Author Topic: I don't want FTDI, what are my options? (Read 14131 times)

cdwijs · « **on:** March 21, 2016, 03:55:25 pm »

Hi All,

I have just hit my nose with a FTDI chip https://www.eevblog.com/forum/microcontrollers/ftdi-chip-only-outputs-00's-has-anybody-also-seen-this/, so I don't want to design anything with FTDI anymore.

I have tested the MCP2221-I/SL, but in one of my applications, it's unreliable, it stops transmitting serial data to the USB pipe at the same point in the conversation. I have tested it with 2 chips, both show the same result. An old (real) FT232RL works fine in this application.

What USB to serial bridges are out there?

Kind regards,
Cedric

Monkeh · « **Reply #1 on:** March 21, 2016, 03:57:46 pm »

Silabs make a range which work quite well: http://www.silabs.com/products/interface/usbtouart/Pages/usb-to-uart-bridge.aspx

Delta · « **Reply #2 on:** March 21, 2016, 04:14:39 pm »

Prolific.

Monkeh · « **Reply #3 on:** March 21, 2016, 04:17:19 pm »

Quote from: Delta on March 21, 2016, 04:14:39 pm

Prolific.

Until such time as they decide the chip is no longer worth writing drivers for.

Buriedcode · « **Reply #4 on:** March 21, 2016, 04:31:42 pm »

I would avoid prolific.

I've used several cheapo cables with these devices, and whilst they could easily have been counterfeit devices, it was a pain. It could cause the PC to freeze, but mostly just the driver crashed requiring an unplugging/plugging cycle.

the CP2102 seems very stable on win7,8.1 and 10.

Failing that, I'm a fanboy of the PIC16F1455. Probably overkill, but occasionally using a micro you have full control over (rather than a permanently programmed micro like these other devices) means you can load off some tasks from other systems. There are a few examples of USB-serial bridges with it where you can add your own code for anything else you need. Otherwise its just a case of flashing it and it works (never had issue with them).

Aodhan145 · « **Reply #5 on:** March 21, 2016, 04:35:23 pm »

Quote from: Buriedcode on March 21, 2016, 04:31:42 pm

the CP2102 seems very stable on win7,8.1 and 10.

and mac but you need the drivers.

Rolo · « **Reply #6 on:** March 21, 2016, 04:40:15 pm »

A Lot of arduino clones use the CH340 now. Maybe thats an alternative for you.

Mr Smiley · « **Reply #7 on:** March 21, 2016, 04:42:45 pm »

CH340G as used on arduino and usb>ttl converters

cdwijs · « **Reply #8 on:** March 21, 2016, 04:46:01 pm »

Quote from: Rolo on March 21, 2016, 04:40:15 pm

A Lot of arduino clones use the CH340 now. Maybe thats an alternative for you.

Thanks, but I cannot buy them at farnell, digikey nor mouser. At my job I have no access to the more hacker-friendly shops.
It does look good, SOIC-16 is nice.

Kind regards,
Cedric

Aodhan145 · « **Reply #9 on:** March 21, 2016, 05:25:34 pm »

What about a MCP2200?

Macman · « **Reply #10 on:** March 21, 2016, 05:28:35 pm »

If you want an SOIC package another option would be a Cypress CY7C65213.

cdwijs · « **Reply #11 on:** March 22, 2016, 02:28:57 pm »

Hi All,

I have seen it's possible to program an AVR chip to function as an USB device. I have tried a few of those projects, but they did not work for me. Probably the problem is between keyboard and chair :-)

Does anybody know a working USB to serial AVR solution? This will allow me to choose from a wide array of packages, from dip to ultra small.

Kind regards,
Cedric

Philfreeze · « **Reply #12 on:** March 22, 2016, 04:02:15 pm »

@cdwijs
There is V-USB (https://www.obdev.at/products/vusb/index.html)
It is a AVR USB bitbang firmware.
Combine it with an AVR chip which has some Serial Inferface and you have what you need.

diyaudio · « **Reply #13 on:** March 22, 2016, 04:34:27 pm »

Quote from: cdwijs on March 21, 2016, 03:55:25 pm

Hi All,

I have just hit my nose with a FTDI chip https://www.eevblog.com/forum/microcontrollers/ftdi-chip-only-outputs-00's-has-anybody-also-seen-this/, so I don't want to design anything with FTDI anymore.

I have tested the MCP2221-I/SL, but in one of my applications, it's unreliable, it stops transmitting serial data to the USB pipe at the same point in the conversation. I have tested it with 2 chips, both show the same result. An old (real) FT232RL works fine in this application.

What USB to serial bridges are out there?

Kind regards,
Cedric

ftdi can go suck it,I literally destroyed all their shit with a hammer. Go Cypress or even Silicon Labs.
CY7C65213

3db · « **Reply #14 on:** March 22, 2016, 05:14:23 pm »

Arduino UNO used a ATMEGA16 u2 as its usb-serial interface.
I think the firmware is available on Github.

matkar · « **Reply #15 on:** March 22, 2016, 06:04:29 pm »

Try sourcing already proposed CH340. I'm sure you can convince your company to buy a bunch wherever especially since they are dirt cheap. Buy 1000 and you're set for a while:)

JTR · « **Reply #16 on:** March 23, 2016, 03:10:50 am »

Quote from: cdwijs on March 21, 2016, 03:55:25 pm

Hi All,

I have just hit my nose with a FTDI chip https://www.eevblog.com/forum/microcontrollers/ftdi-chip-only-outputs-00's-has-anybody-also-seen-this/, so I don't want to design anything with FTDI anymore.

