Electronics > Manufacturing & Assembly

4 layer PCB manufacturing - machine(s) requirements for complete production line

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Styno:

--- Quote from: Styno on August 24, 2021, 02:50:05 pm ---I recently read a story about a US electronics design company that did a lot of high reliability designs. They decided to do their pcb mfg in-house. The result was a fully automated, fully tracked, high capacity and near zero-waste factory that had a payback time of only 2 (or 4, I forgot) years over their Chinese suppliers.

So, it can be done but you need volume and a high upfront investment that will pay back in reduced labor cost and quality.

--- End quote ---
actually it’s from this video with pcb expert Happy Holden:

Rat_Patrol:

--- Quote from: perieanuo on August 31, 2021, 04:47:34 am ---
--- Quote from: tszaboo on August 13, 2021, 10:08:26 pm ---Just think of a number, double it, and then write a zero after it, and add like 12 people's salary to it. And then realize you cannot hire those 12 people.

--- End quote ---
hi,
i worked 10 days for the company :)
finally after realising what means production line for 4-layer they said let's forget that for now and focus on assembly

so reset, restart the 'dossier' with stencil printer, pick-and-place and oven. envelope 20 keuros. after realising the guys wanted to do this prod line with ONE employee for 1000 boards/month, also 3 pcb's not yet designed+prototypes+validation for the next 3 months (including starting from scratch tht pnp line). i was assigned to be r&d designer, prototyping technician, production line operator, production supervisor and why not, janitor and who knows what else. luckily they had already like 5 accountants and 2 rh plus a little football team as commercial diggers.
i liked the idea to repatriate the assembly in europe, but not 1 production employee for 10 non-productive, the percentage seemed wrong

they also 'heard' the autotronik offer (they sent me 3 smt line offers, 69keeuros, 102keorus and 200keuros without vat and transportation, can't disclose the details), way off the records for that 20keuros envelope...
so move on baby :) back to consumerism mode, we like this in EU, bruxelles tells us consuming is goooood (i'm talking about me here) and business owners think the chinese produce those magnific pcb's with those crappy cheap machines  |O

--- End quote ---


Wait, they are giving you 20k Euros to setup for assembly?

Yeah, unless you are going to be rocking Charmhigh 48VB machines, lol

tszaboo:

--- Quote from: perieanuo on August 31, 2021, 04:47:34 am ---
--- Quote from: tszaboo on August 13, 2021, 10:08:26 pm ---Just think of a number, double it, and then write a zero after it, and add like 12 people's salary to it. And then realize you cannot hire those 12 people.

--- End quote ---
hi,
i worked 10 days for the company :)
finally after realising what means production line for 4-layer they said let's forget that for now and focus on assembly

so reset, restart the 'dossier' with stencil printer, pick-and-place and oven. envelope 20 keuros. after realising the guys wanted to do this prod line with ONE employee for 1000 boards/month, also 3 pcb's not yet designed+prototypes+validation for the next 3 months (including starting from scratch tht pnp line). i was assigned to be r&d designer, prototyping technician, production line operator, production supervisor and why not, janitor and who knows what else. luckily they had already like 5 accountants and 2 rh plus a little football team as commercial diggers.
i liked the idea to repatriate the assembly in europe, but not 1 production employee for 10 non-productive, the percentage seemed wrong

they also 'heard' the autotronik offer (they sent me 3 smt line offers, 69keeuros, 102keorus and 200keuros without vat and transportation, can't disclose the details), way off the records for that 20keuros envelope...
so move on baby :) back to consumerism mode, we like this in EU, bruxelles tells us consuming is goooood (i'm talking about me here) and business owners think the chinese produce those magnific pcb's with those crappy cheap machines  |O

--- End quote ---

Boards like that can be ordered for about 2 EUR per piece from Europe, probably even cheaper if you shop around a abit. So they planned to hire someone to make this production, probably even part time, the ROI of the line is negative. But I would argue, that even without it, you wouldn't be able to match those prices, so it would be a loss leader forever.
The fact that they want to make a production line for such a tiny production runs tells me that the MBAs in that company are completely clueless about the electronics market, and I highly recommend you not to take a full time position there. Charge them by the hour. Or have an alternative ready to go on a moments notice, when they have run the business into the ground. Or maybe they are the geniuses, who gets government funding to cover everything, and they can do whatever they want with the endless supply of money - no matter how stupid the company is.

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