EEVblog #96 - The TI LaunchPad MSP430 Development Board

[TripleFault]

After watching Dave's blog on the TI LaunchPad MSP430 Development Board, i was enthused and excited and rushed to the Digikey/Mouser/Element 14 websites.

Yes, i found Digikey and Mouser sell these boards for $4.31, but, here is the killer, you have to pay $35 postage on orders under $200.
So that makes these boards really $39.31.

So I went to Element 14 to see what they would charge and found out they sell them for $31.90.

Wow! They give us 1c discount 

So it isnt really a $4.31 Development board 

[PedroDiogo]

I ordered mine from TI's website at the time and paid nothing for the shipping.

I went through it again and the shipping seems to be included in the price (at least when sending to Portugal), so the board is really $4.30

[TripleFault]

Thanks Pedro,

I will go to the TI Website and see if they do free shipping to Australia.

But I highly doubt it. 

[TripleFault]

Yahoo!

After going to the TI Website and sending them a nice email, they agreed to send the board to Australia for $0 postage.

Thanks for the heads up Pedro!

So, anybody else that is interested in this product, go straight to the horses mouth.... forget Digikey/Mouser/Element 14 as they will charge you postage.

[AntiProtonBoy]

I got mine ages ago when it was widely publicised, but I still haven't unboxed it yet... 

[DavidDLC]

If you are buying from a website from any other country, the shipping will be high.

Check if you can buy it in your country.

[alm]

TI offered free shipping for a couple of months after release. You're almost two years late for the free shipping offer. You can save on shipping by combining orders, it's not like Digikey/E14 only sell Launchpads. The $4.30 + free shipping offer was clearly a loss leader, can't expect promotions to stay up forever.

[westfw]

Note that there is a new version of the launchpad kit that ships with a 20pin 8kb flash chip, rather than the 14pin 2kb chip that was shipped originally.  I've been a bit surprised that there hasn't been a bit more noise about this in hobbyist forums; it makes the launchpad much more comparable to "competitors" than it used to be.

OTOH, note that distributors are (may be) still shipping the older version.  I added a couple to a recent Mouser order explicitly to get updated, and got old boards :-(

[amspire]

Does anyone know if the Launchpad can be used as a way of programming and developing MSP430 chips not in the value range, if you put the right connections on your PCB? I am wondering if it is a cheap way to be able to program general MSP430 ic's.

[PedroDiogo]

Does anyone know if the Launchpad can be used as a way of programming and developing MSP430 chips not in the value range, if you put the right connections on your PCB? I am wondering if it is a cheap way to be able to program general MSP430 ic's.

I think you can, yes, but they must also suppost the Spy-by-wire interface.
http://hackaday.com/2010/09/28/launchpad-not-limited-to-value-line-chips/

[amspire]

In that case. I probably better get a Launchpad. There are some really interesting ICs in the MSP430 range, but don't I want to start using them unless there is a cheap and easy way to get them programmed. I guess they can be programmed via a JTAG interface, but I haven't looked seriously at that yet.

Richard

[oPossum]

All G2000 series (value line), most F2000, F5000 and F6000 can be programmed by Spy-by-Wire using the launchpad.

The older 1000 and 3000 series require a JTAG programmer.

[caroper]

TI offered free shipping for a couple of months after release. You're almost two years late for the free shipping offer. You can save on shipping by combining orders, it's not like Digikey/E14 only sell Launchpads. The $4.30 + free shipping offer was clearly a loss leader, can't expect promotions to stay up forever.

Just out of interest I tried it and the price is still $4.30 + free shipping, I ordered it with South African Shipping address and it went through without issue.

Cheers
Chris

[kripton2035]

yep shipping "included in the item's price" ...

order from here :
https://estore.ti.com/MSP-EXP430G2-MSP430-LaunchPad-Value-Line-Development-kit-P2031.aspx

regards,

[HackedFridgeMagnet]

Yes I just bought some.
I hope I can use them for something.

[westfw]

>> unless there is a cheap and easy way to get them programmed.
The full JTAG/Spy-bi-wire device is only $99:
http://focus.ti.com/docs/toolsw/folders/print/msp-fet430uif.html
It looks like an additional $50 will get you a "target board" with ZIF socket for some particular device.
that's not $5, but it's not unreasonable.
The SW suite might be more problematic.

[amspire]

The $99 dollar device is not unreasonable for a developer, but it does not help if you are designing an open source project and you want to offer a way for people to burn their micro cheaply and easily.  A $99 slug onto the cost open source project is a lot. A $20 cost for an Arduino clone, and then use it to program an Atmel chip is a lot better. Back when we had parallel ports, you could program a lot of chips for a few dollars, but the parallel ports have gone.

Richard.

[westfw]

Hmm.  I think that many of the larger MSP430 chips (the ones that aren't programmable by spy-bi-wire) include a serial bootloader in ROM.  For instance, the MSP430F149 (which is pretty old) datasheet says:

   The MSP430 bootstrap loader (BSL) enables users to program the flash memory or RAM using a UART serial interface. Access to the MSP430 memory via the BSL is protected by user-defined password. For complete description of the features of the BSL and its implementation, see the Application report Features of the MSP430 Bootstrap Loader, Literature Number SLAA089.

