per second and GHz in the CPU... 

Just joking, but a good use for that RGB if you have the monitor close to a white wall is to put it on white for creating a backdrop/bias lightning that's easy for the eyes when using in darker environments, kinda like this:

 

https://www.howtogeek.com/213464/how-to-decrease-eye-fatigue-while-watching-tv-and-gaming-with-bias-lighting/

That's the main reason for some monitors RGB on the back, the ones with bigger strips that the logo only.

[Mechatrommer]

4 pages just to know technicalities how to buy a monitor... can we be twice more productive when working with 120fps vs 60fps monitor? or twice the time spent to play games or watching movies all our entire life? people sent rocket to the moon when monitor was like maybe 15-30fps.. my recent Acer VG270 is not so stellar after several samsung monitors damage. but albeit its 1920x1080 60-75fps limited, at least i know its colors are consistent to the eye on almost all angles of view, and i know its color correct since i have ColorVision SpyderPRO to calibrate it. why i bought it? because its the only best option at affordable price available at my favorite local shop, no special reason specific to its technical specification, so long it can do what a normal monitor today can do. and i think after this i will look after Acer brand since i have much older Acer LCD thats still working albeit its degraded backlight power currently in the office, bought cheaper before few of my damaged Samsung LCD/LED monitors. if you people really obsessed with buying high technical spec monitor, go buy monitor calibrator as well such as from DataColor (ColorVision SpyderPRO) or Gretag Macbeth if you have thick pocket, so you'll know you are not looking at factory fabricated colors nor played up by placebo effect on your high money shiny monitors when watching games or movies, and esp on editing and printing colors imageries like i am... fwiw..