Author Topic: [FT] xDevs.com KX LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.  (Read 67480 times)

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Online mimmus78

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #75 on: November 11, 2016, 10:48:15 am »
Packaging:

 - VK5RC              3pcs       -      PM SENT - Paid - Registered
 - t2kv                    2pcs       -      PM SENT - Paid - Registered
 - klaus11              2pcs       -      PM SENT - Paid - Priority
 - HighVoltage       2pcs       -      PM SENT - Paid - Registered - overbooking list
 - Mimmus78         3pcs       -      that's me

Confirmed waiting for payment:

 - Nuno_pt             3pcs       -      PM SENT - Portugal zone 1 - priority mail 3.50 EUR - registered 7.90 EUR
 - msliva               3pcs       -        PM SENT - Czech Republic  - zone 1 - priority mail 3.50 EUR  - registered 7.90 EUR

Confirmed but in overbooking list (do not pay - wait):

 - SvanGool          2pcs        -     Netherlands  zone 1 - priority mail 3.50 EUR  - registered 7.90 EUR - overbooking list
 - fanOfeeDIY      2pcs       -       Japan - priority mail 5.50 EUR  - registered 9.95 EUR - overbooking list


=======================
TOTAL                  22 pcs
REMAINING         0 pcs


Waiting or confirmation

 - pelule               3pcs       -        please confirm and send me address for shipment quotation
=======================
TOTAL                3pcs


TOTAL CONFIRMED + UNCONFIRMED = 25
 

Offline pelule

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #76 on: November 11, 2016, 04:13:04 pm »
PM sent, still in for the 3 pcs.
You will learn something new every single day
 

Online mimmus78

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #77 on: November 11, 2016, 11:43:01 pm »
Hi guys I have good news.

The PCB are going to be fabricated again ... they decided to be very nice, redo and ship the lot as soon as possible.
As consequence of this I think we have enough PCB for everybody :popcorn:

I think they are going just to correct the open guard track as they didn't asked me to send new gerbers.
I still don't have idea when we will get the new PCBs and if I will need to pay customs and VAT again.

What do we want to do?
 

Online mimmus78

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #78 on: November 11, 2016, 11:49:43 pm »
Packaging:

 - VK5RC              3pcs       -      PM SENT - Paid - Registered
 - t2kv                    2pcs       -      PM SENT - Paid - Registered
 - klaus11              2pcs       -      PM SENT - Paid - Priority
 - HighVoltage       2pcs       -      PM SENT - Paid  - Registered - overbooking list
- pelule               3pcs       -        PM SENT - Germany zone 1 - priority mail 3.50 EUR - registered 7.90 EUR
 - Mimmus78         3pcs       -      that's me

Confirmed waiting for payment:

 
 - Nuno_pt             3pcs       -      PM SENT - Portugal zone 1 - priority mail 3.50 EUR - registered 7.90 EUR
 - msliva               3pcs       -        PM SENT - Czech Republic  - zone 1 - priority mail 3.50 EUR  - registered 7.90 EUR

Confirmed but in overbooking list (do not pay - wait I receive second lot):

 - SvanGool          2pcs        -     Netherlands  zone 1 - priority mail 3.50 EUR  - registered 7.90 EUR - overbooking list
 - fanOfeeDIY      2pcs       -       Japan - priority mail 5.50 EUR  - registered 9.95 EUR - overbooking list
 - little                   2pcs.    -        Germany overbooking list

=============================
TOTAL                                  22 pcs
wait list (overbooking)          3  pcs
« Last Edit: November 12, 2016, 06:59:59 pm by mimmus78 »
 

Offline plesa

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #79 on: November 12, 2016, 12:10:45 am »
What do we want to do?

Did you already ordered resistors? They have extra long leadtime or you are going to use some thin film like PTF56/UXB series?
Good choice can be Rhopoint ( they will fit to TiN boards )
https://www.rhopointcomponents.com/components/resistors/precision-through-hole/wirewound-miniohm-3ppmc-5e10-5g10-series.html
 

Online mimmus78

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #80 on: November 12, 2016, 12:33:30 am »
I contacted Edwin and Vishay. Finished to order some resistor from Edwin. I really don't even checked if this resistors will fit, but I'm also going to build my PCB version so for sure I will use it.

Still waiting for Vishay response, I really liked the idea to have this first board I build with Vishay. I asked fancy pants VHP101 for the heater divider a some other normal in plastic for the others 3.

The main problem I have is that I still don't have 3458A ... I'd like to try to buy same old rusty broken one if it will pop out somewhere, but you must be brave to do this extreme repairs like TiN.

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Offline TiN

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #81 on: November 12, 2016, 07:26:16 am »
Quote
but you must be brave to do this extreme repairs
No bravery needed, just have 2-3K$ cash handy and you will do fine. If A3 ADC bad - 1400$ for replacement. Repeat until it's stable :). It's no different than any other electronics repair, other than requirement of stable and verified calibration sources for DCV and OHM. For the first one you already on the correct way with LTZ module (you can calibrate 3458A to other calibrated 3458A using 7V LTZ output ;). I even had luck to transfer DCV internationally using A9 LTZ module, and got only 6ppm of error in the end.

