Author Topic: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?  (Read 3893 times)

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Offline Bicurico

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My laptop just updated to Windows 11. I did the upgrade for professional reasons, as a distributor of professional CAD/CAM/CAE software, I am required to use the latest versions of the operating system and applications we sell.

Anyway, after the computer booted into Windows 11 for the first time, I was greeted by this HORRIBLE new START menu. Yes, you can move it to the left, but you can no longer pin your favorite applications in groups for a quick access, like you do on Windows 10. Instead, they are pinned on a first START screen, where you cannot group them at all and only the first 15 are shown. If you want to see more, you need to scroll to the next page.

It gets worse: half of the START menu is used for recommendations: last accessed documents or applications. Why Microsoft? Why should I want to show my students and customers which were the last documents I accessed? Hello? Have you heard of privacy?

So next I searched how to get the old START menu back and found this Registry hack:

Open: HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Explorer\Advanced
Then right-click on Advanced and select New → DWORD (32-bit) Value.
Name the new value Start_ShowClassicMode.

But, it does not work, because Microsoft disabled this key with heir latest November, 24th update.

WHY THE F*** DOES MICROSOFT INVEST SO MUCH TIME AND MONEY IN ANNOYING THEIR CUSTOMERS???
LEAVE THE F***ING START MENU ALONE!

It's not that I dislike Windows generically, like many do, and I am stuck on using it due to most professional software running on Windows only. But they make it really hard.

I dislike Linux even more than Windows and I think it is far away from real usability for the masses. Plus it lacks the professional software and drivers. Finally it is difficult to earn money developing software for Linux due to the GNU licenses and what not. Anyway, this is not a thread to discuss Windows vs Linux vs MacOSX (which I dislike, too, especially because once Apple considers your iMac/MacBook obsolete, you are excluded from getting most of the software, despite it being able to run perfectly well on your hardware - the proof being that you can hack MacOSX to install anyway).

This is just a runt on the stupid new START menu. I hope they get quickly a major shitstorm from users and revert back to the old one - or at least reactivate the Registry hack option.

Regards,
Vitor
 
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Offline tszaboo

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #1 on: December 15, 2021, 12:24:45 pm »
L'art pour l'art.
It's like the change for Windows 8. Everyone hated it, and they went back on it eventually.
I don't think I will install Windows 11.
 

Offline PKTKS

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #2 on: December 16, 2021, 12:14:50 pm »
Just came across my attention recently how
they actually handle things...  like PERPETUAL and property

over what is now their property on GITHUB buz...


Contributor License Agreement (microsoft.com)

    Licenses.

    Copyright License. You grant Microsoft, and those who receive the Submission directly or indirectly from Microsoft, a perpetual, worldwide, non-exclusive, royalty-free, irrevocable license in the Submission to reproduce, prepare derivative works of, publicly display, publicly perform, and distribute the Submission and such derivative works, and to sublicense any or all of the foregoing rights to third parties.
    Patent License. You grant Microsoft, and those who receive the Submission directly or indirectly from Microsoft, a perpetual, worldwide, non-exclusive, royalty-free, irrevocable license under Your patent claims that are necessarily infringed by the Submission or the combination of the Submission with the Project to which it was Submitted to make, have made, use, offer to sell, sell and import or otherwise dispose of the Submission alone or with the Project.



INSANITY or landlord fever ?

I will not write or support a single BIT of such terms...
Paul
 

Offline Marco

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #3 on: December 16, 2021, 12:30:10 pm »
What the hell does Microsoft want ... the Windows 10 start menu might not have been popular for users, but for corporations it was pretty useful. XML configuration, lock all the important stuff behind nice big tiles etc. This new start menu seems designed specifically for the dumbest subset of normal users and almost unusable for corporations.
Quote
When you customize the Start layout, you overwrite the entire full layout. A partial Start layout isn't available. Users can pin and unpin apps, and uninstall apps from Start. You can't prevent users from changing the layout.
???

What the hell is Microsoft doing? I don't want to get forced to buy Apple in the future, stop bloody failing Microsoft.

