Author Topic: Cheap flash programmer  (Read 9834 times)

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Offline Jane

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Cheap flash programmer
« on: April 30, 2015, 03:03:35 pm »
I need to read/write NAND flash chips( only from time to time as a hobbyist) . I was thinking about a development board, where I would replace NAND flash chip with a SMD TSOP48 socket( yes the NAND chips  I work with are for this socket only).
I will insert a NAND into this socket  and will read or write into it via JTAG
If the original NAND have the same size as the  NAND chip I am programming, it should work. But what If I need to program( read or write) a NAND with the different size than the original NAND ? Is it possible to set the size of NAND chip  on a development board? Or how  expensive programmers solve programming of different sizes of flash chips?
Thank you for explanations and your oppinion
 

Offline technix

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Re: Cheap flash programmer
« Reply #1 on: May 01, 2015, 03:19:27 pm »
I believe the pinout of NAND chips is standardized and you can get adapters to get a BGA or TSOP56 part work in your existing TSOP48 gear.
 

Offline Jane

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Re: Cheap flash programmer
« Reply #2 on: May 01, 2015, 03:44:17 pm »
Quote
I believe the pinout of NAND chips is standardized and you can get adapters to get a BGA or TSOP56 part work in your existing TSOP48 gear.
Yes,NAND chips can be standardized  but what cheap programmer to use?
 

Offline technix

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Re: Cheap flash programmer
« Reply #3 on: May 01, 2015, 06:01:46 pm »
Quote
I believe the pinout of NAND chips is standardized and you can get adapters to get a BGA or TSOP56 part work in your existing TSOP48 gear.
Yes,NAND chips can be standardized  but what cheap programmer to use?

If you don't mind digging into the documentation you can use an Arduino, appropriately programmed, to pull the data.
 

Offline relax79

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Re: Cheap flash programmer
« Reply #4 on: May 02, 2015, 04:48:13 pm »
Hi, nand programmer are expensive because they have need "Bad Block Management and ECC (Error Code Correction) handling and a lot of kind  SLC (Single Level Cell), MLC (Multi Level Cell), TLC (Triple level Cell), eMMC  .... Cheap solution only read raw data, expensive ones read correct trustable data. There are a few cheap solution but reads only regular nand. Only  Progskeet support Nand and plus TSOP56 NOR flash and it faster read write time.

Progskeet (I use 1.1 version for PS3) , Teensy 2++ and also look "NAND flashers speed comparison" in same page of the top. They are support only x8 8-bit nand flash chips
"http://www.psdevwiki.com/ps3/Talk:Hardware_flashing"
"http://www.psdevwiki.com/ps3/File:Progskeet_with_NAND_socket_SA247-TSOP48-D48_by_playonlcd.jpg"

FT2232H  this is also support only x8 8-bit nand flash chips
"https://spritesmods.com/?art=ftdinand&page=2"

Card Reader to Nand Reader I think
"http://www.pakitong.com/2013/11/re-programming-2wire-nand-flash-ic.html"

STM32F4 Debug Board v1.0 this is not support nand yet but x8 and x16 nand in to do list bottom of page, I ask him but he say making it take a little long time
"http://bvernoux.blogspot.com.tr/2012/08/stm32f4-debug-board-v10-work-in-progress.html"
"https://github.com/bvernoux/hydrabus"
Sorry for my English.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2015, 04:50:05 pm by relax79 »
 

Offline Jane

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Re: Cheap flash programmer
« Reply #5 on: May 02, 2015, 08:17:57 pm »
@relax79:Thanks for the links. As far as I understand properly, Progskeet uses JTAG to program NAND and is for PS3.
And none of rest  supports writting( only reading). How do you program NAND?
 

Offline technix

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Re: Cheap flash programmer
« Reply #6 on: May 02, 2015, 08:26:41 pm »
@relax79:Thanks for the links. As far as I understand properly, Progskeet uses JTAG to program NAND and is for PS3.
And none of rest  supports writting( only reading). How do you program NAND?

You will want to use whatever flash controller your final product used to write the data. All those bad block management, ECC and other maintainence data is usually propertairy and you will have a bit of trouble to get it right unless you have all the required documentation. Also NAND allow bad blocks to be exposed over JTAG so you cannot expect all writes work perfectly.
 

Offline relax79

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Re: Cheap flash programmer
« Reply #7 on: May 03, 2015, 06:26:52 pm »
Hi friends
  Maybe I am misunderstand your question, All links USB to Nand interface (writer and reader) not JTAG. Also I am find SEGGER NAND FLASH EVAL board like in the links but I do not know what it's price. Progskeets JTAG connection only for ACTEL bitstream programming with INJECTUS Programmer(I am not have and use any jtag programmer). Progskeet read and write over usb port like others in the links. I do not know any nand programmer using Jtag interface. Only I know XBOX360 users use jtag for nand programming but only works on xbox360 jtag hardware(Spesific for xbox360 South Bridge Chip) it is not universal (NAND-X or NANDPRO also pic based simple versions).  If you need nand read write over usb to jtag adapter + jtag to nand interface; It would be too complicated. I still need cheap x16 nand solution and I am search time o time but nothing found yet. These links cheap usb to nand programmers only I know.If you need jtag I do not know, sorry. If you search in google "diy nand flasher" (reader, writer, programmer) maybe you find about JTAG nand programming solution.
 

Offline relax79

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Re: Cheap flash programmer
« Reply #8 on: May 03, 2015, 06:47:00 pm »
Or how  expensive programmers solve programming of different sizes of flash chips?

 Expensive programmers generally come with life time chip support for adding not existing, new chip and employers or workers (engineers) put in the chip spesific parameters in new software or programmers firmware updete. Nand chips have a unique manifacturer ID (4 or 5 byte, I don't remember) Nor flash have a CFI, this is more advanced ( name, size, timing details or more) None of these features is not enough to give its decision programmer hardware I think, maybe  I'm wrong
« Last Edit: May 03, 2015, 07:13:04 pm by relax79 »
 

Offline Jane

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Re: Cheap flash programmer
« Reply #9 on: May 04, 2015, 06:36:34 pm »
@relax79:Thanks for your replies.Are you sure Progskeet can be used as a universal 8 bit NAND programmer? I saw people using  it with PS3 and you also say 
Quote
I use 1.1 version for PS3)
. So I thought it is for PS3 ONLY.
 

Offline raza05

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Re: Cheap flash programmer
« Reply #10 on: March 28, 2019, 08:17:44 am »
Hi
If any one is still reading this page ..I tried to build xD card nand reader . for that I purcahsed Teac CA-200 xD card reader & TSOP-48 adapter I have made connection from card reader to adapter Now I cannot read the flash in Windows could any one help me what I am missing here the Flash is Samsung  K9F2G08.. Please guide me
 


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