Author Topic: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?  (Read 8003 times)

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Offline Axk

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Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« on: December 03, 2018, 11:08:28 pm »
LCSC has these FPGAs/CPLDs from 2 chinese companies: AGM Microelectronics and An Road, Shanghi Info Tech.

https://lcsc.com/products/CPLD-FPGA_492.html

Has anyone tried using these?

Is there programmers for these available? Tools?
« Last Edit: December 03, 2018, 11:12:03 pm by Axk »
 

Offline ale500

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #1 on: December 04, 2018, 06:22:18 am »
I can't read chinese but they have a TQFP-44 part !, with like 300 LUTs that is interesting !. Regarding tools and programmers... I'll have to look a bit more for those...
 

Offline Bassman59

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #2 on: December 04, 2018, 05:37:38 pm »
LCSC has these FPGAs/CPLDs from 2 chinese companies: AGM Microelectronics and An Road, Shanghi Info Tech.

https://lcsc.com/products/CPLD-FPGA_492.html

Has anyone tried using these?

Is there programmers for these available? Tools?

I question the longevity and reliability of these companies if you're considering using the devices in production.
 

Offline kony

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2018, 05:44:17 pm »
IIRC, they are Lattice clones (by ex-employees?) and I doubt they are not yet after them for IP rights infringement. Wouldn't dare to use it.
 

Online colorado.rob

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #4 on: December 04, 2018, 06:03:38 pm »
If they are indeed Lattice clones then there is an open source toolchain available that may work with them.  http://www.clifford.at/icestorm/

http://www.alta-gate.com/support.aspx?lang=&p=16

Should probably see if they have tools available in English.

I will also note that Google is indexing the hell out of lcsc.com now.  Searching for "AGM fpga" turns up lcsc.com links and images near the top for me.
 

Online Berni

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #5 on: December 04, 2018, 06:52:51 pm »
I also noticed they have some Altera and Xilinx parts for very nice prices.

But i would assume this is just something they happen to get there hands on and likely disappears once the stocks are up.
 

Offline Axk

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« Last Edit: December 04, 2018, 08:45:22 pm by Axk »
 

Offline janoc

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #7 on: December 04, 2018, 08:54:01 pm »
If they are indeed Lattice clones then there is an open source toolchain available that may work with them.  http://www.clifford.at/icestorm/

http://www.alta-gate.com/support.aspx?lang=&p=16

Should probably see if they have tools available in English.

I will also note that Google is indexing the hell out of lcsc.com now.  Searching for "AGM fpga" turns up lcsc.com links and images near the top for me.

Icestorm works only with one line of Lattice FPGAs - the iCE40 series. Lattice makes a lot of other things (e.g. the Mach family), so if something is a "Lattice clone", it doesn't imply that this toolchain will work with it.
 

Offline Axk

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #8 on: December 04, 2018, 09:34:14 pm »
Anlogic development software: http://www.anlogic.com/down.aspx?TypeId=23&fid=t14:23:14

Looks like a ripoff of some other FPGA tool?
 

Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2018, 10:22:54 pm »
Although the installer and manual are Chinese, the software is clearly Western, all good English. Also some other languages in some files.
Looking through files now for clues..
Has anyone found any example projects ?
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Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2018, 10:59:57 pm »
So some more poking around.
Very few copyright messages, those that are are all Anlogic ( sometimes dated 2011-2021!)

There is no way this was developed by Chinese developers  - the English is too good, and there is a LOT of it. 

VERY small compared to other FPGA software - couple of ~32M executables
They have a github page https://github.com/AnlogicInfo
According to This  from a year ago they're shipping millions. To who I wonder?
« Last Edit: December 04, 2018, 11:26:21 pm by mikeselectricstuff »
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Offline chickenHeadKnob

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #11 on: December 04, 2018, 11:12:44 pm »
The ebay listing provided by Axk above includes the following blurb:
  "Lichee Tang uses Anlogic Technologies' EG4S20 as the core unit, 20K logic unit (LUT4/LUT5 hybrid architecture), approximately 130KB
           S RAM, built-in 32bit bit width 64MBit SDRAM, rich LVDS pin, built-in 12-bit 1MSPS ADC. "

Offhand that does not resemble any lattice product does it? especially the LUT4/LUT5. I am however not that familiar with the full breadth of the lattice line.
 

