Cheap Bluepill, very likely it has fake STM32 right ?

[Noopy]

Today (with thanks to the GromBeestje) I have a MM32F103CBT6 for you:

https://richis-lab.de/STM32_07.htm






 

[GromBeestje]

Keep in mind, the MM32F103 is not compatible with STM32F103. It got some different RCC registers (I haven't compared the other peripherals yet). Furthermore it has a different Device ID, such that tools designed to work with STM32F103 (eg OpenOCD) cannot flash/debug it.  It seems there is support for it in SEGGER J-Link.  There are datasheets and reference manuals available, as well as peripheral libraries.

[Noopy]

And one more:  BLM32F103CBT6


https://richis-lab.de/STM32_08.htm

[Noopy]

I already had a STM32-fake containing a CKS32:
https://richis-lab.de/STM32_04.htm
Now I know what die is inside the second STM32-fake:
https://richis-lab.de/STM32_01.htm

It´s a Hangshun HK32:
https://www.richis-lab.de/STM32_09.htm





 


Credits to GromBeestje

[Noopy]

I have decapped a GD32VF103 but since it´s no more a real STM32-clone I have posted it here:

https://www.eevblog.com/forum/microcontrollers/risc-v-microcontrollers-from-gigadevice/msg3027160/#msg3027160

Credits to GromBeestje

[GromBeestje]

Thanks for the pictures Noopy.

Can I ask you something? If I understood correctly, you started decapping your first fake because you ran into some compatibility issues. What were these compatibility issues?

[Noopy]

If I understood correctly, you started decapping your first fake because you ran into some compatibility issues. What were these compatibility issues?

No, I never worked with the STM32. I prefer analog electronics. Digital is ok but Software only if it´s absolutely necessary. 
The first STM32, the bluepill-fake was sent to me by a member of the mikrocontroller.net: It came from Matthias D. (madias) who started the topic you know already. He had problems with the DMA Controller.

[Jul8]

I've been playing around with the STM32F103 GD32F103 CS32F103 and APM32F103. I've written some code that can tell them apart.

How about the HK32F103? Would you add detection of the HK32F103 as well?

[jaromir]

Does anybody know the figures in the silicon art?

It looks like STM32 families do have internal nicknames. Sometimes the nicknames do "leak to public" via various documents. For example STM32F103 seems to belong to "Piranha" family, mentioned for example here http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/1443552.pdf
That may explain the artwork.
If you happen to take a look at STM32F4xx internals, you'll probably find different artwork on it , as it belongs to "Manta" family, for example https://www.mouser.com/PCN/STMicroelectronics_8451.pdf

I wonder what other aquatic animals are hiding inside STM32 devices.

[Noopy]

It looks like STM32 families do have internal nicknames. Sometimes the nicknames do "leak to public" via various documents. For example STM32F103 seems to belong to "Piranha" family, mentioned for example here http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/1443552.pdf
That may explain the artwork.
If you happen to take a look at STM32F4xx internals, you'll probably find different artwork on it , as it belongs to "Manta" family, for example https://www.mouser.com/PCN/STMicroelectronics_8451.pdf

I wonder what other aquatic animals are hiding inside STM32 devices.

Very interesting! Sounds reasonable! 
I agree with you, I should check some other variants. 


I have a new fake provided by GromBeestje:

https://www.richis-lab.de/STM32_04.htm

It came with an order of CK32.




The marking is different but still bad.




In the package I found another CKS32-die. 

[GromBeestje]

I've been playing around with the STM32F103 GD32F103 CS32F103 and APM32F103. I've written some code that can tell them apart.

How about the HK32F103? Would you add detection of the HK32F103 as well?

I've added detection for the HK32F103, however, USB is not working on my HK32 board.

[profdc9]

In case any of you get desperate for a real STM32F103CBT6 bluepill, I designed one and I just made it so it can be populated by JLCPCB's assembly service. You can find the gerbers at:

https://github.com/profdc9/STM32surface

It uses all basic and easy to obtain parts for the parts not available from JLCPCB, for example 6 mm buttons and USB B connectors.  You can put a STM32F303CCT6 on it if you want something better.  The kicad 3D image of the PCB is below.

Also, one of the reasons I designed my own is so I could lay it out better and make it more noise immune, and the ADC definitely seems to be somewhat less noisy with this board.

Dan

[Jul8]

How about the HK32F103? Would you add detection of the HK32F103 as well?

I've added detection for the HK32F103, however, USB is not working on my HK32 board.

Thank you! 

[Doctorandus_P]

I just had a brainfart (good smelling variant) and did a search for the F103 on LCSC without the "STM", and they sell 7 different variants.

https://lcsc.com/search?q=32F103C8T6
Prefix:      Mgf:   
CSK         CSK      
HK         HK
APM         Apexmic
BLM         Shenzhen Better Life Elec
GD         GigaDevices
MM         MindMotion Microelectronics      
ST         STMicroelectronics

The MM part was labeled as a 5V part which is very unusual for Cortex M3, but the datasheet seems to confirm it:
http://www.mindmotion.com.cn/userfiles/images/MM32F103XiLieWenDang/DS_MM32F103xx_o_V1.13_EN.pdf

For me this probably the end of buying "Blue Pill" boards from China / Ali.
In the latest batch I had to change the ID number to get them programmed at all, and a test program of GRBL for STM32 does not save it's settings in Flash.
I have no interest in figuring out the incompatibilities between those different variants, and Ali Sellers relabeling everything as "STM32" makes it impossible to know what you buy.

Quite a shame, because I liked the form factor a lot. They fit on Breadboads and on matrix board, and I used to solder in the thin round pins instead of the thick square pins, so they can be used in much lower profile sockets.
I also liked the very small ST-Link V2 programmers with Aluminum housing and pinout labeled on the outside.

