Author Topic: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200  (Read 135243 times)

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Offline Alex Eisenhut

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1275 on: March 05, 2020, 12:46:22 am »
I would like a tweezer for my ADS200 but at that price I'll stick to the dual-iron technique. You can buy a lot of KSGER T12s for that money... (And I did LOL)
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Offline labjr

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1276 on: March 05, 2020, 01:06:00 am »
Yeah I feel like they're jacking up the prices now!
 

Offline Shock

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1277 on: March 05, 2020, 04:54:52 pm »
Yeah I feel like they're jacking up the prices now!

Aaron from Pace told us about the ADS200 introductory list price ($265 for instant setback) when the station came out, also the new tweezers were more expensive than the older model, and that Pace has no control over dealer pricing.

If you paid addition to the prices on tequipments website you will have noticed they aren't discounting the station or tweezers 10% at the moment. When you stack that with our 6% it makes quite a difference. So in reality there is less price "discounting" than price "jacking" on tequipments website.
Soldering/Rework: Pace ADS200, Pace MBT350
Multimeters: Fluke 87V, 117, 27/FM               >>> WANTED STUFF <<<
Oszilloskopen: Rigol DS1054Z, Phillips PM3065
 

Offline tooki

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1278 on: March 05, 2020, 05:37:02 pm »
It's about a hundred more than their previous model. From what I see more power, adjustment, aluminum legs, new instant setback stand and a few more smd tips in the series.
Not to mention that the station it connects to is cheaper than the stations the older tweezers go with.
 

Offline dkggpeters

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1279 on: March 06, 2020, 12:53:22 pm »
It's about a hundred more than their previous model. From what I see more power, adjustment, aluminum legs, new instant setback stand and a few more smd tips in the series.
Not to mention that the station it connects to is cheaper than the stations the older tweezers go with.

I have a feeling that they will expand the Accudrive line to be the successor to the Intelliheat line
 

Offline tooki

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1280 on: March 06, 2020, 08:06:25 pm »
Yes, I’ve assumed that to be the case from the beginning.
 

Offline Shock

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1281 on: March 07, 2020, 01:35:26 pm »
Just saw this tip holder for Pace cartridge tips posted on Thingiverse.
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4206731

Soldering/Rework: Pace ADS200, Pace MBT350
Multimeters: Fluke 87V, 117, 27/FM               >>> WANTED STUFF <<<
Oszilloskopen: Rigol DS1054Z, Phillips PM3065
 

Offline neo_

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1282 on: April 15, 2020, 07:26:13 pm »
I was waiting to purchase the new MT-200 tweezers when they are released, but at $400(with ISB) is nearly double then what I paid for the entire ADS200 station and TD-200 soldering pen combo. MT-200 is about twice the cost of MT-100. A bit overpriced, in my opinion. Reminds of JBC pricing...


Just saw this tip holder for Pace cartridge tips posted on Thingiverse.
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4206731



Placing the tips in and out into the retail packaging is adding additional time and effort compared to storing tips in the holes on the ISB base.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2020, 07:34:30 pm by neo_ »
 

Offline Shock

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1283 on: April 15, 2020, 10:42:22 pm »
I was waiting to purchase the new MT-200 tweezers when they are released, but at $400(with ISB) is nearly double then what I paid for the entire ADS200 station and TD-200 soldering pen combo. MT-200 is about twice the cost of MT-100. A bit overpriced, in my opinion.

I agree it looks expensive but our actual price with the tequipment.net eevblog 6% discount code $366 and that includes a pair of $44 tips so really the tweezers are about $320 with setback stand. This is calculated on full list price so that may come down a little if they do a sale. As the ADS200 was on an introductory price as well as on sale for two years it exaggerates the difference.
Soldering/Rework: Pace ADS200, Pace MBT350
Multimeters: Fluke 87V, 117, 27/FM               >>> WANTED STUFF <<<
Oszilloskopen: Rigol DS1054Z, Phillips PM3065
 

Offline hrbngr

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1284 on: April 25, 2020, 02:03:53 am »
Shock and Cliff,

I'm finally getting close to picking up the ADS200 from Tequipment--a little disappointed that I waited for the 2yr sale to stop--but oh well.  I've read every page of this thread since Cliff started it, and had a couple of questions regarding tips, etc.

