Mµ Thermal Imager - real or fake?

[Fraser]

Let us not forget that revolutionary thermal imaging chip that they claim is NOT new, just used in a clever way..... FLIR have gone with a new engine so I would love to know what Mu have actually been playing with all this time. If that is proven to be bogus..... Mu will be shown to have mislead their 'investors' as that is a key component to any such design. If they really did have a radical new idea using an old technology that is cheap, I feel sure they could sell that design on its own without all the crap to connect it to a phone !

[mikeselectricstuff]

I was thinking the same thing as well. It'd be hilarious if Mu Optics ends up buying the sensors from FLIR.

I understand that FLIR have bought at least one sensor manufacturer (ULIS), so it seems likely... Assuming they are actually buying anything from anyone.

[peter.mitchell]

Assuming they are actually buying anything from anyone...

Aside from holidays in the Bahamas...

[FrankBuss]

At least looks like the competition helps with the price. You can get a Fluke VT02 for about $600 now, no need to wait some more years for an indiegogo project, and you don't need an iPhone either. I remember that some years ago it started with some k$ for devices from FLIR.

[EEVblog]

Incidentally I wonder how many of the IGG suckers are outside the US - on the outside chace thay ever get to being able to ship anything, and it's 30FPS as they claim, someone will have a lot of export paperwork to deal with.

That's what I was thinking. If no other manufacturer can ship greater than 9fps outside the US, how can Mu do it legally? Of course, they almost certainly have nothing to ship anyway, so the whole point is moot.

[EEVblog]

Let us not forget that revolutionary thermal imaging chip that they claim is NOT new, just used in a clever way..... FLIR have gone with a new engine so I would love to know what Mu have actually been playing with all this time.

IIRC they claimed to have used sensor that had "been on the market for some time", and that was maybe 7-8 months ago now.
So a low cost 160x120 thermal sensor capable of 30fps, that has been on the market for at least a year, and the only company that has come out with something is Flir, and that uses a new sensor and won't be available for months.
The Mu story is as crusty as it's always been.

[Hypernova]

At least looks like the competition helps with the price. You can get a Fluke VT02 for about $600 now, no need to wait some more years for an indiegogo project, and you don't need an iPhone either. I remember that some years ago it started with some k$ for devices from FLIR.

Given the advent of Flir E4 that price for the VT02 is one digit too much.

[FrankBuss]

Given the advent of Flir E4 that price for the VT02 is one digit too much.

Where can you get it for $60? At Amazon the Flir E4 costs $995. And the VT02 costs $449.96 at Amazon, even cheaper than what I found first at eBay. I think I should buy one

[ixfd64]

I have a feeling the E4 will soon have a price drop as well.

[Rasz]

Incidentally I wonder how many of the IGG suckers are outside the US - on the outside chace thay ever get to being able to ship anything, and it's 30FPS as they claim, someone will have a lot of export paperwork to deal with.

That's what I was thinking. If no other manufacturer can ship greater than 9fps outside the US, how can Mu do it legally? Of course, they almost certainly have nothing to ship anyway, so the whole point is moot.

This whole 'omg ze US reztrictions" is imo whole lot of BS seeing as E4 is manufactured in HungaryEstonia.

[ataradov]

This whole 'omg ze US reztrictions" is imo whole lot of BS seeing as E4 is manufactured in Hungary?

If company has at least some people employed (even if it is just a sales department or support) in the US, then it falls under the restrictions of ITAR.

[Fraser]

For those unaware, I explained the ITAR situation on fps, and the Estonian built E4 here:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/reviews/flir-e4-the-useful-information-thread/msg349832/#msg349832

It may appear 'out of date' or 'stupid' to some, but it is current and enforceable in law.

[Hypernova]

Given the advent of Flir E4 that price for the VT02 is one digit too much.

Where can you get it for $60? At Amazon the Flir E4 costs $995. And the VT02 costs $449.96 at Amazon, even cheaper than what I found first at eBay. I think I should buy one

Even with the reduced price of the VT02 it's bad deal, at double the price you get several orders of magnitude more pixels if you know what to do. I am not suggesting that the E4 is cheap but the VT02 is in a very awkward price bracket the moment E4 became available.

[andtfoot]

"Charles McGrath posted an announcement 6 hours ago

Hello All,

It's been a good week, we've gotten great responses from all of our suppliers as they, and we, are redoubling our effort to get the MuOptics camera to market as fast as possible. Everyone is either hard at work or sleeping. Weekends are workdays. Things are progressing rapidly and we are in the stretch run. We're on the schedule as mentioned in the previous update. We're trully gaining a sense of pride in what we are accomplishing. Hang in there, it's right around the corner.

Cheers,

-MuOptics"


Sooooo... yep, same amount of non-information as normal.

[EEVblog]

Sooooo... yep, same amount of non-information as normal.

Wow, why do they bother?
And it comes down to the same argument that's being going on for 9 months now after every update. If they are so close, why haven't they ever shown a single thermal image?

[Fraser]

Reminds me of the long walks my father led us on around the coast of Cornwall...." the end is just around the next corner "....... it never was 

[thoenig2]

ICYMI

Hello All,

We are planning on a Friday update this week, but we thought we would quickly speak about the FLIR ONE that was just announced yesterday morning at the Consumer Electronics Show(CES) in Las Vegas.