I never liked the bulky Discovery boards and their on board programmers.
If some western manufacturer sold the "Blue Pill" boards for somewhere around EUR5 I would buy them.

From what I've read, LCSC should be a trustworthy seller. The STM variant is their most expensive, (and slowest, least peripherals probably) but I really don't care about that. Just that it works according to the datasheet, and you don't with those re-labled uC's on the Pills.

STM is USD 1.5 (10 up) from LCSC, while if you look at Octopart, no western seller has them below USD 4 (10 up).

[Noopy]

I just had a brainfart (good smelling variant) and did a search for the F103 on LCSC without the "STM", and they sell 7 different variants.

https://lcsc.com/search?q=32F103C8T6
Prefix:      Mgf:   
CSK         CSK      
HK         HK
APM         Apexmic
BLM         Shenzhen Better Life Elec
GD         GigaDevices
MM         MindMotion Microelectronics      
ST         STMicroelectronics

Affirmative!
Had them all:
https://www.richis-lab.de/STM32.htm
 

[rhodges]

From what I've read, LCSC should be a trustworthy seller.
...
STM is USD 1.5 (10 up) from LCSC, while if you look at Octopart, no western seller has them below USD 4 (10 up)

Any opinions on JLCPCB? Their parts library gives $1.18 for STM32F103C8T6, quantity 30, and it is a "basic part".

[OwO]

I haven't bought any bluepills since 2017. Designing a PCB is so trivial that I don't fuck with arduinos or *pills anymore and simply drop a MCU into any design, even MCUs I've never used before.

If you really insist, it'd probably take 30 minutes to design a compatible blue pill PCB with passives all on the bottom side, so it can be easily assembled by JLC SMT. Then you could easily product a batch to sell.

[profdc9]

You can get my Bluepill design made at JLCPCB with SMT assembly:

https://github.com/profdc9/STM32surface

This includes BOM and placement files as xlsx format.  It uses all basic parts from JLC PCB.  You can get five made for about $28.

Dan

[GromBeestje]

If some western manufacturer sold the "Blue Pill" boards for somewhere around EUR5 I would buy them.

You might have a look at Cypress. They used to have a  CY8CKIT-049  (PSoC 42xx series) for $4 on their website. Unfortunately they seem no longer available. But those have been around for many years. I'm kinda surprised that a board from a western manufacturer, at that price point, hasn't become popular in the hobby community.

For a slightly higher price,  $10, they still sell their CY8CKIT-043 (PSoc 42xxM series) and CY8CKIT-059 (PSoC5L series).
In Europe you can get them at RS. The -043 sells for € 8,62 and the -059 for € 13,08.

[Doctorandus_P]

I was unfamiliar with the PsoC, though I have a vague memory I heared taht letter comination sometimes.

A quick look at:
https://www.cypress.com/documentation/development-kitsboards/psoc-4-cy8ckit-049-4xxx-prototyping-kits

and it reads:

The CY8CKIT-049-42xx Prototyping kit supports the Arm® 32-bit Cortex-M0™ CY8C42xx device family with up to 32KB Flash and 4KB SRAM

The STM32F103C8T6 has 64kB Flash, 20kB RAM, and it's among the smaller parts of it's family.
On reason for choosing STM32 was a (nearly?) seamless grow path into uC's with more pins, power, and peripherals than I am ever likely to need in my uC projects.

In the last few years now I've been tinkering a little bit with the things and it took me quite a lot of hours of searching the web and experimenting to find a toolchain and development environment I'm reasonably happy with. I would have found those PsoC uC's interesting when I was doing comparisons of different uC's to get out of the limits of the small Atmel AVR's, but that was years ago.

The CY8CKIT-043 has more flash, but still Cortes M0, twice the price and comes with the attached programmer, which I want separate. I was thinking along the lines of buying 3 or 4 programmers for some redundancy, and 20 or so boards, so those other 15 attached programmers will end up in landfill somewhere.

It's for those relatively simple project where I don't want to design a PCB and have it manufactured in China, but just grab a uC board and dump it on a Matrix board for one -off projects.

[GromBeestje]

The programmers are snap-off. Their firmware can be switched between KitProg and CMSIS-DAP firmware. I would separate them before using them anyways.
And if you would get the 049, use one with them, as the 049 comes with some USB-UART instead.

The Cypress PSoCs, I guess, they are good for their analog features, like a current DAC.
But their software suite only runs on Windows. That's a downside in my opinion. You need that software to generate some code to run it.

[Doctorandus_P]

I was looking for a new uC family when I grew out of the AVR's, and decided on STM32.
It's very unlikely I will be using any other uC family in the coming 10 years or so, and as this is an STM32 thread about the Blue Pill, please keep it a bit on topic.

[Kjelt]

Anyone knows of bluepill pcbs with a lqfp64 STM32F1xx on it (also ok if fake).
I still have 10 pcs of original STs lying with 256kB flash and 48kB ram, i could just replace the uC or design own board, still weighing the choices.

[josip]

If some western manufacturer sold the "Blue Pill" boards for somewhere around EUR5 I would buy them.

There is LPC845-BRK that is not powerful as Blue Pill M4, but for 5 euros you get CMSIS-DAP debug probe that can be used with any NXP device.

https://mcuoneclipse.com/2019/02/02/tutorial-transforming-the-nxp-lpc845-brk-into-a-cmsis-dap-debug-probe/

[profdc9]

I made a PCB that takes STM32F405RGT6 but can also take STM32F103R types with a few component swaps:

https://github.com/profdc9/STM32F4ThruPill