ALLPCB Spammers

[EEVblog]

ALLPCB aren't content to just spam the forum using multiple sock-puppet accounts, now they are spamming my Youtube comments, and not even on PCB related videos. Pathetic.

[mrpackethead]

But they do in most cases make great boards, at good prices, and in resonable times.

I'll have another word to them.

[ataradov]

It is good that there is competition in this area now. I recently tried jlcpcb.com and the quality of the boards was much better than what I get from AllPcb (no issues with "green oil" bridges for me). Not sure how consistent that result is, but I'll definitely give them more orders.

[EEVblog]

But they do in most cases make great boards, at good prices, and in resonable times.

I don't care, they are banned here and I have also turned down paid website and forum advertising from them.
Nor will I use their services myself.

[LapTop006]

But they do in most cases make great boards, at good prices, and in resonable times.

I don't care, they are banned here and I have also turned down paid website and forum advertising from them.
Nor will I use their services myself.

That's the worst part, when an otherwise good company does something stupid that means you can't use them anymore.

[digsys]

That's the worst part, when an otherwise good company does something stupid that means you can't use them anymore.

Being banned for spamming etc doesn't mean members can't still use them. If people were happy with them, nothing changes.
Hopefully, they'll get the message about their shenanigans :-)

[LapTop006]

That's the worst part, when an otherwise good company does something stupid that means you can't use them anymore.

Being banned for spamming etc doesn't mean members can't still use them. If people were happy with them, nothing changes.
Hopefully, they'll get the message about their shenanigans :-)

Sure, but I don't want to work with spammers.

[mrpackethead]

It is good that there is competition in this area now. I recently tried jlcpcb.com and the quality of the boards was much better than what I get from AllPcb (no issues with "green oil" bridges for me). Not sure how consistent that result is, but I'll definitely give them more orders.

Yeah, i've been using JLCPCB a bit recently and they are pretty good as well.    I'm not sure i'd say "much"  better, but I'd say they are on par with each other. I've had bad things from both.   Both are ok, for low tech boards.    The one thing about Allpcb is at least you will get to talk to someone if you need to.

Interestingly they dont' seem to spam me by email.   ( other pcb fabs do )..   I hate spam as much as Dave. but All Pcb have looked after me, and done a few super rush jobs for me,  so, even though it won't change Daves mind, ( as likely as making him like USB-scopes ) it might help them.

[Kean]

This is so frustrating!

I've been using AllPCB recently, but only after discussing my concerns about their spamming with them and Erin apologising.  If they aren't actually going to change their ways, then I'll likely be permanetly switching to JLC.  At least JLC do sponsored ads rather than forum spamming.

I ordered my last (simple) design from both AllPCB and JLC as it was urgent and just prior to the recent holidays.  JLC delivered only one day later, and their soldermask alignment was slightly better but otherwise the quality was comparable.

[thm_w]

Were they the ones offering discount codes for reviews? I remember a lot of threads being created because you'd get free boards if you reviewed their services, etc. Its possible that its not AllPCB but some random guy hoping for discounts or referral money. It is still quite a gray area though to offer that (not just offer to advertise on your *own* blog or forum).

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCVcV1uwH7vdYV2qVYtPN59g

[mrpackethead]

Its very grey.  I see lots of adverts ( i can see two right now on this page ) that are inserted into places i want to find other thigns..   Its very subjective

[NorthGuy]

Many Chinese people have the stereotype that western people are less exposed to scamming and are more naive and easier to scam with simple tricks.

I think, in the west, everyone should be completely immune to all sorts of advertisement by now.

[mrpackethead]

I think, in the west, everyone should be completely immune to all sorts of advertisement by now.

But the marketing guys at AllPCB don't/didn't know. The lack of understanding is there. Imagine how many westerners think Chinese people eat pet dogs.

You meant that odd tasting chicken that i had in Dongguang last trip maybe actually was chicken?

[mrpackethead]

这是一个都市传奇

I do love that this forum supports Pinyin.

[Richard Crowley]

https://youtu.be/3I7oe3MKNF0

[mrpackethead]

Never ceases to amaze me how threads at EEVblog take the most amazing twists and turns.

Woof. My dog says he does not want to be eaten. But he woudl like to eat.

[hermit]

There are people in the US at the lower end of the economic spectrum that eat dogs.  Maybe not THEIR pets, but that distinction isn't important to hungry people.

