Advice on setting up a low-mid volume SMT line for <$130k?

[nisma]

"dedicated air-ride truck," this are trucks with better suspensions for carrying art or computer equipment minimizing vibrations. It don't mean there is no
intermediary loading/unloading. "point to point dedicated air-ride truck" is the term used for what you have supposed.

[jmelson]

The space has been upgraded a bit to 700 sq. ft. That will be ~1000 sq. ft. once the room next door opens up and then I can take that wall down. So it's a little more room to breathe. The feeders should come with carts/racks.

What sorts of other precautions would you all recommend as far as room preparation? So far I have this sequence:

- Install double doors
- Run electrical service (will be done by building owner), 100A or 200A dedicated breaker.

More space will NEVER hurt!  Will you have your own subpanel?  Be rally handy to have your own breakers for the inidvidual machines.  100A 208/3Phase is actually a lot of power.

- Clean the hell out of every surface in the room, floors, walls (brick), ceilings

**BRICK** walls?  Yikes, you do know bricks shed dust, every time you walk past them some dust comes off.  Doesn't sound like the greatest environment.  You don't need to work in a class 100 clean room, but bare bricks would maybe not be best.  If they are painted and the paint actually sticks, that might not be too bad.

- Coat the floor with static-dissipative paint ($200/gallon x 4 gallons)
- Install HEPA air filtration unit to keep the dust down
- Install de-humidifier
- Install air conditioner
- Sticky floor pads like this for people walking in.

HUH?  Brick walls and you are worried about sticky mats?

THEN start moving equipment into the room. From the machine specs I will need like a ~5HP air compressor. Not sure this can go outside so if not it will need to be something relatively quiet like a Kaeser. Another several $k right there. Then an air dryer (harbor freight) and filtration.

Note that air compressors are sometimes not clean (they can release water spray and oil mist), and they can also produce a LOT of heat.  Kaeser is rotary screw, so they generate a lot of oil mist in the compressed air, as well, and you need to worry about that getting into the machines.  (They do have oil-free, you probably don't want to know what those cost!)

Jon

[ar__systems]

The feeder pick-up locations are generally pre-programmed into the machine.  It can be taught the pick-up location for one specific feeder on the rail, and then all other feeders are computed from that one.
So, if you work that way, each feeder should bring the part to the same location, relative to the dowel pin holes that the feeder mounts to.  I have a home-made tool that mostly came from the guy I bought my machine from, I added a bridge over the feeder with a cross-hair to view the component pocket.  Sometimes dirt or dings cause the feeder to tilt, causing the pocket to end up left/right of the expected position.  Or, the sprocket and ratchet assembly drifts a bit, and the pocket is forward or backward of nominal.  The calibration tool allows you to see this error and adjust things until the pocket is properly centred.

Jon

I thought something like that... is that available for Yamaha CL feeders? I could not find any screws or anything else on them to make such adjustment.

[Corporate666]

Placing large pad count components is slower due to the part mass?

No, it may be that small passives are placed blind, but anything with more than 2 leads has to use vision, and that slows the machine down.  Or, maybe the larger parts have more mis-picks or something.
Possibly, this is an added factor for manual programming.  But, I can't imagine many people manually program a P&P.  I have never done it, even my VERY FIRST board was programmed from the CAD/CAM data.

Jon

That depends on the machine.  At least on the Quads, there is an alignment system that is perfectly fine for 0603's, SOT's, SOIC's and such.

There is also an upward facing camera that can be specified for when you need higher accuracy - but I've only ever needed it for fine pitch stuff in larger package sizes, which is an additional trip for the placement head to that camera.  But the determining factor is fine pitch vs not, rather than 2 leads vs more than 2 leads.  My machine will place a board full of SOIC's just as quickly as it places a board full of 0603's.  You can slow down the acceleration for things like a big TQFP, but that's also the case for a heavy 2 lead inductor.  And nozzle changes have a greater impact than the acceleration differences for those parts.

On my Fuji, there was a similar system with a downward facing camera for basic alignment, and an upward facing camera when you needed more accuracy. 

[Corporate666]

**BRICK** walls?  Yikes, you do know bricks shed dust, every time you walk past them some dust comes off.  Doesn't sound like the greatest environment.  You don't need to work in a class 100 clean room, but bare bricks would maybe not be best.  If they are painted and the paint actually sticks, that might not be too bad.

