EEVblog #502 - $19 Hameg Analog Oscilloscope.

[PA4TIM]

Fairytales ? In that case I believe in fairytales (but I do not believe in other fairytales like special audio resistors and caps  )   My experience with scopes is far  below 1 Euro/MHz. But if I am right who you are you  also know  from CO the rest of the story. (why and under which condition) And I allways write  1 euro/MHz upto 3 euro/MHz   (and, no, this price is not for the ebay junkies, they just make each other nuts in the heat of the fight by bidding and forget the real world)

But for those who want a perfect working scope in mint condition withe the warranty that it will run for ever, just forget that price and believe in other fairytales ;-)

 I know my " guidline", (not rule)it is not for every country . The point I try to make is that there are plenty cheap and free scopes around, for most  if you forget ebay. (I think my list was prove enough)

[poundy]

Part of the "challenge" of living in AU is that there's not a huge number of places that'd use and eventually upgrade/replace their equipment, so the kind of opportunity that the EU and US are given, by having copious numbers of used, decent scopes on the 2nd hand market, or even being offered them for free, just doesn't happen.  You have to be pretty vigilant to find something like this in AU, which obviously I am not !

Dave, my bleeding heart story. Well, I reckon I don't think my story will hold anything to the earlier post about the QLD floods, so I vote for that guy! (and in fact, the only thing I would hope that having a scope like this would get me is sympathy from SWMBO so the seeds I've planted about spending several hundred bucks on a new Rigol DS-2072 scope could sprout, and I'd get approval to head to Emona and pick it up )

[Azhar]

Hello again!
I mentioned yesterday that I would love to have this scope and at night I had a dream that I won it! OMG! I need it so much! If I really win it I will print your EEVBlog photos with the word "Thank you" and stick it on it as an appriciation!
please send it to me to Mebourne
I'm studying engineering at RMIT

[vashnavi2010]

Hey Dave

Been into Electronics For About 10 odd years now and have always drempt about getting a scope i have played with many scopes but never ever been able too afford one until now when i saw on your channel that you can get them so cheap but yes having that scope on my workbench would be the best thing ever ive just started getting into arduino stuff having a ball there so a scope on my bench would make a valuable addition..

Dale.

[chibiace]

I am still looking out for a scope like this in New Zealand, Not many cheapies around anymore.

[wigman27]

Hi Dave,

Not sure if it has gone yet.. but.. I would love to add a scope to my growing beginners kit. I am doing Electrical Engineering at Mt Druitt TAFE and currently working in the power industry so I don't have a lot of? use for a CRO for 11kV!

I am starting electronics at home and my first project is a LAB Power Supply which I am working on a design to replace the LT3080 :-) Forum Topic. I have also built an 8x8x8 LED cube that keeps "blowing" LEDS and turning them into resistors!! AAAGGGGHHH A scope would be great to help fault find !

I am in Lithgow NSW but could pick it up on TAFE afternoon! 

Thanks Mate

[jancumps]

Not 100% the same, but close enough:

[Steffen]

Hi there,

this great video by Dave was the point to regsiter to this forum. So this is my first post. Please excuse me if my English is not perfect. As a German guy English is not my mother tounge, but i try my best.

This old Hameg scope brings back memories of my school, where I went to during my vocotional training and still go to for my advanced training. These scopes are standard equipment of many laboratories in my school.   

I don't know if a part of our scopes uses the rear expansion header for communication, but we have these scopes connected to a quite crusty RS-232 interface to transfer curve data to a Windows 98 computer. Acquiring data only works in store mode, but in the end we have an Excel sheet with nearly scope like screenshot as chart.
It's a very nice way for documentation of measurements and putting them to a thumb drive and review them at home.
Some scopes have a home brew modification for storage depth magnification x10 for faster signals.

Theses educational scopes are horrible to use if you are accoustomed to work with Tektronix TDS3054 series and better scopes at work.

[AdamD]

Hi Dave,

That little beauty would take pride of place on my bench. Right next to my Tricky Dicky voltmeter.  I'm building a better remote controlled lawn mower and want to create it with monitoring  / edge sensor system, so it can auto mow the lawn or just not run off the retainer wall into the neighbor's car. My first mower attempt is likely finish the job I stuffed up and make me a para to a quadriplegic if don't get around to MK II . I'd be lying if I haven't wanted, no lusted over of a scope since I first found your channel a couple of years ago.


Catch ya.
Adam

(Maitland - Hunter Valley)

[Stonent]

Well, if anything the thought of a free, cheap scope has caused several people to register as forum members.

[naimis]

Looking at the video around 34:38, the resistor at R2253 (top left, between switch and pot) looks like one of the leads is snapped off.
If it is, it didn't seem to make a lot of difference :-)

[jancumps]

Well, if anything the thought of a free, cheap scope has caused several people to register as forum members.

.. although they most likely were lurkers or viewers already.

[PA0PBZ]

Looking at the video around 34:38, the resistor at R2253 (top left, between switch and pot) looks like one of the leads is snapped off.

