Author Topic: Spectrum Analyzer - Rigol DSA815 (Read 619215 times)

Howardlong · « **Reply #550 on:** February 20, 2015, 07:35:13 pm »

Quote from: thebobster on February 20, 2015, 05:40:48 pm

So to make sure I understand, the mod to U1105 will work with FW 00.01.12 by shorting the # 7 and 8 pins on U1105 and that the pins DO NOT have to be lifted from the board. Is that correct?

Thanks!
Thebobster

That is correct, unless, of course, the board has been changed! The board where a visual and electrical inspection was done on the pad on pin 7 to ensure it was isolated (ie, not connected) was Main Board 00.07.

N8AUM · « **Reply #551 on:** February 24, 2015, 08:05:51 pm »

Just sent off my 815-TG for exchange, wonder what rev the batch will be ?

Firetank · « **Reply #552 on:** March 01, 2015, 06:52:47 pm »

Quote from: ted572 on January 09, 2015, 05:29:29 pm

Quote from: Firetank on January 08, 2015, 08:09:15 pm
Hi Gents, this evening i just received the VB1020 kit and the full software key.

Firetank:

Congratulations on you new DSA815-TG. I'm sure you will enjoy it very much. Although I want to to caution you that Rigol has been having problems with their 'expensive' VB1020 VSWR Bridge for the last couple of years. And as a result they have lowered the specifications a couple of time since it was initially released for production. I included a plot of one I tested for a friend in 2013, but please note that they have since reduced the Return Loss Specification to 20dB typical and 15dB minimum. So if you measure your new unit I expect that it could possibly be worse than my test results were.

I have included some links for Return Loss Bridges that are available. You can also use a Mini-Circuits Directional Coupler (although what you get will be what you will have). You may be happier using a Return Loss Loss Bridge (that can be adjusted and tweaked at least a little A/R), and there are several available at reasonable cost ($70 to $150 is reasonable). And then you may want something even better(?). All of the units I referenced I think are probably at least as good as the VB1020 (yes, I believe even the cheapest). I would recommend returning your VB1020 for full refund, and by the way you have the VSWR Key, so that will remain on your DSA. Tell them that the performance is way too low for your use of a RLB, and you will get your full refund. The VB10220 is a nice clean package, but it doesn't work very well for its intended purpose.

What should a RLB have for a minimum Return Loss (with the UUT port terminated with an excellent 50 ohm termination)? Ideally 30dB minimum for general hobbyist measurements, 35dB is preferred, and 45dB minimum for laboratory type measurements. The amount of error, either to the worst, or 'incorrectly' to the better, can be very significant even with a Return Loss Spec. of 30dB. You may want to to do a little research about RLB's to understand and appreciate this.

Not recommended, but very inexpensive: http://www.ebay.com/itm/100M-1000MHz-RF-Reflection-Bridge-VSWR-SWR-Bridge-Antenna-Analyzer-Module/171589343360?_trksid=p2047675.c100009.m1982&_trkparms=aid%3D777000%26algo%3DABA.MBE%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20131227121020%26meid%3Da0eb29102f10459ba35638440de62a60%26pid%3D100009%26prg%3D20131227121020%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D4%26

Again not recommended, but still inexpensive: http://www.ebay.com/itm/3MHz-1200MHz-RF-Reflection-Bridge-Directional-VSWR-SWR-Bridge-Antenna-Analyzer-/171521995972?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27ef81f4c4

Is 500MHz enough for you(?): http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-1-500-MHZ-reflection-bridge-standing-wave-bridge-rf-bridge-/111510492079?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item19f68b13af

This may be a good option: http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-1-1000MHz-1GHz-reflection-VSWR-bridge-bridge-bridge-RF-SWR-bridge-/131329059012?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e93d268c4

This is probably a Best choice: http://www.amtronix.com/rlb.htm Note that it needs a reference '50 Ohm Termination', and one to check its Return Loss* capability (* you will need this with any RLB you buy, or make).