Note that air compressors are sometimes not clean (they can release water spray and oil mist), and they can also produce a LOT of heat.  Kaeser is rotary screw, so they generate a lot of oil mist in the compressed air, as well, and you need to worry about that getting into the machines.  (They do have oil-free, you probably don't want to know what those cost!)

Jon

IMO you are waaaay over-thinking this.

Brick walls are a non issue.  There are tons of old mill buildings from the 1800's around here that have been converted to cool/chic modern office/light industrial buildings, and tons of electronics/R&D/high-tech start-ups are in these spaces, tons of which are doing electronics type work.  I've bought plenty of equipment from such places and all of these buildings are brick inside and out.  No problems whatsoever.  Even the OP's idea of static dissipative paint and floor pads isn't necessary, IMO, but it won't hurt. 

As for the compressor, a quiet compressor is really nice for your sanity, but all compressors are going to introduce oil and moisture into the air lines.  This is a non issue because there are filtration systems which are perfectly capable of removing whatever is in the air to whatever level you need it removed.




SVFeingold, look at dental compressors on eBay.  I have a Jun-Air 36-150 which I dearly love, but I believe they are well over $10k new... but it's 56db when running, which is really nice.  There are other models which are extremely quiet also (Silent Air, DynAir, etc)... Kaesers are fantastic industrial compressors but keep in mind many industrial compressors do not come with a tank - they are designed to be installed in an air system.  But really, a Kaeser rotary screw compressor is so overkill for running a couple of PnP's that I don't see why you would be looking at one of those.  Where did you get the 5HP number from?  Did you get a CFM and PSI number from Assembleon?  Does the machine use air only for vacuum on picking up parts or are the feeders also pneumatic? 

As far as electrical service goes... keep an eye on that.  A 5HP compressor is going to need at least a 220V/20A circuit.  If you have 100A service, and you are running a reflow oven, air conditioning, two PnP's, a compressor, lights and all the other equipment... you might be putting a strain on the power you've got.  The PnP's won't draw too much, but a big reflow oven sure will.  Air conditioning will.  And a 5hp compressor will.  You don't want a situation where your A/C kicks in while the reflow oven is in pre-heat and the compressor is running and that blows your main breaker, causing everything to shut off while the PnP's were in the middle of placing something.  Just keep an eye on overall power draws.

[Corporate666]

And lastly, with all due respect to the previous poster who mentioned selling feeders, I could not disagree more.  You won't get much for them at all, and invariably the ones you have will break, jam, become problem feeders or whatever.  It really is sooooo nice to have lots of extra feeders.  Taking half-used reels off feeders is a bitch, and you inevitably lose components in the process. 

If you don't have the room in your workshop for them, keep them at home or in a friends basement or rent a storage unit - I would bet my bottom dollar it would be worth it.  One day you will be so glad to have that repository of feeders when you need another 10 or 20 or you have a bunch of feeders on the fritz and don't have time to clean and adjust them.  The money you will save not having to send them out to be cleaned/repaired and just grabbing others from your stash will faaaar outweigh any revenue you'll get by selling them up-front.

Plus, it's not like the value of the feeders is dropping - if you wind up not using them, you can always sell them later or sell them with the machine at some future date.  If I haven't driven the point home enough yet - I'll add this... words you will never hear any pick and place owner say ever... "You know, I just have way too many feeders... I wish I had less". 

[SVFeingold]

Hey guys, thanks for the responses! I actually just wrapped up a 3 hour meeting with a Trans-Tec (Yamaha) service tech, more on that later.

I'm aware that brick walls shed, and I can cover them if needed, but I think a giant HEPA filter unit that can be had for relatively cheap will take good care of it. As the service tech told me "you think all the guys running these machines in Mexico have air conditioned dust-free rooms?"

If I can put the compressor outside it'll be nice, or at least in the hallway where it won't take up space. Then I could just build a box around it to keep the noise down. The tech told me for these machines I'll need about 12 CFM @ 5 bar per machine. Plus whatever the stencil printer takes. So call it 30CFM. Both PnPs use pnuematic feeders. So a decent sized compressor. Granted these are on the conservative side with the machines running full tilt. He recommended a dedicated 20A breaker for each PnP, probably same for the stencil printer, 100A for the oven, whatever the A/C and dehumidifier draw, and the compressor. So I think 200A will do it. Each one should be on its own breaker which makes perfect sense to me.