PS. as for why this happened, the new configuration is in JSON ... I assume they just have too much churn and there are no adults left to make decisions.
« Last Edit: December 16, 2021, 12:37:35 pm by Marco »
 

Offline kaz911

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #4 on: December 16, 2021, 12:52:38 pm »
Well all the "Windows 10" updates kept adding more and more "advertising" for me

I "cross graded" to MacOS 2-3 years ago - and now my very stubborn better half who absolutely HATES new things :) has "cross graded" to MacOS as well. It took her about a week to get used to but it is like a breath of fresh air vs Windows 10 / 11.

The final straw for my better half was the amount of crap they kept serving up in Solitaire. She likes her puzzles and card games - but MS Solitaire became "advertising from hell" product - and that was the straw that broke the camels back.

We both have a Win 11 "parallels" available. But we rarely use it apart from for a few engineering tools (and Visio)

I still have a few Win 10 machines running - but every time I turn them on it is "wait 20 minutes to install updates" before you can work. Then the updates force the Anti "virus" scanner to run - then the indexer runs - so if you are on battery - 25% of the battery have drained due to "updates" and related start up issues. Then after normal update - Microsoft "Store" then starts updating all the "little app's" - and reinstall ALL the crap utilities I have uninstalled before and neither want or need.

Microsoft are bonkers...

Btw I do not think Apple and MacOS is without issues. But the user experience is just so so much better. The HW might be crappily made - and expensive. But it is not full of the constant Microsoft nagging and advertising.
 

Offline MrMobodies

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #5 on: December 16, 2021, 01:15:47 pm »
L'art pour l'art.
It's like the change for Windows 8. Everyone hated it, and they went back on it eventually.
I don't think I will install Windows 11.

It looked too bloated for me so I just used Classicshell which also takes care of the breadcrumbs thing that interferes with my view of the path.

 
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Offline Ranayna

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #6 on: December 16, 2021, 01:18:42 pm »
I coudn't care less about the start menu, to be honest.
Stuff where i regularly use the history of gets pinned to start, enabling me to right-click them to access said history.
Stuff without history requirements that i regularly use gets placed into a taskbar toolbar (Small Icons, no Text).
Everything else gets searched, and i am also one of the old farts that places desktop icons on installation :p So if i do not remember a name i hit Win+D to look for it on the desktop.

What i *hate* though, is that Microsoft has destroyed the Taskbar. For how I work, that is way more important issue.
I want the taskbar to never combine items, and to show the names of the programs. I want to know what is open, and i want to be able to quickly switch between application
That requires space, obviously, so i place the taskbar vertically left on my main monitor. Since 4:3 and 16:10 screens are almost not available anymore, vertical screenspace is at a premium nowadays anyway.
 

Offline Fred27

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #7 on: December 16, 2021, 02:07:30 pm »
I've been using Windows 11 extensively for a few months. I'm a professional software developer but currently use my own hardware working from home, so it's not just a bit of browsing. It did take a little bit of adjustment but I have to say I'm very happy with Windows 11. It was stable even when in beta and I had no compatability issues. There are obviously a few things where I'm more used to the Windows 10 way (like the explorer right click menu) but nothing serious.
 
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Offline Doctorandus_P

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #8 on: December 16, 2021, 06:46:35 pm »
If the'd make something that would work properly, then everyone wants to stick to it.

If Windoze users are happy with what they have, they do not want to "upgrade".

Therefore they constantly change silly things for no particular reason at all, and of course you are forced to use the garbage that they shove down your throat. If they gave you the choice to make your own choices (such as the start menu) then you would stick to those things that you like, and therefore stop wanting to upgrade.
 

Offline tszaboo

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #9 on: December 16, 2021, 06:49:46 pm »
L'art pour l'art.
It's like the change for Windows 8. Everyone hated it, and they went back on it eventually.
I don't think I will install Windows 11.