Edit by Ted572: Added the following information. 1/10/2015: Added Mini-Circuits ZFDC-20-4 Return Loss Data.

Explore all of the available RLB options: Search eBay, Google, etc yourself. Do you want to buy or make yourself, and most important what capability suites your primary interest?
Recommended 50 Ohm Termination: Mini Circuits (MCL) model KARN-50-18+, N male connector, 2 Watts, DC to 18GHz, $14 each (brand new). http://www.minicircuits.com/pdfs/KARN-50-18+.pdf This is an excellent 50 Ohm Termination. You can spend up to ten times more money from other sources, but I don't think you will get any better quality than what this unit has. If you are going to build your own RLB, then I suggest getting at least two (2). One for the reference termination, and one to use for checking (calibration) for your available Return Loss. You can see a KARN-50-18+ on the back side of my RLB (50 Ohm REF).

Hi TED, thank you so much for the information.... This really makes me go mad now.... I have just came back from abroad, i was away for the last 2 months

i will check and see what i can do

Ray

videobruce · « **Reply #553 on:** March 02, 2015, 10:46:03 am »

hpux735;
You didn't need to use the quote function for a simple reply, especially for a long quote.

Firetank · « **Reply #554 on:** March 02, 2015, 02:20:22 pm »

Well i did use the quote function cause the reply for the post goes back for about 2 months as i stated.

But thanks for your advice, i will keep that in mind.

Garnet · « **Reply #555 on:** March 04, 2015, 08:50:48 pm »

As to the power sweep issue. My SA arrived this morning and one of the first things I did was confirmed that (in its "virgin" configuration) it has the sweep issue.
Main board: 00.08
RF board: 00.05
Digital board: 00.04
F/W Ver: 00.01.09
Boot Ver: 00.01 04

TEquipment directed me to call Rigol. Steve @ Rigol was unaware of what I described but called back a few hours later after researching. What he told me on the phone is summed up in his email to me:

"Hello Garnet,

I found some detail on the power sweep issue.

We are expecting a fix for this soon in firmware. I don't have all the details on this yet but there seems to be a combination of firmware and hardware versions that impact power sweep.

Was this analyzer purchased in the last 30 days? Please email back the serial number when you have a chance.

Best regards,

Steve Huss"

He assigned me a case number and stated he would keep me informed. I trust this will be helpful to those interested,

Garnet

Howardlong · « **Reply #556 on:** March 04, 2015, 09:15:21 pm »

Quote from: Garnet on March 04, 2015, 08:50:48 pm

As to the power sweep issue. My SA arrived this morning and one of the first things I did was confirm...

He assigned me a case number and stated he would keep me informed. I trust this will be helpful to those interested,

Indeed, thank you for the update. The description regarding a hardware version specific fault would make sense.

N8AUM · « **Reply #557 on:** March 04, 2015, 10:52:22 pm »

TEquipment directed me to call Rigol. Steve @ Rigol was unaware of what I described but called back a few hours later after researching.

Thats funny, Back in early part of January Steve from Rigol asked me to send a screen shot of the power sweep not working DUH !
When someone figures out how to send something that isnt there, pls let me know !
Any ways, I sent him a screen shot with power sweep enabled, +10db. Next day he wrote me and told me to send it back for an exchange.

Wall-E · « **Reply #558 on:** March 05, 2015, 12:14:53 am »

Re. Post 567, 568, and 569: The Key here is that name removed at Rigol (email removed ) is UNAWARE, was UNAWARE 3 months ago, will still be UNAWARE 3 months from now, and is Fully Incompetent. Ask him about any of the Rigol equipment and you will find out that he's not that familiar with it, or Simply UNAWARE. Rigol has enough problems with their firmware booming out years after product release, and them they have guys like name removed in Product Support. What are they thinking? They essentially have very nice affordable products and then they screw it all up with Lingering and New (when they make a little hardware change) Firmware issues, and a UNAWARE Product Support Specialist.