As for the tech, I talked to him a lot about the capabilities, spare parts, maintenance, etc... He even called 2 customers and had me talk to them. Granted they could be cherry picked but they both seemed very happy with the machines and said that aside from operator-induced damage (leaving a feeder on top of the machine where the head runs into it) they've never had to do any service aside from routine maintenance like seals/grease. One client had the same types of machines running since 1998 and still in production. He's setting up a visit to a company (major defense contractor specializing in electronics) where they are running these machines. Certainly gives me comfort.

I got a good impression from the TransTec guy. He didn't hesitate to point me to third parties for feeders/nozzles if it made sense. He said they don't try to force people into service contracts for things like calibrations, and in my case a service contract isn't necessary. They offered to come out when the machines are delivered to check everything as it comes off the truck. Phone support is free, latest software is free, service calls if you need them might be $140-$180 per hour. Spares are still being manufactured today for both the machines I'm looking at. 

As for shipping I explained my plans and concerns. I was told that the moisture barrier is an unnecessary expense nif it's in a dedicated air-ride truck. Shrink wrap and desiccant should cover it along with shock and tilt sensors. As for vibration damping I was told it's also unnecessary, just put the machine on a sturdy pallet and shrink wrap it then secure it in the truck. He's been there for over 20 years and says all of their machines are shipped this way from Yamaha and that they've never had an issue doing it this way. They DO seem quite sturdy. He also explained exactly how to secure the axes - if the seller doesn't have the brackets that do this it's OK to use some of those big-ass zipties. The heads on the Opal are spring-retract and don't *need* to be secured, the heads on the MG-8 are servo driven and can also just be loosely ziptied to keep them up.

The gist of it was he told me to relax and breathe, as long as the machines aren't moved between being loaded on the truck and unloaded at the destination they'll be fine, and it will be obvious if someone put a forklift through the machine or if it was removed from the truck during transit.

As for the stencil printer and reflow oven, these now seem like the biggest unknowns that I know the least about.

Agree on the feeders, I'll figure it out. I have 15' ceilings so it'll be easy enough to put the ones I don't need up there for storage.

[rx8pilot]

And lastly, with all due respect to the previous poster who mentioned selling feeders, I could not disagree more.  You won't get much for them at all, and invariably the ones you have will break, jam, become problem feeders or whatever.  It really is sooooo nice to have lots of extra feeders.  Taking half-used reels off feeders is a bitch, and you inevitably lose components in the process. 

I am constantly buying more and more feeders. Spares are great. Being able setup a job offline while the machine is running another is great. Some jobs are all 8mm tape, others need a lot of 12, 16, 24mm etc. Would not sell any feeders.

How do the 600 feeders break down in size? Are they all the same variants or are some 8mm only good for 0603 and a special precision model for small parts?

[SVFeingold]

The breakdown is:

364x - 8mm; 156 are 2mm pitch
79x - 12mm
69x - 16mm
56x - 24mm
4x - 32mm
2x - 44mm

A couple of JDEC tray feeders as well. No vibratory feeder but I don't remember the last time I had to use parts in a tube...

[rx8pilot]

I would love to have that available just for my one machine. Super easy to have a bunch of boards loaded and ready with spares that you can swap when a feeder gets fiddly or stops working at all.

un-loading and re-loading feeders is a slow process - I will avoid it as much as possible.

[SVFeingold]

How long does it take you to load/unload a feeder? I definitely don't have room in the dry box (planning on  this one) for all the feeders, but I assume that most passives don't need to be in a dry box, just things with silicon/plastic packages.

Can you unload a feeder without losing parts? I.e. cut the tape leaving 2 feet or however much extra, and wind it backwards onto the reel without dropping components?

I forgot the mention the feeders are about an even mix of FV and CL feeders (I think a few CLi also but no RFID on the machines).

Is there any kind of cheap inventory management? I.e. I buy a bar-code scanner on Amazon, hook it up to the machine, and scan reels so the machine can immediately load the part profile without me needing to hit a bunch of buttons.

[rx8pilot]

How long does it take you to load/unload a feeder? I definitely don't have room in the dry box (planning on  this one) for all the feeders, but I assume that most passives don't need to be in a dry box, just things with silicon/plastic packages.

Can you unload a feeder without losing parts? I.e. cut the tape leaving 2 feet or however much extra, and wind it backwards onto the reel without dropping components?