[NorthGuy]

Woof. My dog says he does not want to be eaten. But he woudl like to eat.

Dog eat dog.

[mrpackethead]

There are people in the US at the lower end of the economic spectrum that eat dogs.  Maybe not THEIR pets, but that distinction isn't important to hungry people.

Do they also send spam PCB marketing to forums

[sdouble]

dogdgy

[bitseeker]

There are people in the US at the lower end of the economic spectrum that eat dogs.  Maybe not THEIR pets, but that distinction isn't important to hungry people.

Do they also send spam PCB marketing to forums

I dunno. But they might eat spam.

I have some boards from JLCPCB and they're cheap 'n' good. Even if ALLPCB is equivalent, I'm not going to use them out of principle. If they continue to get business despite their bad behavior, then what's the incentive for them to change said behavior?

[mrpackethead]

There are people in the US at the lower end of the economic spectrum that eat dogs.  Maybe not THEIR pets, but that distinction isn't important to hungry people.

Do they also send spam PCB marketing to forums

I dunno. But they might eat spam.


I have some boards from JLCPCB and they're cheap 'n' good. Even if ALLPCB is equivalent, I'm not going to use them out of principle. If they continue to get business despite their bad behavior, then what's the incentive for them to change said behavior?

To a lessor or greater degree they all do it. Its  a question of where. Allpcb just seem to keep doing it on EEVblog.

[mrpackethead]

I had a good conversation with the manager at ALLPCB today, and suggest to them, that their activity was 失面子   ( loosing face ).    The penny clicked.     They did not realise that paying peopel for comments, was causing them problems.     ( glory bee ) .   Too late probalby to save them here at EEVblog, but they have been good to me, and they appreicated the feedback.   There is such a cultrual mis-match and sometimes they get it wrong.. ( and sometimes this side of the world, gets it wrong too ).

Be kind. but be firm. 

[bitseeker]

Thanks for the update, mrpackethead. Hopefully, your feedback is effective. I can understand cultural mismatches and the like, but getting banned from here isn't ambiguous. I'm skeptical that they'll suddenly change their ways, but am happy for them to prove me wrong. More competition is a good thing.

[Cerebus]

You meant that odd tasting chicken that i had in Dongguang last trip maybe actually was chicken?

Maybe, or maybe duck. (<pc>Some</pc>) Cantonese eat everything 4 legged, rest of chairs and tables, plus everything they can find in the sky, rest of airplanes.

In Yorkshire they say "You can eat every part of a pig, apart from its squeal", in Guangzhou they serve deep fired pig squeal in batter with oyster sauce. 

[rea5245]

I had a good conversation with the manager at ALLPCB today... They did not realise that paying peopel for comments, was causing them problems.

I haven't allowed reviews of ALLPCB to be posted on PCBShopper for years because of their policy of paying for reviews. ALLPCB knew I was blocking their reviews and they knew why. It did not cause them to change their policy.

Maybe your talk with them will change things, but I'm not getting my hopes up.

- Bob Alexander
  PCBShopper.com

[mrpackethead]

I had a good conversation with the manager at ALLPCB today... They did not realise that paying peopel for comments, was causing them problems.

I haven't allowed reviews of ALLPCB to be posted on PCBShopper for years because of their policy of paying for reviews. ALLPCB knew I was blocking their reviews and they knew why. It did not cause them to change their policy.

Maybe your talk with them will change things, but I'm not getting my hopes up.

- Bob Alexander
  PCBShopper.com

Curious.  Several of the other PCBfabs on your web site, also pay for good review and you can leave reviews .

[rea5245]

PCBWay pays for good reviews, so I do not allow any reviews of them. If there are other manufacturers listed on PCBShopper who pay for reviews, please let me know. (The URL of their page where they mention the deal would be good.)

- Bob Alexander
  PCBShopper.com

[mrpackethead]

We will see where it goes.  I hope ( for their sake really ) that they will make a decision to stop the practice of paying for good reviews.
I'm sorry i must have misread or read it earilre that there were reviews on pcbway on your s

[mrpackethead]

After some further discussions about how things are perceived in the 'west',  Allpcb has decided that they will no longer pursue the practice of paying people with discount coupons for reviews on other peoples pages.    They are going to set up a place on their own web pages for customers comments which is a perfectly good place for them.   While not defending what they did,  I do think it was done out of ignorance of how things are done  out of china.     I hope over time that they can restore their reputation. 

