Free Altium is Coming

[m12lrpv]

I think some people seem to be missing the bigger picture here.....

That hobbyists need even more flexibility than (semi)professionals?

As a hobbyist with less than 10 boards to his name I already find library management to be a pain. Everything I do is generic parts. Being forced to micromanage a library is insane when I just want to put a footprint on a board where I'm not even sure what the final component value will be or if it's even needed until I start testing the board. People trying to copy my boards from a community platform would be bombarding me with crap complaints about my boards not working because of my part and value choices don't work.

I really think that Altium don't understand the target market. Someone said 1.4m Arduino's... How many of them are used in the type of globally open projects that this seems targeted at?

This seems to only be useful to the Open Source Hardware group and not to hobbyists. That's got to be a lot smaller community than Arduino.

Even collaborative education has IP. So the education market for this would also be very restricted.

[Rigby]

There are already lots of players in this space. Lots of software you can choose from.

Some of you are choosing to crap on software you've never used or even seen.  You're imagining shit, calling it real, and bitching about how much it smells like poo...  All one does there is complain about how much their own imagination lets them down.

It hasn't been released yet.  The feature list isn't even firmed up, yet.  All we know is based mostly on rumor and hearsay... As far as ways to gain knowledge go, rumor and hearsay are two of the worst.

No one bitched this loud about the existing software, which leads me to believe that most everyone found something they tolerated.  So... keep using that.  Be glad you found something you can use day to day.

This new Altium software isn't for you.  So, don't complain that the software is so stupid duh and doesn't meet your needs when they've already CLEARLY STATED that the software IS NOT AIMED at you.

[m12lrpv]

This new Altium software isn't for you.  So, don't complain that the software is so stupid duh and doesn't meet your needs when they've already CLEARLY STATED that the software IS NOT AIMED at you.

Last time I checked the software was (supposed to be) aimed at me and I feel that what I've seen and heard about it so far misses the mark by a long way.

Many of the comments criticising the software are based on reality and common sense from those who actually seem to have a good handle on the what is needed for the target market. The fact that the feature requirement for the hobbyist market just happens to match the semi-professional market is no reason to troll the semi-professionals.

[Rigby]

Last time I checked

Where did you check?  Which rumor mill? 

Is there an announced feature set, yet?  Nope.

So, anything we have is rumor or third-hand information, a.k.a. hearsay, and necessarily meaningless without confirmation.

[m12lrpv]

Last time I checked

Where did you check?  Which rumor mill? 

Is there an announced feature set, yet?  Nope.

So, anything we have is rumor or third-hand information, a.k.a. hearsay, and necessarily meaningless without confirmation.

That would be here: http://circuitmaker.com/#why_circuitmaker

No rumor mill needed and in case you don't understand, hearsay is for courtrooms, not for reality. Most hearsay is true but the person stating it is not under oath hence it's hearsay. That doesn't make it untrue which is what the real world cares about.

[Rigby]

Most hearsay is true but the person stating it is not under oath hence it's hearsay. That doesn't make it untrue which is what the real world cares about.

If that is how you feel then you have been lied to a great deal and don't know it.

For me claims require proof.  I've been lied to too much by too many people to trust anything or anyone that can't be verified.  I don't even trust the link you cited to be faithful to what is actually released; lots of things change during a product's development.  I do recognize that it is as official as we're going to see for now, though.  Too bad it doesn't actually list any features except that it'll have 3D.

in case you don't understand

Unappropriate language removed by Simon

[george graves]

Inappropriate language removed

This is why we can't have nice forums things.

[george graves]

I searched for any mention of Altium on the 2014 Maker Faire videos....no videos at all - not even any coverage from Hack-a-day.   

Just the usual 3d printers, and cup-cake go-carts videos.  Yawn...............  

Way, way too soon to call it a marketing fail.  but I expected at last a few blogs to cover it.  Nope!  What's up with that?

Someone at Altium is pissed they didn't get more coverage. What's a cost of setting up a booth and sending 3-4 people and equipment?  $20k USD?

[s3t]

Maybe 'cos true makers do breadboards.

[Simon]

Maybe 'cos true makers do breadboards.

We have had a subcontractor do breadboards . we don't use him anymore...... I think this has been entirely PR driven without actually looking at needs and what is already available.

[Precipice]

I think this has been entirely PR driven without actually looking at needs and what is already available.

Possibly - but the market for piss-poor free tools is pretty much sewn up.
It'll be interesting to see how utterly horrible 'makers' can make a schematic and PCB using better tools.
Stuff I'm seeing authored with designspark has all the readability of drunken perl!

[Circlotron]

My wish list for a free version would be the PCB and schematic capabilities of 99SE (but without the bugs) and maybe a periodic nag screen, or after say 30 minutes it makes you shut it off and restart. No autorouter either. If those  aren't sufficient, maybe you aren't really a hobbyist.

[Rigby]

Inappropriate language removed

This is why we can't have nice forums things.

Yep...  All my fault and no one else contributed.  DIAF.

[tszaboo]

For me,  it is more than value & package.     Value, Package, tolerance, voltage rating, temperature coefficient, etc....