It is actually 2 resistors, one soldered on top of the other. You see the same with R2153 at the other pot below.

[markce]

A not so great feature of this generation scopes is that they use trim pot's as adjustment pot's (Y-vernier fe.). Wears out soon, and not as easy to replace as Dave discovered.  In my experience, Auto triggering is weak, can be quite annoying if you know Tektronix. In general very reliable though, no other obvious weak points, very nice sharp focused trace (much better than most Tek's). Indeed low noise, and sensitive. Free schematics, good user manual.
Bought one new in early 80's as a student (203-5, no memory, EUR 550), still like it.

[edy]

I agree, the scopes aren't worth all that much and they are common. The main probem is shipping weight and international brokerage fees. I tried eBay and noticed the bidding wars (automatic bidding near end of auction) and didn't want to overpay. However, the winner  ended up winning at $20 for a local pickup, for 20Mhz tektronix, and another was $100 for an Iwatsu 200Mhz.

I have looked at local ads because ebay can have some crazy people who put in crazy auto bids... Let them have it. Locals on kijiji or craigslist have narrowed me down to a 50Mhz for $50 including probes and manuals Tektronix. I'll know in a few days if I have it or not!

Hi Dave, You have established a new price point for oscilloscopes: $0.95 / MHz.  Cheers, Mark

I do not understand all the exitement (but I have not looked the video, I unserstand from the topic its an old analog low BW  Hameg, if not then forget my rant 

Here in Holland a rather normal price for analog scopes is around 1 euro/MHz upto 3 euro/MHz for a more special one. (but real special scopers can do more) A 10 or 20 MHz can easy be bought under 50 euro.

Scopes I got offered  for free the last 5 years: two 1 GHz Philips sample scopes (dead, fixed one, kept the other for spares), a Tek 547 (prime condition), 2 x 545 (one dead, HV transformer, the other given away in unkown condition), 546 (given away), 2 x 535, 453 (in perfect shape, resqued from scrapping because nobody wanted it after 2 weeks of adbvertising it for free), a dead 465 (fixed and gave away, a Philips 75 MHz (perfect shape, gave away), a Hameg mini scope from the 60' s (in my collection), a Thandar 10 MHz miniscope (use it on hollydays), a Fairchild 777 (dead and no manuals), two old Philips scopes from the 50's (traded to a 1948 multimeter), a tele-equipment (gave it away)  and I probably forget some more.

Bought a HP1740 100 MHz with probes for 100 euro (gave it to a friend), a Tek 7704 and 7603 together 125 euro (still use them), a 2445 for 125 euro (gave it to a student)

The most expensive per MHz was a Tek 212, that was 80 euro/MHz ( 40 euro for a 500kHz scope ;-)

I have enough scopes but still get them offered, sadly had to turn down about 6 scope offered this year. I know two Tek mainframe scopes with 5 plugins that are  trashed by the owner about a week ago, no interest after a week advertising them for free pickup. I know about a 535A, a 545, a 546 that are scrapped because of the same reason.

So there seems to be a strange thing going on, on the one hand people who want to get rid of there sopes for nothing but can not find candidates or ask little money . And on the other hand lots of people who want to spend 50-200 dollar for scopes the other owners can not get rid of for less as 50 dollar or even for free. I think both do not look at the right place (I think most must learn to look at other places as epay with the extreme prices because many buyers are just addicted to gamblin and are dying to " win" everything many other people are interested in, the attract each other like bees  )

By the way, do not mail me, I have no scopes at the moment to give away and I am not planning to make a list or so 

[xrunner]

This is a very good video. It's an adventure (not that the others aren't) but it is a basic look into what you might expect when looking into a used piece of equipment and a good look at the technology and manufacturing methods of years gone by.

A+

[edwardcurrentclamps]

Well mate,

it already took me ages to get all creative on my username and now I will have to try to find a good reason why you should send this analog voltmeter with a time axis to the Gold Coast. Hmm, suppose it is not enough to tell you that sending an oscilloscope to the Goldie would be like sending a dog into the orbit - hmm, someone did that already right?
Anyway, being surrounded by the surf and a lot of fantastic plastic with blond hair it seems odd to be interested in Physics and Electronics and somewhat lonely.
Conversations with my mates seem to only last for a few minutes if not seconds if I start telling them what I did on the weekends and oscilloscope just doesn't sound quite as cool as stories about ripping through waves.
But who needs a wave if you have an oscilloscope right? Electrons do a pretty good job too I thought! And my work bench is more of a table at the moment since there is only a soldering iron and a DMM on it so *Ze German* would be a great addition to it.
Guess I am left H oping A M agnificent E lectronic G adget will knock at my door and make my table a work bench!

That's me I guess...bzzzt....bzzzt...over and out....bzzzzzt....more interference sound.....

[0201m]

Hey Dave, would be nice to have this German Beauty sitting here in Germany.