[bitseeker]

Good progress, indeed.

[Mr. Scram]

After some further discussions about how things are perceived in the 'west',  Allpcb has decided that they will no longer pursue the practice of paying people with discount coupons for reviews on other peoples pages.    They are going to set up a place on their own web pages for customers comments which is a perfectly good place for them.   While not defending what they did,  I do think it was done out of ignorance of how things are done  out of china.     I hope over time that they can restore their reputation.

Seeing is believing. Lip service is cheap.

[mrpackethead]

They have already changed their website, and the email template that is sent out with every order.  But in deed, talk is cheap.. and we will see..

For me,  i want to see my suppliers, be sucessful, and if i can help them, then i will.     I need my suppliers to make my business work.  Just like they need me as a customer.    Nobodies interests are serviced by not trying to help each other.

[rea5245]

They have already changed their website...

Have they? If you log in to your account there and go to https://member.allpcb.com/newmember/share or https://member.allpcb.com/newmember/share_info, they're still offering rewards for reviews. (Those pages are only visible to logged-in users.)

EDIT: Also https://www.allpcb.com/earn_points_in_allpcb.html, which is accessible to everyone, logged in or not.

- Bob

[SMTech]

In terms of PCB selling junk mail I don't think anyone can quite rival JSD-pcb, absolutely tons of it directed at every mail box we have or had, some quasi legit, some not and some even making lame attempts to get past filtering.

[Mr. Scram]

I just spotted Allpcb spammer postings today, even "replying" to another account with just one post. These people will never stop.

I don't think I like to do business with them.

[mrpackethead]

I just spotted Allpcb spammer postings today, even "replying" to another account with just one post. These people will never stop.

I don't think I like to do business with them.

can you give me a link?

[Mr. Scram]

can you give me a link?

The offending posts have been reported to the moderation crew.

[mrpackethead]

can you give me a link?

The offending posts have been reported to the moderation crew.

I was wanting to take it back to ALlpcb

[mrpackethead]

can you give me a link?

The offending posts have been reported to the moderation crew.

Id agree that the Rodgers post is questionable. You just dont' know.  Given that they have only just stopped giving coupons out, it might take a little bit of time.    As i said above its going to take some time..  I can hear ALlpcb already.." but it was'nt us .     This is an example of were going down the path of paid endorsements, is a dumb dumb thing, becuase you get to a point where you dont' know what is up and what is down.





 

[Mr. Scram]

I was wanting to take it back to ALlpcb

The offending posts have been removed. I gather the moderation crew looks at IP addresses and other metadata too.

It may not have been AllPCB, but at this point it honestly isn't that relevant. They've repeatedly overplayed their hand and consequently they don't have any room to play with left. It's a variant of the "boy who cried wolf" story. Their fate is of their own making.

They'll need to be picture perfect from now on to regain any credibility and trust. The proof of the Chinese pudding will be in the eating. AllPCB needs to understand it could take years to recover.

[EEVblog]

In this case a user who was posting otherwise useful content it seems created a sockpuppet account "pcbnerd" to shill for ALLPCB. They have now been banned as a result.
Likely under instruction / financial enticement from ALLPCB
They posted the same stuff in the ESR meter thread and the Rogers thread.



ALLPCB employee sockpuppet account are many, here are just some:

[mrpackethead]

Is there an implicit rule in EEVBlog, that making comment posts for 'gain' ( aka getting directly paid out for the comment is against the rules ? )

The only thing i coudl see was in teh "About us".      ( not that you really need a set of rules),...


Commercial spamming is not tolerated though.

[Mr. Scram]

In this case a user who was posting otherwise useful content it seems created a sockpuppet account "pcbnerd" to shill for ALLPCB. They have now been banned as a result.
Likely under instruction / financial enticement from ALLPCB
They posted the same stuff in the ESR meter thread and the Rogers thread.



ALLPCB employee sockpuppet account are many, here are just some:

I honestly feel bad for the guy, he seemed to have a genuine interest. I even would have understood posting for a discount when money is tight, but a sock puppet account is crossing the line.

[mrpackethead]

This guy broke the rules. I just asked them at Allpcb, see the response.   This guy ( using the same username ) had just shared the links back to Allpcb to get a credit.
I think the penny just dropped.   the comment as best i can translate it was " OMG,  We did not mean our customers to be spammers ".     
Very expensive lesson for them to have just learned.

