Author Topic: PCB number of designs meaning  (Read 707 times)

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Offline JoeP

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PCB number of designs meaning
« on: July 16, 2019, 09:37:21 am »
I'm ordering a small PCB (6*6cm), but seeing as the price is the same as for a 10*10 board, I thought I could add some little surface mount to through hole adapters around the edge to make it 10*10. However, I'm struggling to work out whether this affects the price; on the JLCPCB website, you have to enter the number of different designs, but what is that referring to? It could mean the number of different designs to be cut from one panel, or it could mean the number of designs within the 10*10 area. Will I be charged extra for this?
 

Offline Dubbie

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Re: PCB number of designs meaning
« Reply #1 on: July 16, 2019, 09:55:30 am »
Yes you will be. The special prices are just for a single design. If you add other designs, most of the time they will reject your files or charge you more.

If you don’t like it, you are free to use another provider.
 
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Offline mrpackethead

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Re: PCB number of designs meaning
« Reply #2 on: July 16, 2019, 09:51:55 pm »
Its cheaper just to order the 2nd board as a seperate project.
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Offline JPlocher

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Re: PCB number of designs meaning
« Reply #3 on: July 17, 2019, 01:10:45 am »
Seeed Studio has a nice graphic describing their policy - I'd be surprised if others were much different.

In general, think of each design as one "schematic+pcb"; if you panelize one design into 4x replicas on a single board, it is still one design.  If you combine two or more designs onto a single board, it is multiple designs.

  -John
 

Offline OwO

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Re: PCB number of designs meaning
« Reply #4 on: July 17, 2019, 04:51:28 am »
JLC doesn't care about multiple designs on one board as long as you design it as a single physical piece (no outline around the individual designs and no slots or v-cuts separating the design). In other words as long as they can treat it as a single board it's fine. I have done multiple designs on a 10x10 board with JLCPCB many times and have experimentally verified that their criteria is whether you have slots between designs. The implication is you have to saw apart the boards yourself (I use a small table saw designed for cutting pcbs).
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Online digsys

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Re: PCB number of designs meaning
« Reply #5 on: July 17, 2019, 05:47:00 am »
I used to do the same thing with PCBFast, and often get away with it, but the last 2 jobs, they cracked down - so if it looks REMOTELY like it is not just 1 design, they charge for multiples !! Many emails later, they refused to back down. On one occasion, I added tracks linking the pcb's - nope, didn't accept it.
Sure peed me off as often it was just little adapters with 2-3 small connectors and a 1/2 doz damn wires - couple squ cm. Maybe i'll try that with JLC next :-)
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Offline blueskull

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Re: PCB number of designs meaning
« Reply #6 on: July 17, 2019, 05:54:30 am »
I use a small table saw designed for cutting pcbs.

Presumably you cut under water (or at least damp) or used a proper dust extraction system. Otherwise your lung may complain in the future.
 

Offline OwO

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Re: PCB number of designs meaning
« Reply #7 on: July 17, 2019, 06:37:51 am »
No, it's in a dedicated room where I enter, hold my breath, cut, and leave the room with the door shut. There is no way to cut under water with any of the table saws I can find.
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Offline mrpackethead

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Re: PCB number of designs meaning
« Reply #8 on: July 17, 2019, 09:29:12 am »
I put extra pcb dust on my toast in the morning. The fibre keeps you regular.
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Offline technotronix

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Re: PCB number of designs meaning
« Reply #9 on: July 17, 2019, 01:30:44 pm »
Check out PCB FAB Capability and Standards.
« Last Edit: July 17, 2019, 01:33:33 pm by technotronix »
 

Offline mrpackethead

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Re: PCB number of designs meaning
« Reply #10 on: July 17, 2019, 08:55:41 pm »
Check out PCB FAB Capability and Standards.