I forgot the mention the feeders are about an even mix of FV and CL feeders (I think a few CLi also but no RFID on the machines).

Is there any kind of cheap inventory management? I.e. I buy a bar-code scanner on Amazon, hook it up to the machine, and scan reels so the machine can immediately load the part profile without me needing to hit a bunch of buttons.

Swapping parts on a feeder is broken up into a number of steps - not a complete list....
1. figure out the feeder you need to swap - the machine software may or may not do a good job of prompting this.
2. Pull that feeder out and set it up on your changing station.
3. Unload the feeder - trimming the tail and possibly taping the cover tape to avoid part loss if they are valuable enough to worry about.
4. The old tape needs to be taped, bagged, etc to avoid losing track of what it is.
5. Go find the new tape - your storage system is pretty critical here.
6. Thread the new tape and setup the cover tape - this is easiest when the tape has a leader but if it is a tape previously loaded the 1st part may be right on the edge. My Quad feeders allow this, but it takes longer to tape on a cover tape leader.
7. index the tape the loading position and put it in the machine.
8. On the machine - you have to verify the position on some parts. The easy ones you can just put it in and go. On my machine, I may have to tweak the pickup position.

I would estimate 3-6 minutes per feeder if I don't have to search too hard for the new tape and nothing else comes up. Some of my PCB's have about 40 different parts or so - At 3 minutes per feeder that is 2hrs. At 6 minutes per it's 4 hrs.
If the feeders are pre-loaded and on a loading rack - it's about :15 per feeder. I keep about 80+ feeders in the machine which reduces the number of feeder swaps. I spend more time changing job than I do actually placing - so this is a critical part of the process for me. I continue to refine how I deal with parts, feeders, swaps, cut tape, part loss, etc.

Most of my stuff is very low-volume, so I REALLY don't want to spend hours setting up.

[Corporate666]

How long does it take you to load/unload a feeder? I definitely don't have room in the dry box (planning on  this one) for all the feeders, but I assume that most passives don't need to be in a dry box, just things with silicon/plastic packages.

Can you unload a feeder without losing parts? I.e. cut the tape leaving 2 feet or however much extra, and wind it backwards onto the reel without dropping components?

I forgot the mention the feeders are about an even mix of FV and CL feeders (I think a few CLi also but no RFID on the machines).

Is there any kind of cheap inventory management? I.e. I buy a bar-code scanner on Amazon, hook it up to the machine, and scan reels so the machine can immediately load the part profile without me needing to hit a bunch of buttons.

In addition to agreeing with everything rx8 wrote, are you getting a component baking oven?  It may not be realistic to keep all of your humidity sensitive parts in that cabinet - although I don't know how many you will have.

Do you have a specific JEDEC MSL level you are planning to meet or offer capability to handle for your customers?  I am not sure what the MSL is on all the various chips out there but some of them are 1-3 days from when the bag is opened until reflow.  Storing them in the dry cabinet is a good step but exposure to humidity above a given level, IIRC, requires baking to be compliant - and your assembly room could be above that level (again, IIRC it's a low humidity level for the more stringent MSL categories).

I've never had issues with it, but if you are planning to offer assembly services to third parties or especially using small/finer pitch stuff (AFAIK which has the tighter JEDEC MSL parameters), it may be something you get asked about or need to consider.

[jmelson]

I thought something like that... is that available for Yamaha CL feeders? I could not find any screws or anything else on them to make such adjustment.

I have somewhat older feeders on my machine, the CSM84.  The ratchet pawls are adjusted with eccentric rods that are secured with setscrews.  You can adjust the index position of the component pocket by about +/- 1 mm, I think.

I have no idea what they have available on the Chinese clone feeders.  But, I suspect REAL Yamaha feeders still have a very similar mechanism, just that it is driven by an air cylinder built into the feeder.

Jon

[jmelson]

That depends on the machine.  At least on the Quads, there is an alignment system that is perfectly fine for 0603's, SOT's, SOIC's and such.

Right, on my Philips CSM84, it has chuck jaws that close and center the part when the nozzle lifts all the way up.  Couldn't be faster.  It works well on MOST components, but has some problems with certain parts.  Aluminum electrolytics are round on top, so the jaws can't align the rotation.

