Author Topic: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope  (Read 2042523 times)

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Offline Orange

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #250 on: October 06, 2014, 01:18:16 pm »
Dave hasn't got his scope yet?
No,

All the Rigol scopes meant for Australia have been sent to Europe  ;D
 

Offline Fungus

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #251 on: October 06, 2014, 01:28:50 pm »
All the Rigol scopes meant for Australia have been sent to Europe  ;D

There's none left in Europe either. Looks like I did the right thing by grabbing mine the very first day. 8)

Nevertheless, from a UI point of view, having to push something which rotates (except for the simplest toggling - e.g. coarse/fine) is a stupid idea on many levels and should be dropped completely from design.

Yep.

Actually, I quite like pushing the horizontal scale knob to go into zoom mode. That one works for me. :-)

(Weirdly enough, it's the only push-function which isn't marked on the front panel...you have to find that one by accident)


For frequent menu selections though? Nope.

 

Offline Orange

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #252 on: October 06, 2014, 01:32:33 pm »
All the Rigol scopes meant for Australia have been sent to Europe  ;D

There's none left in Europe either. Looks like I did the right thing by grabbing mine the very first day. 8)

Nevertheless, from a UI point of view, having to push something which rotates (except for the simplest toggling - e.g. coarse/fine) is a stupid idea on many levels and should be dropped completely from design.

Yep.

Actually, I quite like pushing the horizontal scale knob to go into zoom mode. That one works for me. :-)

(Weirdly enough, it's the only push-function which isn't marked on the front panel...you have to find that one by accident)


For frequent menu selections though? Nope.

AR Benelux still has stock
 

Offline marmad

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #253 on: October 06, 2014, 01:40:06 pm »
Actually, I quite like pushing the horizontal scale knob to go into zoom mode. That one works for me. :-)

Sure, for any function which is a simple toggle (Zoom/Normal - Coarse/Fine), or any function which automatically overrides any drift of the knob caused by the push (any Zero Position) - pushing works just fine every time.
 

Offline soren

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #254 on: October 06, 2014, 02:31:10 pm »
Be aware that the Meilhaus availability status is not correct!

Meilhaus contacted me this morning to let me know that they are on backorder and i will receive my Oszilloscope at begin of November. I checked on their homepage and they are still showing the status as green icon.

That's too bad. I ordered mine on the 29th and received it three days later, so they did have at least some units in stock. That odd "** Subject to being unsold" line did give me pause.
 

Offline Bzzz

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #255 on: October 06, 2014, 03:06:30 pm »
Be aware that the Meilhaus availability status is not correct!

Meilhaus contacted me this morning to let me know that they are on backorder and i will receive my Oszilloscope at begin of November. I checked on their homepage and they are still showing the status as green icon.


The place I got mine from is already posting ">21 days" delivery time on their front page.

http://www.batronix.com/shop/oscilloscopes/Rigol-DS1054Z.html

Meilhaus has them on stock: http://www.meilhaus.de/en/rigol+ds1054z.htm

I wondered why Meilhaus has them on stock while Batronix is struggling to get new devices within 3 weeks...well, faking the availability status is one way to influence the buyer ;) I don't know Batronix, but Meilhaus offers some excellent RS232 converters, I don't think they need to trick their customers in that way. Let's see if the status changes, when in doubt, I buy from the guys that are honest with their availability, even if it takes longer in total.
 

Offline Bert Camper

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #256 on: October 06, 2014, 04:17:31 pm »
A German friend heard that a new container with DS1054Z scopes will not arrive before November 4th.
Guess I ordered my scope just in time last week in the Netherlands. I'm very happy with it :)

Regards,
Bert
 

Offline David Hess

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #257 on: October 06, 2014, 05:42:29 pm »
The ancient Tektronix 2232 has a momentary push rotary control and uses variable programmed hysteresis in the rotation which is both very simple and very effective.  If I try, I cannot even make it glitch.

Well, we'll just have to accept your claim that the Tek knob is impossible to glitch, with smooth movement over all speeds it can possibly be turned at. Nevertheless, from a UI point of view, having to push something which rotates (except for the simplest toggling - e.g. coarse/fine) is a stupid idea on many levels and should be dropped completely from design.