1.  Is the firmware version pretty settled at this point? I was not looking forward to sending the chip to Aaron for replacement.  It does look like the gasket issue is resolved, at least.

2.  Does it seem like there is a consensus on the standard vs ultra-performance tips? price/performance/value

3. I'm coming from an Edsyn 971 where I only used the chisel tip it came with (and ignored the 5-7 others in the bag) and i've fallen deep into the weeds at times here on the forums reading tip recommendation threads(chisel/bent chisel/miniwave/etc), so if you were buying one as a gift for someone to do basic soldering repairs to small appliances, soldering practice kits to improve skills, etc, would you have a basic set of tips in mind that would do the trick until one was knowledgeable enough or had some specific work that might require a different tip option?

here is my basic list:
-=standard tips=-
0.80mm Chisel
1.2mm Bent Chisel
2.38mm Chisel
3.05mm Miniwave
 

Offline Shock

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1285 on: April 25, 2020, 04:16:00 am »
The firmware 1.4 has been out for some time yes. As far as I'm aware it's still the latest. You don't send your old firmware back, Aaron was just sending out the 1.4 to those on older versions.

Both series of cartridges have the same heater but the ultra performance have more mass over the heater. The more mass a tip has, the shorter the tip is, the greater the contact surface with the target means the better performance it will have. So it's a combination of all those factors.

Some of the tips are only in the one series anyway and it makes sense when you look at the tip sizes. For instance the rework blades are in standard series but do you really need more mass in that situation, probably not. I use mostly the ultra performance tips but if I was doing smd prototyping I'd use the standard.

The tips you have selected are a good start. I would add a large chisel as well, they are useful for soldering and removing heatsinks in repair. Then a knife blade which is multipurpose but good for wick/wiping across pads.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2020, 04:28:33 am by Shock »
Soldering/Rework: Pace ADS200, Pace MBT350
Multimeters: Fluke 87V, 117, 27/FM               >>> WANTED STUFF <<<
Oszilloskopen: Rigol DS1054Z, Phillips PM3065
 

Offline hrbngr

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1286 on: April 25, 2020, 04:34:25 am »
Shock,

thanks for the extra tip recommendations.  Have you found the extra mass in the "head" of the ultra perfs getting in the way/obscuring the view at all when working?

oh, on the large chisel, how big is too big???   :o
(ultra perf parts)
3/16" Chisel (4.78mm) P/N 1131-0054-P1
1/4" Chisel (6.35mm) P/N 1131-0055-P1
9/32" Chisel (7.14mm) P/N 1131-0056-P1
5/16" Chisel (7.95mm) P/N 1131-0057-P1
 

Offline Shock

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1287 on: April 25, 2020, 05:13:37 am »
No doesn't bother me at all. If I was choosing from the large chisels for me the 13/64" (5.15mm) and the 5/16" (7.95mm). The small one is more for size appropriate jobs and the large one is good at one shot desoldering through hole transistors and small caps, eyelets, heat sinks, back of potentiometers.
Soldering/Rework: Pace ADS200, Pace MBT350
Multimeters: Fluke 87V, 117, 27/FM               >>> WANTED STUFF <<<
Oszilloskopen: Rigol DS1054Z, Phillips PM3065
 

Offline Mp3

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1288 on: April 25, 2020, 07:32:23 am »
I'm gonna butt in here even though  I am not part of this conversation,

1.  Is the firmware version pretty settled at this point? I was not looking forward to sending the chip to Aaron for replacement.  It does look like the gasket issue is resolved, at least.

Mine bought either a few months ago or half a year ago (can't remember) is on 1-4 and i have never had a problem except for the first time auto setback kicked in during the middle of some work. It is not too hard to fix that, but you'll have to check the manual if it's an issue as i don't remember. I never had the gasket issue. i think that's long gone

2.  Does it seem like there is a consensus on the standard vs ultra-performance tips? price/performance/value

Yeah, I have three tips: one standard chisel 3/16,  ultra conical 1/32, and ultra conical 1/128.