I'm not sure that it would be a good idea to count on the LaunchPad being available as a $5 programmer.  It's certainly not "breaking even" at that price, and could be discontinued pretty much any time...  (OTOH, LaunchPad is pretty ripe for a cost-reduction spin, using a 430 with native USB instead of a separate USB chip, and etc.)

The days of parallel port programmers were also the days that "real" development tools cost $249 for the "low cost" version.  That said, I think I'm a lot happier when the programming protocols are "open" enough that you could implement a simple programmer given some pins that can be wiggled.  That includes AVR's SPI ISP protocol but not their JTAG, for instance.  I haven't looked at where TI sits...

[oPossum]

The EZ430 kits come with a USB program/debug dongle. Prices start at $20.

For open source tools, there is the GoodFET programmer.
mspgcc is stable and under active development.

Many of the MSP430 do have a serial bootloader, including the G2553 that comes with the current Rev 1.5 Launchpad. It is in ROM or reserved flash and does not take away from the specified flash size.

[amspire]

For open source tools, there is the GoodFET programmer.
mspgcc is stable and under active development.

Brilliant. I was hoping to see some good open source support for the MSP430. It gives me more encouragement to give it a try.

[alm]

The serial bootloader probably does not offer debugging, however.

[oPossum]

Brilliant. I was hoping to see some good open source support for the MSP430. It gives me more encouragement to give it a try.

There are quite a few MSPGCC users at the 43oh.com forums and on the #43oh freenode IRC. Lots of great help if you need it.

I personally use CCS (TI's Code Composer Studio) and do a mix of asm, C and C++. TI has occasional deals to get the full CCS for under $40. I have the full license for both 4 & 5 thanks to those discounts. The free version is limited to 16k, but does full optimization (unlike Microchip). I just started learning the MSP430 about a year ago and really like it. Very nice architecture makes asm programming very easy.

[oPossum]

The serial bootloader probably does not offer debugging, however.

Right - no debugging. It is basically the same as AVR/Arduino with a bootloader, but it is already on the chip so you don't need a programmer and it doesn't take away from your user code space.

[caroper]

Well mine arrived in South Africa as advertised, hand delivered by FedEx at no extra charge.
From placing the Order to having the board took less than a week.
Now to find some time to play with it

[amyk]

The $99 dollar device is not unreasonable for a developer, but it does not help if you are designing an open source project and you want to offer a way for people to burn their micro cheaply and easily.  A $99 slug onto the cost open source project is a lot. A $20 cost for an Arduino clone, and then use it to program an Atmel chip is a lot better. Back when we had parallel ports, you could program a lot of chips for a few dollars, but the parallel ports have gone.

Richard.

You can still buy a parallel port for cheap:
http://www.dealextreme.com/p/parallel-port-pci-expansion-card-4638
Reviews indicate it has worked for AVR programming.

[poorchava]

I'm using a PCI expansion card with 2xCOM 1xLPT and it does work with Atmel's STK200 driven by PonyProg and AVRDude. I'm actually using it, because I've got a printer connected to the motherboard LPT (and by the way i'm not risking pulling the DB25 out of the motherboard by accident).

[kd7eir]

Note that there is a new version of the launchpad kit that ships with a 20pin 8kb flash chip, rather than the 14pin 2kb chip that was shipped originally.  I've been a bit surprised that there hasn't been a bit more noise about this in hobbyist forums; it makes the launchpad much more comparable to "competitors" than it used to be.

OTOH, note that distributors are (may be) still shipping the older version.  I added a couple to a recent Mouser order explicitly to get updated, and got old boards :-(

I ordered mine directly from TI in March and I got the two 20 pin chips with it.

[Bored@Work]

I've been a bit surprised that there hasn't been a bit more noise about this in hobbyist forums;

Because the novelty has worn off. The initial rush is long over and TI didn't manage to establish itself as a go-to brand in the "maker" (i.e. the loudmouth showoff) community. It ain't no longer be cool to get a Launchpad. TI's initial screwup and their mishandling of the situation then didn't help to establish them as a DIY brand.

I would guess that something like 90% of all sold Launchpads never saw use beyond running the preprogrammed demo application, if at all.

What was once the Launchpad crowd is today the Raspberry Pi crowd. Lots of people struggling to get one and making big noise about it, the PI foundation repeating TI's mistakes of not being able to deliver and miscommunication, and in the end 90% of all Raspberry Pis will end up in a dark corner fetching dust once the novelty wears off.

[caroper]

Note that there is a new version of the launchpad kit that ships with a 20pin 8kb flash chip, rather than the 14pin 2kb chip that was shipped originally.  I've been a bit surprised that there hasn't been a bit more noise about this in hobbyist forums; it makes the launchpad much more comparable to "competitors" than it used to be.

OTOH, note that distributors are (may be) still shipping the older version.  I added a couple to a recent Mouser order explicitly to get updated, and got old boards :-(

I ordered mine directly from TI in March and I got the two 20 pin chips with it.

The one I received last week came with 2 20 pin Chips, one being an 8K Flash 256Byte ram, the second is even better at 16K Flash and 512Byte RAM. A good deal for $4.30 especially as it can program and debug any spy by wire part including the TI Chronos.