When used to make a menu selection, it appears to use about 5 or 6 steps per rotation with matching hysteresis.  When used for cursor control with push selecting between cursors, it appears to use about 15 steps per revolution also with matching hysteresis but response is non-linear for fast rotations.  I wonder how old the patent is on control acceleration.

Native resolution is about 1200 counts per revolution using a 10 bit ADC which is a lot higher than the expected mechanical resolution; two potentiometers locked together and rotated 180 degrees are encoded separately to remove the dead zone of a single potentiometer in lieu of an optical or mechanical rotary encoder. 

I do not disagree that it is a bad idea but good implementations work well enough.  I have run across poor implementations before where it was difficult to press the control without changing the selection or position which is why I was pleasantly surprised that Tektronix managed to implement it without problems on such an old instrument.  They used the same rotary control implementation for a decade or more in different instruments but the 2232 and close cousins are the only ones I know from that era which had this rotary control combined with a push control.  Maybe they decided it was a bad idea at the time but their current models do it.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2014, 05:49:27 pm by David Hess »
 

Offline Fungus

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #258 on: October 06, 2014, 06:17:02 pm »
I wonder how old the patent is on control acceleration.

The DS1054Z seems to do some sort of acceleration when you're in 'zoom' mode (press the horizontal scale button). It's not brilliant though, could be improved.

two potentiometers locked together and rotated 180 degrees are encoded separately to remove the dead zone of a single potentiometer in lieu of an optical or mechanical rotary encoder. 

On a completely different note: Does anybody know what kind of encoders Rigol uses for their knobs? Optical? Mechanical? Magnetic? Plain old potentiometer?

I'm just wondering how long they're going to last...

 

Offline rolycatTopic starter

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #259 on: October 06, 2014, 11:24:50 pm »

On a completely different note: Does anybody know what kind of encoders Rigol uses for their knobs? Optical? Mechanical? Magnetic? Plain old potentiometer?

I'm just wondering how long they're going to last...

They will be mechanical contacting rotary encoders. Good quality brands can last for 100,000 revolutions or more, although it seems the encoders in the old DS1052E are known for failing/becoming erratic - hopefully Rigol have raised their game.

Optical or magnetic encoders would be great, but as noted recently in another thread they are still bafflingly expensive given how simple their construction can be.
« Last Edit: October 07, 2014, 12:01:34 am by rolycat »
 

Offline leppie

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #260 on: October 07, 2014, 05:02:00 am »
Wow, I thought self-cal was slow, but try saving a big waveform.... Had to leave it overnight, output size was only 11.4MB (4 x 3mb), but it took at least 3 hours to save...  :wtf:
 

Offline mrbook

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #261 on: October 07, 2014, 04:22:57 pm »
Would someone mind sending me the tequipment.net EEVBlog discount code  :-+

Thinking about picking up this scope.

Thanks,

mrbook
 

Offline JDubU

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #262 on: October 07, 2014, 04:39:22 pm »
Would someone mind sending me the tequipment.net EEVBlog discount code  :-+

Thinking about picking up this scope.

Just call them and tell them that you are an EEVBlog forum member.
 

Offline mrbook

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #263 on: October 07, 2014, 04:47:00 pm »
Thanks for the PM's everyone.

mrbook
 

Offline Phil_L

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #264 on: October 07, 2014, 06:32:57 pm »
Wow, I thought self-cal was slow, but try saving a big waveform.... Had to leave it overnight, output size was only 11.4MB (4 x 3mb), but it took at least 3 hours to save...  :wtf:

I got caught out by that one yesterday saving a CSV to my flash drive, I was certain it had crashed but it finished eventually.
 

Offline Mandelbrot

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #265 on: October 07, 2014, 08:05:48 pm »
Just got my DS1054Z after UPS screwed up and lost two of the trucks it was on and all four of the probes were missing the contacts on the hooks. I was told from TEquipment that this is common, and I've already seen it mentioned on this thread, but supposedly Rigol is doing something about it? I have three exams this week so I won't be able to play with it much until the weekend...

Interestingly, my free AC voltage detector arrived on Friday while my scope didn't arrive until today (Tuesday) even though they were shipped from the same place within half an hour of each other. I can't even guess how this would have happened logistically.
 

