Author Topic: My first PACE ADS200 victim  (Read 2765 times)

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Online Alex Eisenhut

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My first PACE ADS200 victim
« on: July 21, 2018, 11:29:10 pm »
Well, like a big dummy I decided to test this Russian aluminum flux by trying to flow SnPb on the bottom of a coke can...

I used my 5/16 Ultra Performance tip at 700F, put a puddle of flux on the can, waited a bit for the bubbles to start, then put the iron and the solder in the puddle.

Well, good news, the solder flowed on a Canada Dry Ginger Ale (100% natural flavour (with the "u"), 355mL) can... but now my lovely tip is crusty and black. No amount of sponging, brassing, or Multicore TTC-1 Tip Tinner Cleanering is fixing it.

So kids, be careful; if your Ginger Ale can needs soldering, try something else than 15$ soldering iron ips.
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Offline exe

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Re: My first PACE ADS200 victim
« Reply #1 on: July 22, 2018, 08:27:50 am »
So, the flux works as advertised -- you were able to solder aluminium cans?

I'm a bit confused, did you solder a coke can, or a 100% natural flavour Canada Dry Ginger Ale can? Anyway, please share photos of the can!

PS I have same flux, but haven't used it yet (And, probably, I will not).
 

Online Alex Eisenhut

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Re: My first PACE ADS200 victim
« Reply #2 on: July 22, 2018, 11:41:41 am »
Sorry, I threw the can out. Here's the thing, I soldered to aluminum foil first with the Hakko, its tip didn't turn black.

But after ten minutes of rubbing the PACE tip on 0000 steel wool, it's 90% usable again.   :phew:

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Offline Whales

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Re: My first PACE ADS200 victim
« Reply #3 on: July 22, 2018, 11:51:58 am »
I once destroyed the plating on some cheap tips by trying to solder to aluminium.  This was under puddles of straight rosin flux. I assumed the aluminium had alloyed into the tip.

http://halestrom.net/darksleep/blog/015_aluminium_silicon_pcb/

Be warned about abrading your tip: tips are usually plated with something that lasts longer than the (often copper) body material.  You'll get performance out of your cleaned tip, but it probably won't last as long, so treat it nicely

N.B. there are solder mixes specifically for aluminium.  The one I saw once was a weird ratio of lead and tin.  Not sure what's in the lead free camp for this.
« Last Edit: July 22, 2018, 11:53:45 am by Whales »
 

Online Alex Eisenhut

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Re: My first PACE ADS200 victim
« Reply #4 on: July 22, 2018, 12:04:56 pm »
Yup, but 0000 steel wool is very fine. I think the plating is OK, maybe it's 4.5 mils instead of 5 now.
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Offline RoGeorge

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Re: My first PACE ADS200 victim
« Reply #5 on: July 22, 2018, 12:31:12 pm »
To solder on Aluminium, do it under a big drop of motor oil. No fancy flux required.  :-+
Probably cooking oil will work too. The idea is to block the Oxygen from air to come in contact with the Al and form oxides at the soldering point. Oil can keep the Oxygen away.

NOTE: Cover the soldering tip in Al foil before soldering, or else the tip will never be the same.

Offline DC1MC

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Re: My first PACE ADS200 victim
« Reply #6 on: July 22, 2018, 01:51:57 pm »
To solder on Aluminium, do it under a big drop of motor oil. No fancy flux required.  :-+
Probably cooking oil will work too. The idea is to block the Oxygen from air to come in contact with the Al and form oxides at the soldering point. Oil can keep the Oxygen away.

NOTE: Cover the soldering tip in Al foil before soldering, or else the tip will never be the same.

This guy solders, listen to him :-+, when I've first witnessed this trick of an old ham that was making cases, my eyes were almost popping out, I've never thought it's possible. At the time there were no Metacals and hi-tech stuff, just a big ass iron and some clear mineral oil (don't use the aditiveated motor oil, it will make a bad surface).

   Cheers,
   DC1MC
 

Online Alex Eisenhut

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Re: My first PACE ADS200 victim
« Reply #7 on: July 25, 2018, 10:12:50 pm »
Some more rubbing with 0 steel wool, and this is as good as it gets. The camera exaggerates the black flecks on the tip, it looks shinier and less pockmarked by eye. Solder wets on it well enough.  :phew:

Lesson learned.
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Online Cliff Matthews

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Re: My first PACE ADS200 victim
« Reply #8 on: July 26, 2018, 01:28:41 am »
Close call with that tip.  :scared:   I'm not saying I did anything, but..

I had mine open today and couldn't resist poking around..  I learned that buyers will find scads of room to quickly wind at least 14 more turns of AWG 18 over the secondary bobbin area to get ~30 VAC @ 3 amps they might send to a sidekick buck supply like the RD Tech model DPS5005 that Dave reviewed ($28).

I learned whenever the common cathode bi-color LED is off, the iron is in sleep mode. So no LED might be the right signal to make use of a decent transformer that's already on a Pace owners bench. A small PCB relay can power an isolated larger relay to run a side-mounted DC-DC supply after a small RC time delay (3 amp fused output, I think is safe). The original winding wouldn't change, but you know, this is just "food for thought.."
 

Online Bud

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Re: My first PACE ADS200 victim
« Reply #9 on: July 26, 2018, 02:05:49 am »
Some more rubbing with 0 steel wool, and this is as good as it gets. The camera exaggerates the black flecks on the tip, it looks shinier and less pockmarked by eye. Solder wets on it well enough.  :phew:

Lesson learned.

The efforts to clean it probably was not worth $13  for a new one  :)
Facebook-free life and Rigol-free shack.
 