As we believed when we started this project, the advent of thermal imaging for the consumer marketplace was nearly upon us. The FLIR ONE is an iPhone 5 and 5s thermal imaging case attachment. We've been hearing rumors about this device for a couple of months now, and have been looking forward to seeing exactly what they were developing. Our anticipation of this announcement has of course involved both nervousness and excitement. Having a competing product from a company like FLIR is certainly something that we have been nervous about, however the flip-side to this is that a huge name in infrared imaging has just confirmed our belief that there is a huge market for affordable infrared imaging products.

We see that a few of our supporters have noticed FLIR's press release and have posed a few questions. Let me fill you all in with as much as we know. The FLIR ONE works with only the iPhone 5 and 5s. It has a physical connection to the phone and an incorporated visible light camera that is used to clarify the thermal images. The FLIR ONE is an impressive device that utilizes a brand new sensor that is much, much smaller than previous sensors, either from FLIR or their competitors. This sensor core is called the Lepton Core. The FLIR ONE does not yet have a published spatial resolution or frame rate, however we believe it to be somewhere between 50x50 and 80x80 pixels, with a frame rate around 10fps. FLIR ONE is expected to be available sometime in the spring of 2014.

We are four weeks away from final prototypes with our camera.  We are scheduled to hand over a number of them to distributors both here and overseas in the middle of February.  At that time we believe we'll be very close to mass manufacturing and distribution.   We expect to begin mass production at the beginning of April.

When we first began designing what would become our final product, we had a lot of planning to do. Decision such as what phones and devices we should support, how to move data from the camera to the host device, what sort of features will benefit the most use cases, etc. During that planning phase we designed the camera that you all will be receiving. The Mu Optics camera has many features that we believe will allow us to actively compete with the new FLIR camera even as both products prepare to enter the market. The Mu Optics camera utilizes WiFi, allowing the user to separate the camera from the phone or tablet. This means that it is easy to examine the thermal scene in hard to reach places. The Mu camera will be accessible for those who want to program it for their own purposes. Our camera has an active shutter, has a frame rate greater than 30FPS with higher resolution. The Mu camera works with nearly any device and OS, and will continue to work with any new phone that a user purchases.

As a CNET article from yesterday stated, "Let the thermal games begin."

Thank you all for your patience, it's been a much harder device to develop than we first thought, but we are excited to be nearing the finish line.

Cheers,

-Mu Optics
[
My company, GTI Predictive technology developed a vibration analyzer, balancer, and alignment on the iPad platform. The MuOptics device would complete our vision to have thermal imaging as well can you or any one help me get in touch with MUOptics? We can help their entry into the predictive/reliability market. We have a software app ready to go.
thoenig2@me.com

[thoenig2]

Hello all,
My company, GTI Predictive Technology developed a vibration analyzer, balancer, and alignment on the iPad platform. The MuOptics device would complete our vision to have thermal imaging as well. Can you or any one help me get in touch with MUOptics? We can help their entry into the predictive/reliability market. We have a software app ready to go.
thoenig2@me.com

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/Smileys/default/icon_smile_thumbsup.gif

[EEVblog]

Hello all,
My company, GTI Predictive Technology developed a vibration analyzer, balancer, and alignment on the iPad platform. The MuOptics device would complete our vision to have thermal imaging as well. Can you or any one help me get in touch with MUOptics?

You know their "product" appears to be vaporware, right?
Their contact emails are in the comments section on indiegogo. Good luck!

[Fraser]

FLIR One would be a better route to investigate....speak to FLIR, at least they know what they are doing and have a product at a very reasonable price. Work with professionals not a company that has shown itself to be a poor communicator with an apparent loose grip on the real world of thermography. I believe the statement...."I wouldn't touch them with a barge pole" applies.

[thoenig2]

MUOptics does seem to post updates, but no matter how I try and reach their company, I can not get through. I guess this is why this thread was started. I am already aware of Flir's new device and I rely like it. I was more intrigued with MUOptics versatility of working on multiple devices. If I can only get them to contact me or call me back.

[EEVblog]

If I can only get them to contact me or call me back.

It seems no one has ever been able to get a call or contact back, except for the eventual refund requests being granted.

[BravoV]

It seems no one has ever been able to get a call or contact back, except for the eventual refund requests being granted.

... and hopefully they wont dry up for the refund requests. 

[Rasz]

MUOptics does seem to post updates, but no matter how I try and reach their company, I can not get through. I guess this is why this thread was started. I am already aware of Flir's new device and I rely like it. I was more intrigued with MUOptics versatility of working on multiple devices. If I can only get them to contact me or call me back.

Their fake movie effects company had real physical location, but they moved "somewhere" after the crowd funding campaign ;-)

[EEVblog]

So it's almost time for Mu to cough up, based on their post a month ago:

We are four weeks away from final prototypes with our camera.  We are scheduled to hand over a number of them to distributors both here and overseas in the middle of February.  At that time we believe we'll be very close to mass manufacturing and distribution.   We expect to begin mass production at the beginning of April.

Who going to guess what the next update will be?