Offline nanofrog

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #266 on: October 07, 2014, 08:27:25 pm »
Just got my DS1054Z after UPS screwed up and lost two of the trucks it was on and all four of the probes were missing the contacts on the hooks. I was told from TEquipment that this is common, and I've already seen it mentioned on this thread, but supposedly Rigol is doing something about it? I have three exams this week so I won't be able to play with it much until the weekend...

Interestingly, my free AC voltage detector arrived on Friday while my scope didn't arrive until today (Tuesday) even though they were shipped from the same place within half an hour of each other. I can't even guess how this would have happened logistically.
TEquipment has different warehouses, so your full order may be packed and shipped in different boxes from multiple locations. Can be confusing the first time you experience this.

Toss UPS in the mix, and those packages may not get to their destination on the same date, even when things go smoothly.
 

Online kwass

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #267 on: October 07, 2014, 10:21:58 pm »
Just got my DS1054Z after UPS screwed up and lost two of the trucks it was on and all four of the probes were missing the contacts on the hooks. I was told from TEquipment that this is common, and I've already seen it mentioned on this thread, but supposedly Rigol is doing something about it? I have three exams this week so I won't be able to play with it much until the weekend...

Interestingly, my free AC voltage detector arrived on Friday while my scope didn't arrive until today (Tuesday) even though they were shipped from the same place within half an hour of each other. I can't even guess how this would have happened logistically.

Just another data point.....

I got my 1054z from TEquipment too, a week ago.  Super fast shipping (ordered Friday, arrived Monday) and all 4 probes were fine.  The free, non-contact voltage detector arrived in its own box the day after I got the 'scope.  They're a great company to deal with!  My previous orders with them have been shipped just as fast and I've never had a problem with anything I've bought from them.



« Last Edit: October 08, 2014, 01:00:12 am by kwass »
-katie
 

Offline alank2

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #268 on: October 07, 2014, 10:40:43 pm »
For some reason they prefer to put the free ac detector in its own box instead of opening the Rigol box and throwing it in.  It is odd though that they never seem to arrive at the same time!  That has happened to me twice in a row!
 

Online kwass

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #269 on: October 08, 2014, 01:03:22 am »
For some reason they prefer to put the free ac detector in its own box instead of opening the Rigol box and throwing it in.  It is odd though that they never seem to arrive at the same time!  That has happened to me twice in a row!

I found that really strange too as they originated form the same location at the same time.  I didn't look but they must be using some sort of "super-saving" shipping method for these ac detectors.  They're wasting shipping materials and money but I suspect that many people would not be happy if they found the manufacturer's seal had been broken.

-katie
 

Offline alank2

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #270 on: October 08, 2014, 01:20:35 am »
but I suspect that many people would not be happy if they found the manufacturer's seal had been broken.

I agree this is likely the reason.
 

Offline miguelvp

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #271 on: October 08, 2014, 04:43:53 am »
but I suspect that many people would not be happy if they found the manufacturer's seal had been broken.

I agree this is likely the reason.

Plus it's more costly for them to do so, they will have to change software and logistics to pack everything in the same box.
 

Offline leppie

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #272 on: October 08, 2014, 05:37:35 am »
Actually they put it in the box for me. Guess it is easier for international shipments.
 

Online edavid

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #273 on: October 08, 2014, 03:05:10 pm »
They are opening all the Rigol boxes anyway, to check the probes.
 

Offline Bzzz

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Re: New Rigol DS1054Z oscilloscope
« Reply #274 on: October 08, 2014, 05:13:13 pm »
According to the Batronix support, their next lot of 60 (!) DS1054Z will arrive on 5th of November. Half of that amount is already sold, and they expect to be totally out of stock again if orders keep coming in at the current rate. The batch after that will be 100 devices (!!) on 19th of November. Meanwhile, Meilhaus changed to 3-4 weeks delivery time. Furthermore, my favourite shop Voelkner (which is also selling DS1074Z/DS1104Z and lots of others at the usual MSRP) cannot source any of these at the moment.

..I guess it's a popular device, but why?  :-// :-DD
 


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