[Chopsticks]

Dave,
i'd love to own a scope so i can learn and 'see' what electricity is doing more the just reading voltage with a multimeter but i hesitate to ask because i/m sure theres someone here who needs it more then me, so cograts to who ever wins this

[Sigmoid]

LOL I love these scopes, I did a lot of lab work on these (or a similar model) at the university. We even used the heat printer output, it's fun. Like riding a steam locomotive or reading by an oil lamp.
I'm out for one, too bad I don't live in Australia. XD Honestly, it seems almost better than a new low-end DSO, as you get a real analog scope, plus the ability to do one-off measurements...

As for prices, on Craigslist, here in NYC you can get anything household-related for a ridiculously low price (microwave for $20, pro salon hairdryer for $5, etc.), but tools are either absent or command almost the price you'd pay at a shop (most of the ads ARE from shops, lol).
I wonder if there's a local alternative to eBay. On eBay these (and some older, non-storage Hamegs) go around $100 in working condition, but often without probes. Does that sound like a good deal? Is there another brand of good analogs with storage to look out for? (The ones that actually have "storage" in the listing title are usually overpriced.)

[Fabian]

Just in case someone also has a Hameg 205-3 at home. I did some investigation on the wired header at the back of it and it turned out that you can read the data from the digital storage as Dave supposed. However, I build a small board and wrote some software for it. Works quite well and I used it alot before buying a more recent scope. Here is all the stuff: http://www.mikrocontroller.net/topic/188035
The latest version is this post: http://www.mikrocontroller.net/topic/188035#2274849
English manual: http://www.akh.se/hameg/hmosc/hm205-3-man.pdf
Sorry, most of it is in German, but you don't need to understand German for understanding source code and schematics

[RJdaMoD]

Hi,
just wanted to emphasize again that getting a scope is really dependent on your location.
For example, some germans (though not me) go berserk for a scope, check here: http://www.ebay.de/itm/HAMEG-Digital-Speicheroszilloskop-Oszilloskop-HM205-3-Scope-/281146635150?pt=Mess_Pr%C3%BCftechnik&hash=item4175a5338e&autorefresh=true
Exactly the same scope, ok, seems to work, but 300€ (about 360$) for 20MHz? Just crazy.
Yesterday i paid 150€ for a Tek 475 with faulty second timebase and minor scratches, but new crt and knobs (think i'm equipped to fix that). That's ten times the bandwidth (or more, i will check that) for half the price. Seller was a nice guy, i will probably stay in contact with him (seems to be a Tek collecter, so lots of spare parts in case of problems).
If you watch ebay.de for scopes, you can really see strange things happen:
- Tek 468 in good condition for 200€ fixed. 1 day before closing, seller dropped to 180€. Did not sell. Re-listed for auction.
- Tek 465 in working condition, auction ended at 101€. But two hours before initial end date. Can not prove this, since end date has changed, but i swear!
- Hameg HM1005 for 300€ fixed or offer. I tried 150€, no luck. Others also. Did not sell.
- The exact Hameg 205-3 seemed to have been sold by another seller few weeks earlier, see http://www.ebay.de/itm/HAMEG-Digital-Speicheroszilloskop-Oszilloskop-HM205-3-Scope-/330951631874?pt=Mess_Pr%C3%83%C2%BCftechnik&hash=item4d0e412402. Same text and images. Copy-paste or maybe did not fit the expactations of buyer/seller (price)?
- there is quite a huge price spread for these Hamegs at ebay. Ended auctions show anything between 50 and 300€. But in my opinion, 50 is enough for 20MHz. So be patient and don't let yourself go crazy after such a scope.
- at least german ebay also has local listings (that's where i got my 475; don't know about other countries, but surely there a similar markets). Even a Hameg 203-7 for 50€ there. But also some crazy people: 204-2 for 120€, another for 100€ VB (but doubt he will go below 80€), a 605 for 190€ VB (crazy), a 1005 for 250€ VB. What are they smoking?
- to clarify: there were also Hitachi V-660 offered for ~90€ starting bid, and they did sell for this (only one bidder). So why pay more than 100€ for 50-60MHz?
Well, i better stop, or i'll fall into rage.
So, greetings from germany.

[Fraser]

Simple answer.....Hameg are a well respected manufacturer. Now owned by Rohde & Schwarz !

I know this is a forum that concentrates on the Digital, rather than analogue, world so it is no surprise that people are derisory about 20MHz bandwidth as that is low where square waves are involved. A 20Mhz Hameg oscilloscope is a very capable machine and not everyone needs or wants a DSO or 100MHz bandwidth. Quality sells.

A product finds its true market value in auctions, so obviously the Hameg products have a following. As a side note, I have owned several Tektronix scopes. They are not my favourites and have all had reliability issues, especially the power supplies. They often use Custom Hybrid IC's that can lead to a write-off if they fail (and they do!). Nope, not my cup of tea at all. I have two languishing in the garage unused for years.

[Fraser]

A picture of my 'spare' scopes languishing in the garage is attached.

In the UK they don't achieve high enough prices on the used market to make it worth the time packing and shipping them. I don't think I will be in need of any more analogue scopes for the rest of my life !

[xrunner]

A picture of my 'spare' scopes languishing in the garage is attached.

LOL - how did you come to have all those scopes?