I have tested the MCP2221-I/SL, but in one of my applications, it's unreliable, it stops transmitting serial data to the USB pipe at the same point in the conversation. I have tested it with 2 chips, both show the same result. An old (real) FT232RL works fine in this application.

What USB to serial bridges are out there?

Kind regards,
Cedric

I'm guessing that you are using Windows (prior to Windows 10?) If so the problem is well known and caused by noise on the CDC Data bulk IN endpoint. It is the host that detects errors and after three strikes in a row it silently drops the endpoint. No warning, messages, bus resets no nothing.

To combat this I have seen circuits that put a very small cap in the range of just a few pf on the D+, D- lines in series with a 22R resistor to add some degree of noise reduction. (Actually I have also seen it on FTDI chips as well as at least earlier FTDI drivers would also fail in the same way.)

Supposedly windows 10 is a lot more stable with the inbuilt CDC driver. This may or may not be the case.

It is because of the well known issue with windows that you will find numerous comments on various forums advising against the use of a USB - UART chip that relies on the standard windows CDC driver. Due to my experience and research I have to agree. The windows CDC driver sucks at least up until it may have been fixed in windows 10.

Daving · « **Reply #17 on:** March 23, 2016, 07:16:11 am »

Quote from: Aodhan145 on March 21, 2016, 05:25:34 pm

What about a MCP2200?

The MCP2221 is the replacement part for that. No crystal required. Still under $2 in quantity.

Cheaper than most of the options listed so far.

kamtar · « **Reply #18 on:** March 23, 2016, 12:40:22 pm »

Quote from: Rolo on March 21, 2016, 04:40:15 pm

A Lot of arduino clones use the CH340 now. Maybe thats an alternative for you.

These have horrible drivers.

Boscoe · « **Reply #19 on:** March 23, 2016, 02:52:45 pm »

I have no idea why people have a problem with FTDI bricking counterfeit products. Everyone would do the same and rightly so. Buy real parts you cheap skate mofo.

elgonzo · « **Reply #20 on:** March 23, 2016, 03:06:33 pm »

Quote from: Boscoe on March 23, 2016, 02:52:45 pm

I have no idea why people have a problem with FTDI bricking counterfeit products. Everyone would do the same and rightly so. Buy real parts you cheap skate mofo.

Let me guess. You didn't read the story as provided as a link in the OP.
Let me help you here before you start humiliating yourself: cdwijs bought the chips from Farnell (a reputable and trusted distributor) and not from ebay/Banggood/DealExtream/Sparkfun/Adafruit/whatever...

suicidaleggroll · « **Reply #21 on:** March 23, 2016, 04:00:40 pm »

Quote from: elgonzo on March 23, 2016, 03:06:33 pm

Quote from: Boscoe on March 23, 2016, 02:52:45 pm
I have no idea why people have a problem with FTDI bricking counterfeit products. Everyone would do the same and rightly so. Buy real parts you cheap skate mofo.
Let me guess. You didn't read the story as provided as a link in the OP.
Let me help you here before you start humiliating yourself: cdwijs bought the chips from Farnell (a reputable and trusted distributor) and not from ebay/Banggood/DealExtream/Sparkfun/Adafruit/whatever...

If they are actually counterfeit, he should send them back to Farnell so they can address the problem and send replacements. Isn't that why you buy from real distributors in the first place? This isn't restricted to FTDI...counterfeit devices sometimes make their way into legitimate supply chains, if you discover you've received one, you need to take it up with the supplier so they can fix the problem.

Daving · « **Reply #22 on:** March 23, 2016, 04:02:07 pm »

I'll just leave this here. This should answer the OP without any bias:

http://www.digikey.com/product-search/en/integrated-circuits-ics/interface-controllers/2556697?FV=1b8034f%2C1b80350%2C1b8038e%2C1b8038f%2Cfff40027%2Cfff80319&mnonly=0&newproducts=0&ColumnSort=1000011&page=1&stock=0&pbfree=0&rohs=0&k=&quantity=1&ptm=0&fid=0&pageSize=25

elgonzo · « **Reply #23 on:** March 23, 2016, 04:20:30 pm »

Quote from: suicidaleggroll on March 23, 2016, 04:00:40 pm

Quote from: elgonzo on March 23, 2016, 03:06:33 pm
Quote from: Boscoe on March 23, 2016, 02:52:45 pm
I have no idea why people have a problem with FTDI bricking counterfeit products. Everyone would do the same and rightly so. Buy real parts you cheap skate mofo.
Let me guess. You didn't read the story as provided as a link in the OP.
Let me help you here before you start humiliating yourself: cdwijs bought the chips from Farnell (a reputable and trusted distributor) and not from ebay/Banggood/DealExtream/Sparkfun/Adafruit/whatever...

If they are actually counterfeit, he should send them back to Farnell so they can address the problem and send replacements. Isn't that why you buy from real distributors in the first place? This isn't restricted to FTDI...counterfeit devices sometimes make their way into legitimate supply chains, if you discover you've received one, you need to take it up with the supplier so they can fix the problem.

Ofcourse cdwijs should do that. But how does it relate to

Quote from: Boscoe on March 23, 2016, 02:52:45 pm

[...] Buy real parts you cheap skate mofo.

Psi · « **Reply #24 on:** March 23, 2016, 08:06:59 pm »

CP2102 works well, but the driver is a bit less forgiving.
I had issues with the comport library i was using when i moved from ft232 to cp2102. Something to do with buffers handled better in the ftdi driver.


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Author Topic: I don't want FTDI, what are my options? (Read 14131 times)

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