While I don't have any problems with the standard chisel, the price difference between the two is negligible so i don't even know why you wouldn't get ultra performance.

I typically switch between the two during tough repair jobs involving desoldering. Being able to swap the tips and reheat so fast rules btw but i wish they gave you a place to set the tips.

3. I'm coming from an Edsyn 971 where I only used the chisel tip it came with (and ignored the 5-7 others in the bag) and i've fallen deep into the weeds at times here on the forums reading tip recommendation threads(chisel/bent chisel/miniwave/etc), so if you were buying one as a gift for someone to do basic soldering repairs to small appliances, soldering practice kits to improve skills, etc, would you have a basic set of tips in mind that would do the trick until one was knowledgeable enough or had some specific work that might require a different tip option?

I asked about the miniwave and got a lot of rave reviews on it. But, for my needs I will simply replace my standard 3/16 chisel with an ultra of the same size when it's time to replace it. I thought  I would start with these three tips and then move on to what else I needed and so far I have not needed. The combination of that size chisel and conical tip have been awesome and amazingly useful for me. The 1/128 only comes out when I am trying to solder wires to surface mount pins or something like that, so it's hardly used.

After nearly equivalent amounts of abuse, the ultra conical looks better. Could just be that it re-tins easier due to its shape. I guess you can take my suggestions with a grain of salt, because I like conical tips a lot and they work great for me as an all-around tip whereas i know a lot of people despise conical. I can't do fine work with a chisel tip to save my life.

For what it's worth, this is the only station i've ever used that allows hot swap of tips (no pun intended) and I do have a jbc clone on the way that can also swap tips while on.

Anyway, what i'm trying to get at is in several months of daily use for all sorts of jobs, i have only found myself wanting my two go-to tips and then the third for special jobs. If you anticipate needing more, go ahead and get more. if you're in the USA, shipping is really reasonable direct from pace.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2020, 07:34:04 am by Mp3 »
Pace ADS200, Jabe UD-1200, TS-100
HP 3478A, Fluke 45, UNI-T UT71A, several fused DT-830B
Power Design TP340 & Siglent SDS1052DL+
 

Offline Shock

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1289 on: April 25, 2020, 08:16:35 am »
Mp3 you reminded me to mention that Hrbngr get the "instant setback" version of the station if he wants stand setback/wake detection.

They give you two places to stow hot tips. One is the silicon rubber pad, the other is several tip storage holes on the back of the stand and a slot for the tip tool and more tips on the stand sides (see right photo). The tip tool is the easiest way to swap hot tips.



Soldering/Rework: Pace ADS200, Pace MBT350
Multimeters: Fluke 87V, 117, 27/FM               >>> WANTED STUFF <<<
Oszilloskopen: Rigol DS1054Z, Phillips PM3065
 
The following users thanked this post: Mp3

Offline hrbngr

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1290 on: April 25, 2020, 06:25:24 pm »
Shock,

Does the station w/ISB stand come w/the tip tool?

I did have this in the "Accessories" order I was thinking of making later:
**TEquipment pricing
P/N 1100-0232-P1 Fiber Cleaning Tool $20.76
P/N 4021-0013-P3 Replacement Sponges  $6.92
P/N 1213-0090-P5 Replacement O-Ring (5pk) $3.95
P/N 1100-0206-P1 Pace Tip Tool  $12.85

If it is not included, is it worth it to move into the order w/the station? Or can I use the silicon rubber pad until then?

Mp3,
for the conical tips, i don't have much experience with them. I had been looking at the bent tip variant:
P/N 1131-0003-P1 1/64" Conical Sharp Bent 30° (0.40mm) *  $13.84
Would an option like that replicate some of uses of the 1/64 straight conical?
 

Offline Shock

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1291 on: April 25, 2020, 09:40:57 pm »
Yes the tip tool comes with the complete station so no need to order a second.

I prefer a set of chisels over pointy ones as they have better control and contact with the pcb, In these videos you can see how chisels are really ideal for both smd and through hole pads. In the first video at 1m33s he very slightly changes contact angle of the tip to ensure the melf gets reflowed with a nice fillet. Then use a conical such as the sharp bent for fine work.