Post modified due to personal nature of post

N8AUM · « **Reply #559 on:** March 05, 2015, 12:49:42 am »

Quote from: Wall-E on March 05, 2015, 12:14:53 am

Re. Post 567, 568, and 569: The Key here is that name removed at Rigol (email removed) is UNAWARE, was UNAWARE 3 months ago, will still be UNAWARE 3 months from now, and is Fully Incompetent. Ask him about any of the Rigol equipment and you will find out that he's not that familiar with it, or Simply UNAWARE. Rigol has enough problems with their firmware booming out years after product release, and them they have guys like name removed in Product Support. What are they thinking? They essentially have very nice affordable products and then they screw it all up with Firmware issues and a UNAWARE Product Support Specialist.

Good one !!!

Post modified due to the personal nature of this post.

N8AUM · « **Reply #560 on:** March 06, 2015, 01:43:49 am »

My new replacement 815-TG came in today and the power sweep is NOT functioning. Not a big deal but handy feature to have. This unit seems to be from this last batch that came in several weeks ago.
Option 3 was not enabled

but the rest of the options have 34 hrs left.

system info is:

Main Board: 00.08
RF Board FPGA: 00.05
Digital Board FPGA: 00.04
Firmware 00.01.09
Boot:00.01.04

I sure hope someone is working on option 3 !

Zucca · « **Reply #561 on:** March 06, 2015, 06:34:27 am »

Quote from: N8AUM on March 06, 2015, 01:43:49 am

... is NOT functioning..

I give them 40 days to fix it. If there will be not a new FW, I will never buy a Rigol again.
A pissed off customer which thinks never go cheap again.

N8AUM · « **Reply #562 on:** March 06, 2015, 01:13:53 pm »

Quote from: zucca on March 06, 2015, 06:34:27 am

Quote from: N8AUM on March 06, 2015, 01:43:49 am
... is NOT functioning..

I give them 40 days to fix it. If there will be not a new FW, I will never buy a Rigol again.
A pissed off customer which thinks never go cheap again.

I dont understand how so many units can make it past their final testing unless they figure that not to many people will be using that function. I am new to Rigol products and own 2 DS1102E and the 815 and for the money they are a great deal. I hope that its just FW and not a hardware issue. To bad that my unit has the latest bootloader so I cannot try any of the previous versions.

thebobster · « **Reply #563 on:** March 06, 2015, 04:30:26 pm »

Please be kind and take this as a legitimate question/concern. Rigol has a 3 year warranty, which is void if you make any mods, such as the mod to "stop the clock" on trial keys. If, within 3 years, the device breaks, what do you do???

I understand the advantages of making the mod, but am trying to decide if the features gained are worth the risk of having a device that is no longer under warranty.

Pros? Cons? Maybe something I haven't considered?

As far as changes/improvements, though confusing from a test/compatibility prospective, you have to give Rigol credit that they are continuing to change and improve their product after release, though the variables with hardware and firmware versions can be difficult to manage.

As far as posts that are anonymous personal attacks against specific individuals in support, does that really add value and is it fair? What is someone posted your real name and similar criticisms on public forums? How would you feel?

Because of the sheer size of Rigol's products under support, is it really fair for us to expect a support person to be a Subject Matter Expert (SME) on every product, and to label someone as "UNAWARE" because they are trying to help you and were not a SME on the particular product you are calling about? Ref http://www.rigolna.com/products/

Would you say it using your REAL NAME and to the person's face?

It is easy to criticize people anonymously online, but it doesn't make it right, fair or helpful, or being a community to conduct civil discourse.

Now I fully expect some anonymous flaming by some tech-trolls, which will only serve to prove my point...

If you intend to do so, please take a minute to think about what I said before you do.

Is it right, fair and helpful, and if it were done to you, how would you feel?