I'm looking forward to see all you guys build some units and get them tested. I did not expect this thread to go this way,  :clap:.

As special case I'd be happy to offer calibration for your finished builds after it's all working and burned-in first 200 hours. Rules would be simple:

1. Build your KX-module, publish short worklog in this thread (few photos of assembled PCBA, photo of it running with DMM hooked up showing 7V)
2. Leave it running for 200 hours, so initial drifts get stabilized. Module should be enclosed in some box without vents.
3. Measure it again, record the temperature and voltage and put a label with values on the box
4. Ship the box to me (Taiwan). You pay shipping.
5. I'll power your box with +15V for 48 hours to have everything stabilize
6. Test 7V output voltage in temperature span +20....+30C, record the graph
7. Unit will be shipped back via EMS Express (~30-40$USD, 4-7 days to USA, bit more to EU). You pay shipping.

I don't have official Keysight/Tektronix/etc calibration certificates for my 3458A, but I'm confident it's +/-2ppm (likely <1ppm) on DCV.
All steps are required :)
« Last Edit: November 12, 2016, 07:27:49 am by TiN »
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Offline VK5RC

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #82 on: November 12, 2016, 08:48:08 am »
I would like to thank both TiN,  for putting his hard work designs up for open review/reproduction and Mimmus78 for putting in the pcb gerbers etc and doing all the postage / customs etc.
TiN,  if that offer re calibration check is open in a month or so,  it will be hard to refuse!
Robert
Whoah! Watch where that landed we might need it later.
 

Offline TiN

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #83 on: November 12, 2016, 08:50:30 am »
Let's make it so: offer valid for any KX reference board once, without time limitation, unless my homelab get major change, which isn't planned.
YouTube | Chat room | Live-cam | Have documentation to share? Upload here! No size limit, firmware dumps, photos.
 
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Online mimmus78

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #84 on: November 12, 2016, 09:51:04 am »
TiN this offer of free calibration will be interesting but we should find a way to ship back and forth without paying customs.

I should check how this can be done.

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Offline plesa

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #85 on: November 12, 2016, 10:53:57 am »
I can offer you similar service like TiN in Europe.
1. Measure it with calibrated 3458A/002 in reasonable temperature range.
2 . For extreme voltnut  - close to me is JJA and they can measure it for 400 EUR / 2-3 weeks of monitoring.

What I will add is power cycling for few days ( On for 1h and off or 30min to cool down).
And maybe bake the LTZ1000 prior assembly.

For shipment can be handy to monitor temperture if you are going to ship it in winter time.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2016, 11:00:35 am by plesa »
 
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Online mimmus78

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #86 on: November 12, 2016, 01:17:05 pm »
Plesa that's very nice for all European guys to have this opportunity.

O men you have JJA near home! I cannot even comment it.

Anyway regards Edwin resistors, despite last problems with quality in last year I think it is the best and cost effective way to get reasonably TC matched resistors for the heater.

Keep this ratio constant is 10 times more important that all other factors.

I read somewhere that resistors made by same person, one after the other can have similar drift and TC.
You can ask Vishay for this, but I this it will increase even more the costs. So I just asked Erwin for this and this seems to be the most practical and cheap way to get this point.
Hope he really solved issues with his epoxy in meantime.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2016, 01:34:50 pm by mimmus78 »
 

Offline Alex Nikitin

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #87 on: November 12, 2016, 01:32:20 pm »
I can offer you similar service like TiN in Europe.
1. Measure it with calibrated 3458A/002 in reasonable temperature range.

I can do a similar service in the UK, if somebody needs it, as the HP3458A Opt 002 just came back from calibration at Keysight. I don't have a temperature chamber yet (though it may change soon), however I can monitor the lab temperature (or the reference enclosure temperature).

Cheers

Alex
 
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Offline TiN

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #88 on: November 12, 2016, 01:39:00 pm »
plesa, Alex Nikitin
If you OK, I can add this section into article on my site, with links to your profile, to keep this program afloat? :)
YouTube | Chat room | Live-cam | Have documentation to share? Upload here! No size limit, firmware dumps, photos.
 

Offline plesa

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #89 on: November 12, 2016, 01:54:12 pm »
plesa, Alex Nikitin
If you OK, I can add this section into article on my site, with links to your profile, to keep this program afloat? :)

Of course.
 
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Online mimmus78

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #90 on: November 12, 2016, 02:04:59 pm »
Fist shipment is ready ... I'm still waiting payment from other 4 members. Let me know if someone have any problem.

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« Last Edit: November 21, 2016, 08:16:59 am by mimmus78 »
 
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Online mimmus78

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #91 on: November 12, 2016, 02:07:22 pm »
OK I think we just need one 3458a for Italy now. I should ask my wife ...

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Offline Alex Nikitin

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #92 on: November 12, 2016, 02:36:41 pm »
plesa, Alex Nikitin
If you OK, I can add this section into article on my site, with links to your profile, to keep this program afloat? :)

Yes, sure.