Soldering/Rework: Pace ADS200, Pace MBT350
Multimeters: Fluke 87V, 117, 27/FM               >>> WANTED STUFF <<<
Oszilloskopen: Rigol DS1054Z, Phillips PM3065
 
The following users thanked this post: dman777

Offline Mp3

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1292 on: April 26, 2020, 05:31:32 am »
Hey thanks Shock, I had totally forgot the stand had a place for the tips.  :-DD Glad I brought it up then!  :-+

Mp3,
for the conical tips, i don't have much experience with them. I had been looking at the bent tip variant:
P/N 1131-0003-P1 1/64" Conical Sharp Bent 30° (0.40mm) *  $13.84
Would an option like that replicate some of uses of the 1/64 straight conical?

Yeah, the only difference really in bent and straight conical comes down to how you like to hold the iron - as far as i'm aware. There are some angles that are really difficult to get without a bent tip and i honestly should get one for that reason.

I think the 1/64 is a good size to go with if you want to have a single conical tip. Even if you don't use them regularly, I find a smaller conical tip like that to be really useful doing repairs on dense boards, as well as cleaning out PCB holes that get filled in during desoldering.

(For what it's worth I have the non - instant setback version and it included both the rubber flap and tweezer style removal tools.)
Pace ADS200, Jabe UD-1200, TS-100
HP 3478A, Fluke 45, UNI-T UT71A, several fused DT-830B
Power Design TP340 & Siglent SDS1052DL+
 

Online Weston

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1293 on: April 27, 2020, 07:40:50 pm »
I was admiring my new ADS200 last night and I realized that the cartridges only have two electrical contacts but the handle cable terminates in four electrical connections which has me confused. I was under the impression that each cartridge contains a thermocouple and a heating element.

Does anyone have any insight to how this works? Shining a light down into the handle seems to show that there are indeed only two electrical contacts. Did I completely miss something? I looked through Dave's review video and went through a good number of the previous comments on this thread but was not able to find any commentary on this.

Does the iron do something weird like put the thermocouple in series with the heater element and switches back and forth between power and sense? Is it actually just a PTC heater element with a calibrated curve?
 

Offline Shock

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1294 on: April 27, 2020, 11:12:50 pm »
The red power wire of the heater is supplied by a fet driven fullwave rectifier outputting pulsed DC at half mains frequency. The control circuitry switches that rail with another fet again to provide the regulation. Temp measurements for the software control are taken from the cartridges k type thermocouple in series with the heater. This can be done (if required) while the cartridge is being heated, during the zero point of each pulse.

The blue is ground and the and green goes to chassis/earth. The white I assume is some kind of thermal protection or tip detection and not connected to the cartridge. It looks like a component is connected to it, I've never bothered to check it out.



« Last Edit: April 27, 2020, 11:39:27 pm by Shock »
Soldering/Rework: Pace ADS200, Pace MBT350
Multimeters: Fluke 87V, 117, 27/FM               >>> WANTED STUFF <<<
Oszilloskopen: Rigol DS1054Z, Phillips PM3065
 
The following users thanked this post: thm_w, Cliff Matthews, Weston

Offline dman777

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1295 on: April 28, 2020, 12:53:44 am »
I recently studied the Pace ADS200 Soldering Station Review and I have two questions, please:

1) Did the manufacture ever give a update about the flux being left on the board? Like that won't happen anymore? I don't want to buy one of these and have corrosion on it and a few years later

2) This Pace unit is 120 watts and the JBC in the review was 130w. Should there be that much of a thermal performance difference for just 10 watts? If not, for a 10 watt difference why wasn't the Pace closer in thermal performance as the JDC? Since it is based on wattage.
 

Offline Shock

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1296 on: April 28, 2020, 03:18:56 am »
Since the stations weren't at normal soldering temperature the JBCs performance was exaggerated. It has a different heating profile and clearly was overshooting during recovery at a low temp. The proof of this is if you watch the video carefully it was reading high briefly on the thermometer. JBCs own benchmarks show the same thing at full temp. Once a solder thermal bridge was established it helped it out even more. There is even a member on the forums here that has a Chinese station which solders below melt point, amazing!