It looked too bloated for me so I just used Classicshell which also takes care of the breadcrumbs thing that interferes with my view of the path.
Ok, then an other, bigger reason: I have a crypto wallet on my PC, and not going to update until it is prooven to be 100% safe and functional.
 

Offline Algoma

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #10 on: December 16, 2021, 07:31:17 pm »
Its like somone at Microsoft needs to justify their job by making changes that nobody asked for.

Microsoft has consistently made every second product release / revision an epic failure of functional design. Often by trying new interface design ideas, usually copied from other products, but having them differnt enough to ultimately be far less useful.

 

Online SiliconWizard

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #11 on: December 16, 2021, 08:17:40 pm »
Its like somone at Microsoft needs to justify their job by making changes that nobody asked for.

To be honest, this scheme has become the de facto standard in the software industry.

Microsoft has consistently made every second product release / revision an epic failure of functional design. Often by trying new interface design ideas, usually copied from other products, but having them differnt enough to ultimately be far less useful.

Yeah. Sort of. But ever since Windows 8, MS has taken such a drastic turn that every Windows version from this point on is going to be pretty annoying for any kind of "power" user. MS is only responding to the needs of IT departments and "newbie" users, and then their "cloud" agenda. The rest can f*ck off, they don't care. Apparently they stated that MS loved Linux ( https://cloudblogs.microsoft.com/windowsserver/2015/05/06/microsoft-loves-linux/ ), so I guess their message is somehow that power users should switch to Linux and stop bothering MS, because they have better fish to fry at MS. (Read: a lot more money to make elsewhere.)
 

Offline neil555

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #12 on: December 17, 2021, 01:28:01 pm »
Have you seen StartAllBack?

https://www.startallback.com/

This fixes a LOT of issues with Windows 11 (Win 7/10 style start menu, click on the taskbar for Task manager, remove the annoying right click menu issue etc)
 
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Online coromonadalix

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #13 on: December 21, 2021, 05:06:08 am »
Msoft think they are smart enough to think  you will adapt to their view / look and feel      lolll

"they" think you will love their way of doing ... be the most "productive" user around by clicking "useless" times for a function  ....
 

Offline Bicurico

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #14 on: December 21, 2021, 08:28:45 am »
Arghhh... They changed the right button context menu, too.
All your custom actions are now in a sub-menu.
I use Notepad++ a lot to open config files. This now takes longer as I have an extra layer of menus. What a stupid decision.
An why does Microsoft insist in supporting ZIP archives in a lousy way. It only confus s users. With the current change, the context menu shows Microsoft's ZIP Menü. To get to 7Zip, one needs to select Other Options... first.

Offline Zero999

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #15 on: December 21, 2021, 09:00:07 am »
At one stage I remember there was talk of porting a Linux desktop, KDE I think, to Windows, but I don't believe it was ever done. Now the Windows desktop seems to be upsetting more power users with every version/update, it might actually happen.
 

Offline cliffyk

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #16 on: December 21, 2021, 04:24:48 pm »
At one stage I remember there was talk of porting a Linux desktop, KDE I think, to Windows, but I don't believe it was ever done. Now the Windows desktop seems to be upsetting more power users with every version/update, it might actually happen.

Windows has been change just for the sake of change since XP, it's as though it has been "updated" by a group of children playing in a technological sandbox--I stopped using it (and most MS products) personally about 15 years ago, and professionally  (and all MS products) 5 years ago when I retired.

6 months ago my wife bought an HP laptop that cam with W10, after using it for a couple months she told me she "wanted her old computer back", so overwrote the W10 with a backup image of her old W7 system--instant joy...
-cliff knight-

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Offline Bicurico

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #17 on: December 21, 2021, 04:37:16 pm »
Not all is bad.

Windows 11 will actually run our CAD/CAM applications faster, reducing calculation time noticeably, compared to Windows 10.

Also, Windows 10/11 is pretty robust, too. We handle CAM applications where the CAD model alone is over 1GB in size! The resulting CAM project can be a 10GB folder. The computer has 32-64GB RAM, SSD, multiple cores running in parallel, etc.