Except a large proportion of passives will not need that level of detail, and where they do, that's when you specify a particular part, otherwise it's a jellybean.

If they make it like the supplier chain in newer Altiums, that works quite well. Imagine like pushing 1 button to order all the stuff at Farnell. On the other hand, Altium has generic resistor values, and you are probably allowed to change the parameters if you wish. So I dont see the reason why it wouldnt be possible what you are saying. Even though I use the library, and I have like 1000 different resistor in a library. It just works, and the 7 seconds you save putting down the resistor, you loose if you have to buy it.
Yes I understand, that you subcontract your designs. We usually send the designs, jelly bean is fully described with a field which allows the manufacturer to use compatible, if they verify it with us. It just works.
Do we know anything about multi-monitor support?

[Wilksey]

I am planning on attending the EDS at the end of October in Coventry, Altium and Premier EDA are both there, so I think i'm going to probe the sales rep and see if he can give me any more info (unless it is released by then, which I doubt), they may even have a demo.

I hope I am wrong, but hobbyist use aside, the new "CircuitMaker" seems gimmicky.
Eagle seems to be more popular due to it's native cross platform ability also, which Altium have already stated (I believe Dave mentioned back along) that they are not that interested in.
I am not 100% sure if DT is native or emulated (WINE et al).
KiCAD is also of course X platform.

I also wonder if it will be able to import libraries and/or designs from other packages (such as Eagle).

[BloodyCactus]

I hope I am wrong, but hobbyist use aside, the new "CircuitMaker" seems gimmicky.
Eagle seems to be more popular due to it's native cross platform ability also, which Altium have already stated (I believe Dave mentioned back along) that they are not that interested in.
I am not 100% sure if DT is native or emulated (WINE et al).
KiCAD is also of course X platform

i went from native eagle on linux to diptrace on wine on linux just to get beyond eagles size limitation. DT runs perfectly fine under wine on linux.

[Wilksey]

I know it runs fine, but from looking at (on other forums) peoples comments regarding "whats best, Eagle vs xxxxx" the main factor seems to be that Eagle runs native, regardless of if the others run also under emulation.

If you are locked in commercially then you tend to run whatever OS the app was designed for, so if the app you require is native Linux then you run Linux rather than CYGWin etc, 90% is Windows native, as well as the obligatory (seemingly) Microsoft Office.  I have a Linux machine with Libre (Open) office on and I get on just fine but I also have 2 Windows machines one for PCB design and one for software development.

For hobbyists however, sometimes people disregard software purely because it was built for Windows, I am not one of them, but I know some who do.

I was just opinionating why I think Eagle (apart from it is actually a good piece of software if you know how to set it up) tends to be the most popular (or it was a few years ago in any case).

[Simon]

i went from native eagle on linux to diptrace on wine on linux just to get beyond eagles size limitation. DT runs perfectly fine under wine on linux.

oh, yea diptrace, I think i made a mistake there

[Rigby]

I'm just stoked about this app.  I am a hobbyist and I make a couple boards a month.  New tools are always welcome for me and my hobby.

[neslekkim]

Since Altium/CircuitMaker will have 10x10cm limit, wonder how long it will take Eagle to change from that strange 8x10cm limit..

[zapta]

Since Altium/CircuitMaker will have 10x10cm limit, wonder how long it will take Eagle to change from that strange 8x10cm limit..

It depends on the success or unsuccess of CM. The more pressure they will feel, the harder they will try. Same goes for competition from Kicad and diptrace.

[Wilksey]

Thinking about it, can we really compare DT, Eagle and now CM alongside KiCAD?
I mean, we can compare it in terms of features or lack thereof whatever your views. but Eagle / DT and CM (when it arrives) are actively developed, KiCAD on the other hand seems to have been taken over by CERN and people can't build it properly for numerous reasons, and it is not being "actively" developed as such from what I can see, as it's open source it's community developed and unlimited.

For a hobbyist it is probably more than adequate, it even has an RF toolbox even on the last windows official build.

Eagle and Diptrace users can make it more powerful by upgrading their licenses, arguably to a professional / semi professional design package.

Altium is the "industry defacto" but it is a different product to CM, so you might be able to upgrade CM to remove certain limitations or add extra features but it will never be Altium (whether that is good or bad remains to be seen).

But the lite version of Eagle or DT is still the same product going up to the professional version.
I guess the design "engine" will be the same as Altium just with a cut down set of features and a rather unsightly UI.

[Rufus]

Since Altium/CircuitMaker will have 10x10cm limit, wonder how long it will take Eagle to change from that strange 8x10cm limit..

I wonder how long it will take people to come up with 1/4th or 1/8th scale footprint libraries and plot gerbers at x4 or x8? Altium's internal resolution is 1 millionth of an inch.

[timb]

Board size limits are dumb. Just have pin/layer limits like DipTrace.


Sent from my Smartphone

[Precipice]

To be fair, all artificial limits like that are dumb. They've just got to choose from the options of dumb...
For me, jamming far too much onto a small PCB is what I do, so boardsize limits would be ideal. For others, other limits would win.