There is also an upward facing camera that can be specified for when you need higher accuracy - but I've only ever needed it for fine pitch stuff in larger package sizes, which is an additional trip for the placement head to that camera.  But the determining factor is fine pitch vs not, rather than 2 leads vs more than 2 leads.  My machine will place a board full of SOIC's just as quickly as it places a board full of 0603's.

Yes, I can handle up to SOIC-16 parts, but the higher pin count and wide parts need to use the mechanical alignment station, which is slower.  I don't have a vision system on it.

Jon

[jmelson]

  Does the machine use air only for vacuum on picking up parts or are the feeders also pneumatic? 

I think the feeders are pneumatic, the door locks are pneumatic, and the nozzle Z feeds may be pneumatic.
(It may have one servo Z head for large/special parts.)

Jon

[jmelson]

How long does it take you to load/unload a feeder? I definitely don't have room in the dry box (planning on  this one) for all the feeders, but I assume that most passives don't need to be in a dry box, just things with silicon/plastic packages.

I can load a feeder in about 2 minutes.  Really no big deal.  Now, if it is a new piece of cut tape where I have to splice the cover tape, that might be 4 minutes.

Can you unload a feeder without losing parts? I.e. cut the tape leaving 2 feet or however much extra, and wind it backwards onto the reel without dropping components?

I certainly do not fret over losing 2-3 resistors when taking the tape/reel off the feeder.  Much better to dump them than have them flip in the pocket and cause the feeder to bind.  For ICs and larger parts I get in cut tape, then I usually put aside 2-3 pieces while threading the feeder and splicing the cover tape, then I manage to put them back in at the end of the cut tape piece.  If SOT-23 transistors or something, I put them in a spares bin for rework.

Yes, for parts that cost more than $0.25 or so, I can carefully remove the tape so it keeps the parts from spilling.  The Yamaha feeders peel back a VERY small amount of cover tape, so only a couple parts are exposed when you unthread.

Is there any kind of cheap inventory management? I.e. I buy a bar-code scanner on Amazon, hook it up to the machine, and scan reels so the machine can immediately load the part profile without me needing to hit a bunch of buttons.

Bar code scanner on the machine?  I haven't heard of that.  You are taking for the immediate future of one big job, so just have a printout of the feeder setup.  Just a list of feeder number and component description.  If you want to manage it with a spreadsheet, and keep track of stock on hand and how many parts are used per panel, that would be simple to set up.  That would make it easy to plan when to buy what parts.

For a one man shop, complex inventory management systems seem unnecessary.  I manage the parts for more than 15 products, and most of it is just a few boxes with reels ordered by component value.  I also have a few boxes that have parts that are used on only one product.  it really isn't that complicated.

At least my machine has a field in the feeder file that lists the component description, so that is one more place where error prevention can be helped.  Part of my system is I put masking tape on the side of the reel to hold down the end of the cover tape.  I write the component description on that with a Sharpie.  When the reel is put on the feeder, the tape is transferred onto the handle of the feeder.  That can be read from outside the machine.  This is just part of my "system".

Jon

Jon

[SVFeingold]

In addition to agreeing with everything rx8 wrote, are you getting a component baking oven?  It may not be realistic to keep all of your humidity sensitive parts in that cabinet - although I don't know how many you will have.

The cabinet has a baking function built in, 60C IIRC. Supposedly that works fine for baking parts without stressing them but I don't know if it's compliant to whatever standard (i.e. if the minimum is 12 hours at 125C and no less).

Bit of a laugh compared to the rest of this equipment but I do have a pretty sweet little toaster reflow I spent a week assembling/insulating with a Controleo2. I plan to upgrade it to a Controleo3 when that comes available which can do baking cycles. I couldn't fit more than a few reels in there, and probably no reels larger than ~8-10". And I definitely wouldn't feel great putting a reel worth $20k or some such in there...but it's something.

I'll have to read up on guidelines for MSL requirements. If it comes to it desiccant, humidity cards, and barrier bags are cheap enough. I kind of just assumed most fabs store all moisture sensitive parts in dry boxes but considering the cost of them...

It was my understanding that the MSL rating refers to time spent outside of optimal conditions. I.e. if a part has a shelf life of 2 days before requiring baking, then anytime it's in a non-dry environment the clock is ticking. I.e. you can take it out for a day and then put it in a dry box for a week, but when you remove it from the dry box you only have 1 day remaining until you need to bake it again.

[rx8pilot]

I can load a feeder in about 2 minutes.  Really no big deal.  Now, if it is a new piece of cut tape where I have to splice the cover tape, that might be 4 minutes.

