Author Topic: [UK] Job ad: Wanted, electronic engineer  (Read 28198 times)

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Offline KJDS

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Re: [UK] Job ad: Wanted, electronic engineer
« Reply #75 on: February 01, 2015, 10:01:03 am »
I find that the bad contractors often get brought back repeatedly because it isn't obvious to management that they are bad. The product kinda works and when it needs updating they just get the same person back to do it. Sure, it takes them longer because of the crap design, but management doesn't know that.

The good contractors tend to become permanent anyway.

Interesting comments MC, because when I was doing contracts I found it was exactly the opposite!
....

I was going to respond to that last night with the reply "boolox" but I'd had a few beers so thought it prudent not to comment.

I'm now sober, therefore I'm happy to say that good contractors becoming permies is indeed, bollox. I know about 100 contractors, one of whom has become a permie. The rest are still enjoying the benefits of contracting, as are quite a few of the permies I'd got to know.

Offline Stonent

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Re: [UK] Job ad: Wanted, electronic engineer
« Reply #76 on: February 01, 2015, 11:38:54 am »
I find in my line of work, IT, there tend to be a lot of people who just don't really understand in depth how things work.

Maybe I'd be an a-hole for doing it, but I'd consider asking an applicant to start at the outlet and describe in detail how a computer starts up all the way until the desktop is ready.

or "How might you install a driver that can't boot due to lack of that driver?"

I'd be impressed if I found someone who knows how to use the windows debugger to read crash-dump files.
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Offline GK

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Re: [UK] Job ad: Wanted, electronic engineer
« Reply #77 on: February 01, 2015, 12:20:23 pm »
it would be nice to see more job ads on this forum.


I once had a similar thought; even suggested an employment classifieds section to the forum. However now considering the amount of bullshit that appears to get posted in every single job thread, I don't think so any longer.
Bzzzzt. No longer care, over this forum shit.........ZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
 

Offline Howardlong

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Re: [UK] Job ad: Wanted, electronic engineer
« Reply #78 on: February 01, 2015, 02:17:09 pm »
I find in my line of work, IT, there tend to be a lot of people who just don't really understand in depth how things work.

Maybe I'd be an a-hole for doing it, but I'd consider asking an applicant to start at the outlet and describe in detail how a computer starts up all the way until the desktop is ready.

or "How might you install a driver that can't boot due to lack of that driver?"

I'd be impressed if I found someone who knows how to use the windows debugger to read crash-dump files.

I've been out of IT for a couple of years now, but I was in it in one form or another since the mid 70s and I agree. Knowing the fundamentals helps you identify problems as entire systems as opposed to the more typical blinkered approach. The typical programmer says the immortal phrase "it's a network problem" when they haven't really go a clue, the network guy says it's a server problem, and the server guy says it's an app problem. Having an open mind and a broad range of skills is automatically nurtured by knowing the fundamentals, but nowadays people are pigeon holed and having a broad range of skills isn't valued.

I'd have loved it if someone had asked me to start at the outlet in an interview, they might end up with quite a bit more than they bargained for that's for sure.

Not sure if I could answer your other two questions nowadays, although at one point in my career I did write quite a number of graphics drivers for Windows 2.0, 2.1 and 3.0, back in the days where a good deal of that stuff was still in assembler, and you counted your instruction cycles. We used Symdeb back then, but more recently it became windbg and I think KD? or something, plus you needed a bunch of OS symbol files appropriate to your OS version (there were also debug versions of some Windows versions, not sure if that still applies) to figure out. As you can prolly tell it's been a while...
 

Offline Galenbo

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Re: [UK] Job ad: Wanted, electronic engineer
« Reply #79 on: February 02, 2015, 07:06:47 pm »
I went to see a customer a few years ago and he was in a bad mood, having spent his morning teaching people with Masters degrees to solder.

I pointed out that I'd rather spend a morning teaching someone to solder then a couple of months to get them proficient in control theory.

So why doesn't he hire Masters that have proven their skills to solder?
Was their management course result more important?

I solder since I was 12 years old, including plastic toys.

Chances are that the ones that can solder are way better in control theory, too.
Not in repeating the graphs, words and formulas, but in looking at the result and defining possible shortcomings.
If you try and take a cat apart to see how it works, the first thing you have on your hands is a nonworking cat.
 

Offline KJDS

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Re: [UK] Job ad: Wanted, electronic engineer
« Reply #80 on: February 02, 2015, 08:23:58 pm »
I went to see a customer a few years ago and he was in a bad mood, having spent his morning teaching people with Masters degrees to solder.