Windows allows a huge number of periferals, drivers, etc. to be installed and you actually don't see that many BSOF (Blue Screen of Death), considering the amount of options.

I don't have complaints in this area.

What really annoys me, are the little things: why change the stupid START menu to something which is obviously WORSE? Why not give the options to revert to the old START menu?

Why create a new instance of context menu?

Why include doubious and incomplete functionality like the ZIP options? You guy's won't imagine the support I have to give to students who don't understand that running an executable or opening a CAD/CAM project within a folder that is actually a ZIP archive won't work, because Windows only decompresses the file one double-clicked onto.

Or why hide the file extension? You can program a stupid executable that whipes your harddisk and give it the same icon as any PDF file...

So, yes, I agree with the contribution that says: Microsoft is trying to get the last idiot to use a computer, ignoring they upset the whole existing user base.
 
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Offline Zucca

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #18 on: January 09, 2022, 05:47:33 am »
My current PC HW is not compatible with Win11.
I will then SW upgrade to Linux since my HW is okay and it working properly.

Microsoft will bleed...
Can't know what you don't love. St. Augustine
Can't love what you don't know. Zucca
 

Offline Messtechniker

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #19 on: January 09, 2022, 07:51:25 am »
Hint: Use "StartAllBack" and things are back to normal.
In my case WIN7 handling. :-+
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Online SiliconWizard

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #20 on: January 09, 2022, 07:11:36 pm »
At one stage I remember there was talk of porting a Linux desktop, KDE I think, to Windows, but I don't believe it was ever done. Now the Windows desktop seems to be upsetting more power users with every version/update, it might actually happen.

I dunno about Windows 10 and 11, but there were indeed alternative "shells" (I think that's Windows lingo for desktop environment) for earlier versions of Windows. A few tens of them, even. Looks like most of them are now abandonware, though.

Edit: one of the very few (and open source) still alive is Cairo Desktop: https://cairodesktop.com/
Haven't tried it myself, but it does support Win 7 to 10. They do not mention 11 as of yet. If anyone feels adventurous... :D
« Last Edit: January 09, 2022, 07:21:22 pm by SiliconWizard »
 

Online SilverSolder

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #21 on: January 09, 2022, 07:35:15 pm »
[...] Microsoft is trying to get the last idiot to use a computer, ignoring they upset the whole existing user base.

The problem is that today, the "last idiot" doesn't need to use a computer at all - they didn't need a computer in the first place...  Most of this category of consumer is perfectly happy with tablets and phones, and likely only use computers at work.
 

Offline geggi1

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #22 on: January 10, 2022, 06:20:24 am »
IF IT WORKS DONT FIX IT!
That is the thing MS have not understood.
I beleve MS have an agenda to become more tablet friendly and because of this is FU**NG up the GUI.
 

Offline AntiProtonBoy

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #23 on: January 10, 2022, 07:22:53 am »
Unpopular opinion time: I think the start menu sucks and it has always sucked. It's just a clutter of shortcuts to application executables, uninstall executables, nested folders, shortcuts to text files, help files, and whole lot of garbage, 90% of which the user never *ever* cares about. A really good model that Microsoft should emulate is Application pop-up panel in the dock under macOS, or if they really want to keep the start menu, then have a look at what Kubuntu does.
 

Online rsjsouza

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Re: Windows 11: Why does Microsoft think they should change the START menu?
« Reply #24 on: January 10, 2022, 08:37:48 pm »
If that is an unpopular opinion, call me unpopular as well. I always despised the start menu since its inception in Windows 95. At the time I loved OS/2 and its quick launch bar, together with the workspace arrangement of icons, which was to me a better evolution of the icon arrangements of Windows 3.x versions - which I also liked better than '95.

The Start menu was so inefficient that most people I know (including myself) have gobs of icons plastered all over the desktop area for the most common applications and documents.
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Oh, the "whys" of the datasheets... The information is there not to be an axiomatic truth, but instead each speck of data must be slowly inhaled while carefully performing a deep search inside oneself to find the true metaphysical sense...
 
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