Online Alex Eisenhut

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Re: My first PACE ADS200 victim
« Reply #10 on: July 27, 2018, 12:30:23 am »
The efforts to clean it probably was not worth $13  for a new one  :)

I had the steel wool already. It was used to remove glue from a botched hardwood floor job. (The wool won't damage the wood but it removes the glue. It was amazing. )
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Online Cliff Matthews

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Re: My first PACE ADS200 victim
« Reply #11 on: July 30, 2018, 09:32:29 pm »
So I got in my eye, to modify :) I'm ordering a DPS5005 to mount on top of my Pace, so this small mod gets me 40Vdc.
I hold down the Pace blue button until it reads "OFF" to free-up ~90 watts* for the DPS (and no bench space required).

*edit - I weighed the Pace transfo (a bit heavier than a 88va Hammond) and de-rated my estimates. Pace uses the full 120 watts only intermittently, not constant duty (but for safety, Pace has a TCO installed inside :-+ )
« Last Edit: July 31, 2018, 07:37:34 pm by Cliff Matthews »
 

Offline labjr

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Re: My first PACE ADS200 victim
« Reply #12 on: August 06, 2018, 10:21:31 pm »
So I got in my eye, to modify :) I'm ordering a DPS5005 to mount on top of my Pace, so this small mod gets me 40Vdc.
I hold down the Pace blue button until it reads "OFF" to free-up ~90 watts* for the DPS (and no bench space required).

*edit - I weighed the Pace transfo (a bit heavier than a 88va Hammond) and de-rated my estimates. Pace uses the full 120 watts only intermittently, not constant duty (but for safety, Pace has a TCO installed inside :-+ )

Do you know the resistance of the heater?

Seems like we're already getting closer to a third party control PCB for ADS200 or even a station for TD-200 handpiece and tips.
 

Online Cliff Matthews

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Re: My first PACE ADS200 victim
« Reply #13 on: August 07, 2018, 12:26:03 am »
So I got in my eye, to modify :) I'm ordering a DPS5005 to mount on top of my Pace, so this small mod gets me 40Vdc.
I hold down the Pace blue button until it reads "OFF" to free-up ~90 watts* for the DPS (and no bench space required).

*edit - I weighed the Pace transfo (a bit heavier than a 88va Hammond) and de-rated my estimates. Pace uses the full 120 watts only intermittently, not constant duty (but for safety, Pace has a TCO installed inside :-+ )

Do you know the resistance of the heater?

Seems like we're already getting closer to a third party control PCB for ADS200 or even a station for TD-200 handpiece and tips.
I measured 9 tips between 3.7 and 4.0 ohms with both a Fluke 77 and Aneng 8002 (feel free to laugh at an old geezer..). IMO a little elbow grease, a 12v supply, a 555 and MOSFET driving 2 Angled MiniWave* tips can make great hot tweezers for < $40 !!

*edit: Homegrown hot-tweezers can be made with 2 of these: https://www.tequipment.net/Pace/1130-0033-P1/Tips/

**edit: I measured again via bench supply @ 1A (all 9 tips are 4.3-4.4 ohms) and flow 60/40 solder at about 5 volts. So yes, 12-19vdc and a 555 pwm'ed Mosfet will allow low cost portability or mini-weezers to become a reality...
« Last Edit: August 07, 2018, 01:53:56 am by Cliff Matthews »
 

Offline labjr

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Re: My first PACE ADS200 victim
« Reply #14 on: August 07, 2018, 02:58:42 am »
Probably time to swap out the transformer for one with tighter regulation that won't sag when it's asked to step up. Or raise the voltage a bit. Because 24v should provide plenty of power into a 4 ohm load. Maybe like a 200va toroid.  ;D
« Last Edit: August 07, 2018, 03:01:24 am by labjr »
 

Online Cliff Matthews

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Re: My first PACE ADS200 victim
« Reply #15 on: August 07, 2018, 09:15:12 am »
I think this transformer's sag is not important. Did you know this particular Pace model will run with the mains at just 40 VAC?  (or 80vac for 240v units). What interests me is why tip heater resistance is less than half of a JBC tip... This means eventually these tips could gain a "cult following" among the portable crowd.

They can forget the TS100,  without active components, a 12 volt battery gives over 30 watts to the tip.  :-+
« Last Edit: August 07, 2018, 09:35:06 pm by Cliff Matthews »
 

Offline mbless

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Re: My first PACE ADS200 victim
« Reply #16 on: August 07, 2018, 12:50:45 pm »
What interests me is why tip heater resistance is less than half of a JBC tip...
[/quote]

You must have meant Hakko. JBC heater resistance is around 3 ohms.
 
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Online Cliff Matthews

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Re: My first PACE ADS200 victim
« Reply #17 on: August 07, 2018, 01:53:21 pm »
What interests me is why tip heater resistance is less than half of a JBC tip...

You must have meant Hakko. JBC heater resistance is around 3 ohms.
[/quote]
Corrected  :palm: I remembered seeing 9.1 ohms in a Marco Reps video, but wasn't paying close attention.
https://youtu.be/M-EaxWU70xM?t=211

Still, 4.3 ohms and $25 is not bad to rig-up budget tweezers (but in an open scissor setup, ~5.5" may not fit everywhere)


*edit - attached best tip for attempting budget tweezers (higher thermal mass and tips open should be under 2.5")
« Last Edit: August 07, 2018, 03:01:32 pm by Cliff Matthews »
 

Offline james_s

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Re: My first PACE ADS200 victim
« Reply #18 on: August 07, 2018, 04:09:09 pm »
The oil trick sounds interesting, I should make an aluminum tip for my soldering iron and give it a try. I wonder if a shielding gas would work, nitrogen or CO2, I have a tank of gas for my MIG welder I could try.
 


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