[mrpackethead]

This is so fustrating.  Trying to genuinely help these guys, as they have been really helpful to me. Yet they keep kicking own goals.     

[Mr. Scram]

Is there an implicit rule in EEVBlog, that making comment posts for 'gain' ( aka getting directly paid out for the comment is against the rules ? )

The only thing i coudl see was in teh "About us".      ( not that you really need a set of rules),...


Commercial spamming is not tolerated though.

He didn't just try to gain by posting, he dishonestly tried to trick people by using a sock puppet account. You shouldn't need rules to understand that's not acceptable. It's also a form of commercial spam, which actually is explicitly banned.

[EEVblog]

Is there an implicit rule in EEVBlog, that making comment posts for 'gain' ( aka getting directly paid out for the comment is against the rules ? )

There isn't, but maybe I should add it.

Commercial spamming is not tolerated though.

Neither are sockpuppet account.
If Ramin110 had just posted for gain we could have just deleted those posts and said don't do it again, and he could have stayed. But creating a sockpuppet account to talk up the company is against the rules and will not be tolerated.

[mrpackethead]

Is there an implicit rule in EEVBlog, that making comment posts for 'gain' ( aka getting directly paid out for the comment is against the rules ? )

There isn't, but maybe I should add it.

Commercial spamming is not tolerated though.

Call me dumb, but where are the rules?

[EEVblog]

Is there an implicit rule in EEVBlog, that making comment posts for 'gain' ( aka getting directly paid out for the comment is against the rules ? )

There isn't, but maybe I should add it.

Commercial spamming is not tolerated though.

Call me dumb, but where are the rules?

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/forum-rules-please-read/

[rjp]

Even without any specific rules, typically etiquette on all forums is that you put your business in the signature and then carry on like a regular, helpful forum member.

If someone specifically asks you about your products, you reply, otherwise you keep your shilling to yourself.


 

[Mr. Scram]

There isn't, but maybe I should add it.

Neither are sockpuppet account.
If Ramin110 had just posted for gain we could have just deleted those posts and said don't do it again, and he could have stayed. But creating a sockpuppet account to talk up the company is against the rules and will not be tolerated.

If such a rule is added, it might be wise to clarify if and how it applies to distributors, people with a commercial website or people selling items. Especially some of the distributors here can be rather one sided and persistent, with their own personal financial interest obviously being the motivation.

[EEVblog]

Even without any specific rules, typically etiquette on all forums is that you put your business in the signature and then carry on like a regular, helpful forum member.
If someone specifically asks you about your products, you reply, otherwise you keep your shilling to yourself.

Yep, this.
We have quite a few commercial companies and reps on the forum, and it's mostly a case-by-case basis on whether they are accepted by the community or not.
This generally takes the form of user reports. If people start reporting and complaining then we generally give them the flick.
It's a difficult/impossible thing to make a blanker rule about because we have good examples of valuable forum contributions from companies and dealers, but also bad examples on companies in the same market space.

[rea5245]

ALLPCB has removed their pages soliciting paid reviews. Of the three links I posted earlier, two are now 404 errors. The third has the message:

Dear Customers,


Thank you for your continuous support for ALLPCB. We appreciate your business.

ALLPCB has previously operated a program where we offered discount coupons in return for good reviews. We made a mistake doing this and we know we need to remedy this. Effectively immediately ALLPCB will no longer be offering any coupons for public reviews or comments. We were reminded that some of our customers posted comments which where spam in order to get a discount. We are very sorry that our program caused this problem and we know it damaged our reputation. We value your honest feedback and hope that the quality and value of our products will be sufficient for you to recommend us to your friends and colleagues.


We are very sorry for any trouble that we caused. Our intentions were not bad, but in retrospect this was not a good thing to do.

Yay!

- Bob

[mrpackethead]

i hope in time that they can regain some reputation and people can be forgving of their mistakes.     A bit of kindness keeps the world going.

Some appropriate pressure in the right place had the desired effect.  You can see thigns change if you apply enough pressure in teh right places.

[GeorgeOfTheJungle]

Imagine how many westerners think Chinese people eat pet dogs.

[mrpackethead]

Since Allpcb made changes to not pay for reviews, has anyone seen any spam?