Cheers

Alex
 
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Offline TiN

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #93 on: November 12, 2016, 03:50:22 pm »
Added a section about calibration offer on site  :-+

Also updated top post in thread. Thanks!

Calibration by Accuracy / Standard    Region/Country Contact for participants
  xDevs.com        <2ppm / 3458A-mod + 2*K2002 Asia/Taiwan      EEVBlog forum PM
  plesa            <4ppm / 3458A-002   Europe/Sweden    EEVBlog forum PM 
  Alex Nikitin      <4ppm / 3458A-002   Europe/UK        EEVBlog forum PM
YouTube | Chat room | Live-cam | Have documentation to share? Upload here! No size limit, firmware dumps, photos.
 

Offline HighVoltage

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #94 on: November 12, 2016, 04:46:36 pm »
I am still in the middle of getting to know my 3458A (8 ppm) and will have it officially Keysight calibrated in a few month time. If anyone needs its KX reference board measured in Germany, you can send it to me, as long as you pay shipping. I can also offer a comparison to my 34470A and DMM7510.
But, until now I can not change the temperature, that is a future project.   
There are 3 kinds of people in this world, those who can count and those who can not.
 
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Offline dr.diesel

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #95 on: November 12, 2016, 05:48:20 pm »
Probably plenty of 3458As in the US, but I'm happy to offer comparisons with an in Cal DMM7510 and K2010.

I also have an 0.05% Hameg 8118 LCR.

Online mimmus78

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #96 on: November 12, 2016, 10:19:37 pm »
This is going to be huge ... a global volt nut club.

Thanks to plesa I asked to rhopointcomponents.com too for a quote of the resistors. I will let you know what happens.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2016, 10:23:45 pm by mimmus78 »
 

Online mimmus78

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #97 on: November 14, 2016, 08:56:10 am »
UPDATES:
Hi guys, I shipped the 5 packages to VK5RC, t2kv, klaus11, HighVoltage, pelule.
For all that paid for registered main I will send them a PM with the tracking number.

I'm still waiting payment by: Nuno_pt, msliva. I sent them 2 PM but they seems kinda busy now.
I have other 8 spare PCBs, I think if I don't get notice from them I a couple of days I will start accept payment from to the "overbooking list".

Shipped:

 - VK5RC              3pcs       -      PM SENT - Paid - Registered
 - t2kv                    2pcs       -      PM SENT - Paid - Registered
 - klaus11              2pcs       -      PM SENT - Paid - Priority
 - HighVoltage       2pcs       -      PM SENT - Paid  - Registered - overbooking list
- pelule               3pcs       -        PM SENT - Germany zone 1 - priority mail 3.50 EUR - registered 7.90 EUR
 - Mimmus78         3pcs       -      that's me

Confirmed waiting for payment:
 
 - Nuno_pt             3pcs       -      PM SENT - Portugal zone 1 - priority mail 3.50 EUR - registered 7.90 EUR
 - msliva               3pcs       -        PM SENT - Czech Republic  - zone 1 - priority mail 3.50 EUR  - registered 7.90 EUR

Confirmed but in overbooking list (do not pay - wait I receive second lot):

 - SvanGool          2pcs        -     Netherlands  zone 1 - priority mail 3.50 EUR  - registered 7.90 EUR - overbooking list
 - fanOfeeDIY      2pcs       -       Japan - priority mail 5.50 EUR  - registered 9.95 EUR - overbooking list
 - little                   2pcs.    -        Germany overbooking list

=============================
TOTAL                                  22 pcs
wait list (overbooking)          3  pcs
 
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Offline Dr. Frank

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #98 on: November 14, 2016, 09:15:28 am »
I can offer you similar service like TiN in Europe.
1. Measure it with calibrated 3458A/002 in reasonable temperature range.

I can do a similar service in the UK, if somebody needs it, as the HP3458A Opt 002 just came back from calibration at Keysight. I don't have a temperature chamber yet (though it may change soon), however I can monitor the lab temperature (or the reference enclosure temperature).

Cheers

Alex

Plesa, Alex, and also HighVoltage:

What kind of KS calibration and report for your 3458As did /will you get?

The single page report, which only confirms that the instrument is in 1 years specification limits, or the elaborate, much more expensive, multi page calibration report, with all measurement results (as found) including test limits?

I think, if it's only the first kind, it won't be sufficient for this purpose, as the 1 year DCV specification is 8ppm / 4ppm for option 002 only, and about <= 1ppm uncertainty is required.

Frank
« Last Edit: November 14, 2016, 09:20:57 am by Dr. Frank »
 

Offline Alex Nikitin

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Re: [FT] LTZ1000A fairy-tale, or the story of little jumper.
« Reply #99 on: November 14, 2016, 10:54:42 am »

What kind of KS calibration and report for your 3458As did /will you get?

The single page report, which only confirms that the instrument is in 1 years specification limits, or the elaborate, much more expensive, multi page calibration report, with all measurement results (as found) including test limits?

Hi Frank,

Here is a page from the certificate. I hope it answers your question.

Cheers

Alex
 


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