Is it worth clouding every constructive post you ever made, or will make in the future with a record of abusive posts, where people attribute it as coming from a jerk who might launch an attack against you if they don't like what you say?

saturation · « **Reply #564 on:** March 07, 2015, 04:14:01 pm »

If you truly need any SA for a particular task, hacking risks bricking, and thus the task to be done, is not done. If a new purchase device fails to meet your measurement task OOB make sure you use a vendor that accepts returns for a full refund.

OTAH, if one is evaluating new pieces of equipment for its own sake, say to add to your lab, bricking it is part of the game of hacking, if hacking is part of what you do during evaluation. Thus, without an actual need for a piece of gear, you can wait for it to be repaired or DIY if possible.

So in the end, it depends what the end use of the T&M gear purchase is for.

Note the warranty experience varies by country, so if you are not in a country with a Rigol rep, there may be no warranty to speak off. So risking damaging a device that is effectively without warranty is a higher risk, regardless of its end purpose.

I only hack gear I can afford to lose, so hacking becomes pure gain to my use.

Quote from: thebobster on March 06, 2015, 04:30:26 pm

Please be kind and take this as a legitimate question/concern. Rigol has a 3 year warranty, which is void if you make any mods, such as the mod to "stop the clock" on trial keys. If, within 3 years, the device breaks, what do you do???

I understand the advantages of making the mod, but am trying to decide if the features gained are worth the risk of having a device that is no longer under warranty.

jimgeb · « **Reply #565 on:** March 13, 2015, 06:28:09 am »

Received my new Rigol DSA 815-TG. Power sweep failure also. Must be a bad batch from what I see on this forum. Probably don't need it but will contact Rigol to see when and if they will have a fix. Thinking of returning it but maybe a big hassle unless something else comes up. Just a hobbyist learning about spectrum analyzers. I guess I shouldn't expect too much from an entry level piece of equipment.

N8AUM · « **Reply #566 on:** March 13, 2015, 07:57:48 am »

Jim, welcome to the club. Sorry to hear that your power sweep function is not working. Seems that the problem sprung up with the latest hardware/firmware combo. Not sure when or if Rigol is working on solution or not. Personally I can live without PS function. You cant beat it for the price. Hope you enjoy playing with your new toy !

thebobster · « **Reply #567 on:** March 13, 2015, 06:42:57 pm »

Has anybody tried using a block down-converter to throw Wi-Fi Freqs into the freq range of the 815 so they can be monitored?

If so, any recommendations on hardware? I understand that it won't be frequency accurate nor the cleanest way to do it, and there will be the frequency conversion issues, noise, measurements would be uncalibrated etc etc... This is mainly to point antennas etc.

Thanks!

jimgeb · « **Reply #568 on:** March 13, 2015, 08:04:17 pm »

Steve Huss of Rigol got back to me today on the power sweep issue and he said, I quote:

" This is a bug we were just recently made aware of. It happened after a recent hardware update and will be corrected with the next firmware update. I don't know exactly when the new firmware will be available but it is a high priority item. I would check back by the end of the month".

Let's hope it gets corrected soon especially for the people who use this feature.
Jim

N8AUM · « **Reply #569 on:** March 13, 2015, 08:45:59 pm »

Quote from: thebobster on March 13, 2015, 06:42:57 pm

Has anybody tried using a block down-converter to throw Wi-Fi Freqs into the freq range of the 815 so they can be monitored?

If so, any recommendations on hardware? I understand that it won't be frequency accurate nor the cleanest way to do it, and there will be the frequency conversion issues, noise, measurements would be uncalibrated etc etc... This is mainly to point antennas etc.

Thanks!

I use a mixer and a 1Ghz Lo and the accuracy will depend on the Lo

Björn · « **Reply #570 on:** March 24, 2015, 05:23:09 pm »

Hi all,

Just found this great forum and this topic about the 815.
Maybe this has been passed many times, but I have some questions about the firmware.
And I want to absolutely be sure I am having it all understood right.
I was reading about the v1.09 and the v1.12 firmware.