Online colorado.rob

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #12 on: December 06, 2018, 04:38:06 am »
I don't see Anlogic FPGAs being sold by LCSC.
 

Offline mikeselectricstuff

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #13 on: December 06, 2018, 08:08:04 am »
I don't see Anlogic FPGAs being sold by LCSC.
   https://lcsc.com/products/CPLD-FPGA_492.html?q=fpga
For some reason the manufacturer is listed as "An Road, Shanghai Info Tech"
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Online coppice

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #14 on: December 06, 2018, 10:33:23 am »
I don't see Anlogic FPGAs being sold by LCSC.
   https://lcsc.com/products/CPLD-FPGA_492.html?q=fpga
For some reason the manufacturer is listed as "An Road, Shanghai Info Tech"
Their Chinese name is 安路科技 (an lu ke ji, which you can read as Anlogic with only minor twisting  :) )
安 == something like peaceful or safe
路 == road
科技 ==  technology
« Last Edit: June 03, 2019, 03:53:11 pm by coppice »
 

Online colorado.rob

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #15 on: December 06, 2018, 06:45:39 pm »
   https://lcsc.com/products/CPLD-FPGA_492.html?q=fpga
For some reason the manufacturer is listed as "An Road, Shanghai Info Tech"
Ah... that explains my confusion.  You can clearly see the "Anlogic" name on their chips.

I just found this on Github: https://github.com/mmicko/prjtang -- Project Tang enables a fully open-source flow for Anlogic FPGAs using Yosys for Verilog synthesis and nextpnr for place and route.
 

Offline up8051

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #16 on: December 12, 2018, 01:27:11 pm »
Chinese FPGA startup opens European office in UK
http://www.eenewseurope.com/news/chinese-fpga-startup-opens-european-office-uk

Regards,
up8051
 

Offline technix

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #17 on: December 13, 2018, 05:05:28 am »
Maybe I should call them up and ask for samples...?
 

Online Berni

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #18 on: December 13, 2018, 06:11:25 am »
Chinese FPGA startup opens European office in UK
http://www.eenewseurope.com/news/chinese-fpga-startup-opens-european-office-uk

Regards,
up8051

I had a look trough the website and they do some nice stuff.

Going to one of the distributors you can get a small QFN package FPGA with built in 64Mbit of SDRAM for $3.79 in singles:
https://www.edgeelectronics.com/fpga/gw1nr-lv4qn88c5-i4/

Okay the FPGA is pretty poor in terms of LUTs but the large built in memory could really come useful in some simple video applications where you need a framebuffer but don't actually need to do heavy processing on the image. Some DSP applications also come to mind.
 
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Offline a59d1

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #19 on: January 10, 2019, 11:35:09 pm »
Chinese FPGA startup opens European office in UK
http://www.eenewseurope.com/news/chinese-fpga-startup-opens-european-office-uk

Regards,
up8051

I had a look trough the website and they do some nice stuff.

Going to one of the distributors you can get a small QFN package FPGA with built in 64Mbit of SDRAM for $3.79 in singles:
https://www.edgeelectronics.com/fpga/gw1nr-lv4qn88c5-i4/

Okay the FPGA is pretty poor in terms of LUTs but the large built in memory could really come useful in some simple video applications where you need a framebuffer but don't actually need to do heavy processing on the image. Some DSP applications also come to mind.

That's exactly the application I tried (and failed) to use an ICE40 for - practically ran out of pins fitting an external RAM on.
 

Offline free_electron

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #20 on: January 11, 2019, 05:30:30 pm »
how to get access to that software ? i keep running in circles, they need chinese mobile number . registrations doesnt work , download doesnt work...
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Offline FrankBuss

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #23 on: April 25, 2019, 05:16:28 am »
Seeedstudio has the same board as the eBay seller for the Anlogic FPGA, but cheaper:

https://www.seeedstudio.com/Sipeed-TANG-PriMER-FPGA-Development-Board-p-2881.html

I got one, will do some experiments with it.