For me - loading the feeder is about 25% of the overall effort.

For the pricey parts - dealing with short tapes adds up fairly quick. Putting them off to the side and re-loading them later takes time of course. I sometimes use the previous empty cut tape to load parts from the head and tail of the new tape - but that too takes time. Sometimes, I load a cut tape in the feeder, after a number of parts have been picked - I pull parts from the tail and add them back to the head since my feeders can't pick the last few inches of tape. That also takes time.

There are few things that take a lot of time. It comes down to a ton of things taking a little bit of time each. I find myself looking for a few seconds of process improvement when that process is repeated over and over - it adds up to hours, then days, then weeks of time saved. To me, that value equals money, nights, and weekends.

If any process takes longer than zero seconds - I do not categorize it as no big deal.

[SVFeingold]

Fully agree on that point rx8. If I stop and think about it too many of my days are taken up by a whole bunch of things that don't take much time independently.

corporate: Just checked the BOM, there's only one part with a MSL of 3 (168 hours), a few with MSL 2 (1 year) and the rest are unlimited. So pretty light requirements.

I had kind of assumed that if I have a sensitive part (say 24 hours) I could unbag it, run X boards, put the feeder/reel in the dry box, and then as long as it's in the dry box it still has whatever life was remaining at the time I put it into the box. Is that not the case? I.e. even if the part only spends 12 hours out before going in the dry box, I still need to bake it after it's been in the box for 1 month?

I gave the wrong link earlier, this is the cabinet I've got planned. All of the documents I've read so far refer to baking at 125C, whereas this goes to 60C but also says it can "replace traditional oven baking." So then it sounds like you can bake at 60C and still be compliant but I've yet to find the standard where that's explicitly stated...

[SVFeingold]

Hey guys, I feel pretty dumb! About the air compressor anyway. The service techs told me that each machine needs about 12CFM of air @ 5+ bar. However the MG-8 pre-installation guide shows the required flow as 350 Nl/min. If you convert that using the liter/min to CFM conversion you indeed get about 12 CFM. However, paying attention to that "normal" part and accounting for pressure differences it's really closer to 2-2.5CFM @ 5.5 bar per machine. Which seems far more reasonable. So for the whole thing, including the stencil printer, 10CFM ought to more than cover it assuming I did my math right.

Looks like I don't need a 10HP compressor after all. Phew! I was starting to get really anxious about that. Thought I was crazy, my sand-blasting cabinet barely uses 12CFM...

[rx8pilot]

Peak CFM and average CFM are very different. It only needs a short burst per pick - so it may be even lower on average.

At my previous shop, I had a rather large storage tank and a small compressor. That allowed big bursts to be used so long as the average did not exceed the compressor.

On my Quad machine, I also disabled the venturi vacuum in favor of a vacuum pump and 5 gal vac tank. The pump cycles a few every once in a while and it uses a lot less compressed air.

Sent from my horrible mobile....

[SVFeingold]

They don't specify in the manual, I'm not sure if it's peak or average. But that makes things way easier, that's a much cheaper compressor. The stencil printer actually draws about 2x, 6CFM @ 5.5 bar vs 2.5CFM @ 5.5 bar for the PnPs. During the vacuum cleaning cycle the printer consumes 21 CFM but presumably that's for like...10 seconds or so.

I'd be interested in a vacuum pump + buffer, I've got a bunch of good vacuum pumps lying around. Not sure what that modification would look like on these machines or how easy it is. Will be a while before i want to fiddle with them.

[Kjelt]

You can always place an aditional pressure tank close to the machine, it kinda works like a capacitor for electronics. I have one in my attick converted from a used butane bottle it works great.

[jmelson]

The cabinet has a baking function built in, 60C IIRC. Supposedly that works fine for baking parts without stressing them but I don't know if it's compliant to whatever standard (i.e. if the minimum is 12 hours at 125C and no less).

Right, the COMPONENTS need a 125C bake, but the reels/tapes can take 50 C tops, and the waffle trays can take 60C or so.  OK, how are you supposed to do this, then?  Take all the parts out of the tapes/trays?  RIGHT, NOBODY is ever going to do that!

I never bake parts, and have never had a problem with it.  I DO bake boards that have sat around for a few months.  I have had a few boards blister when reflowed if I didn't bake them after sitting for too long.

Jon