My DSA has the v1.07 firmware with the v1.03 bootloader.
All features unlocked "forever"

1. Can I safely upgrade to v1.09 or v1.12? and will all my unlocked options still be available?
2. What version should I upgrade too?, from the rigol website I can only get the v1.12?
3. If I want to have the v1.09 where to get it?
4. Is there any website I can download older versions? to revert back?

Here is a screenshot of my system menu:

Hope someone can point me out where to go and what to do..

73
Bjorn de PD5DJ

KD0RC · « **Reply #571 on:** March 24, 2015, 11:00:38 pm »

Quote from: Björn on March 24, 2015, 05:23:09 pm

1. Can I safely upgrade to v1.09 or v1.12? and will all my unlocked options still be available?
2. What version should I upgrade too?, from the rigol website I can only get the v1.12?
3. If I want to have the v1.09 where to get it?
4. Is there any website I can download older versions? to revert back?

Hi Bjorn,
1. Yes and Yes.
2. I have 1.12 on mine and it is fine.
3 & 4. I don't know how to go back or get older versions.

Len

ted572 · « **Reply #572 on:** March 25, 2015, 01:45:52 am »

Quote from: Björn on March 24, 2015, 05:23:09 pm

Hi all,

Just found this great forum and this topic about the 815.
Maybe this has been passed many times, but I have some questions about the firmware.
And I want to absolutely be sure I am having it all understood right.
I was reading about the v1.09 and the v1.12 firmware.

My DSA has the v1.07 firmware with the v1.03 bootloader.
All features unlocked "forever"

1. Can I safely upgrade to v1.09 or v1.12? and will all my unlocked options still be available?
2. What version should I upgrade too?, from the rigol website I can only get the v1.12?
3. If I want to have the v1.09 where to get it?
4. Is there any website I can download older versions? to revert back?

Hope someone can point me out where to go and what to do..

73
Bjorn de PD5DJ

Bjorn: As long as you have Boot Loader .03 you will be able to go to Firmware 00.0.12 and then go back in the future if need be.
Please see -> https://www.eevblog.com/forum/testgear/spectrum-analyzer-rigol-dsa815/msg513125/#msg513125 for how to go back to a previous firmware. If you don't have all of the Options installed, Re. using Riglol 1.0c or d Keygenerator you should install any first if you are missing any. And you are all set to install the Options with your Firmware 00.01.07.

You definitely should install firmware 00.01.12, as it includes all the latest improvements and updates. Don't even bother with FW 00.01.09. The 00.01.12 Firmware will retain your current .03 Boor Loader, so you will still be able to go back to an earlier Firmware if required. Where as those with Boot Loader .04 that was added with the new Maim Board Hardware V. 07/08 in recent DSA815's are stuck, and they have what they have. You are very fortunate that you don't have one of the newer DSA815s.

Read through these postings to understand more. If you get lost, I will help you. . . Just send me a EEVblog PM (personal message).
Keygenerator -> http://gotroot.ca/rigol/riglol-103d/
Firmware Request -> http://beyondmeasure.rigoltech.com/acton/form/1579/0012:d-0001/1/index.htm?id=0012,
Good Luck, Ted

Björn · « **Reply #573 on:** March 25, 2015, 12:03:01 pm »

Hi Ed and Len

Thanks for the kind reply

I will perform the update tonight, and will let you guys know how it went.

--- Edit ---

And the rig is updated, no problems at all, all went smoothly..

Thanks!!!

coflynn · « **Reply #574 on:** March 27, 2015, 12:04:16 am »

Just as a note, I successfully performed the update to 01.12 with fairly old HW/bootloader, my versions were as follows:

Version of Main Board: 00.01
Version of Radio Frequency Board FPGA: 00.05
Version of Firmware: 00.01.07
Version of Boot: 00.01.01

Only reporting as most of the posts had more recent main boards or bootloaders!

EDIT: This didn't affect the status of licenses either.


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Author Topic: Spectrum Analyzer - Rigol DSA815 (Read 619215 times)

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