But where do I get the Anlogic chips for my own products? Looks like they are available in hobby friendly TQFP packages:

https://lcsc.com/product-detail/CPLD-FPGA_An-Road-Shanghai-Info-Tech-EG4D20EG176_C134201.html

but I just requested a quote for this chip, and they answered with "unavailable".

Recently I tried to ask gowinsemi.com for their chips, and it was very difficult to get even a price quote, which was about $9 for a similar chip, and minimum order quantity of 200 ICs, and I couldn't get samples. I guess they want to trade with big companies only. But their support was good, I got a license for their Gowin_YunYuan IDE, because the apply for license button on their website didn't work. Probably as well based on some western IDE, all good English dialogs. Could blink an LED with this board:

https://shop.trenz-electronic.de/en/TEC0117-01-FPGA-Module-with-GOWIN-LittleBee-and-8-MByte-internal-SDRAM
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Offline alvieboy

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #24 on: May 31, 2019, 06:53:38 am »
All Anlogic parts at LCSC show as "discontinued" now. Unsure about what that means, though.

Alvie
 

Online martinayotte

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #25 on: May 31, 2019, 01:30:23 pm »
All Anlogic parts at LCSC show as "discontinued" now. Unsure about what that means, though.

Alvie

Alvie, are you the ZPUino author ?
 

Offline EEVblog

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #26 on: June 03, 2019, 02:11:35 pm »
According to This  from a year ago they're shipping millions. To who I wonder?

One farting novelty gadget order win could get that volume. It's China.
 

Online coppice

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #27 on: June 03, 2019, 03:49:18 pm »
According to This  from a year ago they're shipping millions. To who I wonder?
One farting novelty gadget order win could get that volume. It's China.
They wouldn't start on the development of silicon without some high volume lead customers lined up ready to go. Very few chips are developed as generic catalogue parts. Even the most generic looking MCUs have actually been designed with some specific high volume applications in mind.
 

Offline Rasz

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #28 on: June 04, 2019, 01:05:17 am »
According to This  from a year ago they're shipping millions. To who I wonder?
One farting novelty gadget order win could get that volume. It's China.
They wouldn't start on the development of silicon without some high volume lead customers lined up ready to go. Very few chips are developed as generic catalogue parts. Even the most generic looking MCUs have actually been designed with some specific high volume applications in mind.

Again, its China. They are being paid big grants for development, not sales.
https://press.trendforce.com/node/view/3025.html
https://www.scmp.com/tech/article/2161387/investor-warns-day-reckoning-90-pc-chinese-ai-start-ups-funding-dries
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Offline FrankBuss

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #29 on: September 17, 2019, 07:58:08 pm »
All Gowin FPGAs are discontinued at LCSC. And all Gowin parts I checked at https://www.edgeelectronics.com/fpga/ are 0 in stock. So much for reliably sourcing. Maybe for hobby projects it is better to buy only parts which are available at Digikey, and maybe at least 1,000 in-stock, as it is the case for many not much more expensive Lattice FPGAs. Looks like Gowin is not interested in small customers.
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Offline thm_w

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #30 on: September 17, 2019, 10:31:44 pm »
All Gowin FPGAs are discontinued at LCSC. And all Gowin parts I checked at https://www.edgeelectronics.com/fpga/ are 0 in stock. So much for reliably sourcing. Maybe for hobby projects it is better to buy only parts which are available at Digikey, and maybe at least 1,000 in-stock, as it is the case for many not much more expensive Lattice FPGAs. Looks like Gowin is not interested in small customers.

Interesting. I asked LCSC why but they may not have any information.
There might be some on Taobao, it takes more effort to buy than LCSC though: https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=a230r.1.14.13.702e7b4cvOlOUf&id=593353980683
Alibaba also has listings but they've copied the photos from LCSC...
 

Offline thm_w

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Re: Chinese FPGAs sold by LCSC, has anyone tried those?
« Reply #31 on: September 18, 2019, 08:57:50 pm »
Here is LCSCs response:

Quote
Hello there,

Just got an update from our purchasing team:
the reason is: we do not corperate with this Brand.

Maybe issues with the company/payments/supply? who knows.
 


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