So neither station was struggling, just the JBC was running hotter. As that video mentions, Pace deliberately plate there tips to last, compared to JBC prices and considering longevity I think it's a nice saving. The power difference indicated between the two I doubt was even a factor, both stations have very similar heating/recovery speeds.

No idea about the flux, it was only on the hand soldered connectors. I'm sure Pace saw it and would have changed their process if they thought it was necessary. Without knowing the flux being used it could have a beneficial effect on tin whiskers. :)
« Last Edit: April 28, 2020, 04:10:10 am by Shock »
Soldering/Rework: Pace ADS200, Pace MBT350
Multimeters: Fluke 87V, 117, 27/FM               >>> WANTED STUFF <<<
Oszilloskopen: Rigol DS1054Z, Phillips PM3065
 
The following users thanked this post: dman777

Offline EEVblog

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1297 on: April 28, 2020, 04:12:53 am »
The firmware 1.4 has been out for some time yes. As far as I'm aware it's still the latest. You don't send your old firmware back, Aaron was just sending out the 1.4 to those on older versions.

I'm still running 1.2  :(
 

Offline Mp3

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1298 on: April 28, 2020, 04:18:04 am »
Hey Shock (and anyone else) - a quesrtion for anyone with the instant setback stand. Isn't the instant setback switch on that stand a simple microswitch?

If so, i was thinking about rigging up a foot pedal to act as that switch, since i tend to flip the power on and off as i need it, and maybe keeping a little box on the floor is easier than always reaching for the power switch.


I recently studied the Pace ADS200 Soldering Station Review and I have two questions, please:

1) Did the manufacture ever give a update about the flux being left on the board? Like that won't happen anymore? I don't want to buy one of these and have corrosion on it and a few years later

2) This Pace unit is 120 watts and the JBC in the review was 130w. Should there be that much of a thermal performance difference for just 10 watts? If not, for a 10 watt difference why wasn't the Pace closer in thermal performance as the JDC? Since it is based on wattage.

my 2 cents
1) I have gear from the 80's that has flux coated boards, and i was horrified when i saw it, but i even  made a thread about it on here once and several people told me i could clean it off if i wanted but it wouldn't likely harm anything. Not saying the pace is definitely protected against that as , since Shock says, there are many kinds of flux out there.

2) I have a clone of that jbc station on the way which some youtube reviewers really like, but from what i seen, and having used my pace very much in the last couple months, i don't think that 10 watt difference is making any real difference.  To address your other point, the pace definitely overshoots when i power it up or switch temperatures on it, so i think it just tends to do that, personally i prefer it to overshoot for a second than sag and catch back up.
Pace ADS200, Jabe UD-1200, TS-100
HP 3478A, Fluke 45, UNI-T UT71A, several fused DT-830B
Power Design TP340 & Siglent SDS1052DL+
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: Pace ADS200 solder station. Production-grade quality at about $200
« Reply #1299 on: April 28, 2020, 04:23:50 am »
2) This Pace unit is 120 watts and the JBC in the review was 130w. Should there be that much of a thermal performance difference for just 10 watts? If not, for a 10 watt difference why wasn't the Pace closer in thermal performance as the JDC? Since it is based on wattage.

Not sure what video you are referring to but in my comparison video the JBC did outperform the Pace thermally. I do not know if that's at the expense of temperature recovery overshoot though as some have suggested.
IMO the only way to fairly compare irons for thermal performance is to turn them down a to a minimum temp that will melt on given surface (e.g. copper plane) if they are both the same temp and one melt and the other doesn't then you have a clear winner. Pace took me to task at the time over this comparison, but even when asked they provided no better method for a comparison.
But it's pretty moot under normal soldering conditions. Pace also admitted that the JBC was in a different price bracket so any comparison in that regard was not fair.
Tips and their individual performance also play a huge role. Plus the JBC has 10W more power.
« Last Edit: April 28, 2020, 11:49:50 pm by EEVblog »
 
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