I pointed out that I'd rather spend a morning teaching someone to solder then a couple of months to get them proficient in control theory.

So why doesn't he hire Masters that have proven their skills to solder?
Was their management course result more important?

I solder since I was 12 years old, including plastic toys.

Chances are that the ones that can solder are way better in control theory, too.
Not in repeating the graphs, words and formulas, but in looking at the result and defining possible shortcomings.

Why do you think that a correlation might occur between soldering skills and control theory

Offline linux-works

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Re: [UK] Job ad: Wanted, electronic engineer
« Reply #81 on: February 02, 2015, 08:44:34 pm »
Why do you think that a correlation might occur between soldering skills and control theory

I think I see a correlation.  too much coffee -> shaking hands -> can't control the position of the soldering iron well.

LOL


"It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion.
It is by the beans of Java that thoughts acquire speed, the hands acquire shaking, the shaking becomes a warning.
It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion."


that's control theory, right?  back off the coffee so you can solder properly?

(heh)
 

Offline jpb

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Re: [UK] Job ad: Wanted, electronic engineer
« Reply #82 on: February 02, 2015, 08:55:24 pm »

Why do you think that a correlation might occur between soldering skills and control theory

One of my lecturers (in computer science) told us that there was a high degree of correlation between the time at which people found the room for the registration and induction at the start of the degree course and the resultant class of degree at the end.

His suggestion was it would save a lot of time and effort if they didn't bother with final exams and just awarded degrees in the order at which candidates came to the introductory talk! :)
 

Offline zapta

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Re: [UK] Job ad: Wanted, electronic engineer
« Reply #83 on: February 02, 2015, 09:24:53 pm »
Why do you think that a correlation might occur between soldering skills and control theory

Because soldering is one of his stronger skills.  People come with all kinds of strange rationales to justify why they are valuable more than others.
Drain the swamp.
 

Offline Galenbo

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Re: [UK] Job ad: Wanted, electronic engineer
« Reply #84 on: February 04, 2015, 05:32:55 pm »
Why do you think that a correlation might occur between soldering skills and control theory

1. I see no inverse correlation, the way you stated it.

2. Don't mention "control theory", please specify, like:
 
A) writing down an exact copy of something in a book about control theory
B) making a painting about a guy explaining control theory
C) a guy that knows how to apply what he learnt in the lessons control theory, in a real experiment
D) ...

I choose C, you can choose the same, or another.

What I saw in my education as engineer, is that there was only a minority that was hands-on, and guess what? VERY often they were multi-hands-on. They repaired their bycicle, played with electronic kits, made something in wood, made an RC plane, and so on.

When we were in projects, those hands-on of course were better and faster in soldering, making a base plate, but also in applying control theory. They went straight forward over the known issues like V-max and V+max, PID factor limiting, simple filtering, installing a fast working demo, doing some tests on it and then, with that data, open the books and see how to refine.

In big contrast to the so-called theorists, still discussing about the usage of the right word, arguing about overcomplex models till none of them knew anymore what they were talking about. Every time again. Think they all ended up in sales and management. At least I saw their efforts afterward.



   

« Last Edit: February 04, 2015, 05:35:13 pm by Galenbo »
If you try and take a cat apart to see how it works, the first thing you have on your hands is a nonworking cat.
 

Offline Galenbo

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Re: [UK] Job ad: Wanted, electronic engineer
« Reply #85 on: February 04, 2015, 05:40:18 pm »
Why do you think that a correlation might occur between soldering skills and control theory

Because soldering is one of his stronger skills.  People come with all kinds of strange rationales to justify why they are valuable more than others.

Thanks for the compliment. I consider myself as just-above-average in the practice of soldering.

If you try and take a cat apart to see how it works, the first thing you have on your hands is a nonworking cat.
 

Online tom66

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Re: [UK] Job ad: Wanted, electronic engineer
« Reply #86 on: February 04, 2015, 09:31:42 pm »
The soldering skills of most students at Leeds Uni leave a lot to be desired, but they can't entirely be blamed as my university does not provide tuition. Sigh.
 

Offline jlmoon

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Re: [UK] Job ad: Wanted, electronic engineer
« Reply #87 on: March 25, 2015, 03:52:18 pm »


btw, you may want to rethink this one line:

- have an excellent academic background, including a degree in Electronic Engineering (or a related subject) from a respected university

lots of people are good at the stuff you are looking for, but may not have a degree or degree from a snooty named place.  in fact, I've had more luck with self-trained hw/sw guys than ones who went to famous name schools.

judge the person, not their sheepskin.  that's my advice, fwiw.  and good luck, hope you find your employee.

+1


Amen!    +1
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