If you are going to put adverts in for your company, you really should include a link that works.
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Online thm_w

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Re: PCB number of designs meaning
« Reply #11 on: July 17, 2019, 10:42:37 pm »
Dirty PCBs is the one that I know of that offers unlimited number of designs for a 10x10 2 layer PCB: http://dirtypcbs.com/store/pcbs/about

You will have to add the tabs manually though:
"Please note: only one separate design is allowed in each order. Panelized designs are OK for 2 layer boards only, but the boards must be connected by tabs (mouse bites and slots) that snap apart later! Separate, non-connected boards will be refused by the board house!"

Don't waste you time and lungs sawing boards unless you have the proper equipment, as blueskull says.
 

Online digsys

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Re: PCB number of designs meaning
« Reply #12 on: July 18, 2019, 12:41:29 am »
Quote from: thm_w
Don't waste you time and lungs sawing boards unless you have the proper equipment, as blueskull says.
Not advocating either way, users can make up their own mind / decision. I've cut up easily 1,000s pcbs over 30+ yrs, with ZERO ill effects. Sometimes, I don't even turn the exhaust fan on :-) yeah I'm a bad ass :-) Also know several other friends in the trades who do the same. Cautions are fine.
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Offline mrpackethead

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Re: PCB number of designs meaning
« Reply #13 on: July 18, 2019, 01:04:43 am »
Lead Solder Paste, on toast with a sprinkling of FR4 dust is good for you.
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Offline JPlocher

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Re: PCB number of designs meaning
« Reply #14 on: July 18, 2019, 03:41:59 am »
A wet tile saw with a diamond blade works well, and is (IMHO) safer than using a toothed blade in such tiny quarters.  De-panelizing a 10cm^2 board on a table saw?  Yikes!  :palm:

That said, the $not-so-much for a multi-design board - or heck, a couple of extra single design boards at $5/ea for 10 - is a pittance to pay and really makes it not worth my time to resaw things anymore.

Peace, and be sure to count your fingers when you are done  :-+
 

Offline OwO

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Re: PCB number of designs meaning
« Reply #15 on: July 18, 2019, 05:01:52 am »
It's not worth it for 2 layer boards but for 4 layers the price difference is significant. Even more so if you are doing PCBA (there is a $10 fee per design). I usually have 5 different designs on a 10x10 panel, so the price difference is over $100. The OP hasn't mentioned number of layers. If you have a front porch or sun deck that's where I would put the table saw; the door is closed most of the time and in the 20 seconds it takes to enter, cut the PCB, and exit you can easily hold your breath.
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Offline Barabas

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Re: PCB number of designs meaning
« Reply #16 on: July 18, 2019, 02:43:00 pm »
I emailed the JLCPBC support about the outline attached (2 layer board 103x75mm). They said that this counts as two designs, because the boards can be separated.

The pricing makes no sense though. It's £5.85 extra for having two designs, but if I ordered the small section separately it would only be £1.60 extra, as it is under 10x10 cm.

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Offline Barabas

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Re: PCB number of designs meaning
« Reply #17 on: July 18, 2019, 02:44:17 pm »
Looks like the attachment didn't show up
 

Online Mechatrommer

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Re: PCB number of designs meaning
« Reply #18 on: July 18, 2019, 04:16:57 pm »
seeedstudio doesnt complain about different designs as long as you only have 10x10 square border in outline file, so you have to cut it yourself later. go read section C its official...
http://support.seeedstudio.com/knowledgebase/articles/388503-what-are-the-pcb-panelization-rules

i sent them 6-8 designs in a board twice so far, no question asked, not even to connect some silly copper traces nor ground plane. my designs are entirely galvanically isolated between one another. i used diy/3d printed sliding table with dremel knock off drill tool and sand grinder bit to cut them, straight cut as a CNC but yes dust is like hell, so if you worry lung digesting fiber glass, you can always use pcb cutter..


if something can select, how cant it be intelligent? if something is intelligent, how cant it exist?
 
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